Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 ... 21 22 [23] 24 25 ... 27  All

Author Topic: Creating Dominion  (Read 97753 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Jimmmmm

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1734
  • Shuffle iT Username: Jimmmmm
  • Respect: +1943
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #550 on: August 30, 2016, 06:39:22 am »
0

Runway
Event, 5 Stefcoins

All card shape things cost one less on your turns for the rest of the day.

Is a Shuffle iT subscription card shaped?
Logged

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5590
  • Respect: +3609
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #551 on: August 30, 2016, 10:18:24 am »
+1

...any payment model that isn't completely outlandish...

Pay 0.1 cents each time you buy or gain a card!
Playing is free, but the ability to mute people in chat is $20 a month!

Build and upgrade a thriving fortress to mine DominionBux that you can use to play, but be careful, other players can attack your fortress and steal your DominionBux!

You hit home on everything I despise about the mobile gaming "community" that wasn't immediately obvious.
Logged
3/4ths retired

J Reggie

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 705
  • Shuffle iT Username: J Reggie
  • Respect: +1122
    • View Profile
    • Jeff Rosenthal Music
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #552 on: August 30, 2016, 11:55:07 am »
0

feel like the worst scum ever and kill myself.

Why not feel like the best scum ever and kill town PRs?

Donald X needs to play mafia!

michaeljb

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1396
  • Shuffle iT Username: michaeljb
  • Respect: +2044
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #553 on: August 30, 2016, 01:08:08 pm »
+1

Logged
18xx is taking over my gaming life

timchen

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 704
  • Shuffle iT Username: allfail
  • Respect: +233
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #554 on: August 30, 2016, 01:23:08 pm »
0

Pretty interesting discussion, made me feel I want to chime in.

I find myself sympathizing with chrisjwmartin more. I did not read every post of his but at least the ones that Donald replied to.

Thing is, business is business, contract is contract, that I understand. However if we are also on the ideal side of things, speaking from passion with board games perspective, it starts to sound bad.

Like saying, you know, most board game makers don't really make that much money, but I do.
and sadly, even though I have cash sitting at home so that I don't need to work for a living, those money aren't from making fun or goko so I can't pay for your loss. Thanks for your interest in the game! Oh by the way, if you don't feel like it don't buy it. I won't force anyone.

I think, from a idealistic perspective, it is not really about how much the loss is involved and whether one should care about that or not.
There was a promise for the thing to last forever. If the company is no longer there to keep up with the promise, someone should take over. At least someone with passion should.

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

Not saying that is what I think should be done, but that would be the thing to do from a passion perspective, and the thing I would really appreciate as a fan.
Logged

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9156
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #555 on: August 30, 2016, 01:40:50 pm »
+1

Pretty interesting discussion, made me feel I want to chime in.

I find myself sympathizing with chrisjwmartin more. I did not read every post of his but at least the ones that Donald replied to.

Thing is, business is business, contract is contract, that I understand. However if we are also on the ideal side of things, speaking from passion with board games perspective, it starts to sound bad.

Like saying, you know, most board game makers don't really make that much money, but I do.
and sadly, even though I have cash sitting at home so that I don't need to work for a living, those money aren't from making fun or goko so I can't pay for your loss. Thanks for your interest in the game! Oh by the way, if you don't feel like it don't buy it. I won't force anyone.

I think, from a idealistic perspective, it is not really about how much the loss is involved and whether one should care about that or not.
There was a promise for the thing to last forever. If the company is no longer there to keep up with the promise, someone should take over. At least someone with passion should.

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

Not saying that is what I think should be done, but that would be the thing to do from a passion perspective, and the thing I would really appreciate as a fan.

Essentially, Donald is already paying for a year of service for all these players.  How is it reasonable to suggest even tentatively that paying for eternal service would be "the thing to do", especially when he wasn't really party to the contract with the guys who made the impossible promise?
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #556 on: August 30, 2016, 02:02:53 pm »
+4

Pretty interesting discussion, made me feel I want to chime in.

I find myself sympathizing with chrisjwmartin more. I did not read every post of his but at least the ones that Donald replied to.

Thing is, business is business, contract is contract, that I understand. However if we are also on the ideal side of things, speaking from passion with board games perspective, it starts to sound bad.

Like saying, you know, most board game makers don't really make that much money, but I do.
and sadly, even though I have cash sitting at home so that I don't need to work for a living, those money aren't from making fun or goko so I can't pay for your loss. Thanks for your interest in the game! Oh by the way, if you don't feel like it don't buy it. I won't force anyone.

I think, from a idealistic perspective, it is not really about how much the loss is involved and whether one should care about that or not.
There was a promise for the thing to last forever. If the company is no longer there to keep up with the promise, someone should take over. At least someone with passion should.

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

Not saying that is what I think should be done, but that would be the thing to do from a passion perspective, and the thing I would really appreciate as a fan.


I want to clarify that I don't find his (chrisjwmartin) position unsympathetic, or his frustrations entirely unjustified, but he came in here calling names and writing inflammatory posts, and saying things that didn't seem (to me) aligned with reality. 

I don't really agree that Donald ought to do any kind of reimbursing.  I don't think the language he's been quoted using before really involves him making actual promises---he isn't in a position to uphold those promises either.  It seems more like his take on how things are working and going to work. 

Well I guess you're not saying he should do it, either,  but your post is kind of saying it anyway.

I guess maybe my point of view on these things is different.. I kind of take it that when I make a purchase, I'm accepting the risk that it's a bad purchase, and I'm not really obligated towards things like refunds unless there is something inherently wrong, covered by some warranty.  I assume there's a chance I may end up eating some cost.. that sucks, but I made the choice to pay the money.  There's an argument here (I think) that we have a similar situation; that something was promised in exchange for the payment but not delivered, or not followed-through on.  It doesn't seem like that is the case to me, though.

I suppose I'm also not invested because I'll probably just take the offline version and be happy with that.
Logged

AdrianHealey

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2244
  • Respect: +774
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #557 on: August 30, 2016, 02:15:17 pm »
+1

When I heard about the switch, I said 'caveat emptor' and went on with my life.
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #558 on: August 30, 2016, 02:22:08 pm »
+2

When I heard about the switch, I said 'caveat emptor' and went on with my life.

I suppose Latin is one of those efficient languages.
Logged

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5590
  • Respect: +3609
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #559 on: August 30, 2016, 02:28:54 pm »
0

When I heard about the switch, I said 'caveat emptor' and went on with my life.

I suppose Latin is one of those efficient languages.

Tu sunt rectam.
Logged
3/4ths retired

timchen

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 704
  • Shuffle iT Username: allfail
  • Respect: +233
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #560 on: August 30, 2016, 02:29:30 pm »
0

Essentially, Donald is already paying for a year of service for all these players.  How is it reasonable to suggest even tentatively that paying for eternal service would be "the thing to do", especially when he wasn't really party to the contract with the guys who made the impossible promise?
That' not what I suggested. What I am saying is that he can reimburse the difference as if the buyers bought the subscription service in the first place starting from whenever the purchase is made. The total amount would probably end up similar.

The question is not whether he ought to do the reimbursement or not; from the law perspective he clearly need not and from a standard business perspective it is not his responsibility either.

It is all about passion. He clearly stated that he can afford it; he also said that he is willing to work on projects without obvious income down the road. It really sounds a bit lame, trying to explain that oops sorry, we did not foresee this and that? Or, yeah, I did endorse goko back in the days, but what else do you expect me to do?

I mean, sure it is Goko and MF in the end that leads to all the trouble, maybe Jay and Donald have lost some money due to this contract mistake as well. But hey, it is negotiated and signed by them. End customers like us really has no say, and I tend to think most of those buying into these products are because it is the official product, in other words, supported by the game developer and publisher. So it is sad to hear that when bad things happen, they did not pick up as much responsibility as people like (especially if they can.)
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11207
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (。 ω 。`)
  • Respect: +11882
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #561 on: August 30, 2016, 02:31:33 pm »
0

When I heard about the switch, I said 'caveat emptor' and went on with my life.

I suppose Latin is one of those efficient languages.

Tu sunt rectam.

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The Twitch channel where I stream DominionThe YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's albums for free

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5590
  • Respect: +3609
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #562 on: August 30, 2016, 02:37:37 pm »
+1

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2016, 02:38:47 pm by Seprix »
Logged
3/4ths retired

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #563 on: August 30, 2016, 02:52:18 pm »
0

Essentially, Donald is already paying for a year of service for all these players.  How is it reasonable to suggest even tentatively that paying for eternal service would be "the thing to do", especially when he wasn't really party to the contract with the guys who made the impossible promise?
That' not what I suggested. What I am saying is that he can reimburse the difference as if the buyers bought the subscription service in the first place starting from whenever the purchase is made. The total amount would probably end up similar.

The question is not whether he ought to do the reimbursement or not; from the law perspective he clearly need not and from a standard business perspective it is not his responsibility either.

It is all about passion. He clearly stated that he can afford it; he also said that he is willing to work on projects without obvious income down the road. It really sounds a bit lame, trying to explain that oops sorry, we did not foresee this and that? Or, yeah, I did endorse goko back in the days, but what else do you expect me to do?

I mean, sure it is Goko and MF in the end that leads to all the trouble, maybe Jay and Donald have lost some money due to this contract mistake as well. But hey, it is negotiated and signed by them. End customers like us really has no say, and I tend to think most of those buying into these products are because it is the official product, in other words, supported by the game developer and publisher. So it is sad to hear that when bad things happen, they did not pick up as much responsibility as people like (especially if they can.)

I guess for people coming it late this could be something.  If you bought back when Goko started, I think you actually saved money compared to the subscription model. 
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8069
  • Respect: +8856
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #564 on: August 30, 2016, 02:58:22 pm »
+4

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.

"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5590
  • Respect: +3609
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #565 on: August 30, 2016, 03:03:15 pm »
+1

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.


"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."

Singletee and I are talking about this. We are concluding that the guy is seriously making a game, but he's making his own thing and doing a bait-and-switch sort of thing. I mean, it could also be an elaborate troll.
Logged
3/4ths retired

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8069
  • Respect: +8856
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #566 on: August 30, 2016, 03:04:17 pm »
+5

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.


"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."

Singletee and I are talking about this. We are concluding that the guy is seriously making a game, but he's making his own thing and doing a bait-and-switch sort of thing. I mean, it could also be an elaborate troll.

Google shows that the guy (or someone with his same username) is definitely a serious programmer. But as a programmer, I can say confidently that his estimate of a working version in 40 hours of work is ridiculous.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #567 on: August 30, 2016, 03:06:19 pm »
+3

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.


"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."

Singletee and I are talking about this. We are concluding that the guy is seriously making a game, but he's making his own thing and doing a bait-and-switch sort of thing. I mean, it could also be an elaborate troll.

Google shows that the guy (or someone with his same username) is definitely a serious programmer. But as a programmer, I can say confidently that his estimate of a working version in 40 hours of work is ridiculous.

Where was this guy when Goko was trying to get a product up?!
Logged

Seprix

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5590
  • Respect: +3609
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #568 on: August 30, 2016, 03:10:25 pm »
+6

Where was this guy when Goko was trying to get a product up?!

Plot twist: He was Goko.
Logged
3/4ths retired

SCSN

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7134
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #569 on: August 30, 2016, 03:29:56 pm »
+5

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

If it would take just 50k to honor all Goko/MF purchases that's 100% what would have happened. The actual amount will end up being such that this just isn't possible.

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.


"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."

Singletee and I are talking about this. We are concluding that the guy is seriously making a game, but he's making his own thing and doing a bait-and-switch sort of thing. I mean, it could also be an elaborate troll.

I'm aware of the thread and don't have an opinion until he actually shows something.
Logged

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #570 on: August 30, 2016, 03:34:34 pm »
0

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

If it would take just 50k to honor all Goko/MF purchases that's 100% what would have happened. The actual amount will end up being such that this just isn't possible.


Wait, really?  The (aggregated) difference between had each member only paid a subscription amount for the time they bought vs. what they paid with the one-time set purchases is actually very large?

Did the prices end up increasing?  I looked back and it looks like I paid $45 back in March-ish 2013.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 7081
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +9808
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #571 on: August 30, 2016, 03:37:55 pm »
0

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

If it would take just 50k to honor all Goko/MF purchases that's 100% what would have happened. The actual amount will end up being such that this just isn't possible.


Wait, really?  The (aggregated) difference between had each member only paid a subscription amount for the time they bought vs. what they paid with the one-time set purchases is actually very large?

Did the prices end up increasing?  I looked back and it looks like I paid $45 back in March-ish 2013.

MF doubled the prices, yes.
Logged

Deadlock39

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1722
  • Respect: +1747
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #572 on: August 30, 2016, 03:45:47 pm »
+2

It appears Stef and SCSN have a 'rival' for next year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dominion/comments/4z4c7c/regarding_dominion_online_2017/

It's probably a troll, but on the off chance it is not, here you all go. Just read all of the posts by Harbub in this Reddit thread. He claims no legal action will happen to him, and if he changes the names and mechanics of everything like he says he will, I don't know that legal action could be taken.


"That doesn't include most card animations; those will be time-consuming."

"I plan on adding animations so that when you play a card it will look cool."

Singletee and I are talking about this. We are concluding that the guy is seriously making a game, but he's making his own thing and doing a bait-and-switch sort of thing. I mean, it could also be an elaborate troll.

Google shows that the guy (or someone with his same username) is definitely a serious programmer. But as a programmer, I can say confidently that his estimate of a working version in 40 hours of work is ridiculous.

I don't know. He isn't very clear. If he is referring to a polished product, then he is definitely crazy. I understood his comment to say he had a basic game engine coded with ~10 cards and a simplistic 2D UI in under 40 hours. That seems somewhat reasonable to me. I've dabbled with digitizing games for a local play environment, and put a basic Dominion engine (with very limited UI) together in 20-30 hours.

(Disclaimer: This is local-play hobbyist tinkering, and none of it will be shared outside my home. Also, I did some dumb things, and the Dominion engine is currently not capable of supporting crazy complicated cards such as 'Feast', so it isn't the greatest supporting argument, but I am confident that if I was actually experienced in this area that I could have put a basic engine together that actually worked in this amount of time.)

In any case, based on his recent post about all the new cool things his game can do that Dominion can't do, my money is on bait and switch. He appears to be promoting his Dominion clone, and pretended it was "reskinned" Dominion initially.

SCSN

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7134
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #573 on: August 30, 2016, 04:00:10 pm »
+1

From a quantitative perspective also, I think Donald is certainly competitive enough to be hired as a software engineer. For a senior position say he can make 200K a year at that job. That is 50K for 3 months. Now he can give up all this money by doing an expansion that sells almost for nothing, but why can he not spare the same amount of money to reimburse those people that have bought into Goko or MF's product (discounted by the expected subscription price times number of months used?)

If it would take just 50k to honor all Goko/MF purchases that's 100% what would have happened. The actual amount will end up being such that this just isn't possible.


Wait, really?  The (aggregated) difference between had each member only paid a subscription amount for the time they bought vs. what they paid with the one-time set purchases is actually very large?

In that case I may have misunderstood the suggestion. If it was that we should retrospectively apply our new pricing model and offer something only to those who would have ended up short, I think that would result in more, not less unhappy people.
Logged

Kirian

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7092
  • Shuffle iT Username: Kirian
  • An Unbalanced Equation
  • Respect: +9371
    • View Profile
Re: Creating Dominion
« Reply #574 on: August 30, 2016, 04:02:13 pm »
+4

When I heard about the switch, I said 'caveat emptor' and went on with my life.

I suppose Latin is one of those efficient languages.

Tu sunt rectam.

"You bet your ass" ??
Logged
Kirian's Law of f.DS jokes:  Any sufficiently unexplained joke is indistinguishable from serious conversation.
Pages: 1 ... 21 22 [23] 24 25 ... 27  All
 

Page created in 0.227 seconds with 22 queries.