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Author Topic: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy  (Read 14305 times)

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crj

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #25 on: June 09, 2016, 06:45:45 pm »
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I understand your reasoning, but I really don't see anything at or below 8 as a possible right answer. I mean, it's as if they're selling an extra (super-)province, and you want to win the split 5-4. Refusing to pay more than 8 for the most "comfortable" Province can't be the right answer there.
One difference is that you buy regular Provinces at a time to suit you. the Mountain Pass might turn up at a really inconvenient moment.

I don't have a feel for how that could pan out.
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Accatitippi

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2016, 06:51:13 am »
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I understand your reasoning, but I really don't see anything at or below 8 as a possible right answer. I mean, it's as if they're selling an extra (super-)province, and you want to win the split 5-4. Refusing to pay more than 8 for the most "comfortable" Province can't be the right answer there.
One difference is that you buy regular Provinces at a time to suit you. the Mountain Pass might turn up at a really inconvenient moment.

I don't have a feel for how that could pan out.

Well, we were discussing Big Money Ultimate, and in BMU pretty much any moment is a good moment for a virtual Province, if you have a Gold in your deck.
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jomini

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2016, 09:59:22 am »
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If it's the last Province, bid <40>

If it's the last Province, nobody gets to bid.

Salt the Earth
Even then, the game ends before the "between turn" phase where Mountain Pass does it's thing

I do, however, see room for Mission, Opost, and Possession to allow you to bid 40 and forget. I am a little hazy on the last, but with debt, would it be a good idea to bid 40 just to spike your own deck against the other guy's Possession?

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crj

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2016, 11:03:15 am »
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No, because they'll stick their Possession in an Archive and wait for you to pay off your own debt before playing it?
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jomini

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #29 on: June 10, 2016, 11:55:16 am »
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No, because they'll stick their Possession in an Archive and wait for you to pay off your own debt before playing it?

I have not done more than read the cards and the Debt entry in the wiki, but here is what I am thinking:

I build a reliable Possession deck (at least one Possession play per turn).

You gain the first province after I have at least one Possession.

I immediately bid 40 debt.

When I Possess your deck, I am making decisions that you officially carry out. As such, you have no debt to pay back. I can keep gaining cards after you buy them.

You Possess my deck, you are making decisions that I officially carry out. I officially have 40 debt and those must be paid back before I can buy anything; you can gain no cards until the debt is paid.

I could be parsing wrongly here, but I think this is how you resolve debt & Possession.
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drsteelhammer

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #30 on: June 10, 2016, 11:58:53 am »
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No, because they'll stick their Possession in an Archive and wait for you to pay off your own debt before playing it?

I have not done more than read the cards and the Debt entry in the wiki, but here is what I am thinking:

I build a reliable Possession deck (at least one Possession play per turn).

You gain the first province after I have at least one Possession.

I immediately bid 40 debt.

When I Possess your deck, I am making decisions that you officially carry out. As such, you have no debt to pay back. I can keep gaining cards after you buy them.

You Possess my deck, you are making decisions that I officially carry out. I officially have 40 debt and those must be paid back before I can buy anything; you can gain no cards until the debt is paid.

I could be parsing wrongly here, but I think this is how you resolve debt & Possession.

You are only wrong in so far that gaining cards still works, just buying will be prohibited.
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crj

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #31 on: June 10, 2016, 12:03:51 pm »
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Oh, sorry - you're suggesting leaving yourself permanently in debt to stymie their Possessing you, and making progress yourself primarily by Possessing them?

OK, yes, that could work. Or it could be the most broken and frustrating mirror ever. (-8
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liopoil

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #32 on: June 10, 2016, 06:26:24 pm »
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Hey, this is pretty interesting. Here's a general solution:

Suppose each player has a value in debt which they value to 8VP at, and that this is common knowledge to everyone. Further assume that extra debt or less debt than this amount has linear value, which is the same for everyone. Now:

2 player: Bid the average of the two values, and the player who bought the province will have two equally good options. The player who values 8VP more highly benefits.

3+ player: Assume that I don't care whether my opponents get a steal or pay too much or not, because otherwise we have to deal with politics about who is in the lead, etc. Then the first player should bid at the highest value of any of his opponents, plus or minus one. There is no net gain for anyone unless the first player values it by far the highest. This is not what actually happens because we consider making opponents pay more than they want to if they bid more. For large numbers of players this fades away.

I actually don't like the politics of 3 player there ag all. The two player one is cool though - you want to run a deck which dislikes green as much as possible.
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JW

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #33 on: June 10, 2016, 06:50:37 pm »
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Hey, this is pretty interesting. Here's a general solution:

Suppose each player has a value in debt which they value to 8VP at, and that this is common knowledge to everyone. Further assume that extra debt or less debt than this amount has linear value, which is the same for everyone. Now:

2 player: Bid the average of the two values, and the player who bought the province will have two equally good options. The player who values 8VP more highly benefits.

You bid the greatest integer less than the average of the two values. E.g., if you both value it at <10.5>, you'll bid 10.
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Limetime

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2017, 09:58:30 pm »
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Who owns mountainpassbiddingstrategy.com?
Sadly it just redirects to here :(
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singletee

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2017, 10:06:04 pm »
+5

Who owns mountainpassbiddingstrategy.com?
Sadly it just redirects to here :(

I do. Did you want to do something with it? :D

Limetime

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Re: Mountain Pass Bidding Strategy
« Reply #36 on: January 04, 2017, 12:22:13 am »
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Who owns mountainpassbiddingstrategy.com?
Sadly it just redirects to here :(

I do. Did you want to do something with it? :D
You should make your own forum at forum.mountingpassbiddingstrategy.com
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