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Author Topic: The Necro Wars  (Read 337450 times)

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Awaclus

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1475 on: October 21, 2021, 06:29:30 am »

I'm not a Netflix user, is the algorithm supposedly based on human-understandable classifications of what the movies actually contain? Most recommendation algorithms just recommend people stuff, keep track of what recommendations worked on whom, and then recommend the same thing to other similar people, regardless of the contents.
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Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1476 on: October 21, 2021, 02:05:03 pm »

I'm not a Netflix user, is the algorithm supposedly based on human-understandable classifications of what the movies actually contain?

Nope. That was my implicit assumption because that's (on first glance) how I would approach the problem. In fact, I've read an article that was very light on details and sounded like the author didn't really know what they were talking about, but it sounded a bit more like what you're describing.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1477 on: October 21, 2021, 02:28:09 pm »

It does seem stupid though, why treat movies as black boxes when you have plenty of features you use instead?

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1478 on: October 21, 2021, 06:08:58 pm »

Someone recommended me this (well the band, I picked the album) to add to my repertoire of frightening music. And I'm like, a 90 minutes long monster with unorthodox songwriting and insane things happening all over the place, that's about what I was looking for.

I think I'm beginning to understand a frustration I have with most classical music, which is that it seems too constrained. I totally respect it, the sound is nice, but the compositions are usually too formulaic. This album feels like it it's doing what more classical music was supposed to do.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1479 on: October 21, 2021, 06:10:11 pm »

Art is all about going further

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1480 on: October 21, 2021, 06:13:26 pm »

M > S

Awaclus

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1481 on: October 22, 2021, 06:43:47 am »

It does seem stupid though, why treat movies as black boxes when you have plenty of features you use instead?

I think it's smart. Over time, it gets relatively effective for the average user, and the algorithm doesn't have to care what it's recommending as long as people are clicking on the recommendations. A fancier algorithm could more easily have all kinds of pitfalls, as it would have to make more substantial assumptions and the thing about assumptions is that they can be wrong.
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Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

silverspawn

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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1483 on: October 22, 2021, 07:22:55 am »

It does seem stupid though, why treat movies as black boxes when you have plenty of features you use instead?

I think it's smart. Over time, it gets relatively effective for the average user, and the algorithm doesn't have to care what it's recommending as long as people are clicking on the recommendations. A fancier algorithm could more easily have all kinds of pitfalls, as it would have to make more substantial assumptions and the thing about assumptions is that they can be wrong.

What do you mean by assumption? Fitting a linear model to a bunch of features of movies or shows doesn't seem to require any assumptions

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1484 on: October 22, 2021, 07:23:29 am »

Well except that the factors are independent ofc

faust

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1485 on: October 22, 2021, 07:37:06 am »

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Awaclus

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1486 on: October 22, 2021, 07:47:20 am »

What do you mean by assumption? Fitting a linear model to a bunch of features of movies or shows doesn't seem to require any assumptions

The assumption that such a linear model will reflect what users want to watch.
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Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's Creative Commons albums for free

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1487 on: October 22, 2021, 06:58:56 pm »

So sad if a show has real good things going for it and then squanders it by finishing in the dumbest most cliche way possible

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1488 on: October 23, 2021, 02:11:51 am »

So sad if a show has real good things going for it and then squanders it by finishing in the dumbest most cliche way possible

"Ratched" flashbacks
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1489 on: October 23, 2021, 10:51:21 am »

If my internet disconnects follow a Poisson distribution, I believe this means that, given the data point of a disconnect after 8 minutes, I should have decent chances to have no disconnect for 16 minutes, which is about enough to download the aforementioned album. I'm gonna try it a bunch of times.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1490 on: October 23, 2021, 10:53:08 am »

Btw faust, if you don't mind me asking, how much did you work while doing your masters? (Do I remember correctly that you majored in pure math?)

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1491 on: October 23, 2021, 10:56:52 am »

another 8 minutes one

faust

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1492 on: October 23, 2021, 11:23:55 am »

Btw faust, if you don't mind me asking, how much did you work while doing your masters? (Do I remember correctly that you majored in pure math?)
No that's fine. Yes I majored in pure math. The workload is a bit hard to judge... I also had a tutoring job alongside my studies, I was active as one of our faculty's student representatives, and I wrote (and briefly headed the politics department) for our university's student newspaper. Needless to say I took more than the standard 4 semesters. I did my Master's in 5 semesters, but then I had already taken some Master courses during my Bachelor's, which took 9 semesters.

That all definitely totalled at more than 8 hours per day, it might get there if we take 8 hours every day including weekends. But it's very hard to disentangle how much of that was actually study time.

Now I'm doing my PhD (also pure math) and it works out alright at 40 hours per week. I do have a very decent position, lasting for 5 years and including teaching, with full compensation. If I wanted to get it done in the standard 3 years that would have been signifcantly more difficult, though my productivity has also suffered during lockdown, otherwise I could probably be in a better position.
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silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1493 on: October 23, 2021, 11:25:00 am »

This is an interesting (and ime, rare) completely non-artificial use case of statistics in real life.

Namely, one may examine the question "What's the probability of 16 minute duration without disconnects given observed data points of (2, 8, 12) minutes.

Unfortunately, the answer is of course that it depends on the chosen prior if you're using Bayesian methods (or that you should be using Bayesian methods if you're not). Still, I could, in fact, do some math here that would probably adjust my estimate, by assuming a Poisson distribution with a prior for \lambda (over 16 minutes) uniform in [1,4] or something

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1494 on: October 23, 2021, 11:34:19 am »

Btw faust, if you don't mind me asking, how much did you work while doing your masters? (Do I remember correctly that you majored in pure math?)
No that's fine. Yes I majored in pure math. The workload is a bit hard to judge... I also had a tutoring job alongside my studies, I was active as one of our faculty's student representatives, and I wrote (and briefly headed the politics department) for our university's student newspaper. Needless to say I took more than the standard 4 semesters. I did my Master's in 5 semesters, but then I had already taken some Master courses during my Bachelor's, which took 9 semesters.

That all definitely totalled at more than 8 hours per day, it might get there if we take 8 hours every day including weekends. But it's very hard to disentangle how much of that was actually study time.

Now I'm doing my PhD (also pure math) and it works out alright at 40 hours per week. I do have a very decent position, lasting for 5 years and including teaching, with full compensation. If I wanted to get it done in the standard 3 years that would have been signifcantly more difficult, though my productivity has also suffered during lockdown, otherwise I could probably be in a better position.

Interesting. (Nice to hear that a PhD takes less  time/day than a masters.)

I assume the standard for bachelor&master was 10, so you've taken 40% more time there? Which is similar to the PhD. My impression was that very few people would be able to finish a master in math with grades that make them eligible for a PhD with 8 hours/day in the regular time -- even though 8 hours is already a lot. A lot of people at my university didn't manage that for computer science, and computer science is so so much easier.

Taking more overall time but less per day is probably more effective, too.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1495 on: October 23, 2021, 05:32:08 pm »

I feel like there is a very hard but important lesson writers have to learn, which is that just because they're really emotional about something, the audience doesn't have to feel the same way. In particular, they don't get a license for no longer making sense.

I learned this lesson by -- how could it be different -- writing a romance scene of My Little Pony fanfiction. I was very emotional about it but it didn't make sense and my prereaders didn't like it. (I can't believe I had prereaders back then when I was 1000 worse at writing fiction than now and now I don't have them but that's the situation.)

But what is interesting is that I've repeatedly seen really accomplished, good writers ostensibly falling victim to that.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1496 on: October 23, 2021, 06:08:29 pm »

I can't help laughing right now as I reminisce about how incredibly weird the pony days were. I don't think they were particularly weird because they were the pony days, it's more that I had a bunch of extremely strange social interactions around that time. Which is admittedly upstream of the show because it attracts a lot of AUTISTIC people or people who like me had extreme social anxiety.

Of course the real difference between me then and now is that then 90% of what I did was signaling, i.e., actions motivated by wanting others to view me a certain way. One does have to go no further than my infamous first post in this forum to see what that looked like. Being extremely signaling driven and liking something socially awkward like MLP isn't inherently contradictory but led to strange results

I remember that my socially polished (and of course incredibly deep reason) for liking the show was essentially that it was a utopia, i.e., humans are jerks but the inhabitants of this fictional universe were predominantly nice. Which is not that wrong and was probably a part of the real reason I liked it, but certainly there was also a less flattering component.

Although I will still say that settings with people-who-aren't-like-humans are underrated in fiction. Which doesn't have to be full fantasy like MLP, it can also be like The series of unfortunate events.

silverspawn

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1497 on: October 23, 2021, 06:20:04 pm »

With the essential restriction that it has to be intentional. in some sense, almost all settings are populated with people-who-aren't-like-humans because the author has an incorrect view of what humans are like, and that is a bug. E.g., there are no consequentialists in Twilight; there are no utilitarians in Harry Potter except Grindlewald who is evil. Often it's more subtle, but for almost every author, you can find subtle philosophical ideas that are unilaterally shared by all people in the universe because the author can't conceive of people who don't hold them. The closest to an exception is of course a song of ice and fire where characters feature a very rich set of fundamental world views. E.g. for ethics, we have both Deontology (Ned Stark) and Consequentialism (Varys) presented in such a way that I expect people who actually hold those views won't feel like they're being strawmanned.

And then there are autistic-but-not-smart people who write stories and it's just a disaster

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1498 on: October 23, 2021, 06:26:00 pm »

Also I think e.g. Arya is Virtue Ethics? Now I just have to research whether other people who have classified these characters would agree with me. I'm probably not the best at differentiating Deontology and Virtue ethics.

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Re: The Necro Wars
« Reply #1499 on: October 23, 2021, 06:29:37 pm »

Brienne is probably a purer example of virtue ethics
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