Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[iguanaiguana]

@JReggie

I asked you a question in the neighborhood chat, which you haven't answered.  You wanted to recruit someone "non-threatening", and you mentioned myself, Cron and Haddock.  Can you explain what you meant by threatening, and why those were your choices?  Furthermore, can you explain why you picked the players you did, on the nights you did? Your first few picks were Lyle, Haddock, and Chairs.  Those are probably the three lowest posters in the game, at the time you picked them, so it stood to reason they wouldn't post much in the QT either. Furthermore, if your information component was some mass track, why did you pick Chairs when Cron had already said he targeted no one on night one?

I guess I'm just trying to understand the mindset you had and what you were trying to accomplish.  If you were picking town reads, why did you pick ones who weren't likely to actually use the chat and discuss things? If you were trying to generate information with the mass track, why wouldn't you pick scum reads, and why did you pick Chairs?

I think Lyle is effectively confirmed town, and I think EMFW is pretty town behaviorally, on top of Chairs' play matching disinterested town to a T.  So I agree that at least one of you or Haddock has to be scum, therefore am trying to figure out if how you've handled the role can come from town, versus scum who had to pick people, and went out of his way to pick people that weren't a threat to catch him, or something.  Because that "non threatening" word choice is something I have trouble seeing come from town there.

At this point, I am highly inclined to sheep Cellovix on whatever he thinks is best.

[faust]

Anyway faust, I'm sorry if I cause you to regret rejoining forum mafia. Honestly though, I think that being desperate and trying to guilt trip me is pretty scummy so I'm still going to vote for you.

Okay, asking for reasons is now "guilt tripping". Great.

PPE: 6

[faust]

I've voted for you twice, because I think you are probably scum, and said no insults. You've told me "Fuck you" and called me lazy for doing that.

Okay. I'm sorry. There might be some... ongoing game stuff that caused my behaviour. Better to discuss it after the game probably, at least after that game finished.

You've never once done anything like this to EgorK or Joseph or Chairs or Roadrunner or any other Teamlyle FFS or any of the many other players on our site that rarely form long cases of their own but still vote based on their reads and other people's cases.

I'm pretty sure I've called at least some of these people lazy (or equivalent) before. The swearing was uncalled for, you're right. I was just frustrated that I get nothing to work with, and I felt that you're not trying.

[faust]

And I swear this is not going against you personally, it's just general frustration with what f.ds mafia has changed into which has probably unjustly been directed towards you.

[faust]

And frankly, this game is just such a mess to me. I'm on the brink of being lynched when there's a pair of 2 players of which one is pretty certainly scum, and I even have a pretty good idea which one, and I don't get why I'm considered as an alternative to them at all.

[Cellovix]

I've been jotting down some scum team possibilities to see if logic can solve the game.  It's a habit I've gotten into on other sites where there is no alignment reveal, so you have to keep in mind multiple possibilities.

There are 7 players alive.  I am town, Lyle is IC'd courtesy of Faust.

That leaves JReggie, Haddock, Faust, Iguana, EFHW.

Assuming two mafia remaining, here are the possible scum teams:

Faust/EFHW
Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
Faust/Iguana
EFHW/JReggie
EFHW/Haddock
EFHW/Iguana
JReggie/Haddock
JReggie/Iguana
Haddock/Iguana

Faust and Iguana is an impossible scum team, because it is not mechanically possible for all of JReggie, Haddock, EMFW and Lyle to be town, with the contradicting claim.

I think EFHW has been very behaviorally town, for their own play in the thread and in the QT, plus Chairs' lack of N1 action + disinterest in game matching with underwhelming town role.  I'm removing those options for now.

That leaves:

Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
JReggie/Haddock
JReggie/Iguana
Haddock/Iguana

If Faust is town, that makes Haddock more likely town because of the retroactive roleblock on Night Two.  So that makes Haddock/Iguana, JReggie/Haddock less likely.

Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
JReggie/Iguana

Using that logic we're left with these three teams.  None of those makes perfect sense, but if a scum team does make perfect sense they played rather poorly, I suppose.  I want to go back and look at Jan interactions again, maybe, because I'm kind of just looking at the gamestate right now and going ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

I have trouble seeing Haddock's role co-exist with mine, but I don't know enough about RMM games to say that with any certainty.  Just talking from dozens of games hosted as a designer and moderator. I haven't liked a lot of things he's done, which I've outlined previously.  But Faust's claim gives me some pause, as does JReggie pushing against EMFW to possibly try and chain mislynches.

There's also the elephant in the room of the second kill on night two.  I didn't make it. EFHW didn't make it (since targeted Faust on N2). Lyle didn't make it.  No one dead made it, I don't think. So one of JReggie, Haddock, Faust, or Iguana are responsible for the second kill on that night.  I don't necessarily think that's something we should resolve today, but it bears being concerned about as our number grows fewer.

[iguanaiguana]

And frankly, this game is just such a mess to me. I'm on the brink of being lynched when there's a pair of 2 players of which one is pretty certainly scum, and I even have a pretty good idea which one, and I don't get why I'm considered as an alternative to them at all.

I believe it is mainly because you are playing in a really antagonistic way, and making a lot more statements than asking questions. I get the impression from you that you seem to know everything already, which is the very definition of scum in a mafia game. I have seen you play as town in a much more questioning way, distrusting everyone. Here you are saying "J Reggie is obviously scum, and we all need to lynch him." It feels like you have an agenda that as town you should not have. And I have seen you play as scum just like this in the past.

I can remember moments from you in the past where you fakeclaimed beloved princess, and yet you were the traitor, and where you came out against Witherweaver with a strong claim that you had tracked them and saw them performing the kill, and you were mafia. So that makes it a lot harder for me to trust you when you say "I roleblocked Haddock and nothing happened, so J Reggie is scum here." It makes me think that when you have a claim that no one can in any way substantiate, I trust you less, not more.

I could do quotes and all of that but again I don't want to spend an hour sitting here when I have laundry to do and work in the afternoon.

[Cellovix]

@JReggie

I asked you a question in the neighborhood chat, which you haven't answered.  You wanted to recruit someone "non-threatening", and you mentioned myself, Cron and Haddock.  Can you explain what you meant by threatening, and why those were your choices?  Furthermore, can you explain why you picked the players you did, on the nights you did? Your first few picks were Lyle, Haddock, and Chairs.  Those are probably the three lowest posters in the game, at the time you picked them, so it stood to reason they wouldn't post much in the QT either. Furthermore, if your information component was some mass track, why did you pick Chairs when Cron had already said he targeted no one on night one?

I guess I'm just trying to understand the mindset you had and what you were trying to accomplish.  If you were picking town reads, why did you pick ones who weren't likely to actually use the chat and discuss things? If you were trying to generate information with the mass track, why wouldn't you pick scum reads, and why did you pick Chairs?

I think Lyle is effectively confirmed town, and I think EMFW is pretty town behaviorally, on top of Chairs' play matching disinterested town to a T.  So I agree that at least one of you or Haddock has to be scum, therefore am trying to figure out if how you've handled the role can come from town, versus scum who had to pick people, and went out of his way to pick people that weren't a threat to catch him, or something.  Because that "non threatening" word choice is something I have trouble seeing come from town there.

At this point, I am highly inclined to sheep Cellovix on whatever he thinks is best.

If you end up being scum this game, congratulations on quite thoroughly fucking with my head. Because I have trouble fathoming scum ever saying this about someone they know is town.

[Cellovix]

I was leaning towards JReggie/Iguana but now I'm having doubts after Iguana's recent posting.

How likely is a team of JReggie + Haddock scum? Where they were defending each other on day two, and then came up with the plan to claim an outlandish supertracker result to create a dichotomy between them, ensuring whichever one wasn't lynched would get away freely?

[iguanaiguana]

Faust and Iguana is an impossible scum team, because it is not mechanically possible for all of JReggie, Haddock, EMFW and Lyle to be town, with the contradicting claim.

Damn straight.

I think EFHW has been very behaviorally town, for their own play in the thread and in the QT, plus Chairs' lack of N1 action + disinterest in game matching with underwhelming town role.  I'm removing those options for now.

I don't love giving a full game pass to EFHW. A pass for the day is a lot better. We need to look at her tomorrow I think regardless of what happens today.

That leaves:

Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
JReggie/Haddock
JReggie/Iguana
Haddock/Iguana

If Faust is town, that makes Haddock more likely town because of the retroactive roleblock on Night Two.  So that makes Haddock/Iguana, JReggie/Haddock less likely.

Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
JReggie/Iguana

Using that logic we're left with these three teams.  None of those makes perfect sense, but if a scum team does make perfect sense they played rather poorly, I suppose.  I want to go back and look at Jan interactions again, maybe, because I'm kind of just looking at the gamestate right now and going ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

This is good deduction for the most part, but I think I'd come down to possible scumteams being

Faust/JReggie
Faust/Haddock
Faust/ EFHW
EFHW / J Reggie
EFHW / Haddock

because I do think there is still a chance at least that she is scum.

I have trouble seeing Haddock's role co-exist with mine, but I don't know enough about RMM games to say that with any certainty.  Just talking from dozens of games hosted as a designer and moderator. I haven't liked a lot of things he's done, which I've outlined previously.  But Faust's claim gives me some pause, as does JReggie pushing against EMFW to possibly try and chain mislynches.

No comment here, since I don't know your role.

There's also the elephant in the room of the second kill on night two.  I didn't make it. EFHW didn't make it (since targeted Faust on N2). Lyle didn't make it.  No one dead made it, I don't think. So one of JReggie, Haddock, Faust, or Iguana are responsible for the second kill on that night.  I don't necessarily think that's something we should resolve today, but it bears being concerned about as our number grows fewer.

I think I actually have an adequate explanation for this. My role mentions the existence of a motivator. I am a time traveler, but I am only allowed to time travel if I am targeted by the motivator.

I mentioned this on an earlier day, and I was neither killed at night nor targeted by the motivator; basically, I was ignored. That makes me think that the motivator is now dead, and possibly that Seprix, master of time and space, was the motivator. In another game, I think it was Sherlock Mafia, being targeted by the motivator allowed a scum player to make an extra kill.

Therefore, it's very possible that someone on the scum team was targeted by the motivator before the motivator was killed and got an extra kill for night 2. If this is true, there is likely no serial killer, just mafia.

[iguanaiguana]

I was leaning towards JReggie/Iguana but now I'm having doubts after Iguana's recent posting.

How likely is a team of JReggie + Haddock scum? Where they were defending each other on day two, and then came up with the plan to claim an outlandish supertracker result to create a dichotomy between them, ensuring whichever one wasn't lynched would get away freely?

I still think this is possible, and in that case J Reggie was the one doing the kills, so Faust's roleblocking Haddock had no effect.

J Reggie has been scummy, as Faust has pointed out, but Faust's pushing him makes me super worried.

[iguanaiguana]

@JReggie

I asked you a question in the neighborhood chat, which you haven't answered.  You wanted to recruit someone "non-threatening", and you mentioned myself, Cron and Haddock.  Can you explain what you meant by threatening, and why those were your choices?  Furthermore, can you explain why you picked the players you did, on the nights you did? Your first few picks were Lyle, Haddock, and Chairs.  Those are probably the three lowest posters in the game, at the time you picked them, so it stood to reason they wouldn't post much in the QT either. Furthermore, if your information component was some mass track, why did you pick Chairs when Cron had already said he targeted no one on night one?

I guess I'm just trying to understand the mindset you had and what you were trying to accomplish.  If you were picking town reads, why did you pick ones who weren't likely to actually use the chat and discuss things? If you were trying to generate information with the mass track, why wouldn't you pick scum reads, and why did you pick Chairs?

I think Lyle is effectively confirmed town, and I think EMFW is pretty town behaviorally, on top of Chairs' play matching disinterested town to a T.  So I agree that at least one of you or Haddock has to be scum, therefore am trying to figure out if how you've handled the role can come from town, versus scum who had to pick people, and went out of his way to pick people that weren't a threat to catch him, or something.  Because that "non threatening" word choice is something I have trouble seeing come from town there.

At this point, I am highly inclined to sheep Cellovix on whatever he thinks is best.

If you end up being scum this game, congratulations on quite thoroughly fucking with my head. Because I have trouble fathoming scum ever saying this about someone they know is town.

I'm a town. Let's do this. I wanna get the scums.

Wagons!

[faust]

I believe it is mainly because you are playing in a really antagonistic way, and making a lot more statements than asking questions. I get the impression from you that you seem to know everything already, which is the very definition of scum in a mafia game. I have seen you play as town in a much more questioning way, distrusting everyone. Here you are saying "J Reggie is obviously scum, and we all need to lynch him." It feels like you have an agenda that as town you should not have. And I have seen you play as scum just like this in the past.

It's funny, because honestly I'm pretty much at a "distrusting everyone" point. I am saying J Reggie is obviously scum, yes. That's how it looks to me. I mean, if it just were my result, I would be skeptical. But the main thing is I just cannot make sense of scum!Haddock being lynchproof and also being somehow able to target 2 people in the same night. And then J Reggie has been so scummy D1 with the Jan lynch, and D2 with the "I've been playing scummy on purpose" stuff, and [ongoing game stuff].

I may not be asking a lot of questions because to me it seems that I have found scum, but somehow everyone else disagrees and I don't really get it. I tried to get it, get responses and stuff, it didn't work. You can be sure that I will be asking a lot more questions once we've resolved this.

I can remember moments from you in the past where you fakeclaimed beloved princess, and yet you were the traitor, and where you came out against Witherweaver with a strong claim that you had tracked them and saw them performing the kill, and you were mafia. So that makes it a lot harder for me to trust you when you say "I roleblocked Haddock and nothing happened, so J Reggie is scum here." It makes me think that when you have a claim that no one can in any way substantiate, I trust you less, not more.

I get that you would aprroach my claim with caution. But if you look at those previous examples, I always claimed because the claim directly benefitted my team. I like to think that I am somewhat good at fakeclaiming. My claim here would kinda make sense as a fakeclaim if it ensured a mafia win... but that seems less than sure. Otherwise, I just put myself in a dangerous position. I get that it could look as though I am Haddock's partner... that would be ballsy play, but yeah I sometimes do that... but in that case, wouldn't it be better to lynch Haddock? And then me? Because Haddock's flip at the very least gives definite information about J Reggie's alignment.

[iguanaiguana]

Unvote

time to do this sheep Cellovix thing for real.

[iguanaiguana]

I believe it is mainly because you are playing in a really antagonistic way, and making a lot more statements than asking questions. I get the impression from you that you seem to know everything already, which is the very definition of scum in a mafia game. I have seen you play as town in a much more questioning way, distrusting everyone. Here you are saying "J Reggie is obviously scum, and we all need to lynch him." It feels like you have an agenda that as town you should not have. And I have seen you play as scum just like this in the past.

It's funny, because honestly I'm pretty much at a "distrusting everyone" point. I am saying J Reggie is obviously scum, yes. That's how it looks to me. I mean, if it just were my result, I would be skeptical. But the main thing is I just cannot make sense of scum!Haddock being lynchproof and also being somehow able to target 2 people in the same night. And then J Reggie has been so scummy D1 with the Jan lynch, and D2 with the "I've been playing scummy on purpose" stuff, and [ongoing game stuff].

I may not be asking a lot of questions because to me it seems that I have found scum, but somehow everyone else disagrees and I don't really get it. I tried to get it, get responses and stuff, it didn't work. You can be sure that I will be asking a lot more questions once we've resolved this.

I can remember moments from you in the past where you fakeclaimed beloved princess, and yet you were the traitor, and where you came out against Witherweaver with a strong claim that you had tracked them and saw them performing the kill, and you were mafia. So that makes it a lot harder for me to trust you when you say "I roleblocked Haddock and nothing happened, so J Reggie is scum here." It makes me think that when you have a claim that no one can in any way substantiate, I trust you less, not more.

I get that you would aprroach my claim with caution. But if you look at those previous examples, I always claimed because the claim directly benefitted my team. I like to think that I am somewhat good at fakeclaiming. My claim here would kinda make sense as a fakeclaim if it ensured a mafia win... but that seems less than sure. Otherwise, I just put myself in a dangerous position. I get that it could look as though I am Haddock's partner... that would be ballsy play, but yeah I sometimes do that... but in that case, wouldn't it be better to lynch Haddock? And then me? Because Haddock's flip at the very least gives definite information about J Reggie's alignment.

This is the towniest thing you've said today.

Still super hard for me to trust you. It's not your fault that you're good at mafia but it does make you hard to trust. Sorry.

[faust]

I was leaning towards JReggie/Iguana but now I'm having doubts after Iguana's recent posting.

How likely is a team of JReggie + Haddock scum? Where they were defending each other on day two, and then came up with the plan to claim an outlandish supertracker result to create a dichotomy between them, ensuring whichever one wasn't lynched would get away freely?

It does make some more sense considering Haddock is lynchproof. That allows them to draw the fight out longer.

Something that is slightly bothering me is that if J Reggie is scum, wouldn't he still have some power that has something to do with the neighborhood? Like, could the players in the neighborhood be in some sort of danger? On the other hand, if there was such a power, I'd think J Reggie would have used it last night.

[faust]

Still super hard for me to trust you. It's not your fault that you're good at mafia but it does make you hard to trust. Sorry.

Ha. No worries, I get it. You should distrust me. (Though man, this game would be so easy if everyone just trusted me.)

[faust]

I have to figure out what to do with my Cellovix read at some point.

[Cellovix]

I had some concern that he was actually some kind of cultist who wins if everyone alive is in his neighborhood, hence him primarily picking low activity people who are unlikely to get NK'd (Lyle, Chairs, etc).

I know nothing about this site and what kind of roles can fly in RMM games, so it's probably just idle paranoia. 

His target selections just don't make sense to me, and his claimed desire to pick "non threatening" people for the neighborhood likewise doesn't sit right.

[gkrieg13]

Vote Count 4.2


J Reggie (2): faust, Haddock
faust (1): teamlyle
Haddock (1): J Reggie
Not Voting (3): Cellovix, iguanaiguana, EFHW

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.  Day 4 ends 11 am Monday August 14

[faust]

Vote Count 4.2


J Reggie (2): faust, Haddock
faust (3): EFHW, teamlyle, iguanaiguana {L-1}
Haddock (1): J Reggie
Not Voting (1): Cellovix

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.  Day 4 ends 11 am Monday August 14

iguana unvoted me. Thank god. Scum might like to quickhammer me. Please don't just put me at L-1 again.

[Haddock]

Vote Count 4.2


J Reggie (2): faust, Haddock
faust (3): EFHW, teamlyle, iguanaiguana {L-1}
Haddock (1): J Reggie
Not Voting (1): Cellovix

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.  Day 4 ends 11 am Monday August 14

iguana unvoted me. Thank god. Scum might like to quickhammer me. Please don't just put me at L-1 again.

I think EFHW did too...

[gkrieg13]

Oops.  Sorry, I forgot to search unvote after searching vote:  The votecount has been corrected!

[Cellovix]

I have to figure out what to do with my Cellovix read at some point.

I recommend just town reading me, since, I'm town!

More seriously, who could I even be scum with? Objectively I don't think I make sense with JReggie or Haddock given how I've interacted with them this game.  I can't be scum with Iguana.  I don't think I can be scum with EFHW, because Cron tracked chairs doing nothing N1, and Reggie would be town in that scenario, so his claim would be true.  Maybe we're secretly buddies and this is our elaborate plan.

[faust]

Considering all this, Cellovix comes across as townier. I think he could have gotten away with the hammer. I have to check how long I've actually been at L-1.

...

Yeah, I was never actually at L-1. And EFHW unvoted too. I guess there's nothing in this.

PPE: 3