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Author Topic: Ritual  (Read 906 times)

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majiponi

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Ritual
« on: March 03, 2017, 10:38:49 pm »
+3

Quote
Gain a Curse. If you do, trash a card from your hand. +1vp per $1 it cost.
This is the past tence, so the cost before trashing matters, right? When Quarry is in play, I trash Catacombs to gain Mandarin which is Ferried, cost/costs difference matters.

(Of course, this is very edge case, I found it when preparing Japanese translation for the Online. I thought this very unique, so I asked.)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 10:41:54 pm by majiponi »
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Doom_Shark

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2017, 12:53:44 am »
0

Shouldn't this be in rules questions?
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majiponi

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2017, 01:57:21 am »
0

Shouldn't this be in rules questions?
Oops, I misposted. How do I move this?
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Re: Ritual
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2017, 03:23:58 am »
+1

Shouldn't this be in rules questions?
Oops, I misposted. How do I move this?

It's "Move Topic" on the bottom left.
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Re: Ritual
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2017, 04:03:12 am »
0

Shouldn't this be in rules questions?
Oops, I misposted. How do I move this?

It's "Move Topic" on the bottom left.

Except that he doesn't have it because it requires mod/admin rights on most boards, including this one.

Joseph2302

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2017, 06:13:08 am »
0

Shouldn't this be in rules questions?
Oops, I misposted. How do I move this?
Message theory and he can move the topic
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DG

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2017, 09:23:24 am »
0

From the Adventurers rulebook:

The -2 cost token also goes on an Action Supply pile. It reduces the cost of cards from that pile on a particular player's turn. The -2 cost token lowers costs for all purposes; for example with a -2
cost token on Gear, a player could Transmogrify Copper into Gear. The -2 cost token does not lower costs below 0. This token is placed with Ferry.

From the Dark Ages rulebook:

For example, if you use Procession to play Band of Misfits twice and choose Fortress the first time, you will automatically replay it as Fortress, then trash the Band of Misfits, return it to your hand (it is a Fortress when it's trashed, and Fortress has a when-trashed ability that returns it to your hand), and gain an Action card costing exactly 6 (1 more than Band of Misfits, which has left play and so is no longer copying Fortress).

It would appear ritual uses the cost of the card at the time it was trashed but procession uses the cost of the card when it is in the trash. I cannot immediately see where the timing makes a difference for ritual however the timing is important for procession.
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majiponi

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2017, 09:53:06 am »
0

You can take only 3 vps if Ritual references before-cost.
You can take 5 if it references after-cost (due to when-trashing effect). I wonder whether this is intended or just a mistake.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 09:54:14 am by majiponi »
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ThetaSigma12

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2017, 09:59:24 am »
+1

I'm confused, Ferry token effects costs during your whole turn, whether or not it's in the trash. Therefore Ritual would all ways give you the 5, right?
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majiponi

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2017, 10:15:41 am »
0

I'm confused, Ferry token effects costs during your whole turn, whether or not it's in the trash. Therefore Ritual would all ways give you the 5, right?
Yes, so Mandarin costs lower than Catacombs, which enables you to change the cost of Catacombs due to its when-trashing effect.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 10:18:14 am by majiponi »
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Simon (DK)

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2017, 10:52:03 am »
+1

The descibed change in cost comes from removing Quarry from play.
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Kirian

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2017, 01:46:03 pm »
0

Quarry is still in play when you trash the Catacombs.  Gaining the Mandarin happens after the trashing, so using Ritual to trash Catacombs gets you 3 VP.
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werothegreat

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2017, 03:14:44 pm »
+1

Ritual tells you to trash a card from your hand (full stop).

The trashed card might have a when-trash effect.

Ritual then has an effect based on the cost of the trashed card, which may have changed since it was trashed.

The same logic applies to Summon: You gain the card (full stop).  The card may have when gain effects that might lose track of the card.  Summon then tries to set the card aside, and if it can't, fails to do anything else.

EDIT: Hmm, yes that is past tense on the card.  That's really weird.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 03:16:51 pm by werothegreat »
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Donald X.

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2017, 03:40:13 pm »
0

Quote
Gain a Curse. If you do, trash a card from your hand. +1vp per $1 it cost.
This is the past tence, so the cost before trashing matters, right?
Yes.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2017, 06:34:04 pm »
0

Quote
Gain a Curse. If you do, trash a card from your hand. +1vp per $1 it cost.
This is the past tence, so the cost before trashing matters, right?
Yes.

Was it intentional for it to be different than Procession for example, or was it just something that happened out that way because there wasn't much of a reason to put thought into weather to say "cost" or "costs"?
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Donald X.

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2017, 11:30:51 pm »
+1

Was it intentional for it to be different than Procession for example, or was it just something that happened out that way because there wasn't much of a reason to put thought into weather to say "cost" or "costs"?
I don't remember if I thought I was improving things. If I'd thought it through I imagine I wouldn't have changed it, because probably it hasn't had any positive effect, and it's generated these questions.

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Jeebus

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Re: Ritual
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2017, 07:26:14 pm »
0

This has been noted before actually.
An example without Mandarin was used. Instead it was Quarry + Inheritance.
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