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[ehunt]

The only thing you need with Council Room is money and that's pretty easy to come by, because it's in every game!
If you have just an Hunting Grounds, you still need to find your +Buy or +Gain somewhere to make use of your huge hands.

If you don't have anything but money in addition to Council Room, you won't be able to utilize the +buy much, either.

True although Kingdom Treasures change this --  Council Room/Bank or Council Room / Fool's Gold will reliably produce double province turns (and of course in the latter case, turns like Province/FG, not to mention a couple of early FG/FG turns).

[Davio]

The only thing you need with Council Room is money and that's pretty easy to come by, because it's in every game!
If you have just an Hunting Grounds, you still need to find your +Buy or +Gain somewhere to make use of your huge hands.

If you don't have anything but money in addition to Council Room, you won't be able to utilize the +buy much, either.

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

[Awaclus]

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

When I'm choosing a strategy, I ask myself questions like:
Are there any combo strategies available?
Are there any rush strategies available?
What is the best engine payload?
Can I build an engine around that payload?
Are there any slog strategies available?
What's the best BM terminal?

Out of those questions, Council Room only really answers the last one significantly more than Hunting Grounds does.

[Accatitippi]

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

When I'm choosing a strategy, I ask myself questions like:
Are there any combo strategies available?
Are there any rush strategies available?
What is the best engine payload?
Can I build an engine around that payload?
Are there any slog strategies available?
What's the best BM terminal?

Out of those questions, Council Room only really answers the last one significantly more than Hunting Grounds does.

Its cost and its +Buy make it sometimes better than Hunting grounds at Question#4 too.

[Awaclus]

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

When I'm choosing a strategy, I ask myself questions like:
Are there any combo strategies available?
Are there any rush strategies available?
What is the best engine payload?
Can I build an engine around that payload?
Are there any slog strategies available?
What's the best BM terminal?

Out of those questions, Council Room only really answers the last one significantly more than Hunting Grounds does.

Its cost and its +Buy make it sometimes better than Hunting grounds at Question#4 too.

Not really. If there's already a payload worth building an engine for, I'd take Hunting Grounds in the kingdom over Council Room every time.

[Chris is me]

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

When I'm choosing a strategy, I ask myself questions like:
Are there any combo strategies available?
Are there any rush strategies available?
What is the best engine payload?
Can I build an engine around that payload?
Are there any slog strategies available?
What's the best BM terminal?

Out of those questions, Council Room only really answers the last one significantly more than Hunting Grounds does.

Its cost and its +Buy make it sometimes better than Hunting grounds at Question#4 too.

Not really. If there's already a payload worth building an engine for, I'd take Hunting Grounds in the kingdom over Council Room every time.

Yeah, but +Buy is very often part of that payload, in the form of multiple province turns, and even when it is not you want that +Buy for multiple component turns. Only in scenarios where your whole engine is just handed to you is Hunting Grounds a lot better than Council Room, and Dominion engines are rarely that perfect.

[Max]

In the base set, with few cards that provide +1 Buy, this is a good card. Early game it builds your engine, late game it allows you to check out.

The real questions for a base set C.R. are:
1. Is the chapel out?
2. Is throne room out?
3. Are the buys necessary?

The easiest question in the base set for C.R. is "is the chapel out?", if the answer is yes, then the main detriment to the C.R. is gone, because that extra card for them will only be kickstarting an engine if they've over greened, but you should be in a better position than that. If they've over greened before you've tried to check-out I'm confused. If the answer is no, you really need to have an idea about how stable their engine is. If it'll fire every turn, the C.R. is good. If it requires a set of collisions... If the chapel isn't out, then you don't want to use this as a draw-your-deck.

The second question, is important solely because it's the only card you can truly "make good" (mine and moneylender are truly edge cases). You have to evaluate the throne room threat. This ties in to the stability of their engine, but it makes a difference if you're on the edge of greening and already have enough for your last engine parts you don't play a C.R. to try for a province too.

The third is the question is absolutely vital. It's usually the main question between this and another terminal draw, the buys can make a big difference. I lost the province split 5/3 with a C.R. engine (I started greening a little too late, when you're buying 3 provinces a turn that's an awful error), but could pump my deck to size 30 with the coppers and a tonne of gardens.

I think these questions remain pretty stable with the addition of intrigue and seaside (the ones I own physically). All you need to know is "how much value is the card I'm giving them" and that's mainly effected by effective trashing and the stability of an engine, later expansions send more buys floating around, so that becomes way less important.

If both hunting grounds and council room are available. Hunting grounds is far more viable to draw your deck, but you will still want a council room for the buy. (Terminal drawing with +1 Buy is not to be sniffed at)

[Seprix]

My point is that if you're choosing a strategy, you ask yourself questions like:
How can I improve my handsize?
How can I get more than 1 card per turn?

CR answers those questions with 1 card.

When I'm choosing a strategy, I ask myself questions like:
Are there any combo strategies available?
Are there any rush strategies available?
What is the best engine payload?
Can I build an engine around that payload?
Are there any slog strategies available?
What's the best BM terminal?

Out of those questions, Council Room only really answers the last one significantly more than Hunting Grounds does.

Its cost and its +Buy make it sometimes better than Hunting grounds at Question#4 too.

Not really. If there's already a payload worth building an engine for, I'd take Hunting Grounds in the kingdom over Council Room every time.

In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds, I think I'm taking a single Council Room as it is $5, and as it provides a +buy. After that, I easily have the draw to get Hunting Grounds or whatever.

[Awaclus]

In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds, I think I'm taking a single Council Room as it is $5, and as it provides a +buy. After that, I easily have the draw to get Hunting Grounds or whatever.

In a game with nothing but Council Room and Hunting Grounds, sure, I'd play Council Room big money too. In a game with other cards, it is highly dependent on what those cards are and if there's something else that you want at $5, you probably want to go for that rather than Council Room.

[Seprix]

In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds, I think I'm taking a single Council Room as it is $5, and as it provides a +buy. After that, I easily have the draw to get Hunting Grounds or whatever.

In a game with nothing but Council Room and Hunting Grounds, sure, I'd play Council Room big money too. In a game with other cards, it is highly dependent on what those cards are and if there's something else that you want at $5, you probably want to go for that rather than Council Room.

Are you my brother or something? Do I have to say exactly everything like a lawyer or else you'll find some loophole when it's clearly obvious for everybody else what I meant?

[yuma]

In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds, I think I'm taking a single Council Room as it is $5, and as it provides a +buy. After that, I easily have the draw to get Hunting Grounds or whatever.

In a game with nothing but Council Room and Hunting Grounds, sure, I'd play Council Room big money too. In a game with other cards, it is highly dependent on what those cards are and if there's something else that you want at $5, you probably want to go for that rather than Council Room.

Are you my brother or something? Do I have to say exactly everything like a lawyer or else you'll find some loophole when it's clearly obvious for everybody else what I meant?

Relevant quotes

Like, for example, go smash your head against the wall.  It is, very likely, far more enjoyable than talking with Awaclus.

So, you are verifying once and for all what an incredible waste of time it is for anyone to try to argue about this with you.

and oh fuck it why do I even bother talking this is just going to get a pointless response to lead to more pointlessness.

[Awaclus]

In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds, I think I'm taking a single Council Room as it is $5, and as it provides a +buy. After that, I easily have the draw to get Hunting Grounds or whatever.

In a game with nothing but Council Room and Hunting Grounds, sure, I'd play Council Room big money too. In a game with other cards, it is highly dependent on what those cards are and if there's something else that you want at $5, you probably want to go for that rather than Council Room.

Are you my brother or something? Do I have to say exactly everything like a lawyer or else you'll find some loophole when it's clearly obvious for everybody else what I meant?

I'm interested in hearing what did you mean by "In a game with Council Room and Hunting Grounds" that is not covered by "In a game with nothing but Council Room and Hunting Grounds" and "In a game with other cards".

[Seprix]

But I quoted you, when you stated that (paraphrased) "in a game with both Council Room and Hunting Grounds, you'd just get Hunting Grounds." Whatever, It's not worth continuing on over. It just seemed logical, I guess it wasn't.

[Awaclus]

But I quoted you, when you stated that (paraphrased) "in a game with both Council Room and Hunting Grounds, you'd just get Hunting Grounds." Whatever, It's not worth continuing on over. It just seemed logical, I guess it wasn't.

No. I stated that (paraphrased) "in a game with 9 kingdom cards that are not Council Room or Hunting Grounds and some of them being good engine payload cards, I'd rather have the 10th card be Hunting Grounds than Council Room".