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Author Topic: Random Stuff Part III  (Read 650406 times)

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Kirian

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2050 on: November 30, 2016, 02:45:41 pm »
+1

Anyone have recommendations for a phone stylus?  I bought a cheap-ish one from Best Buy so I could continue to play Pokemon Go without my hands freezing.  It is wearing out after only a couple weeks of use.  Not sure if it's just especially low quality, cold weather or the specific motions needed for PoGo (but probably some combination of all 3).

Anyway, I'm not sure if a more expensive stylus would be better.  For now, I've ordered a set of 10 extra-cheap styluses from Amazon.  No idea if they'll collectively last longer, but it's so cheap that I may as well try.  They're gonna take a month to arrive though.  Any of you guys have relevant wisdom to offer?

No wisdom, but a question: How in the world is something from Amazon taking a month to ship?

Unless I've misunderstood and they're coming from some rare uncontacted tribe in the Amazon.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2051 on: November 30, 2016, 06:22:26 pm »
0

Anyone have recommendations for a phone stylus?  I bought a cheap-ish one from Best Buy so I could continue to play Pokemon Go without my hands freezing.  It is wearing out after only a couple weeks of use.  Not sure if it's just especially low quality, cold weather or the specific motions needed for PoGo (but probably some combination of all 3).

Anyway, I'm not sure if a more expensive stylus would be better.  For now, I've ordered a set of 10 extra-cheap styluses from Amazon.  No idea if they'll collectively last longer, but it's so cheap that I may as well try.  They're gonna take a month to arrive though.  Any of you guys have relevant wisdom to offer?

No wisdom, but a question: How in the world is something from Amazon taking a month to ship?

Unless I've misunderstood and they're coming from some rare uncontacted tribe in the Amazon.

My understanding is that it's actually shipping from China, even though it's sold on Amazon.  If they rip me off I won't care that much because it was about $2.  Reviews seem to be fine though.  Amazon as a storefront seems to obfuscate a lot though so I'm not entirely sure.
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pacovf

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2052 on: December 01, 2016, 03:23:33 am »
0

Anybody in here has any experience with signal processing? I have signals that have a huge messy noise source around 50kHz that I want to get rid off. I've tried some things already with less good results than I was hoping, so I am looking for options.
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Awaclus

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2053 on: December 01, 2016, 04:50:17 am »
0

Anybody in here has any experience with signal processing? I have signals that have a huge messy noise source around 50kHz that I want to get rid off. I've tried some things already with less good results than I was hoping, so I am looking for options.

I would have some ideas for audio signals specifically (e.g. just leave it there because who cares about 50kHz), but you probably mean something different.
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pacovf

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2054 on: December 01, 2016, 10:12:23 am »
0

Well, yeah. Assuming it were a more annoying frequency for you, what would you do? Probably won't be useful to me, but who knows.
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pingpongsam

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2055 on: December 01, 2016, 10:19:11 am »
+1

Well, yeah. Assuming it were a more annoying frequency for you, what would you do? Probably won't be useful to me, but who knows.

notch filter? for meatspace
« Last Edit: December 01, 2016, 10:24:02 am by pingpongsam »
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Awaclus

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2056 on: December 01, 2016, 11:16:55 am »
+1

Well, yeah. Assuming it were a more annoying frequency for you, what would you do? Probably won't be useful to me, but who knows.

I might do some of the following:

 - Record the signal and use a denoiser after the fact
 - Use a multiband noise gate to duck the volume whenever there's just noise going on
 - Record the signal and manually automate the volume of a peak filter to achieve the same result as above but better
 - Blend the signal in with a similar sounding synthesizer
 - Play around with Vocodex and hope for the best

But mostly if the 1st option wasn't enough to get the result I wanted, I'd try to get a better signal before doing anything else, unless I had no other choice but to use that signal no matter what (or if I had to do it live).

A notch filter is a pretty heavy-handed approach but it works if there's nothing important going on at the frequencies in question.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2016, 11:23:39 am by Awaclus »
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pacovf

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2057 on: December 01, 2016, 03:58:32 pm »
0

Well the data is already recorded, so at this point I am looking at digital solutions. Analog solutions could prove useful for next time though.

I have a relatively short signal sitting on a relatively long (and noisy) window, with the 50kHz (actually more like 45 to 60 kHz) being the part of the noise that interferes the most with my signal. I care about the noise during and right before or after my signal.

Something like a notch filter seems to create too many aberrations to be useful (admittedly I haven't tried all possible implementations). I've tried identifying the phase of the ~50kHz and substracting a sinusoid with same amplitude, but the phase is only stable for some 400 μs before some transient behaviour changes it in some random way, as far as I can see.

For the time being, the best solution I've found is to "flatten" the 50kHz peak in frequency space; it does reduce the contribution of that noise without affecting my signal, just not quite enough.

Worst part of this is that trying to read the research on the topic is very frustrating, because for some reason signal processing comes associated with different terminology depending on the area it is being applied to.

Any idea what a denoiser does, exactly?
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scott_pilgrim

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2058 on: December 01, 2016, 10:07:32 pm »
+5

You never truly appreciate the 'r' and 'e' keys being right next to each other until you try to search "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them" and come up with something totally different...
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eHalcyon

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2059 on: December 01, 2016, 10:14:15 pm »
+5

You never truly appreciate the 'r' and 'e' keys being right next to each other until you try to search "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them" and come up with something totally different...

It's always good to proofread, in order to keep abeast of typos.
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Awaclus

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2060 on: December 02, 2016, 12:24:31 am »
0

Any idea what a denoiser does, exactly?

It needs a saample of just the noise, and it analyzes that and then it can remove similar noise from any signal.
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pacovf

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2061 on: December 02, 2016, 12:41:18 am »
0

I guess it would be too much to assume that you know how? Or, failing that, have a link?
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Awaclus

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2062 on: December 02, 2016, 01:07:41 am »
+1

I guess it would be too much to assume that you know how? Or, failing that, have a link?

I mean, I know how to use it, but I have no idea what it's technically doing.
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Kirian

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2063 on: December 02, 2016, 11:34:14 am »
0

You never truly appreciate the 'r' and 'e' keys being right next to each other until you try to search "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them" and come up with something totally different...

This will obviously be a parody porn, if it isn't already.
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Kirian

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2064 on: December 02, 2016, 11:36:04 am »
0

You never truly appreciate the 'r' and 'e' keys being right next to each other until you try to search "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them" and come up with something totally different...

It's always good to proofread, in order to keep abeast of typos.

As Taylor Mali says, there is no prostitute for proper proofreading.
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SpaceAnemone

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2065 on: December 02, 2016, 11:57:38 am »
+1

I guess it would be too much to assume that you know how? Or, failing that, have a link?

I'm in image processing rather than 1D signals, but usually if you can characterize the statistical properties of your noise vs your signal, you're off to a good start. Often denoising relies on decomposing your signal into some kind of basis function representation, downweighting coefficients that represent the noise band, and reconstructing the original signal minus the noise from that. You say you've tried frequency space (FFTs?) already, so that's one related approach. You might investigate different windowing functions you could apply beforehand, too.

An important question is what you're doing with your signal afterwards, though. If you're using it for some kind of analysis, can you just design the remainder of the pipeline to be robust/invariant to the noise, rather than requiring a pre-processing step that might also interfere with the informative part of the signal?
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Kuildeous

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2066 on: December 02, 2016, 12:49:42 pm »
+1

As Taylor Mali says, there is no prostitute for proper proofreading.

Well, there's yet another one of my kinks unfulfilled. *sigh*
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Kirian

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2067 on: December 02, 2016, 11:26:12 pm »
0

For reference

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pacovf

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2068 on: December 02, 2016, 11:56:49 pm »
0

I guess it would be too much to assume that you know how? Or, failing that, have a link?

I'm in image processing rather than 1D signals, but usually if you can characterize the statistical properties of your noise vs your signal, you're off to a good start. Often denoising relies on decomposing your signal into some kind of basis function representation, downweighting coefficients that represent the noise band, and reconstructing the original signal minus the noise from that. You say you've tried frequency space (FFTs?) already, so that's one related approach. You might investigate different windowing functions you could apply beforehand, too.

An important question is what you're doing with your signal afterwards, though. If you're using it for some kind of analysis, can you just design the remainder of the pipeline to be robust/invariant to the noise, rather than requiring a pre-processing step that might also interfere with the informative part of the signal?

Simplifying my problem, I am trying to identify the number of times a given pulse shape appears in my signal, with that pulse shape occurring in clusters.  I have yet to try Wiener deconvolution (since I know my pulse shape and have a good estimate of my noise), that seems like the next logical step. Otherwise, I have to try wavelets and see what happens, although I have no experience with those.

I have tried to make the remainder of the pipeline more robust to the noise, that was my first approach, but I have only limited success because of that 50kHz, so that's why I am trying to approach the problem from that angle now.
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LaLight

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2069 on: December 03, 2016, 02:06:21 am »
0

I had a dream tonight that made me remember about one beautiful and interesting game called Braid. Has anyone played? I highly recommend it, it's in my top-5 best games in the world!
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Titandrake

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2070 on: December 03, 2016, 03:27:38 am »
0

I had a dream tonight that made me remember about one beautiful and interesting game called Braid. Has anyone played? I highly recommend it, it's in my top-5 best games in the world!

I've played it. I wouldn't put it in my top 5, but it was definitely worth playing.
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SpaceAnemone

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2071 on: December 03, 2016, 01:50:14 pm »
0

An important question is what you're doing with your signal afterwards, though. If you're using it for some kind of analysis, can you just design the remainder of the pipeline to be robust/invariant to the noise, rather than requiring a pre-processing step that might also interfere with the informative part of the signal?

Simplifying my problem, I am trying to identify the number of times a given pulse shape appears in my signal, with that pulse shape occurring in clusters.  I have yet to try Wiener deconvolution (since I know my pulse shape and have a good estimate of my noise), that seems like the next logical step. Otherwise, I have to try wavelets and see what happens, although I have no experience with those.

I have tried to make the remainder of the pipeline more robust to the noise, that was my first approach, but I have only limited success because of that 50kHz, so that's why I am trying to approach the problem from that angle now.

How strong a constraint do you have on the exact pulse shape? Presumably not strong enough that you can just convolve the signal with that and look for peaks? Assuming not, maybe try
sliding window approach, with a windowing function -> fourier space -> match against a frequency profile for your signal that's robust to whatever's going on around 50kHz -> non-maximal suppression to get a count.

The objective function you're optimizing over in order to arrive at a denoised version of your original signal is almost certainly the wrong thing if what you actually want to do to the signal is just to count pulses. Even if the above outline of a plan isn't good enough, I feel that there ought to be a much better approach that utterly destroys most of the original signal, but is very good at making your desired pulses stand out, so that's what I'd be looking for. BTW, what software are you using for your investigation?
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SpaceAnemone

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2072 on: December 03, 2016, 01:56:39 pm »
0

I had a dream tonight that made me remember about one beautiful and interesting game called Braid. Has anyone played? I highly recommend it, it's in my top-5 best games in the world!

I've played it! :-) I think Braid and Portal 2 are the only two computer games I've played in the last 10+ years! That doesn't count the odd browser game, and a lot of Ingress/Pokemon Go, of course...
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Roadrunner7671

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2073 on: December 04, 2016, 08:52:43 pm »
0

In the past people have been able to answer my questions about dice, but I think this one is more difficult.

Which one is more likely to win, a D10 or a D8+1? Which one is 'better?'

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Re: Random Stuff Part III
« Reply #2074 on: December 04, 2016, 08:54:43 pm »
+2

So I saw Book of Mormon today.  It's pretty amazing.
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