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[iguanaiguana]

Vote: Faust

Time to make the hard choice

[Seprix]

Vote: Faust

Time to make the hard choice

I'm still inclined to vote Ash.

[faust]

Vote: Faust

Time to make the hard choice

It's the wrong choice though.

[faust]

There will be a reread. With my reads on people. Hopefully laer today. But well, we still have quite some time left until the deadline.

iguana, gkrieg, what convinced you to vote me over ash?

[iguanaiguana]

I always feel bad lynching Ash, because it's so popular. I always feel good lynching you, because it's so unpopular.

In this case, where the two of you have both had such similar play, I count on the scum WIFOM to land on "Let's put a popular, hard to lynch player up against an unpopular, easy to lynch player who will probably say something really provocative."

In other words, pure meta, and mafia hipster reasons.

If it helps, I feel awful voting for either of you.

[gkrieg13]

You just seemed scummier in your defense.

[faust]

Right. Let's do a reread. All this presupposes that ash is scum, because well he is.

Joseph claims scum. Really I thik more likely a scum move. He also names ash and me as his scum buddies. One off, one on? Sounds legit.

Jimmmmm thinks ash and I are scum together because I said we weren't. Well look at that. I think minor townpoints for Jimmmmm though.

ash has a strong townread on Jimmmmm. That says nothing for now, but you know, noted for later. (By the way, note that ash says "That was not in my PM" with regards to Ghoul powers. But PMs were just links. Only later he corrects to QT.) He immediately reverses his read on Jimmmmm. What does this say? I think it says that the contfrontation wasn't planned, and thus Jimmmmm is likely town. Which means ash was the intended scum kill. Interesting.

ash has a town read on Jimmmmm and J Reggie. If Jimmmmm is indeed town, I would think that J Reggie is scum. These are the only two reads ash has at that point, and thus one is likely on a scumpartner.

gkrieg goes after Jimmmmm. His reasoning was actually decent I thought. Mild town.

I don't like that e diagrees and says we should give reads lists, but doesn't actually push that. It's the faintest of scumreads.

Also, look here! I provided the final piece of the plan:

It is still one guaranteed scum NK if we do the plan.  It fails if anyone uses their power on a different night or outside the plan.  I think we should do it N1.

I would assume that scum can no-kill.

Except they cannot:

The Mafia NK is compulsory. A town-player will be randomized if no choice was submitted.

Well, then let's do it. Looks super-broken, but I guess them's the rules.

How towny is that? (Okay, not very.)

ash votes Egor out of nowhere. Hum.

Town again on gkrieg for tunneling Jimmmmm.

Seprix is weird. Not sure yet if that is alignment-indicative. But the way he argues against the plan is a bit scummy. I mean it's not so great for scum to argue against it because it's obviously good, but I could see scum!Seprix doing it.

And then gkrieg backs off his Jimmmm read after he explains. I'm telling you, this guy is town.

Also don't like Seprix arguing with teamlyle as if he knows that he's town. More scum points.

I think at the point where ash puts teamlyle to L-3, other scum would be afraid to joi the wagon. Haddock says he thinks teamlyle is town after that. Mild scum.

ashersky switches from teamlyle to Joseph, putting both at three votes. Bold move if Joseph/ash are partners.

Egor has some towny posts.

Haddock tries to figure out a coin flip hack. Some town points are in order, even if it doesn't work.

Joseph joins the teamlyle wagon, ash puts him to L-1. Coordination? That is probably too tinfoil-y.

iguana say "No idea why we lynch teamlyle, but the wagon is good". That's a towny statement.

Seprix does not want to hammer teamlyle. Scummish caution.

That's D1. I don't think there is a whole lot to be seen from D2. I will just look at the ash wagon at peak:

gkrieg13, Seprix, faust, J Reggie, ashersky

Naturallly, all those people are less likely to be scum. Well except ash. On the other hand, maybe scum was on it and that's why ash self-voted. Meh.

Overall, let me group my reads, town to scum:

gkrieg
Jimmmmm
Egor
iguana
Haddock
e
Joseph
J Reggie
Seprix

[faust]

You just seemed scummier in your defense.

You're not giving me a whole lot to work with

[gkrieg13]

You just seemed scummier in your defense.

You're not giving me a whole lot to work with

That's partially on purpose.

Mainly it's just the feel of your defense earlier.  This last defense is a little better.  I'll really have to look over today again and maybe even read a past scum game of yours to get a real feel, but it seems to me like you are acting more like scum!faust.

[Joseph2302]

Been busy today, sorry.
Tomorrow will be catching up day for this.

[ashersky]

In Faust's re-read he says I vote Egor out of nowhere.  Just want to point out he skips over my prod request of Egor, which relates. 

[J Reggie]

So I don't really know what to think here. My gut still tells me ash is scum, but I see him finding me scummy as more likely to come from town. But I honestly can't see Faust as town here.

[J Reggie]

So I don't really know what to think here. My gut still tells me ash is scum, but I see him finding me scummy as more likely to come from town. But I honestly can't see Faust as scum here.

Ftfm

[J Reggie]

Wait did I do that right? Now the words town and scum are starting to look the same to me. I need a minute.

[J Reggie]

Sorry guys, I have a headache now. I'll clarify what I meant later. I think I'm dehydrated.

[EgorK]

Well, I'll go with my read then
Vote: ash

[Haddock]

Just reread the whole game.
Can't do a post by post on my phone but I came to
vote: faust

[faust]

I really don't know what I can do to convince you. Everyone's just giving feelings and noone can point to actual scummy things I've done. I guess part of that is that we're still very much at the start of the game... but this is wrong, and it will put us in a bad spot.

[faust]

Also this was L-2, which is really L-1 because ash is not voting. Just be careful what you do from here on.

[ashersky]

Also this was L-2, which is really L-1 because ash is not voting. Just be careful what you do from here on.

Seems awful nervous and self-aware there.

[Joseph2302]

So on a quick reread I've noticed this:

ash seems to be calm & collecting in his posting
faust seems to be very defensive & self-conscious

That's leaning me towards faust being scum.
Will reread properly this evening.

[skip wooznum]

/tag

[2.71828.....]

Sorry, work has been super busy. Will do a better reread son and post stuff

[Joseph2302]

faust D1:

Hi. I would like to have a plan. Unfortunately, I don't think there is one to be had.

Really? There wasn't a plan to be found? With hindsight this seems scummy, since there was a clever plan to be had.

It makes me sad that I am still not scum with ash, now that I finally have the chance again.

True enough.

It is still one guaranteed scum NK if we do the plan.  It fails if anyone uses their power on a different night or outside the plan.  I think we should do it N1.

I would assume that scum can no-kill.

Except they cannot:

The Mafia NK is compulsory. A town-player will be randomized if no choice was submitted.

Well, then let's do it. Looks super-broken, but I guess them's the rules.

Interesting that faust thought there was a no kill option available, town probably look at the setup a bit less, so minor town points.

I may have to retract that townread on ash sadly... something just doesn't add up. He claims to have thought about this setup for a bit, yet he didn't know there are only 1-shot ghouls. If scum!ash had the town PM available, I could see him going for this kind of fake.

Meh.

So neither ash or faust has read the setup properly. Guess that nulls the minor town read above.

I will follow the Ghoul plan tonight, target the person on the list after me.

Ash wanted to do the N1 plan before faust did, so ash seems townier from this.

Seprix does have a point that we may want to delay the usage of our nightkill (which it is, effectively). The main reason against it is that scum have more power to drive discussion in a direction of their choosing the longer all of them remain alive.

No, just no.

I don't know. This game is weird. Do people seriously believe that it's good to not give reads? Because that is bullshit.

We had this discussion in thread (#313-319), and I disagree.

Vote: Seprix

This as well. Should I hammer you?

You'll have to wait until I'm less tired and less drunk.

+1. Though as he unvoted himself he is at L-2 now

You're right. Vote: teamlyle

Late onto the mislynch, but the vote helps it happen.

Overall, I'm fairly sure faust is scum.
Will reread ash later, and look at D2.

[Joseph2302]

ash D1:

Hi. I would like to have a plan. Unfortunately, I don't think there is one to be had.

There is, in fact, a huge plan to be had.  And I have it.

Also, as is amazingly awesome, DAMA.

First post, and a towny post- would be townier if he'd actually given reasons though.

Let me lay out out for you, though.

NO ONE GIVE READS LISTS.

Ghoul is our strongest tool, guys.  Like, scum should be super scared to kill anyone due to the redirection of the kill thing.  We need to lynch three scum or Ghoul three scum or some mix of those two.  NKs are our friends if the towniest players do a good jobo f redirectioning hte kills. 

If schum knows who we think ar scum, that's a bad thing.  So no reads lists in day 1.  Capisce?

Agree with this- both the no reads and the plan.

Someone should check it to be sure.  But I think that's right.

Scum ought to be super angry in their QT right now.  Can't we just do this every night and win?

Not read the setup properly- null since faust also didn't read setup properly at another point.
Although mine doesn't say 1-shot either, and nor did teamlyle's.

Also, I'm a mason.  My partner will confirm.

Non-serious post. Minorly towny, since scum tend to be more serious.

I almost feel bad about the plan since it's one guaranteed mafia nk. It does limit us later in the game since we won't have any PR though, but I still think it's probably worth it.

If we can lynch properly today that puts us in a great spot.

Don't feel bad -- it's no worse than your perfect vigging in that game with the Chinese warriors in it.

Also, our PR kind of sucks horribly, so using it to guarantee a mafia dies is pretty awesome.

Agree with most of this. We found a loophole, and should have been able to exploit it.

You know, can't really say since we aren't doing readslists this game.  I seriously have no clue what I am going to do.  Not doing readslists is fun and exciting and different.  But tough.

We're co-ordinating the Ghoul powers, so the reason to not do reads lists is null and void anyway.

This is right.

Reads list!

1. Dune
2. 1Q84
3. Age of Myth
4. Othello

Again, non-serious post.

That's like the good ole days.  I'm almost double the nearest poster, who is surprisingly JIMMMMM.

Townpoints for Jimmmmmm for being so active.
Scumponts for Jimmmmmm for earning townpoints.

faust is strangely absent.  He's usually the top in post numbers.  Iguana/Haddock/Joseph are in the sweet acti-lurking scum slots.

vote: joseph

Encouraging posting is good.
Voting for me, not so much.

vote: teamlyle

L-1

Earlier vote on the mislynch than faust. I'm leaning towards town for that, as teamlyle was anti-town for not wanting to follow plan.


Overall, definitely thinking faust over ash based on D1 content.