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Author Topic: M85: Olympics Mafia (Game Over!)  (Read 27964 times)

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Joseph2302

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #275 on: August 22, 2016, 05:32:51 pm »

Seprix has not been scummy and the votes on him are bad. Once again, he does things like this as town all the time. I have not played a game where he was scum, but I would expect him to actually be more careful when he has more information to work with. His blunders are an indication that he is town. Read any of his games.
What do the others, more experienced players (especially silver, mail und Roadrunner) think?
Woah I'm in the elite 'experienced player' group?
And I'm not? :(
I've played more games here than RR
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SpaceAnemone

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #276 on: August 22, 2016, 06:12:30 pm »

I'd vote for Joseph now but I'm curious what the next vote count will look like vote: Joseph

Hey! Is this another silent L-1, or am I miscounting?
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Seprix

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #277 on: August 22, 2016, 06:13:57 pm »

I'd vote for Joseph now but I'm curious what the next vote count will look like vote: Joseph

Hey! Is this another silent L-1, or am I miscounting?

Did you take into account that I am not voting for Joseph anymore? At least, I'm pretty sure I'm not...?

unvote in case
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #278 on: August 22, 2016, 06:14:27 pm »

I'd vote for Joseph now but I'm curious what the next vote count will look like vote: Joseph

Hey! Is this another silent L-1, or am I miscounting?

Oh, wait, no.. I may be confusing votes for Seprix and Joseph. Sorry, guys!
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Calamitas

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #279 on: August 22, 2016, 06:34:55 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now. The interaction between those two is just weird. The following things have drawn my attention:

1. In #89 iguana reacts quite harshly to a post from Seprix
2. In #114 iguana attacks Seprix for his accusatiom of me
3. Suddenly iguana defends Seprix when he was accused (#161)

And now starts the more interesting part:

4. Seprix voting for iguana in #204 in a post containing "by the way". (I think that is supposed to make the post look more spontaneous, but does it over the top IMO)
5. Iguana naming the error and seprix correcting the mistake within the minute
6. Seprix claiming iguana is not a good lynch option
7. After me posting my thoughts in #262 Seprix and iguana have been more active than before (which for itself is understandable)
8. Within 7, iguana defended seprix again (#265) just to attack him a few posts later again (#269) which matches the pattern of number 1 respectively 3

IMO the behavior above is very weird either way. I cannot think of a regular explanation for all that kind of flip-flopping. However, if they would really form the mafia, wouldn't they be more careful since they are quite experienced?
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #280 on: August 22, 2016, 06:44:28 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now. The interaction between those two is just weird. The following things have drawn my attention:

1. In #89 iguana reacts quite harshly to a post from Seprix
2. In #114 iguana attacks Seprix for his accusatiom of me
3. Suddenly iguana defends Seprix when he was accused (#161)

And now starts the more interesting part:

4. Seprix voting for iguana in #204 in a post containing "by the way". (I think that is supposed to make the post look more spontaneous, but does it over the top IMO)
5. Iguana naming the error and seprix correcting the mistake within the minute
6. Seprix claiming iguana is not a good lynch option
7. After me posting my thoughts in #262 Seprix and iguana have been more active than before (which for itself is understandable)
8. Within 7, iguana defended seprix again (#265) just to attack him a few posts later again (#269) which matches the pattern of number 1 respectively 3

IMO the behavior above is very weird either way. I cannot think of a regular explanation for all that kind of flip-flopping. However, if they would really form the mafia, wouldn't they be more careful since they are quite experienced?

Calling scumteams day 1 usually doesn't lead to good reads.

However, I don't like iguana's flip floppiness on Seprix either, so he's on the scummy side of things.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #281 on: August 22, 2016, 06:50:52 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now. The interaction between those two is just weird. The following things have drawn my attention:

1. In #89 iguana reacts quite harshly to a post from Seprix
2. In #114 iguana attacks Seprix for his accusatiom of me
3. Suddenly iguana defends Seprix when he was accused (#161)

And now starts the more interesting part:

4. Seprix voting for iguana in #204 in a post containing "by the way". (I think that is supposed to make the post look more spontaneous, but does it over the top IMO)
5. Iguana naming the error and seprix correcting the mistake within the minute
6. Seprix claiming iguana is not a good lynch option
7. After me posting my thoughts in #262 Seprix and iguana have been more active than before (which for itself is understandable)
8. Within 7, iguana defended seprix again (#265) just to attack him a few posts later again (#269) which matches the pattern of number 1 respectively 3

IMO the behavior above is very weird either way. I cannot think of a regular explanation for all that kind of flip-flopping. However, if they would really form the mafia, wouldn't they be more careful since they are quite experienced?

Calling scumteams day 1 usually doesn't lead to good reads.

However, I don't like iguana's flip floppiness on Seprix either, so he's on the scummy side of things.
As I said, its probably nothing but otherwise I cannot make any sense of that behavior (even though it would be really bad mafia play either).
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #282 on: August 22, 2016, 07:11:56 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now. The interaction between those two is just weird. The following things have drawn my attention:

1. In #89 iguana reacts quite harshly to a post from Seprix
2. In #114 iguana attacks Seprix for his accusatiom of me
3. Suddenly iguana defends Seprix when he was accused (#161)

And now starts the more interesting part:

4. Seprix voting for iguana in #204 in a post containing "by the way". (I think that is supposed to make the post look more spontaneous, but does it over the top IMO)
5. Iguana naming the error and seprix correcting the mistake within the minute
6. Seprix claiming iguana is not a good lynch option
7. After me posting my thoughts in #262 Seprix and iguana have been more active than before (which for itself is understandable)
8. Within 7, iguana defended seprix again (#265) just to attack him a few posts later again (#269) which matches the pattern of number 1 respectively 3

IMO the behavior above is very weird either way. I cannot think of a regular explanation for all that kind of flip-flopping. However, if they would really form the mafia, wouldn't they be more careful since they are quite experienced?

Calling scumteams day 1 usually doesn't lead to good reads.

However, I don't like iguana's flip floppiness on Seprix either, so he's on the scummy side of things.
As I said, its probably nothing but otherwise I cannot make any sense of that behavior (even though it would be really bad mafia play either).

I think Iguana's actions are independent reactions to Seprix; if you don't try to join them up looking for a pattern, they make quite a lot of sense in isolation. I mean, it seems to be taken as fact that Seprix has a scummy-feeling meta, so it will do Iguana no good to deny it. But if Seprix has wound Iguana up, then it's also totally understandable that Iguana might make a post like the one where he was basically just accusing Seprix of massive OMGUS. Of course, the people who'd have the most difficulty building a coherent narative through their posts would be the scums, who're busy trying to manufacture fake arguments...

I'm at risk of seeming like I'm only interested in tunnelling Iguana here. I also think Seprix's suspicion-list is also valid, and would generally like to hear more from those players, especially if we take it that Seprix's general play style tends to run people the wrong way in terms of scumminess.

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #283 on: August 22, 2016, 07:26:18 pm »

ok, I'll explain my point and my "+1" to mail-mi.

I wrote some ideas on Seprix and maybe they weren't very approving on the expert eye, but they were to me. Then, Seprix explained to me his mistakes and then IMO became strangely aggressive. After that I put +1 to mail-mi's message, because after some time I have really become more sure about Seprix. Das ist alles.

As was mentioned many times I neither a professional nor know how other players play. So, it's just my opinion, not "sheeping".
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #284 on: August 22, 2016, 07:38:26 pm »

ok, I'll explain my point and my "+1" to mail-mi.

I wrote some ideas on Seprix and maybe they weren't very approving on the expert eye, but they were to me. Then, Seprix explained to me his mistakes and then IMO became strangely aggressive. After that I put +1 to mail-mi's message, because after some time I have really become more sure about Seprix. Das ist alles.

As was mentioned many times I neither a professional nor know how other players play. So, it's just my opinion, not "sheeping".

That "strangely aggressive" part is I think the main component is what people are talking about when they say he acts scummily all the time. If you re-read but try to separate tone from actual play content, do you feel any differently?
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #285 on: August 22, 2016, 08:33:01 pm »

Seprix has not been scummy and the votes on him are bad. Once again, he does things like this as town all the time. I have not played a game where he was scum, but I would expect him to actually be more careful when he has more information to work with. His blunders are an indication that he is town. Read any of his games.
What do the others, more experienced players (especially silver, mail und Roadrunner) think?
igu is 100% correct
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #286 on: August 22, 2016, 08:35:58 pm »

initially, I was of course mainly trying to provoke reactions.

it really depends on how you react, how believable it is, but generally, voting is the best reaction, not doing anything is the worst.

Joseph hasn't done anything and his push on Seprix is pretty telling. What Seprix did isn't alignment indicative and Joseph should know that.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #287 on: August 22, 2016, 08:39:45 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #288 on: August 22, 2016, 08:56:14 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
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Calamitas

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #289 on: August 22, 2016, 09:09:46 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
Previously you agreed with me, that their flip-floppiness was kinda weird. Calling them the scum team was perhaps kind of premature, but I still believe that my argumentation is valid. I am far from beeing sure, however, one cannot deny that there is some evidence.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #290 on: August 22, 2016, 09:53:05 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
Previously you agreed with me, that their flip-floppiness was kinda weird.

I don't think I did.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #291 on: August 22, 2016, 09:53:25 pm »

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right?

yeah.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #292 on: August 22, 2016, 10:02:12 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
Previously you agreed with me, that their flip-floppiness was kinda weird.

I don't think I did.
I meant mail-mi ;)
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #293 on: August 22, 2016, 10:03:43 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
Previously you agreed with me, that their flip-floppiness was kinda weird. Calling them the scum team was perhaps kind of premature, but I still believe that my argumentation is valid. I am far from beeing sure, however, one cannot deny that there is some evidence.

I do agree with you on that point. But you're being super hedgey about it the scum team you're calling, and about your reads on them if I'm not mistaken.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #294 on: August 22, 2016, 10:07:11 pm »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

You mean, if Calamitas is scum right? Or if Calamitas is town?

Speaking of him, that most recent post about calling the scum team was kinda scummy. I wouldn't be unhappy to lynch him today.
Previously you agreed with me, that their flip-floppiness was kinda weird. Calling them the scum team was perhaps kind of premature, but I still believe that my argumentation is valid. I am far from beeing sure, however, one cannot deny that there is some evidence.

I do agree with you on that point. But you're being super hedgey about it the scum team you're calling, and about your reads on them if I'm not mistaken.
Of course I am since I don't know anything for certain. I just have a relatively strong suspicion, but still don't think we should act prematurely.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #295 on: August 22, 2016, 11:40:49 pm »

My narrative on Seprix has been 100% consistent. I think much of what he's done has been detrimental to town, particularly because he does things that so easily draw votes among a playerbase that doesn't know him.
 
Nevertheless, Seprix always does things like this, which puts his behavior well within his town meta. Therefore, I townread him. I don't think I've ever indicated that I thought he was scum this game.

Basically, I've criticized Seprix because I can be a condescending jerk. Don't mistake that for a scum narrative. My only vested interest in keeping him alive is so that I can fulfill my town!Trampoline win condition.
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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #296 on: August 23, 2016, 06:12:26 am »

Probably its just "coincidence", but i kind of believe in the Seprix-iguana mafia by now.

And I'm calling Joseph - Calamitas.

Seriously though, if we lynch Calamitas, this mostly means town points to Seprix. Of course that doesn't matter anymore if we lynch the other scum first.

I don't buy that scum team as things stand, mainly because I'm reading you as considerably more scummy than Calamitas.

The fact your second sentence hints at a strategy where we lynch Joseph first has me worried, though, because I'm wary of falling into some scum trap :-/ That's because Joseph is someone I wouldn't mind seeing more scrutiny on, so that part of your subtly-hinted plan is something I could probably get behind. If you'd said Joseph-LaLight, I'd have found your overall call more compelling.

What was it you were fishing for when you were pushing newbies to elaborate on experience? The fact that Calamitas and I have IRL werewolf experience, and that LaLight admits to a lot of high-level IRL Mafia experience on top of werewolf  makes me wonder why you'd single Calamitas out. Unless you're going solely on the early shade Calamitas through on Joseph as a newbie trying to put distance between the scum buddies, and what you were fishing for wasn't over-performing noob, but actual lack of experience. Still, that doesn't really gel with your hidden player thing. I still think you're just being screwy with a lot of this :-(

In conclusion, I no longer feel that Iguana is the single most scummy prospect out there, so unvote.
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Town games: M84(L), M85(W), M86(L), M87(W), M88(L), M90(L), M92(W), M94(L), M97(L), M99(W), M100(L), M104(W), M107(W), M110(L), M112(L), RMM37(L), RMM40(D), RMM41(L), RMM43(L), RMM47(W), ZM23(W).
Scum games: M89(D), M108(L), NM8(W&MVP), NM10(L)   Mod: NM9, RMM38, RMM42.   Pronouns: they/them

silverspawn

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #297 on: August 23, 2016, 09:04:00 am »

You're taking the Calamitas comments too seriously. The scum-team call was a joke, and the "if we lynch Calamitas" was just that; if we do lynch him, we know something.

I should have said 'if he flips scum' instead to not make it sound like I want to lynch him.

as for the questions about experience, it's always helpful to know, because some kinds behavior gets more or less scummy depending on that.
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SpaceAnemone

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #298 on: August 23, 2016, 10:14:17 am »

You're taking the Calamitas comments too seriously. The scum-team call was a joke, and the "if we lynch Calamitas" was just that; if we do lynch him, we know something.

I should have said 'if he flips scum' instead to not make it sound like I want to lynch him.

Gah. You're still being annoyingly noncommittal and screwy. Most of the experienced players won't back a D1 lynch on you, though, will they?

Vote: Joseph
My reasoning being:
1) The early scum claim is null, but I still dislike it as establishment of an unhelpful meta.
2) He comments that the scum team probably want to keep him alive as an easy mis-lynch.
3) A "catch-up" at post #174 that ignored the actual conversations that had happened in the meantime.
4) Long disappearance which he even admits was over the 24-hour limit ("barely" still counts as "over"!).
5) He contributes nothing in terms of personal analysis of others' posts...
6) ... and yet be complains that SS's empty content isn't helping!
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Congratulations! Your SpaceAnemone evolved into UniverseAnemone!
Town games: M84(L), M85(W), M86(L), M87(W), M88(L), M90(L), M92(W), M94(L), M97(L), M99(W), M100(L), M104(W), M107(W), M110(L), M112(L), RMM37(L), RMM40(D), RMM41(L), RMM43(L), RMM47(W), ZM23(W).
Scum games: M89(D), M108(L), NM8(W&MVP), NM10(L)   Mod: NM9, RMM38, RMM42.   Pronouns: they/them

silverspawn

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Re: M85: Olympics Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #299 on: August 23, 2016, 11:45:02 am »

You're taking the Calamitas comments too seriously. The scum-team call was a joke, and the "if we lynch Calamitas" was just that; if we do lynch him, we know something.

I should have said 'if he flips scum' instead to not make it sound like I want to lynch him.

Gah. You're still being annoyingly noncommittal and screwy. Most of the experienced players won't back a D1 lynch on you, though, will they?

I reject the first adjective claim. "If X is scum than Y looks town" is a useful thing to state, and that was all I did. I just committed on Joseph, so I'm not non-committal.

I'm not sure if I want to reject the second, it sounds kind of nice, though I don't quite know what it means.

Have a weirdly unfitting image of an angry old lady:
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