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Author Topic: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful  (Read 3526 times)

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Seprix

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Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« on: June 22, 2016, 12:55:56 pm »
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I think I will try to create a Dominion Challenge every week or month or I don't know, just a fun way for people to think outside of the box and create new cards/Kingdoms/ideas or something else like this. I don't mind other people making challenges as well, people have so many more useful and cool ideas than I do, anyways. Alright, so here is the first challenge.

Create a Kingdom where going for Transmute is not only viable, but the strongest strategy. It has to be the best strategy on the board, but it does not have to be Transmute Big Money or something silly. The answer is almost certainly going to be an engine with a strong incentive to get other Potion cost cards anyways, so I will include another part of the challenge: You cannot have other Potion cost cards in the Kingdom, only Transmute.

I feel that Transmute is one of the single most misunderstood cards in all of Dominion, as a direct result of its being incredibly weak. As a result, this challenge will help people to possibly see cases where picking up a Transmute may be an okay play instead of simply ignoring it. Even Scout has its uses, why not Transmute? I am looking forward to the answers people submit.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2016, 01:11:08 pm »
+1

Transmute isn't a strategy in the same way Remodel isn't a strategy.
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jsh357

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2016, 01:11:59 pm »
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Transmute, rats, silk road, throne room, royal carriage, procession, great hall, bureaucrat, secret chamber, duchess. No colony, no shelters.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2016, 01:14:55 pm by jsh357 »
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traces Around

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2016, 01:24:10 pm »
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Let's play big money!
Since straight transmute big money loses to straight big money I will assume this is okay.

Cards: transmute, crossroads, secret chamber, chancellor, develop, warehouse, coppersmith, feast, scout, walled village
Events: bonfire
Provinces/Estates

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160622/log.0.1466616004283.txt

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160622/log.0.1466616434886.txt
« Last Edit: June 22, 2016, 01:35:09 pm by traces Around »
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Chris is me

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2016, 01:28:43 pm »
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Here's one attempt that I'll flesh out and revise more later but I want to squeeze in the door now: Coin of the Realm, Cultist, Transmute, Duke, Beggar, Navigator, Cutpurse, Chancellor, Feast, Scout

Basically, if you neglect Transmute, you miss out on an easy way to trash Ruins to get Duchy for Dukes. Actions are plentiful, but not Buys, and the board is sloggy enough that Duke / Duchy should beat Province.

This challenge is a lot harder without being able to put Vineyard in the kingdom.
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Co0kieL0rd

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2016, 01:43:24 pm »
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Let's play big money!
Since straight transmute big money loses to straight big money I will assume this is okay.

Cards: transmute, crossroads, secret chamber, chancellor, develop, warehouse, coppersmith, feast, scout, walled village
Events: bonfire
Provinces/Estates

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160622/log.0.1466616004283.txt

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160622/log.0.1466616434886.txt

In both games, you only used Transmute once or twice, turning Estates into Golds, then trashed Transmute with Bonfire which is inconsequential. If Transmute is part of the best strategy on this board, why deviate from it? Also, that may sound harsh, but I don't think games against bots are proof enough.
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traces Around

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2016, 02:00:18 pm »
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In both games, you only used Transmute once or twice, turning Estates into Golds, then trashed Transmute with Bonfire which is inconsequential. If Transmute is part of the best strategy on this board, why deviate from it?

Because it runs out of stuff to do. It's not like you keep your chapel around after getting to bishop/gold/silver/silver/chapel.

Also, that may sound harsh, but I don't think games against bots are proof enough.

Ok, cool. You wouldn't mind getting onto the client then I suppose. Though if seeing 6 provinces in under 17 turns on a board without any strong draw isn't enough proof, I am not sure what is.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2016, 02:04:19 pm by traces Around »
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Dingan

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2016, 02:06:51 pm »
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Transmute, rats, silk road, throne room, royal carriage, procession, great hall, bureaucrat, secret chamber, duchess. No colony, no shelters.

I feel that Bureaucrat looks somewhat strong here, much better than Transmute.  With it, I think Provinces beat a Silk Road / Great Hall / Estate thing, although not sure.  I would replace B-crat w/ Sea Hag.  Rats certainly help as Transmute fuel, and Duchess helps cus they're free and could be Processed into Great Halls to help your Silk Roads.  But ya, I just think this kingdom needs a junker.
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math

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2016, 02:11:47 pm »
+1

Here's one attempt that I'll flesh out and revise more later but I want to squeeze in the door now: Coin of the Realm, Cultist, Transmute, Duke, Beggar, Navigator, Cutpurse, Chancellor, Feast, Scout

Basically, if you neglect Transmute, you miss out on an easy way to trash Ruins to get Duchy for Dukes. Actions are plentiful, but not Buys, and the board is sloggy enough that Duke / Duchy should beat Province.

This challenge is a lot harder without being able to put Vineyard in the kingdom.

I could be wrong, but I think straight Beggar-Duke would be stronger than Transmute, especially since Beggar also gets stronger in the presence of Cultist.  Maybe you could replace it with something else like Herbalist.
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funkdoc

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2016, 02:29:52 pm »
+3

transmute works in big wharf engines where it's the only trasher, since that payload is important and your multiple buys make the potion less painful

A Ladder

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2016, 02:32:59 pm »
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Here's my attempt:

King's Court
Duke, Stables,
Throne Room, Island
Great Hall, Warehouse
Duchess, Crossroads
Transmute

Essentially you use Transmutes to snatch up Duchies, gaining Duchess in the process as Action food for your transmutes to keep going.
Stables for non-terminal draw and Warehouse for sifting gives you a better chance of colliding your Transmutes with Actions.
Use Transmute on the the Great Halls/Islands to get Gold/Duchies at one swing.
Use TR/KC on the Transmute when you start getting action dense to grab a bunch of duchies at one swing.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2016, 02:34:17 pm by A Ladder »
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Asper

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Re: Dominion Challenge I: Make Transmute Useful
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2016, 12:37:47 pm »
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- Transmute
- Duchess
- Chancellor
- Scout
- Thief
- Feast
- Fortune Teller
- Secret Chamber
- Thief
- Rats

- Tax
- Obelisk (chosen card is Transmute)
- Tower

Key here are the Landmarks and Tax, as they make the Duchess/Duchy/Transmute three-pile gaining a lot more attractive. All other cards are supposed to be either useless, or with their only positive interaction being Transmute.
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