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Author Topic: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University  (Read 4250 times)

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Jack Rudd

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Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« on: May 01, 2016, 04:25:29 am »
0



It's a village and a gainer.

Which $5 cards is it best with?
When is it a trap?
How awesome is the combo with Watchtower?
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Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

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Seprix

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2016, 10:08:58 am »
+1

University is not as good as people think it is. I don't have a perfect example and I'm almost certain I'm doing it a little wrong, but you'll understand my point:

Quote
(Playing without University)
T1: buy Silver
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: You buy that nice $5 action card you really wanted
T5/T6/T7: You play the card


(Playing with University)
T1: buy Potion
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: buy University
T5/T6/T7: use University
T7/T8/T9: use gained card

Because you're buying Potion and then Uni, you have to wait three shuffles until you see any sort of return on your investment. Therefore, University is likely a trap on a board where you don't need a lot of Action cards, or on a quicker game. It's a nice gainer in the long term, but not only does it take awhile to work wonders for you, you also don't even draw a card, not to mention the extra useless Potion in your deck. If it's your only village, cool, you've gotta live with it. But if there are drawing Villages, I'd be wary of getting too many Universities.

Another tactic people don't learn is when to stop gaining cards with University. You don't have to gain anything when you play University. Also, do not overbuy this card. If there are other Villages, and even on an amazing University board, I don't think you ever need more than two, period. (unless it's a Vineyard board)

All of that being said, University is still a strong card. It's just not as strong as some players think it is.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2016, 10:15:22 am by Seprix »
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ced

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2016, 02:12:37 pm »
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IMO, Uni is at its best in two situations:

1. There's an engine in the 5s that can draw your deck, letting you gain and play your payload in the same turn.

2. A strong spammable 5 is available e.g. Minion, Highway, Lab.

Uni as a Village is weak. It's nice that it gives you extra action to play the multi card payloads it enables, but if you're using it to play the terminal draw you're gaining, you'll have problems. The potion cost makes it hard to quickly add to your deck to support all the terminals, while the lack of draw is a problem if you can't trash down. Using it to gain other villages (especially City/Bazaar) is better.

City is one of the best 5s to gain. City doesn't really do much for your deck before it is activated, so you can afford to go for Uni and wait the extra shuffle to use the gain. Uni is also good for emptying piles, in particular emptying the City pile mid turn to get the first benefit of the draw.
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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2016, 05:34:41 pm »
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I used to go gaga over this card.  And yes, this was even when we were NOT using it to gain Duchies (it seems more than one group has missed that you can only gain ACTION cards that cost up to $5).  Chalk this up as another card that's really not THAT good.  A card that costs Potion no less

Does work to buff up Vineyards.  Not uncommon to have Vineyards worth 6 to 9 pts per due to this.

Quote
Which $5 cards is it best with?
I'd say it'd be nice to get Great Halls with this, but I'd like to think they'll be gone by the time you can get that many, if any at all with a Uni.

Cards you'd like to have a lot of.  Already covered by ced... Minoin, Lab, Highway.  I'd also add Lost City and Treasury to the mix.

Quote
When is it a trap?
Otherwise, to get $5 cards, they should be easier and quicker to get without Uni., unless there are cards that bog decks down (like Militia).

Quote
How awesome is the combo with Watchtower?
Pretty.  Play a Uni., top deck a $5 or useful action card, and then you'll be guaranteed to get it AND have the action to play that one action card.
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Village, +2 Actions.  Village, +3 Actions.  Village, +4 Actions.  Village, +5 Actions.  Village, +6 Actions.  Village, +7 Actions.  Workers Village, +2 Buys, +8 Actions.  End Action Phase.  No Treasures to play.  No buy.  No Night cards to play

faust

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2016, 06:11:26 pm »
+1

Quote
(Playing without University)
T1: buy Silver
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: You buy that nice $5 action card you really wanted
T5/T6/T7: You play the card


(Playing with University)
T1: buy Potion
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: buy University
T5/T6/T7: use University
T7/T8/T9: use gained card

If you're opening Potion/Silver for University, chances are you already misplayed.
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faust

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2016, 06:13:53 pm »
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Does work to buff up Vineyards.  Not uncommon to have Vineyards worth 6 to 9 pts per due to this.

FTFY
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LibraryAdventurer

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2016, 11:07:01 pm »
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University is a tough one for me to know when it's worth it.  There have been times that I didn't think it was worth it and got beaten by someone who went for it, and other times I went for it and got beaten by someone who didn't.
(or maybe it's just cause I'm not very good at the game in general.)

Seprix

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2016, 11:19:29 pm »
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Quote
(Playing without University)
T1: buy Silver
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: You buy that nice $5 action card you really wanted
T5/T6/T7: You play the card


(Playing with University)
T1: buy Potion
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: buy University
T5/T6/T7: use University
T7/T8/T9: use gained card

If you're opening Potion/Silver for University, chances are you already misplayed.

Dude, it was just to show how many cycles it takes to get a return on University's investment. It wasn't supposed to be some deep contemplative opening.
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faust

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2016, 02:19:13 am »
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Quote
(Playing without University)
T1: buy Silver
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: You buy that nice $5 action card you really wanted
T5/T6/T7: You play the card


(Playing with University)
T1: buy Potion
T2: buy Silver
T3/T4: buy University
T5/T6/T7: use University
T7/T8/T9: use gained card

If you're opening Potion/Silver for University, chances are you already misplayed.

Dude, it was just to show how many cycles it takes to get a return on University's investment. It wasn't supposed to be some deep contemplative opening.

But that's exactly why you should get some sifting/trashing to go with your Potion; then you will see your nice $5s earlier. Of course still not as early as you'd see them without Uni, so if you wanted that one key card (mostly Curser) early, then Uni is bad.
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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2016, 04:43:10 am »
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I remember once playing a game where the kingdom cards included Chapel, University, Minion, City and Peddler. Turn 13 three-pile with seven Provinces in my deck.  ;D
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Centuries later, archaeologists discover the remains of your ancient civilization.

Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

'ISOTROPIC WILL RETURN!'

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Re: Let's discuss Alchemy cards: University
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2016, 05:01:58 am »
+1

I used to go gaga over this card.  And yes, this was even when we were NOT using it to gain Duchies (it seems more than one group has missed that you can only gain ACTION cards that cost up to $5).  Chalk this up as another card that's really not THAT good.  A card that costs Potion no less

Does work to buff up Vineyards.  Not uncommon to have Vineyards worth 6 to 9 pts per due to this.

Quote
Which $5 cards is it best with?
I'd say it'd be nice to get Great Halls with this, but I'd like to think they'll be gone by the time you can get that many, if any at all with a Uni.

Cards you'd like to have a lot of.  Already covered by ced... Minoin, Lab, Highway.  I'd also add Lost City and Treasury to the mix.




Thats just weaker player opinion which is mostly wrong as for these university is probably a trap.

Minion is worst nombo of these. When its your primary draw then university opening loses to silver/silver as money player will probably buy 6 minions while university gets 4 minions and has at least two more junk cards in deck.

City is most of time nombo too unless uni and city are only villages and there is good draw. Versus opponent that ignores cities they will activate by the time opponent already got fifth province and game is basically over.

Similar with highway. Only real combo is play two higways, gain king's court. If there is engine with +buy then one will sooner reach buying 2 higway turns and getting 5 highways by skipping university. Without +buy getting highways (or markets) is quite slow, buying mine and improving your buying power with it is faster. Similar logic also applies for treasury and baker.

As for best 5 cost with university its probably count as you could open with it on 5/2 and start trashing. Really with university 5 cost cards should be last of your concern, more important factors are if there is good trasher, and smithy variant to get engine going quickly.

 Next best one is tactician as it gives you tempo to pick components while you build double tactician engine.

Another synergy is margrave and torturer when university is only village as they slow down game to make gaining them worthwhile.
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