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Author Topic: Early Adventures Impressions  (Read 23862 times)

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xyz123

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2016, 01:19:34 pm »
+1

A bunch of random thoughts from my games so far. Probably way off on most of them.

Lost Arts on Goons - The frees up the terminal space to be used on draw. I was able to consistently get 5 Goons in play every turn.

Pathfinding on Baker - This seemed to turn it into an insane card.

Distant Lands - I was surprised at how early you can start Green. It seems to open up some strange rush strategies if you can win the split.

Inheritance on Crossroads - Didn't think that one through properly.

Port - Brings an interesting dynamic to the game. If you need them because they are the only village they are going to go quickly. If there are other villages I am beginning to feel it might be a trap. I had one game where the villages were Port and City. That was interesting. Port is easier to get, but in doing so it powers up Cities.

Coin of the Realm and Conspirator - Is this a synergy or an anti-synergy?

Plan - This seems to be quite hard to use. I put it on a card I know I will want to buy lots of and then I find I don't want to trash what is left in my hand. I put it on something I only want a few of and then I find I don't want any more of that card but I want to trash something in my hand.

Caravan Guard and Vineyards - CG seems very good here. Cheap, spamable cantrip and gives money.
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Awaclus

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2016, 01:26:16 pm »
0

Coin of the Realm and Conspirator - Is this a synergy or an anti-synergy?

Kind of? You usually want Conspirator in the deck where you want Coin of the Realm, but getting Conspirator in that deck might or might not be worth the effort. You don't always want Coin of the Realm in the deck where you want Conspirator, either. But there's some overlap.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2016, 01:37:35 pm »
0

Plan - This seems to be quite hard to use. I put it on a card I know I will want to buy lots of and then I find I don't want to trash what is left in my hand.

Remember that the trashing from the trashing token is optional.
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amoffett11

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2016, 01:42:17 pm »
0

Once you have a hero it can't be trashed by warrior

Right, I'm talking Warrior + Bridge Troll/Highway/Bridge or something though, which was my original thought, not just Warriors alone. 

I'm not going to claim it's some unstoppable combo, but it could be something to watch out for in games with Cost-Reduction cards if A) your opponent is ignoring Pages/Champions or B) you yourself plan to ignore Pages/Champion.  Warrior is different than any other trashing attack because it can hit any card (Treasure/Victory/Action) and if the cost is right, and it can trash a lot of them.  4 or 5 Warriors with 3 or 4 pages (+ your Champion in play) can inspect 20+ cards a turn and trash everything that costs 3/4, or 5/6 with a couple Bridge Trolls or all their Provinces with 4.  Warrior also helps you play your Bridge Trolls with its card drawing.  It's much more powerful than Saboteur because it can trash multiple cards each play and there's no replacement, Knights only trash one card per play.  The real problem here is the Treasure Hunter, setting this up you've gained at least 6 silver, and then another treasure from your Hero.
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LaLight

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2016, 02:41:25 pm »
+1

okay guyz, Cultist + Training + CotR = INSANITY

https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160504/log.0.1462387097899.txt

Edit: I even didn't need Ferry in this game
« Last Edit: May 04, 2016, 02:42:40 pm by LaLight »
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2016, 02:55:00 pm »
0

Once you have a hero it can't be trashed by warrior

Right, I'm talking Warrior + Bridge Troll/Highway/Bridge or something though, which was my original thought, not just Warriors alone. 

I'm not going to claim it's some unstoppable combo, but it could be something to watch out for in games with Cost-Reduction cards if A) your opponent is ignoring Pages/Champions or B) you yourself plan to ignore Pages/Champion.  Warrior is different than any other trashing attack because it can hit any card (Treasure/Victory/Action) and if the cost is right, and it can trash a lot of them.  4 or 5 Warriors with 3 or 4 pages (+ your Champion in play) can inspect 20+ cards a turn and trash everything that costs 3/4, or 5/6 with a couple Bridge Trolls or all their Provinces with 4.  Warrior also helps you play your Bridge Trolls with its card drawing.  It's much more powerful than Saboteur because it can trash multiple cards each play and there's no replacement, Knights only trash one card per play.  The real problem here is the Treasure Hunter, setting this up you've gained at least 6 silver, and then another treasure from your Hero.

You see, that's the problem. You need to gain a lot of silvers to set that up. It just seems way, way too slow.
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Accatitippi

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2016, 02:24:38 am »
+3

Once you have a hero it can't be trashed by warrior

Just after I read this, I played a Page/Moutebank game with no sifting nor trashing. My opponent's 2-depth-Warrior trashed my own Warrior and discarded my Hero at the beginning of a 25-card shuffle.
Yeah.
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iguanaiguana

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #32 on: May 05, 2016, 06:16:29 am »
+3

This was a fun game. http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?https://dominion-game-logs.s3.amazonaws.com/game_logs/20160504/log.0.1462401813587.txt

My opponent goes for the "Play lots of knights and nothing else" strategy. I defend with a golden deck that plays distant lands, attacks with relic, and buys distant lands every turn. Once the distant lands are gone, he thinks I'm pinned, but I just empty estates.
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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #33 on: May 05, 2016, 08:26:43 am »
+3

I'm still a fan of Page, but it feels more money-ish than I had realized. People talk about getting a Champion for your engine, but by that point, you're usually going to have quite a few treasures. This can be a good or bad thing depending on how you view it, but those treasures are often going to end up being your payload; the champion just makes it easier to draw them and get +buy. It's important to keep in mind that most Page games are mirrors, so you can't count on attacks being your payload. Therefore, it just turns into "once I have my Champion, how fast can I score points?" This often means just drawing all of your treasures and buying a bunch of Provinces. The threat of attacks is what really pushes Page games to mirrors; Champion isn't actually all that fast, but once you get it you can attack the heck out of your opponent. Only with both absence of other attacks and a way to do something without $3 or $4 cards should you skip Page.

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #34 on: May 05, 2016, 08:49:03 am »
+1

Soldier can be amazing payload. Until now, he was the biggest surprise for me. If your drawing card is an attack, VLAM! 10 coins per Soldier. And you always have a source of +Buy on the board. :)
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Chris is me

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #35 on: May 05, 2016, 09:14:09 am »
+1

Quest sucks less than I thought. Played an Urchin BM game where I could just buy like five Urchins and get a Gold every turn while trashing with Mercenary. I didn't win this game because there was an engine I missed, but it's not a terrible idea.
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smcrtorchs

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #36 on: May 05, 2016, 02:20:23 pm »
+13

With adventures, it feels like I am a small kid again discovering the forest, instead of trying to see which tree is 2 turns shorter.
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Chris is me

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #37 on: May 05, 2016, 02:45:09 pm »
+3

Yeah, Warrior is insanely OP. It's more cancerous than Urchin and Rebuild combined. I don't mind Rebuild games. I don't mind Cultist games. I don't mind Mercenary games. But man, I mind Champion games.

This is a crazy amount of hype for a really underwhelming strategy. Every time Warrior is out, it is on a board with a permanent Moat available. If you both try to set up Champion quickly, Warrior won't have enough time to devastate anyone. If you just completely ignore your opponent spending half of the game setting up a 6+ depth attack and then heavily invest in $3/$4 cards, then yeah you lose, but then you're also brain dead and pay no attention to the nuances of the game.

The exception is when Warrior trashes the opponents Warrior, which sucks, but I mean, get two Pages.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2016, 02:50:28 pm by Chris is me »
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #38 on: May 05, 2016, 03:30:48 pm »
+1

In super thin decks a warrior strategy might work. I'm thinking mostly Chapel page boards here
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AdrianHealey

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #39 on: May 05, 2016, 03:36:47 pm »
+3

If you can get teacher out, it's insanely fun.

Warrior should just not be able to trash down travellers, really. That would solve the entire warrior problem.
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wachsmuth

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #40 on: May 05, 2016, 04:06:24 pm »
0

Lost Arts on Goons - The frees up the terminal space to be used on draw. I was able to consistently get 5 Goons in play every turn.

Someone else mentioned this in relation to Miser (which is nowhere near the best), so I think we can expand it to strong terminal payload in general. +Action token on spammable payload cards is pretty good - you know, the ones that just get better the more you get in play. So other than Goons, there's also Merchant Guild, Bridge, Wine Merchant and possibly Bridge Troll.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #41 on: May 05, 2016, 04:17:44 pm »
+5

Lost Arts on Goons - The frees up the terminal space to be used on draw. I was able to consistently get 5 Goons in play every turn.

Someone else mentioned this in relation to Miser (which is nowhere near the best), so I think we can expand it to strong terminal payload in general. +Action token on spammable payload cards is pretty good - you know, the ones that just get better the more you get in play. So other than Goons, there's also Merchant Guild, Bridge, Wine Merchant and possibly Bridge Troll.

Almost always, if you have the option between putting Lost Arts on terminal draw or terminal payload, you should put it on terminal draw. It just makes your deck so much more reliable. That's why Laboratory is so much more expensive than Moat, whereas Silver is only marginally more expensive than Duchess.
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wachsmuth

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #42 on: May 05, 2016, 04:23:46 pm »
0

Lost Arts on Goons - The frees up the terminal space to be used on draw. I was able to consistently get 5 Goons in play every turn.

Someone else mentioned this in relation to Miser (which is nowhere near the best), so I think we can expand it to strong terminal payload in general. +Action token on spammable payload cards is pretty good - you know, the ones that just get better the more you get in play. So other than Goons, there's also Merchant Guild, Bridge, Wine Merchant and possibly Bridge Troll.

Almost always, if you have the option between putting Lost Arts on terminal draw or terminal payload, you should put it on terminal draw. It just makes your deck so much more reliable. That's why Laboratory is so much more expensive than Moat, whereas Silver is only marginally more expensive than Duchess.

Yes, this is obvious. Putting +Action on Goons is mainly good if you don't need it for your draw, of course. But I think the situation arises relatively often with Teacher, since often your best draw is going to be +Cards on some cantrip, and then +Action on terminal payload looks pretty good.
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Aleimon Thimble

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #43 on: May 05, 2016, 04:30:55 pm »
+1

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.
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wachsmuth

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #44 on: May 05, 2016, 04:43:37 pm »
+1

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.

It doesn't even have to be terminal. Putting +Action on some non-terminal you play before all your terminals is also pretty good, if you have more of that card than your most common terminal. I had a decent game with +Action on Hunting Party. Basically put it on some card you have a lot of, as a very general rule. Of course the restrictions from Teacher makes this a lot more complicated.
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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #45 on: May 05, 2016, 05:16:05 pm »
+2

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.

If a village is on the board, putting +Action on Council Room makes more sense than putting on Goons, even if you only have 3 Council Rooms. Essentially every CR you play is the equivalant to 3 Labs.   :o
« Last Edit: May 05, 2016, 05:17:59 pm by Beyond Awesome »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #46 on: May 05, 2016, 05:20:10 pm »
+1

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.

If a village is on the board, putting +Action on Council Room makes more sense than putting on Goons, even if you only have 3 Council Rooms. Essentially every CR you play is the equivalant to 3 Labs.   :o

Plus one Lab for your opponents! Plus a Market Square. But yes, I agree with you.
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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #47 on: May 05, 2016, 05:42:07 pm »
0

it's worth noting that if there's no other +action it feels like you should probably be putting it on your terminal draw anyway, since you'll probably be playing some kind of goons big money.

If your token goes on your goons you can only play the goons you have at the beginning of your turn (works with terminal draw in form of wharf or hireling), whereas if it goes on your terminal draw you can play one every turn.
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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #48 on: May 05, 2016, 06:38:29 pm »
+1

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.

If a village is on the board, putting +Action on Council Room makes more sense than putting on Goons, even if you only have 3 Council Rooms. Essentially every CR you play is the equivalant to 3 Labs.   :o

Uh, no? +Action on Council Room and you'll need 5 Villages to play 6 Goons. +Action on Goons and you'll need only 3 Villages to play 3 Council Rooms (and be able to play something else afterwards). You can skip buying two Villages and put the money in another Goons!

I guess +Action on Council Room does make the engine slightly more reliable, but if you're getting to the point where you can play 6 Goons in a turn, reliability is not really an issue.
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Accatitippi

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Re: Early Adventures Impressions
« Reply #49 on: May 05, 2016, 06:51:32 pm »
+1

I think you should generally just put +Action on the terminal card you have the most of in your deck. If you have 3 Council Rooms and 6 Goons, I wouldn't put my token on Council Room.

If a village is on the board, putting +Action on Council Room makes more sense than putting on Goons, even if you only have 3 Council Rooms. Essentially every CR you play is the equivalant to 3 Labs.   :o

Uh, no? +Action on Council Room and you'll need 5 Villages to play 6 Goons. +Action on Goons and you'll need only 3 Villages to play 3 Council Rooms (and be able to play something else afterwards). You can skip buying two Villages and put the money in another Goons!

I guess +Action on Council Room does make the engine slightly more reliable, but if you're getting to the point where you can play 6 Goons in a turn, reliability is not really an issue.

True, but I think that in a Goon Engine mirror, reliability is much more important than gain efficience. You should have plenty of gains, but if you skip a turn, you're toast.
This case is particular due to opponent's Council room boosting your reliability.
Still, +Action on CR also helps you to start drawing your deck, which is when you start growing like crazy.
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