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Author Topic: The Necro Wars  (Read 343331 times)

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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3900 on: June 30, 2022, 02:03:40 pm »

the violin is the most graceful of all instruments

The violin is the worst. It is super uncomfortable to play and there's a million things you're doing wrong all the time and it's impossible to concentrate on all of them at the same time, it's also impossible to know if your position is ShiTty because you're ShiTty or because your chin rest and shoulder rest are not the right ones for your body shape, and it's also impossible to figure out which chin rest and shoulder rest would be right for you, and it's ridiculously difficult to get it in tune, and it's going to sound like ShiT until you're a super pro violinist, and everything is ShiTty overall.

Doesn't all of this make it even more beautiful when someone pulls it off?

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3901 on: June 30, 2022, 02:05:21 pm »

Pretty sure it does

It's not like I'm planning to go near any of these things myself. They are pure sorcery.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3902 on: June 30, 2022, 02:08:01 pm »

Doesn't all of this make it even more beautiful when someone pulls it off?

No! It makes it even more frustrating when people who have played the violin since they were 5 set the standard for what violin playing is supposed to sound like and I'm struggling to not sound like complete ShiT.
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3903 on: June 30, 2022, 02:49:00 pm »

Nate Silver on the new forecast model

I seem to update upward on how smart I think Nate is every year

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3904 on: July 02, 2022, 09:02:31 am »

Kookkurrenz is a German word

thought that was funny. that's all.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3905 on: July 02, 2022, 09:03:00 am »

oo is very rarely seen in this language

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3906 on: July 02, 2022, 03:27:10 pm »

So I've rewatched all of Adventure Time except the sequels. And it's really good. In fact I think it's altogether my second favorite show after GoT. I give it a 9/10. This is based on my feelings toward the show as a whole, not a mean of all episodes, which would be much lower. The ideas, characters, and world building is just so strong. And it's remarkable that the characters are good given that the show is mostly famous for being insanely weird.

Because I like rating things, let's rate the ~12 most common characters


Finn. Good realization of a teenager. Straight-forward personality, but likeable. 7/10.



Jake. So I don't think I really understand Jake, or how you could come up with him. One way to look at him is like an adult who chooses to never grow up/live a teenage lifestyle. If you do read it that way, then the show's verdict is that this is a totally fine thing to do, but it's unclear how to transfer that to the real world?

And the other thing is that he keeps doing random/unpredictable things, sometimes in really important cases. But it works out. And he's a dog, but it's adventure time so that doesn't really factor in.

I kind of don't like him as a person? But he's fun to watch. There must be something genius about him. Idk? 6/10.



BMO. He's a cute robot! But actually, I think he's best read as an eccentric kid. He's into weird things and does weird games with himself when he's alone. And his thing is like... being fascinated by the idea of being human-like (or not-robot-like)? The show definitely made a point that he's programmed to understand fun, unlike other robots. Also arguably gender fluid? There's one episode where he imagines that his other self in the mirror takes his place, and also the other self is a she. And called Football because this is Adventure Time. Anyway I like him. 7/10.



Lady Rainicorn. Chill, feminine, mature, and only speaks Korean for some reason. And she's Jake's girlfriend, and the show gets props for breaking stereotypes and not having a single scene where they have relationship drama. Anyway, the fact that she's this preposterous made-up creature but totally feels like a real person is cool. 8/10.



Lumpy Space Princess. So. This character. She's a bratty, entitled, naive and ridiculously self-centered uh princess. But she's also a flying purple ball, which somehow makes her brilliant. I can't really justify it, but I feel like every scene with her in it is hilarious. Maybe because she's somewhat self-aware and tries to be good when it really matters, so she's really likeable? Or maybe because she's so wonderfully authenatic? Anyway she's great. 9/10.



Marceline. I believe she's probably the most universally beloved character of the show. She's supposed to be 1000 years old and a vampire, but who chooses to live a fun lifestyle.

Whenever extremely old people who have a young physical appearance are depicted in fiction, they tend to be awful. The most common failure mode is make them behave in ways that are totally unrealistic for someone with this much life experience. However, Adventure Time happens to have good writing, so Marceline avoids this completely and manages to be believable. And beyond that, well, she's cool and a lot of fun. 9/10.



Tree Trunks. This character. What to say about this character? Well let's start with the obvious. She's an idiot. That's kind of her main character trait: being unintelligent. She's also incredibly condescending and self-centered, but totally not self-aware, unlike LSP.

I feel like the show understands this since her character is fairly consistent. E.g., she unironically admires the next character, which I find highly believable. But at the same time, the show gives her a pass? She should be treated like the piece of shit that she is, but she's not. She's instead treated as real character, which is extremely annoying. She tends to make every scene worse by being an idiot who others have to deal with, but since they treat her as if she's decent, it's annoying rather than funny.

So basically what I'm saying is that she's the worst character ever and I hate her. Yet she keeps being brought back. There's an episode about her in the final season. I don't know why. Tree Trunks is abysmal. She also has an incredibly annoying voice. 0/10.



King of Ooo. This character's personality is that he's a piece of shit. That is literally it. He's acting benevolent to others, but it's made perfectly clear that it's purely an act. He is power hungry, money hungry, status hungry, has zero empathy, and acts entirely selfish. This never changes, there's not a single scene where he does something for someone else or is redeemed in some other way.

However, none of this is bad since he's treated appropriately by the show, so actually, I think he's a pretty great villain. He doesn't appear that often, but I like basically everything they did with him. Good stuff. 8/10.



Susan Strong. So she's introduced as a primitive, sort of barely-above-animal-level-intelligence human, but actually she's a smart educated person whose brain got messed with. There's an entire huge backstory about the other humans relating to her, about which I mostly felt the same as I feel about this character, which is that she's not terrible but doesn't have anything particularly going for her. She's just kind of boring compared to other things in the show. 4/10.



Princess Bubblegum. She's the Candy Princess! That means she's literally made out of candy, and she's the princess of the candy kingdom, where everyone else is also made out of candy! And she's all pink and girly. Woo.

If this show were bad, that would be the extent of her personality. She would be dumb and pretty, and Finn the main character would have to do things for her or whatever.

But the show isn't bad, it's Adventure time, so she's a real character. She's also the incarnation of the candy elemental, which in this universe is one of the four primal forces in the world. 800 years ago she was created along with her brother, who is a barely sentient dragon creature afraid of everyone except her, but who has the power to turn vitamins from trees(?) into a substance that's sort of a universal life force.

So being the only intelligent person out there, she began studying her environment, built stuff, and literally figured out how to use the life force to create candy mass and then give it life. So she's not only the person who actually runs things, she also literally created every person in her kingdom. Instead of being dumb because she's a pink princess, she's easily the most intelligent character in the show and -- gasp -- actually makes smart choices consistent with that, well most of the time. She's also a control freak who spies on everyone all the time to prevent disaster, and it's mostly working.

There's a sub plot early where Finn is romantically interested in her but -- get this -- the show understands that an 800 year old scientist who is running a kingdom isn't going to be interested in a teenager. I know, I can barely believe it myself. Instead, she eventually has a romantic relationship with Marceline. Someone roughly her age.

And also, besides being ancient, brilliant, and the creator of life, she's also a totally believable cool person.

The fact that it subverts expectations so much does make it better, but she'd be amazing even without that. 10/10.



Gunter. Wenk. 8/10.



Ice King/Simon. So Simon is a nice, caring, somewhat nerdy bookworm, but he found the ancient crown which turned into... well, Ice King who you see on the left. Who is so different that it's not really possible for me to conceptualize them as the same person, they're just two separate characters in my head.

The show severely messes with you by introducing Ice King first without telling you about the backstory, and when they first do, I remember assuming that it was a pretty messed-up joke that would never be brought up again. It wasn't. They totally went with it.

So Ice King, despite being ~1000 years old, is best thought of as something like an autistic kid that wants to make friends but no-one likes him. The crown basically kills his long term memory, so he lives on a couple of month(?) long time horizon, and because this show is well-written, that tracks how he behaves. Also, he kidnaps princesses. which is funny.

Kind of difficult to critique them since Simon doesn't have enough screen time to be a real character and Ice King is, well, mostly functioning by creating problems for everyone else to clean up. But I always thought the crown thing was really strong. Also, he's a lot of fun as Ice King. The episodes with him in it tend to be great. 9/10.



Earl of Lemongrab. Describing this exceeds my abilities, but for whatever reason I actually think he's fantastic. 9/10.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3907 on: July 02, 2022, 03:34:55 pm »

ah also moderate spoilers. It's very useful to add spoiler warnings after the thing.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3908 on: July 02, 2022, 05:05:23 pm »

Also, let's do top 10 episodes! Which is not that many across 10 seasons....

10. The Prince Who Wanted Everything because I appreciate parodying self-insert fan fiction
9. Blank Eyed Girl because it's so pleasantly unpredictable
8. Broke His Crown because characters and story
7. I Remember You because genuinely touching character moments out of nowhere
6. Puhoy because more time passed in this episode than the rest of the series combined
5. Varmints because I like the characters so much
4. Orgalorg because Wenk
3. Princess Cookie because it's absurd yet delightful and sweet
2. Is That You? because it's truly impressive to be this creative while still making sense
1. The Hall of Egress

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3909 on: July 02, 2022, 05:51:17 pm »

so what are the chances that the villain in stranger things has a reason to tell the good guys his plan vs being an idiot?

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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3911 on: July 03, 2022, 04:26:01 pm »

I think I've mentioned that I've implemented a sudoku solver four times, in java, haskell, python, and java. it's actually five now because I wrote another python implementation when I was bored.

But. Can I implement a sudoku solver in PROLOG? in a logical programming language? Where your program consists of facts and logical rules, rather than commands or functions? Essentially an implementation of formal logic?

I don't know. But I intend to find out. I think understanding logical programming is actually kind of relevant for my interests.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3912 on: July 03, 2022, 05:21:11 pm »

Length function in Python
def len(x):
  s = 0
  for i in x:
    s += 1
  return s

Length Function in Haskell
len [] = 0
len (x:xs) = len xs + 1

Length Function in Prolog
len([],0).
len([_|X],N) :- len(X,M), N is M+1.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3913 on: July 03, 2022, 06:29:06 pm »

shows really need to stop using the "things go bad but then the good characters remember something inspiring, get really determined, fight back, and win" template.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3914 on: July 04, 2022, 05:53:15 pm »

I'm so good at programming

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3915 on: July 04, 2022, 05:55:44 pm »

is how I feel when I use functional programming (or now logical programming), where code actually works after you write it. it's unheard of for most languages

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3916 on: July 04, 2022, 06:00:44 pm »

So I wrote the sudoku "solver" in Prolog. It's 16 lines of code and it seems to  work. The catch is that it's actually only a logical predicate that decides whether or not something is a sudoku, but that's what programming is in Prolog. You say what the thing is, and the compiler searches for such things for you. E.g., I type sudoku(X). into the compiler, and it finds all X that fulfill the predicate, i.e., all sudokus.

What actually happens is that it doesn't find anything because, without any optimization, finding even a single sudoku would probably take 100+ years of computation or something. This would be the reason why logical programming isn't used much in practice.

But it would work with infinity time, and you can put in a real or wrong sudoku and tell you "true" or "false".

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3917 on: July 04, 2022, 06:04:37 pm »

Anyway I think the concept that, given infinity computing power, you can solve every problem by only specifying what the solution is, rather than how to obtain it (and then a fixed-sized compiler finds all solutions for you), is philosophically important, which is the reason why I picked up prolog in the first place.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3918 on: July 04, 2022, 06:42:52 pm »

shows really need to stop using the "things go bad but then the good characters remember something inspiring, get really determined, fight back, and win" template.

No-one will admit this, which means I have no evidence for this thesis, but.

I think the fact that so much fiction does the above is having legit effects on real people. It's fine to think that the world has a sense of justice and morality, and that being very determined is the answer... until it's not. Until you it affects decisions you make. I feel like we have both a problem of nihilism and of, whatever you want to call it, narrative bias.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3919 on: July 06, 2022, 04:21:30 pm »

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3920 on: July 07, 2022, 10:29:57 am »

A patronizing model of development stages of models on quality of art, version 0.000. Disagreement/scorn appreciated. This is relevant for ethics.



Stage 1. Things you like are good. Things you don't like are bad. People who agree with you are correct, people who disagree are wrong. (This is the level that children tend to be on.)

Stage 2. You understand the concept of personal taste but apply it inconsistently. You sort qualities into objective and subjective based on a visceral reaction that you don't investigate or question. You will use that reaction to call some things you dislike "good but not for me", and other things "bad". (This is the level that people are on.)

Stage 3. You realize that stage #2 is inconsistent and conclude that "everything is subjective, there's no such thing as objective judgment".

Stage 4. You recognize that "everything is subjective" isn't quite right but but also that you can't make arbitrary calls like in Stage 2. You don't really have a model.

Stage 5. You identify the problem as defining what it means to be good, and conclude that objective judgment is possible given a crisp definition. You discover well-defined aspects that map onto the distinction that your gut sense of good vs. not for me (that Stage 2 is just running with) is getting at.

Stage 6. You grasp on a deep level that that subjective/objective distinction doesn't get at anything fundamental because every subject is just a part of the world like everything else. Statements about art/personal taste/etc. aren't special; they're true, false, or ambiguous, just like statements about anything else. You recognize that the same is true for emotions/liking/etc.; they too are just more things in the world.

Stage 7. You grasp the philosophical position of stage 6 and also begin to understand the mechanics behind what makes people say things. E.g., why is art appealing, how do preferences work, etc.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3921 on: July 07, 2022, 10:30:48 am »

*most people are on

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3922 on: July 07, 2022, 10:41:06 am »

In this model, people are who are passionate defenders of #3 will spend almost their entire time arguing against people on stage #2 since there are so many more people on stage #2 than #4+.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3923 on: July 07, 2022, 11:04:26 am »

A patronizing model of development stages of models on quality of art, version 0.000. Disagreement/scorn appreciated. This is relevant for ethics.



Stage 1. Things you like are good. Things you don't like are bad. People who agree with you are correct, people who disagree are wrong. (This is the level that children tend to be on.)

Stage 2. You understand the concept of personal taste but apply it inconsistently. You sort qualities into objective and subjective based on a visceral reaction that you don't investigate or question. You will use that reaction to call some things you dislike "good but not for me", and other things "bad". (This is the level that people are on.)

Stage 3. You realize that stage #2 is inconsistent and conclude that "everything is subjective, there's no such thing as objective judgment".

Stage 4. You recognize that "everything is subjective" isn't quite right but but also that you can't make arbitrary calls like in Stage 2. You don't really have a model.

Stage 5. You identify the problem as defining what it means to be good, and conclude that objective judgment is possible given a crisp definition. You discover well-defined aspects that map onto the distinction that your gut sense of good vs. not for me (that Stage 2 is just running with) is getting at.

Stage 6. You grasp on a deep level that that subjective/objective distinction doesn't get at anything fundamental because every subject is just a part of the world like everything else. Statements about art/personal taste/etc. aren't special; they're true, false, or ambiguous, just like statements about anything else. You recognize that the same is true for emotions/liking/etc.; they too are just more things in the world.

Stage 7. You grasp the philosophical position of stage 6 and also begin to understand the mechanics behind what makes people say things. E.g., why is art appealing, how do preferences work, etc.
It's true except the model peaks at stage 4; everything beyond that is a worse understanding of art.

Of course it's entirely possible that there are stages beyond 4 but if so then I don't know what they are.
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #3924 on: July 07, 2022, 12:41:14 pm »

It's true except the model peaks at stage 4; everything beyond that is a worse understanding of art.

Of course it's entirely possible that there are stages beyond 4 but if so then I don't know what they are.

That's exactly what someone on level 4 would say!
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