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Author Topic: Forced Wins Training Sessions  (Read 13125 times)

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aku_chi

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #100 on: October 07, 2017, 10:37:33 pm »
+1

It may not look like it, but I can end the game here.  How do I do it?  How do I maximize points?  Try it out with Game #7548391, Decision 141.



The maximum I've managed to get is 64 total VP.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2017, 11:14:17 pm by aku_chi »
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Jfrisch

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #101 on: October 07, 2017, 10:54:45 pm »
+4


Kings court kings court

expand fortress, gaining a kings courtm an expand, and a gear,

then use gear to draw all of them iterating (you don't need to gear every turn), you can gain close to infinite points by also gaining bishops and eventually bishoping your fortresses as much as you can.
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Dingan

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #102 on: November 06, 2017, 05:59:26 pm »
+3

Pulled this one out of the hat



EDIT: I think this was the first Fountain game where I went 7 Coppers -> 0 Coppers -> 10 Coppers
« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 06:00:52 pm by Dingan »
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ThetaSigma12

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #103 on: November 06, 2017, 06:34:47 pm »
+2

Play Mint gaining Copper, call Royal Carriage x3 to gain 3 more Coppers.
Play Merchants and Village to draw the 4 coppers.
Play Catapult trashing Minstrel to give a Curse, and Nomad Camp.
Buy Copper + Dominate bringing it to 30/42
Play the 6 HoP to gain 6 Duchies, winning 48/42.
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Seprix

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #104 on: November 06, 2017, 10:36:25 pm »
0

It may not look like it, but I can end the game here.  How do I do it?  How do I maximize points?  Try it out with Game #7548391, Decision 141.

The maximum I've managed to get is 64 total VP.

Weirdly enough, I cannot access that gamestate. I can play the game but Decision 141 does not work in the slightest, it infinitely loads  :-[
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Seprix

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #105 on: December 17, 2017, 05:50:50 am »
0

This is a slightly harder one. Put on your thinking caps.

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faust

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #106 on: December 17, 2017, 06:01:40 am »
+3


Play Stonemason trashing Silver for 2 Stonemasons. This guarantees 2 cards in your discard.
Play 2 Mills, discarding Estate/Random card (removing the -1$ token) you drew and Copper/random card you drew.
Play 2 Copper for $5 total.
Buy Messenger gaining Bridge Troll (opponent gains Bridge Troll).
Buy SM overpaying 1$ for 2 extra SMs.
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Awaclus

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #107 on: December 17, 2017, 06:14:49 am »
0

You could alternatively

play the Mill to draw the Bridge Troll, Stonemason the Bridge Troll into two Wandering Minstrels, play the other Mill to draw a WM and discard WM+Estate for $2, then you can buy a Messenger to empty the Bridge Trolls and a WM to empty the WMs.
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navical

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #108 on: December 17, 2017, 06:53:01 am »
0


Play Mill to draw Bridge Troll, play Stonemason trashing Bridge Troll for Wandering Minstrel and Stonemason, play Mill discarding Estate + drawn card to get you to $1, play 3 Copper and 1 Silver to get you to $6.
Buy Stonemason overpaying 3 for 2 Wandering Minstrels, Stonemason overpaying 1 for 2 Stonemasons.
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Seprix

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #109 on: December 17, 2017, 06:12:09 pm »
+1

You could alternatively

play the Mill to draw the Bridge Troll, Stonemason the Bridge Troll into two Wandering Minstrels, play the other Mill to draw a WM and discard WM+Estate for $2, then you can buy a Messenger to empty the Bridge Trolls and a WM to empty the WMs.


Play Mill to draw Bridge Troll, play Stonemason trashing Bridge Troll for Wandering Minstrel and Stonemason, play Mill discarding Estate + drawn card to get you to $1, play 3 Copper and 1 Silver to get you to $6.
Buy Stonemason overpaying 3 for 2 Wandering Minstrels, Stonemason overpaying 1 for 2 Stonemasons.


Drawing the Bridge Troll is not guaranteed and thus not a solution. I apologize, there's way more cards than one in the discard.
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Dingan

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #110 on: January 04, 2018, 12:50:27 pm »
+6

So here's something. Of the 23 Kingdoms posted in this topic, below are the cards or events that showed up most frequently in them.

Card/EventNumber of Kingdoms
Stonemason6
Village6
Moneylender5
Horn of Plenty5
Remodel4
Mountebank4
Magpie4
Laboratory4
Artisan4
Smithy3
Poacher3
Market3
Lost Arts3
Fortress3
Festival3
Expand3
Chapel3
Butcher3
Bridge Troll3
Ball3
37 other cards/events2
103 other cards/events1

I didn't include Landmarks (which certainly affect endgame scenarios), cus uhh just didn't want to.
The thread was made before Nocturne and Empires, and even game logs from way long ago were posted.
Several games were Base-only or heavily-Base, which might explain Village, Moneylender, etc.

==> My main takeaway:
Stonemason and HoP are the pile kings and make endgame scenarios difficult (or, rather, make game worthy of posting here).
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jonaskoelker

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #111 on: January 29, 2018, 11:37:14 am »
+2

It's my turn. I have a forced win from here.

Workshop a Silver. Draw it with 2xWorker's Village. Remodel Gold into Province, play 4xSilver, buy the last Province, win 25-21.

Here's a forced win:


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navical

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #112 on: January 29, 2018, 01:55:12 pm »
+2

Play FV. Governor remodel Copper->CSM, topdecking with Watchtower. Hand is WT-WT-Gold-Prov-Bishop, so playing WT draws CSM. You still have an action, so play CSM. You have 3 buys, plenty of coins to buy 3 CSMs to pile them out, and a points lead.
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Titandrake

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #113 on: January 31, 2018, 02:39:07 am »
+3

Here's a neat one from a match I played 11 days ago.



There's actually a lot of leeway here, but you can guarantee a win even if you only produce enough money to buy 2 Provinces.

Your last 2 cards aren't necessary - assume they're blank.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 02:40:47 am by Titandrake »
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navical

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #114 on: January 31, 2018, 06:28:00 am »
0

Observe that LR currently has the only Spoils not in the Spoils pile.

Stonemason Gold -> 2x Bandit Camp.
Play City Quarter to draw everything.
Play 2x Bandit Camp, gaining 2 Spoils.
Play 5x Forager trashing Graverobber, Wishing Well, City Quarter, 2x Copper = $20.
Play 3x Gold, 1x Copper, 2x Treasure Trove, gaining 2x Gold, 2x Copper = $34.
Pay off debt, $31. Buy 2x Province, 3x Duchy.

You have as many Golds and Coppers as you started with, and 2 more Spoils; that means LR is on at most 43 points, while you have at least 21 + 21 + 5 = 47 points.

You can do better than this by counting Keep points on other Treasures (how much better depends on exactly what's in your draw pile) but all that matters is the win
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aku_chi

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #115 on: January 31, 2018, 09:22:11 am »
+1

I'm having a difficult time making sense of the point totals.  My best guess is that your opponent has 5 Provinces, 20 Keep points, and is miserable; and you have one Province and 15 Keep points.  There are 5 treasures, which means that two of them are tied.  Your opponent leads in Spoils 4-0.  Your opponent has the only Silver.  You're tied in two of: Treasure Troves, Coppers, and Golds and are winning the other.  I'll assume you need to gain one of each to win all the Keep points.  With these assumptions, it's possible to win without drawing any more cards.

Use Graverobber to gain Treasure Trove from the trash to give the opponent -5 VP.
Use Stonemason to trash Gold and gain 2 Silvers (winning the Silver split, giving your opponent -5 VP and you +5 VP).
Play 5 Foragers trashing 2 City Quarters, a Wishing Well, and 2 Coppers for $20 and +5 buys.
Play two Treasure Troves to get $4 and gain two Copper and two Golds (winning the Gold split and giving the opponent -5 VP).
Play 3 Golds and a Copper for $10.
Pay off 3 Debt and have $31 and 6 buys.  Buy 2 Provinces and 2+ Coppers (winning the Copper split and giving the opponent -5 VP).  You could also buy two Duchies, but it's unnecessary.

At the end:
Your opponent has 5 Provinces, 5 Keep points, and is miserable: 33 VP
You have 3 Provinces, 0-2 Duchies, 20 Keep points: 38-44 VP
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michaeljb

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #116 on: January 31, 2018, 06:12:21 pm »
0

I'm having a difficult time making sense of the point totals.  My best guess is that your opponent has 5 Provinces, 20 Keep points, and is miserable; and you have one Province and 15 Keep points.  There are 5 treasures, which means that two of them are tied.  Your opponent leads in Spoils 4-0.  Your opponent has the only Silver.  You're tied in two of: Treasure Troves, Coppers, and Golds and are winning the other.  I'll assume you need to gain one of each to win all the Keep points.  With these assumptions, it's possible to win without drawing any more cards.

I'm also using these assumptions, but my solution went a different direction.


Play Stonemason; Gold (net: -1 Gold) --> Graverobber, Stonemason
Play City Quarter, drawing Province, "blank", Graverobber, Stonemason
Play Stonemason; Gold (net: -2 Gold) --> Graverobber, Graverobber
Play City Quarter, drawing Graverobber, Graverobber
Play Graverobber; Graverobber -> Province
Play Graverobber; Graverobber -> Province
Play 4 Foragers, trashing Wishing Well, Copper (net: -1 Copper), Forager, "Blank", for +$16, +4 Buys

Play 2 Golds, 2 Coppers, 2 Treasure Troves for +$12, gaining 2 Golds+Coppers (net: 0 Gold, +1 Copper)

$28, 5 Buys
pay off 3D
$25, 5 Buys

Buys:
Silver, Silver (net: +2)
Gold (net: +1)
Treasure Trove (net: +1)
Duchy

Now you have all the Keep points for Copper, Silver, Gold, Treasure Trove; net +5 VP for you, -15 VP for opponent

Final scores:
21 + 5 + 12 (Provinces) + 3 (Duchy) = 41
48 - 15 = 33


(Edit) Better solution (by which I mean higher score):


play Stonemason; Gold -> Graverobber, Treasure Trove (net treasures: Gold -1, Treasure Trove +1)
play City Quarter, drawing Province, "blank", Graverobber, Trove
play Graverobber; Graverobber -> Province
play 5 Foragers; trash "blank", Wishing Well, City Quarter, 2 Coppers, for +$20, +5 Buys (net Copper -2)
play 3 Gold, 1 Copper for +$10
play 3 Treasure Troves for +$6, gaining 3 Golds and Coppers (net: Gold +2, Treasure Trove +1, Copper +1)
$36, 6 Buys
pay 3D
$33, 6 Buys:
2 Silvers
1 Province
3 Duchies

same Keep swing as above solution, but 2 more Duchies:
21 + 5 + 12 + 9 = 47
48 - 15 = 33

final score: 47-33
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 07:24:54 pm by michaeljb »
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Cave-o-sapien

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #117 on: January 31, 2018, 07:41:10 pm »
0

Hey, I remember that game!
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Titandrake

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #118 on: February 02, 2018, 11:10:48 pm »
+2

Here's what I did in the original game.


Down by 27 VP. Two Provinces is 12 VP. 15 VP from Keep + any extra VP is enough for the win.

Currently have 0 Silvers to 1 Silver, and 2 Treasure Troves to 2 Treasure Troves. I didn't bother tracking the Copper or Gold splits, because Treasure Trove really makes those confusing. The first 2 Silver gains are each worth 5 VP (first gains me 5 VP, 2nd makes them lose 5 VP). The first Treasure Trove gain is worth 5 VP. If I gain 2x Silver and 1x Treasure Trove, that's the 15 Keep VP I need.

I first need to get more gains --> Stonemason WW into 2 Stonemason.
Graverobber gains Silver.
Play City Quarter, draw rest of deck.
Stonemason Gold --> Treasure Trove + Silver.
That's all the treasures I need, and after playing Treasure Trove I'm going to have lots more Gold so I don't need to worry about Gold count --> Stonemason Gold --> 2x Duchy to get the extra VP needed to win.
City Quarter draws gained Treasures.

I will play 3 Treasure Troves this turn, which will gain 3 Copper. So I can trash up to 3 Copper without losing VP from Keep from the Copper split.
3x Forager trash 3 Copper.
4th Forager trashes 5th Forager.

That leaves plenty of money to buy the last 2 Provinces.
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jonaskoelker

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Re: Forced Wins Training Sessions
« Reply #119 on: April 15, 2018, 03:08:16 pm »
0



At 19:40, Adam is revealing Wandering Minstrel, Colony and Spice Merchant to a Wandering Minstrel. Remaining in his deck are Platinum, Gold and Peddler. Plan out the rest of his turn such that he wins the game. The payload part of Adam's previous turn, from 17:00 to 17:30, might provide a hint if you're stuck on one particular aspect. Watching from 19:40 onward will give a big hint.

(My solution is available as a youtube comment.)
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