Here's the longer version of my take on Mail-mi's motivations and inconsistencies for much of the game.
Early game: jumps around a bit with reasonable RVS explanations, then starts the teamlyle mislynch.
"Thanks for making me explain, it just made me a lot more sure of this vote." (#126) This is a very "look at this and follow me" kind of statement.
The "new Mail-mi" thing in #175 could also be explained by being more engaged earlier on through being scum.
The "what he said" thing with Silver (#180) -- posting without content, and echoing a town person.
#205-206 Calamitas queries whether mail-mi has already voted teamlyle -- e.g. Calamitas is keeping a close eye on where his scumbuddy and the mislynch are going.
#225-226 Mail-mi and Calamitas are the first two to express shock over the mislynch, moments after the vote count, so they were clearly watching the wagon very closely.
#250: "That depends on if the mafia knew about the traitor, I'd guess." A set piece explanation? Especially given that it's Calamitas he's responding to...
#255: Very fast onto the chairs mislynch wagon without any new argument: "seems good. vote: chairs Wagons!"
#266: This is a really tenuous grab at pointing out a scumslip! Chairs said Seprix's partners didn't know he existed, and Mail-mi jumped on it, whereas surely there's an implicit "probably didn't know" for most of us when reading that, yes?
#318: gkrieg didn't like that mail-mi was sheeping the chairs case. All mail-mi responds is that he thought it was a good case.. no other argument necessary, and again he's only echoing people he already knows to be town.
#319: But then he immediately jumps to a "pressure vote" on diedre anyway.
#321: Post from Calamitas that points out that mail-mi's behaviour might be scummy or towny, but leans "mildly scummy" in a very polite nonconfrontational way. The fact he says that mail-mi being townie is "absolutely realisic" looks bad in light of Calamitas's flip result.
#329, #332, #334: this could be a premeditated exchange about me being "scummy"/abstent. Mail-mi and Calamitas are still being super-nice to each other -- this is the only instance of "thx" in the whole game.
#364: Silver's suspicion on mail-mi for being quick to sheep gkreig's "basic" reads. It seems true that scum should follow any expereinced player with a good argument on a town player, and Mail-mi's doing exactly that with gkreig's vote on Chairs.
#381 "I am going to want an explanation for that" -- seems an odd way of sounding suspicious at Silver being weird about a diedre lynch.
#398: Jumps onto me for my selfconscious segue into a post where I actually vote. This is another example of him being really opportunistic with his voting switches.
#415: Reads as scummy something gkrieg reads as townie in #416 -- more opportunistic blame-casting. (in relation to diedre's "I meant it!" post at #412).
#420: Silver goes back to voting Mail-mi for opportunism.
#428: Silver points out possible scumslip by Mail-mi, who counters it as lazy typing at #449. It may well be a real slip. Mail-mi doesn't seem to recall that he has made more or less the same accusation to Chairs about his alledged slip back around #266.
#453: Refuses to get drawn into a speculation about what scum roles could have killed Seprix. Maybe because he doesn't want scum speculation, and/or would find it hard because he actually knows exactly what's going on with the scum team?
#459: Goes way back to re-quoting my post at #395 to throw extra suspicion at me. Absolutely does not engage with all the reasonable thought-process stuff I posted in the meantime to explain exactly where I was coming from and why (e.g post #456). He's deliberately drawing expereinced town's attention away from my arguments.
#478: This is the second time he's posted about his other game as an excuse for not being more engaged.. which is also perfect cover.
#526: Asking Silver about his shade on Calamitas, and pointing out a "pretty null" read on him in the process. Worried for his partner?
#565: Votes for me (after switching momentarily to iguana) and says "I guess I could be convinced on Calamitas, though I'd prefer SA or chairs, maybe diedre." -- which puts his scumbuddy in the perfect noncommittal location, pretty much favouring all the other non-ICs over him.
#579: "That's pretty convincing. Will vote for Calamitas if SA doesn't happen." Compare this to the way he opportunistically jumped on every mislynch going earlier in the game.
#623: "If he was scum, he would know that not mafia only has one night kill." This one I really don't like, not least because it made no grammatical sense. I think he's saying that I would know that mafia only has one night kill (just with a misplaced "not" in the middle), but because he misgendered me yet again, I thought there was a chance he might really be talking about someone else (Chairs?) and I might just be confused. This whole exchange was also late at night for me (almost midnight) in the middle of a 48-hour ultra-busy period for my company, so I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt, and I asked him to re-word it rather than immediately assuming the worst. Also "Though it also looks like he knows there's only two scum, when we don't know that for sure..." -- he's got this bizarre objection to me making a numbers assumption in any reasoning, even though I got it from someone far more experienced than me (it was either gkrieg or iguana, I think; can't remember now), and in the particular case I was quoting, it was a particular reaction to iguana suggesting a particular scum pairing... so me assuming that same pairing in commenting on that pairing was the only logical thing to do. The fact he was trying to pick at it seemed like a really unfounded attack.
#628-#630: He reacts totally really agressively to what I thought was a reasonable question about what his non-grammatical sentence was trying to say. I still don't think he's noticed he wasn't talking sense by #630 when he still also doesn't seem to have read my comment about assuming two scums. He's willfully reading for what he wants to see and pick holes in, rather than what people like me are actually writing!
#635: Still puts Calamitas on his lynch list (since Silver is making a case), but right at the end, so that there's no real danger of having to go down that far.
#641: "Oh. That clears things up a little bit." Too late for me because his outright attacks about me still stand there, but then he already knew it was all completely unfounded.
#647: Asks why Silver and I find him opportunistic!! Also: "today my scum reads are currently you, chairs, and Calamitas to an extent." -- still putting Calamitas there, but only at the very end.
#706: "Willing" to take Calamitas off the table after Iguana's read? Convenient!
#747: Really shady-looking claim following on from Iguana's tracker result on Calamitas, but of course he had to pick Calamitas, becuase he knows Calamitas didn't perform the NK, so Calamitas onto anyone would be a totally safe redirect to claim.
#750: He didn't seem very sad about his PR being used up in a worthless way. "I was basically thinking, okay, I can choose either SA or Calamitas, my top two reads, and have them target the other. I was going back and forth a bit, but eventually settled on Calamitas. Turns out either I guessed wrong or my reads are off." Are one-shot redirectors even that common, and if so, are they used in situations like this, or saved till the PR-holder really knows what's going on well enough to make it count.
#752: "I didn't get it either really, since I've never actually seen a town redirector. I'm actually inclined to believe everyone. Iguana and you are obvious, and Calamitas seems genuine." Haha, Calamitas seems genuine. I know what I was thinking (that super-weak claimed town roles meant that Calamitas was a backup), but what were experienced players thinking? This is mosty just a question for gkrieg, obviously.
#761: "I chose wrong, out of a ~50/50 chance." This is obviously untrue, because if he'd been town, he couldn't be at all sure that his top two scum reads actually included one, much less two, scum, and it's only 50/50 at all if both people he picks are scum. Of course, he already knew that exactly 1/2 was scum, and also that that scum wasn't the one who was targetting anyone at all that night.
#763: "Calamitas maaaaayy be scum" -- this is like the nth time he's been vague about Calamitas maybe being scum, but how many times has he voted calamitas, taken anything he's said wrongly, asked him anything in a hostile manner, or asked him to repeat things he's posted -- these are all behaviours he's shown to me in trying to get me to look scummy.
#792: Summary of my pairwise reads, and I put Mail-mi-Calamitas as my second-most-likely pairing after Mail-mi-diedre. Note that almost all their interactions are cordial, and they seem to be on the same page throught, which is in stark contrast to how Mail-mi has acted towards other people, presumably because he's got to villainise us in his head in order to build cases against people he knows are really town, while still trying to sound townie.
#816 Mail-mi's re-read on me cites things (like my unvote on diedre after RR said he wasn't confident that he's scum) that I'd already explained perfectly reasonably. Of the other things he thinks are scummy, two boil down to me being self-conscious about the way I open posts and set context, which I can work on as I become less of a newbie. I still argue that my self-preservation thing is a newbie issue because it's how I'm used to playing IRL. Smiley faces as a scum read is someting Silver came up with in my first game, and it's ridiculous. Everything else in his whole D3 case on me is actually just a null or slight town read.
#863: "Rr seems different than in Olympics, and I was his partner. I really think it's space." Conveniently forgetting about Calamitas!
#881: "Unfortunately, my redirect was only 1-shot." Okay, so are we happy believing in this ultra-weak town role, even after the reveal that Gkreig's role is stronger than we'd originally thought?
#888: On gkreig's no-lynch plan: "It's not a good idea, I don't think, because in what scenario does scum not just kill you?" -- try reading this as coming from a worried scum who wants to make sure he doesn't waste a potential NK on the offchance gkrieg also has a protective component in his role!
#896: Here's another example of him trying to make me look scummy by picking at trivial things I'd already exlained. In fact, he made me go back to this again in #988 and #903 to re-quote my already-perfectly-good explanations. He may just have been being inadvertantly awful and careless, but if I stop trying to give him the benefit of the doubt, there's defintiely the potential for a more deliberate reading.
#919: Says that his D3 reads on me still apply. Those are ones I thoroughly argued against already, and half of those reads were town/null anyway.
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Topic: M84: Battlestar Galactica Mafia (Game Over - Cylons Win!) (Read 97318 times)