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Author Topic: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge  (Read 18880 times)

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theory

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These are the nine sets that were scheduled for the final of the 2011 DominionStrategy.com Championships.  (The ninth set was unused, but is still eligible for this poll.)  Please vote for your favorite of these sets -- you may define favorite in any way you choose.  You may change your vote at any time.

Feel free to use this thread to discuss the sets, how olneyce and manzi played them, and whether you spot any alternative strategies that the players might have missed.

The winner will receive a Dominion expansion of his choice.  Voting will close in one week.

If you submitted one of the sets below, please do not identify which set you submitted until after the voting is concluded.  After the winner is announced, we will also release all the other sets submitted to this challenge.

Game 1: Moat, Tunnel, Bishop, Gardens, Ironworks, Young Witch, Tournament, Council Room, Torturer, Border Village
Bane: Hamlet
Colony: No

Game 2: Crossroads, Loan, Silk Road, Baron, Bureaucrat, Apprentice, Duke, Farmland, Harem, Nobles
Colony: Yes

Game 3: Haven, Great Hall, Workshop, Masquerade, Ironworks, Island, Throne Room, Tactician, Goons, King's Court
Colony: No

Game 4: Lookout, Masquerade, Oracle, Smithy, Worker's Village, Festival, Ghost Ship, Margrave, Mountebank, Treasury
Colony: No

Game 5: Embargo, University, Scrying Pool, Worker's Village, Remodel, Wharf, Rabble, Grand Market, Forge, Peddler
Colony: Yes

Game 6: Menagerie, Tunnel, Ghost Ship, Governor, Inn, Monument, Worker's Village, Grand Market, Goons, Adventurer
Colony: No

Game 7: Embargo, Scheme, Menagerie, Watchtower, Fishing Village, Remake, Haggler, Vault, Grand Market, Expand
Colony: Yes

Game 8: Crossroads, Secret Chamber, Warehouse, Loan, Ambassador, Caravan, Worker's Village, Bureaucrat, Merchant Ship, Grand Market
Colony: Yes

Game 9: Chapel, Fishing Village, Watchtower, Ironworks, Gardens, Bridge, Highway, Mountebank, Ill-gotten Gains, Goons
Colony: Yes
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brokoli

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2012, 06:43:59 am »
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My four favorites :

Game 1 : I quite like the use of tunnel here.
Fame 2 : Baron, Crossroads, and Silk road. I love these three cards. Nice synergy, but too victory cards in the same board.
Game 3 : I love the Ironworks/Island/Great hall combo. But the presence of KC/Goons/Masq is a bad idea for me.
Game 6 : Excellent use of menagerie. Inn and Monument are also very nice.

With much hesitation, I vote for Game 6.
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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2012, 08:11:51 am »
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Board 9: A Garden Lover's Board. I love gardens.  8)
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olneyce

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2012, 12:14:09 pm »
+1

I'll have more complete comments on the games in the results thread, but here's my take on how enjoyable it was to play these:

Was not in love with set 1: I think we may have gone too aggressively down the Torturer path, but it all made for quite a slog.

I usually don't enjoy alternative victory cards that much but set 2 was a lot of fun.  There was just so much variety, and I really love the opportunity to Barons-rush, which rarely works.

Set 3 drove me up the wall.  I got so fixated on the pin that I didn't really think about how it would actually work out.

Set 4 worked out very very well for me.  In some ways it was my favorite, since it really was all about engine-construction.  But the constant Margrave-Masq back-and-forths left it a bit frustrating for both sides.

Set 5 was also among my favorites.  University into Wharf is great, but it does make for a very quick game.

Set 6 is a strong competitor for favorite set.  The only reason I wouldn't pick it is that the swinginess of Governor/Goons was VERY frustrating while playing.  Still, it's a set that involves a LOT of decisions, and rewards strategic buys and plays quite a lot.  I'm curious about the presence of Adventurer on here, though.  It seemed like an obvious 'don't buy' while playing. Is there idea that you can draw golds into your hand and then remodel them into Provinces easier?

Set 7: I love Watchtower engines, and the one Manzi puts together here is a thing of beauty.  It can't be my favorite, though, because I got crushed so badly.

Set 8 might actually be my favorite.  I've really grown fond of Ambassador lately - and I think the combination of Crossroads/Caravan/Secret Chamber as a mechanism for getting relatively early Grand Markets makes for a very interesting Ambassador war.  It was only mid-game that I realized 'whoa, I just want to send back double coppers at every opportunity.'  But once I did, it was pretty much over.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2012, 01:06:53 pm »
+1

Set 1: I think Ironworks/Gardens with Tunnel and hamlet support is best here. In the chat, everyone was trying to convince me that bishop stealing a couple gardens was able to counter that effectively. I remain unconvinced. (If anyone is curious, I played jonts a couple games after the match on this board with this strategy. Border Village is huge for the bishop player, and we split 1-1. I also realize that I was going at the ironworks way too slow in both games). 1st turn is huge here, any way you slice it. I'm really unimpressed by going torturer chains. Mostly because Ironworks/Gardens just doesn't care about them. It is going to require some nuance and adjustment to your opponent in every case, though, so not a bad set, per se.

Set 2: Love the all-green set. Well, I think 4 barons is a lot. The talk in the chat was whether you wanted bureaucrat on your second shuffle or not (open baron/silver). Well, we all thought that crossroads and silk roads were key cards here (part of why we prefer baron to the other stuff at the start is for the buys). Duke is a trap here, for sure, and I don't understand what apprentice is doing. After seeing the game, probably 2-3 barons is what I'd get, and then lots of silk roads. And crossroads somewhere. A little tricky to figure out what order to grab stuff. And you have to react to what your opponent is doing, making sure they don't flank you out of the VP cards you need to win, while at the same time not thrusting for them so early yourself that you end up totally choked in green. Baron is an excellent answer to that though. Probably you buy silk roads pretty early here - 2nd reshuffle? And probably I'm not buying anything that costs over $4 all game. No, seriously.

Set 3: Consensus was the pin was a trap. If they're trying to pin you, loading up on all the ironworks and islands and then rushing great halls must be fast enough. People were solitairing it in like 11-12 turns (someone remind me what the initial $3 we decided to buy was?). And quite conceivably, you only really need 2 piles gone before getting pinned. You know, you can buy out those curses. Anyway, it really helps to get those great halls, because the pinning player can grab those for VP points (both from goons and what they naturally give you) while executing the pin, helping himself overcome if the deficit is small enough. Which coulda been real interesting if it happened that the pin got very lucky to get up that fast. As it was, I still think it somewhat interesting how much they were able to do off of Havens and tacticians to save themselves from total deck deletion.

Set 4: Chat consensus was to build an engine here. My initial thought was opening masq/silver, maybe one more silver the whole game, one mountebank, as many ghost ships as possible, and some oracles. Well, eventually someone points out that oracle can counter GS pretty well. Hm. Getting enough villages seemed like the big issue. And some people thought to skip the Mountebank entirely, just throttle toward an engine. Margrave I think is weak, because in general it's weak in engines (or rather, against them). Reason is, it gives them a chance to take 3 cards out of 6, which gives them a good chance of kicking their engine off. You know, it's not so hard to have an engine fire off a 3 card hand when you get to pick those 3 cards. Of course, masq can be like an attack in these situations, which should give some very nice tactical decisions about what to keep when attacked, in case you get hit with masq. Which is probably why I'd still go GS as the cornerstone of my draw in the engine.

Set 5: I think consensus was a univ/wharf/WV engine. Scrying pool is too slow. Forge we liked at some point, if it fell to you right. Embargo got tossed around a bit. What to embargo? Well, I think embargoing university could have been interesting. And Peddlers are liable to run out fast. Um, not that this was a boring set, but I can't think of a lot to say right now.

Set 6: Ah, yes. Everyone in chat was screaming for big goons play. We were SHOCKED that we didn't see more of it. There were sorta two camps. One (which I advocated) was Inn+Menagerie+goons. The other was Governor+WV+Goons. Well, okay, everyone wanted to combine both of those. And a lot of people were in the middle totally (but man, how many buys do you have? Which do you prioritize?) The reason I like going more inn-heavy is you can buy coppers more generously. Also, don't know what you're doing with either one early, really. But the governors give you a better chance at a mega mega turn. Hard to know. Oh, and tunnel has lots of nice interactions here, tunnel/inn, tunnel/adventurer... but it must be far too slow and too weak (as in, you won't get enough points with all the green cards out if you don't goons at all) to compete. Anyway, really shocked that they only had 2 goons each. We expected Goons to be the first pile to run.

Set 7: We had quite a discussion on this one (though not so much an argument). Fishing Village is massive. You need the actions. We wanted FV+remake opening, race the fishing villages until the pile is out. Then we wanted a couple of watchtowers, a couple hagglers (which we thought would be really important) and maybe an expand or two. Grand Markets when possible, but mostly off the gains. Eventually some schemes and menageries. Well, ok, we wanted most every card. Actually, most of us figured vault was a little too slow (and helping the opponent), even with the vault/GM and vault/Watchtower combos. We expected a pretty quick 3-pile ending, so you'd have to be tactically alert enough to get a big enough lead to defend yourself against that. Very interesting. Well, not exactly as we'd planned, but decently close to it. Don't think I like the scheme open. Oh, and the luck involved on what you pair remake with is why I rather dislike that card.

Set 8: You know, I'm saying that this has lots of great cards to fight ambassador. But it's a colony game, AND there's a village. So you have to go for it. There was some disagreement whether to go Amb/Amb or Caravan/Amb. Oh, and like most of the sets, we saw a big first turn advantage here. Except, even bigger here. Ambassador does that. Biggest 1st-turn advantage card in the game. At some point, I even talked about going triple ambassador here, though I don't think there's enough of an engine, lacking TR, KC, or any real card draw. So, I figured it's likely to be decided on who wins the ambassador war. Which is likely player one. Sorta boring and sad really. Take the colonies out and it's much better - warehouse, bureaucrat, merchant ship, crossroads, all help you fight amb. And WV, crossroads, caravan really help amb. So it woulda been a nice potential for a good dichotomy.

Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2012, 01:43:02 pm »
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I've played a couple of games similar to set 6 and I'm pretty sure that you want governor with both ghost ship and goons but the ghost ship is the stronger and more important.
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shark_bait

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2012, 02:11:30 pm »
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Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

Have you no faith in the engine WW!  I think IW/G can be beat by the engine.  Open IW/Chapel, get a trim deck and use highways/ironworks to get your engine parts extremely fast.  I'd go for a fishing village/watchtower/highway/goons engine looking to end the game on 3-piles while accumulating VP chips and disposing extra buys (if any) with watchtower.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2012, 02:17:26 pm »
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Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

Have you no faith in the engine WW!  I think IW/G can be beat by the engine.  Open IW/Chapel, get a trim deck and use highways/ironworks to get your engine parts extremely fast.  I'd go for a fishing village/watchtower/highway/goons engine looking to end the game on 3-piles while accumulating VP chips and disposing extra buys (if any) with watchtower.
Well... I mean, it's possible. But IW/G is so FAST. And if you're grabbing IW, that only helps me get my piles.

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2012, 02:27:54 pm »
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Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

Have you no faith in the engine WW!  I think IW/G can be beat by the engine.  Open IW/Chapel, get a trim deck and use highways/ironworks to get your engine parts extremely fast.  I'd go for a fishing village/watchtower/highway/goons engine looking to end the game on 3-piles while accumulating VP chips and disposing extra buys (if any) with watchtower.
Well... I mean, it's possible. But IW/G is so FAST. And if you're grabbing IW, that only helps me get my piles.

I'm with shark_bait on this one. IW/G is fast but with goons and colonies you can eclipse gardens points pretty easily in 10-12 turns. I think this set is actually quite interesting. Against pure IW/Gardens, goons, highway, watchtower, FV engine should stomp it, ignoring attacks. But against another engine, the attacks might become more relevant, to the point an IGG deck might work, but then the IW/gardens deck should beat the IGG/gardens deck.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2012, 02:30:18 pm by jonts26 »
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shark_bait

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2012, 02:31:47 pm »
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Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

Have you no faith in the engine WW!  I think IW/G can be beat by the engine.  Open IW/Chapel, get a trim deck and use highways/ironworks to get your engine parts extremely fast.  I'd go for a fishing village/watchtower/highway/goons engine looking to end the game on 3-piles while accumulating VP chips and disposing extra buys (if any) with watchtower.
Well... I mean, it's possible. But IW/G is so FAST. And if you're grabbing IW, that only helps me get my piles.

I'd probably just open with IW and stop with one.  So I wouldn't really be helping empty that pile all that much.
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jonts26

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2012, 02:42:02 pm »
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http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-114047-0111bfd3.html

Here's 30 points in 10 turns, which is about what you'd expect from IW/gardens at game end (maybe a touch more, but close). And if I had an extra turn or two to play with, I could double that easily.

EDIT: well, gardens might get to 4 points each, but that's not happening unless the game lasts 14 or so turns. And in that case the 40ish points for IW/Gardens certainly won't be enough.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2012, 02:45:11 pm by jonts26 »
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2012, 02:50:46 pm »
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Impressive log. You're lucky as all get out there, but yeah, you're probably right.

RisingJaguar

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2012, 02:58:56 pm »
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http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-114047-0111bfd3.html

Here's 30 points in 10 turns, which is about what you'd expect from IW/gardens at game end (maybe a touch more, but close). And if I had an extra turn or two to play with, I could double that easily.

EDIT: well, gardens might get to 4 points each, but that's not happening unless the game lasts 14 or so turns. And in that case the 40ish points for IW/Gardens certainly won't be enough.
At first I was on the side of the engine, but now I'm starting to side on the IW/G side in a different manner.  I think chapelling to that is actually very fast.  I haven't gotten the correct manner just yet, and also considering that the other engine builder would want fishing villages, I think this works.  The fact this is a colony game REALLY hurts the IW/G side though. 

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-115632-8b1d937a.html

I get to 31 points in 11 turns while ending the game. 

Edit: This took me awhile to figure out, so seeing this in a game 9 would probably be slim. 

Another game stopping at 7 fishing villages (2 were gained last turn, so if the other dude had 5 FV, my engine still works fine).  30 cards in deck, 10 turns, about 30ish points.  I also don't grab a gardens till turn 8? so maybe its deceptive too?

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-120857-3cdf9025.html
« Last Edit: January 29, 2012, 03:12:09 pm by RisingJaguar »
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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2012, 03:07:05 pm »
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Set 9:Boooooring. Nothing here to stop IW/Gardens. Fishing village helps that, so, so much. Sure, the other stuff is mega-powered, but it can't get off the ground fast enough. Even with all the help it has. Well, okay, there's a lot of help. Maybe not SO bad. But I seriously think IW/G is the beast here.

Have you no faith in the engine WW!  I think IW/G can be beat by the engine.  Open IW/Chapel, get a trim deck and use highways/ironworks to get your engine parts extremely fast.  I'd go for a fishing village/watchtower/highway/goons engine looking to end the game on 3-piles while accumulating VP chips and disposing extra buys (if any) with watchtower.
Well... I mean, it's possible. But IW/G is so FAST. And if you're grabbing IW, that only helps me get my piles.

I'd probably just open with IW and stop with one.  So I wouldn't really be helping empty that pile all that much.
Agreed. Love these types of boards because there is almost always a better strategy, you just have to look away from that main strategy and look towards a different one, one that at first glance looks bad, but in fact is the dominant strategy. Overall, I fully agree with Shark_Bait and I love the board. I wonder what would happen if someone didn't use watch tower for trashing. There can be a few variations of this same action chain strategy with varying effectiveness. Hmm I might try out some stuff later :)

Also, as a game 9 this is just awesome as it puts both players to have to muster up all their brain  power they have left to analyze the board really deeply. Whoever made this one(again don't announce yourselves until after the winner of this is announced) thank you so much :).
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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2012, 03:10:24 pm »
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http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-114047-0111bfd3.html

Here's 30 points in 10 turns, which is about what you'd expect from IW/gardens at game end (maybe a touch more, but close). And if I had an extra turn or two to play with, I could double that easily.

EDIT: well, gardens might get to 4 points each, but that's not happening unless the game lasts 14 or so turns. And in that case the 40ish points for IW/Gardens certainly won't be enough.
At first I was on the side of the engine, but now I'm starting to side on the IW/G side in a different manner.  I think chapelling to that is actually very fast.  I haven't gotten the correct manner just yet, and also considering that the other engine builder would want fishing villages, I think this works.  The fact this is a colony game REALLY hurts the IW/G side though. 

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-115632-8b1d937a.html

I get to 31 points in 11 turns while ending the game. 

Edit: This took me awhile to figure out, so seeing this in a game 9 would probably be slim.

Now chapeling into a Gardens strategy here is a very interesting move, and one I hadn't considered. I do think you get pretty lucky here, but it does look a bit more competitive than the more traditional IW/Gardens in this case, particularly since you can expect the engine builder to help drain those FV's.
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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2012, 04:35:04 pm »
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http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-114047-0111bfd3.html

Here's 30 points in 10 turns, which is about what you'd expect from IW/gardens at game end (maybe a touch more, but close). And if I had an extra turn or two to play with, I could double that easily.

EDIT: well, gardens might get to 4 points each, but that's not happening unless the game lasts 14 or so turns. And in that case the 40ish points for IW/Gardens certainly won't be enough.
At first I was on the side of the engine, but now I'm starting to side on the IW/G side in a different manner.  I think chapelling to that is actually very fast.  I haven't gotten the correct manner just yet, and also considering that the other engine builder would want fishing villages, I think this works.  The fact this is a colony game REALLY hurts the IW/G side though. 

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201201/29/game-20120129-115632-8b1d937a.html

I get to 31 points in 11 turns while ending the game. 

Edit: This took me awhile to figure out, so seeing this in a game 9 would probably be slim.

Now chapeling into a Gardens strategy here is a very interesting move, and one I hadn't considered. I do think you get pretty lucky here, but it does look a bit more competitive than the more traditional IW/Gardens in this case, particularly since you can expect the engine builder to help drain those FV's.
I would venture a guess that it all depends how quickly gets their Goons, as it really does mess up with the IW/G hand (or the way i play it with FV/watchtower).  That part is something hard to solitaire (when I would normally be attacked by Goons).
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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2012, 03:26:59 am »
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My favorites:

1. Set 5: I don't mind that it's going to be fast game, I like that Embargo is available which may mess with things. The key to winning with a set like this is timing. When are you going to pick up which critical piece for your engine? Is there enough time for the Potion buys? Both Uni and SP can be great, but again, is there time? With Embargo, maybe... I doubt whether it being Colony actually makes any difference, because this will always be a 3-pile game. However, one player snagging a Colony may upset this delicate balance.

2. Set 2: This set was a close second for me. I love the overflow of VP cards for Crossroads and Silk Roads. The only thing is... what do you need to pick up and when? You'd love to have all the cards and as much of them as you can, but at some point you have to make the switch and go for all green instead of mixed green. When will this point of no return be reached by the players? Very interesting board.

3. Set 7: There are many ways to get to those crucial GMs here. Racing Vault -> GM is certainly always a decent one, but I'd rather open Remake, because FV/Watchtower in itself is also a juicy little engine and provides some coin after trashing Estates and Coppers. I think a Remake-engine is faster in the end than just going Silver/Silver/Vault/GM, but I'd like to see this one played out by the best players. Embargo could screw things up, but I doubt whether any player is willing to pay the oppertunity cost of Embargoing GMs instead of going for them himself.
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RisingJaguar

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2012, 10:10:49 am »
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3. Set 7: There are many ways to get to those crucial GMs here. Racing Vault -> GM is certainly always a decent one, but I'd rather open Remake, because FV/Watchtower in itself is also a juicy little engine and provides some coin after trashing Estates and Coppers. I think a Remake-engine is faster in the end than just going Silver/Silver/Vault/GM, but I'd like to see this one played out by the best players. Embargo could screw things up, but I doubt whether any player is willing to pay the oppertunity cost of Embargoing GMs instead of going for them himself.
Isn't this what occurred? Am I misunderstanding here again? :( They opened remake and made FV/Watchtower engines.  Embargo also came into play because haggler allows for gaining shenanigans.
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Anon79

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2012, 12:11:05 pm »
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I originally voted for Set 9, but I changed my mind when I realised that it basically has a lot of cards that are known to be awesome by conventional wisdom. Chapel, FV, Bridge, Mountebank, Goons, then basically glue in the form of Ironworks/Watchtower/Gardens, and round off with Highway and IGG. Looks an interesting board sure, but too many "good" cards for me.

I changed my vote to Set 8, primarily due to the presence of Secret Chamber. Looking at all the sets, we don't see many "bad" cards in there - but this set has SC when the only thing resembling a deck-inspection attack (Bureaucrat) looks weak, and made it shine against traditional Ambassador play as so beautifully demonstrated by olneyce.
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theory

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2012, 12:15:21 pm »
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Is it just a coincidence that the only unplayed set is the one leading the poll?  I confess that I did not at all expect it to be as popular as the poll suggests.  Then again, the crowd is more reliable than the individual.
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Davio

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2012, 12:17:12 pm »
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3. Set 7: There are many ways to get to those crucial GMs here. Racing Vault -> GM is certainly always a decent one, but I'd rather open Remake, because FV/Watchtower in itself is also a juicy little engine and provides some coin after trashing Estates and Coppers. I think a Remake-engine is faster in the end than just going Silver/Silver/Vault/GM, but I'd like to see this one played out by the best players. Embargo could screw things up, but I doubt whether any player is willing to pay the oppertunity cost of Embargoing GMs instead of going for them himself.
Isn't this what occurred? Am I misunderstanding here again? :( They opened remake and made FV/Watchtower engines.  Embargo also came into play because haggler allows for gaining shenanigans.
This is indeed what occured, but I still like this set. :)
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2012, 12:19:53 pm »
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Is it just a coincidence that the only unplayed set is the one leading the poll?  I confess that I did not at all expect it to be as popular as the poll suggests.  Then again, the crowd is more reliable than the individual.
In picking the correct opinion? I don't really understand the last point, since this is a totally subjective poll; it's a popularity contest, basically.

Razzishi

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2012, 01:05:41 pm »
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I'm thinking theory hasn't mentioned that the administrators put their lesser favorites at later games because they'd be less likely to be used, which suggests that 9 is their least favorite.

Also, I swear I thought up the basic idea for at least 3 of these sets and only ending up submitting 2, but I have absolutely no idea which 2 they would have been.  Given other people almost certainly had the same ideas with different details, even if I remember which two ideas I submitted I couldn't be really sure that any of my kingdoms were picked.  And of course I can't seem to find anywhere my sent PMs would be.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2012, 01:10:35 pm by Razzishi »
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popsofctown

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2012, 02:39:21 pm »
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Why so many Grand Markets?
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theory

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Re: Final Voting: 2011 DominionStrategy.com Kingdom Design Challenge
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2012, 03:16:44 pm »
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Why so many Grand Markets?
Funny note: in compiling the sets, I made a list of 16 final candidates.  In that list, 100 different Kingdom cards were included, with Gardens, Grand Market, Worker's Village, and Ironworks being in a 4-way tie at 4.

This one is actually technically slightly more diverse: still 4 with GMarket and Worker's Village, but 62 Kingdom cards represented (out of a possible ~90).


Wow my numbers are totally off.  Let me redo them.
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