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Author Topic: Highest Total Value from One Buy  (Read 6751 times)

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singletee

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Highest Total Value from One Buy
« on: November 25, 2015, 01:47:27 pm »
+2

Puzzle:
During your buy phase, you buy a single card and resolve any on-buy and on-gain effects and any additional effects you wish to trigger from those. What is the highest possible total value of the bought card plus the additional cards you end up with in your deck?

Rules:
  • Solo game
  • Any number of events allowed in Kingdom
  • Perfect shuffle luck
  • Unlimited turns of setup
  • Standard number of Treasures (53 Copper, 40 Silver, 30 Gold, 12 Platinum, 16 Potion)
  • 10 Curses in Supply
  • Potions in costs do not count extra for value
  • If any cost reductions are in effect after your buy, your total value is calculated using the reduced costs
« Last Edit: November 26, 2015, 01:40:22 am by singletee »
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xyz123

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2015, 02:44:21 pm »
0

170.

Setup
- Have >=6 to spend.
- Trader in hand.
- 9 Duplicates on the tavern mat.

1) Buy Border Village.
2) Call your Duplicates to gain another 9 Border Villages.
3) For each BV, choose Cache as your cheaper card.
4) Reveal Trader for each of the Coppers that came with the Caches.

Cards gained.

10x Border Village
10x Cache
20x Silver.
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AdamH

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2015, 02:45:52 pm »
0

I'm thinking a big Doctor overpay, discarding Tunnels to gain 30 Gold and trashing 8 Feoda for 24 Silvers, so that's $255 (30*6+24*3+3 for the Doctor himself)

We can trash 10 Catacombs to gain ten 4-costs, I'd really like to make them Ferry-ed Border Villages so we can gain 3-costs but there are no events allowed. Hmm... So this is $40 more.

EDIT: Events ARE allowed. Reading is hard. So we can get ten 3-costs for an additional $30

We have 10 Hagglers in play so we can gain ten 2-costs. That's $20 more.

Well that's $315 $345. That's a start.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 02:49:23 pm by AdamH »
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iguanaiguana

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2015, 02:56:31 pm »
0

I'm thinking a big Doctor overpay, discarding Tunnels to gain 30 Gold and trashing 8 Feoda for 24 Silvers, so that's $255 (30*6+24*3+3 for the Doctor himself)

We can trash 10 Catacombs to gain ten 4-costs, I'd really like to make them Ferry-ed Border Villages so we can gain 3-costs but there are no events allowed. Hmm... So this is $40 more.

EDIT: Events ARE allowed. Reading is hard. So we can get ten 3-costs for an additional $30

We have 10 Hagglers in play so we can gain ten 2-costs. That's $20 more.

Well that's $315 $345. That's a start.


trader the two costs for silvers and get 10$ more
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AdamH

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2015, 03:04:04 pm »
+1

Stealing ideas from xyz123/iguana:


Can use the Trader trick to gain Silvers instead of $2-costs, that adds $10 more.

We can duplicate our Doctor 9 times to get $27 more. That's a total of $382.

Is this possible with only 10 kingdom cards? I'll have to calculate the minimum overpay required to get the Tunnels since it's definitely more than 30. There's a lot of crap floating around in there so we'll need a bunch of money to discard past it.

We already require this stuff still in the supply:

10 Doctors
10 2-costs (we can just Haggle Coppers and Trader them)
10 Border Villages
10 3-Costs

We already require this stuff still in the deck:

10 Catacombs
8 Feoda
some number of Tunnels (7)
10 Hagglers
9 Duplicates
a Trader

some kind of village that lets us play 10 Hagglers. KC is an obvious choice but then we also need some draw. I'm thinking Conspirator?

In any case, there isn't room in a kingdom for all of this, so some of it has to go. It depends a lot on how much money we really need for this Doctor overpay. I think we only get 9 copies of each card to work with and 7 Tunnels because adding a mid-turn gainer to keep the game from ending seems inconvenient.

Hey we don't actually need a 2-cost pile because of Trader.

So maybe it looks like this. Kingdom:
Catacombs
Doctor (YW bane from the Black Market deck)
Border Village (with Ferry)
Black Market (with Trader in it)
Feodum
Tunnel
Haggler
Duplicate
King's Court
Conspirator

Figuring out the exact potential of this is a bit tricky...

I like this puzzle :-)
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singletee

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2015, 03:52:02 pm »
0

I am waiting a bit to reveal my solution, but it took me several hours over the course of a few days to figure out and the number is over ____500____. I actually just thought of a small improvement, too.

Accatitippi

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2015, 04:11:21 pm »
+1

You might want some hunting grounds in there too. It gains Duchies and silvers, plus you maybe used it as your draw? But now you'll need a real village though.
Or it could take Haggler's spot since it generates more gaincoins, and you don't even have to play it.
10Haggler+Trader=30
10Hunting Grounds+Trader=40(duchies)+18(traded estates)=58
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AdamH

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2015, 04:30:36 pm »
0


So let's say we have 9 King's Courts and 9 Conspirators in our life. We get 17 tripled actions. Let's say we put Pathfinding on Conspirator and triple 9 of those, so we get 54 card draws (if only we could get just one more!) and we'll have 8 tripled actions left after that.

13 of those have to be KC/Conspirator. One has to be a Trader. Ten have to be Hagglers. So we have 30 cards, 8 tripled actions, then 17 more actions after that. How much money can we make? I do believe all of these cards we use need to come from the Black Market deck

$54 from Conspirators, $20 from Hagglers

$59 from Counting House, drawing all but one Copper so the pile isn't empty.

$55 ;D from 11 Platina that I draw

I can get $6 out of Counterfeiting a Platinum for one card.

I can King a Poor House and a Harvest for $12 each.

...I'm beginning to think money probably isn't going to be an issue and I don't need any draw.

So I'm thinking we need to gain more expensive cards. What about Peddlers, I suppose they count as $8 but can be gained super-easy. That's $50 more if that's allowed. I see the Hunting Grounds idea to gain 8 Duchies, so that replaces Duplicate to make us $15 more, and then we can get Estates to get more Silvers too. There's probably some more dollars we can squeeze out...
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luser

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2015, 04:31:47 pm »
0

Bits tricky how to optimize this, I have 532.

 doctor overpay idea stays same, with trader and tunnel from bm you get 300 by emptying gold and silver piles.

Then we need additional piles for trashing

10 squires trashed to goons 60
Trash ten catacombs for ferried border villages and duplicate throne rooms for ten bm (use ambassador from bm to return bm) 110

ten hunting grounds 42

ten hagglers for stonemasons 20

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singletee

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2015, 04:49:38 pm »
0


What about Peddlers, I suppose they count as $8 but can be gained super-easy.


Peddlers count as whatever their current cost is, depending on how many action cards you have in play.

AdamH

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2015, 05:15:38 pm »
0

I don't understand how Doctor overpay plus Trader gains the Silver pile unless you trash something and gain something else...
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mith

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2015, 05:27:03 pm »
+1

You'd need a ton of overpay, but you can reveal Tunnel 70 times and Trader 40 of the Golds into Silver.

You can also get 21 Hagglers into play via Inheritance.
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faust

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2015, 06:01:25 pm »
+1


...I'm beginning to think money probably isn't going to be an issue and I don't need any draw.


You can just put a Candlestick Maker in the BM deck for infinite money. Then you can also put Tunnel in the BM deck since one is enough to do everythingyou want.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2015, 06:04:23 pm »
0

You might want some hunting grounds in there too. It gains Duchies and silvers, plus you maybe used it as your draw? But now you'll need a real village though.
Or it could take Haggler's spot since it generates more gaincoins, and you don't even have to play it.
10Haggler+Trader=30
10Hunting Grounds+Trader=40(duchies)+18(traded estates)=58


10 Hunting Grounds -> 30 Estates -> 30 Silvers = $90 value

So if you're gonna do that Hunting Grounds thing, you're better off not taking Duchies at all unless the Silver pile runs out (which, OK, is possible).  But even then, it's better to take Estates before Duchies because 3 Estates is $6 value compared to the $5 value of a Duchy.
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iguanaiguana

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2015, 06:21:40 pm »
0

When you're getting duchies from your hunting grounds don't forget to take free duchesses.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2015, 06:47:42 pm »
+1

When you're getting duchies from your hunting grounds don't forget to take free duchesses.

Is there room in the supply for that?
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faust

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2015, 07:27:54 pm »
+3


Let's try to collect everything...

Kingdom:
Catacombs
Doctor (Bane)
Border Village
Black Market (contains: Tunnel, Trader, Candlestick Maker, Native Village, Ambassador, Young Witch, Watchtower, Scheme, University, Develop, Counting House)
Squire
Goons
Haggler
Duplicate
Hunting Grounds
Duchess
Page

Inheritance
Ferry

Setup:
Buy all cards in the BM deck, then return Black Market to the supply with Ambassador. Use Hermit/Scheme to gain 10 Madmen. Buy 10 Squires, 9 Duplicates, 10 Catacombs, 9 Hunting Grounds, 7 Estates, 9 Hagglers. Put Ferry token on Haggler, inherit Hagglers, put Ferry token on Border Village. Play CM for sufficient amount of coin tokens. Put a Champion into play.

Set up Native Village with 9 Hagglers, 2 Estates, Trader, Watchtower, Scheme, University, Develop, Counting House. Play University, gain the last Haggler, put it on top of your deck with Watchtower. Play Scheme, draw Haggler. Play Develop, trash Counting House, put last Hunting Grounds and the last Duplicate on top of your deck. Play all Hagglers and Estate-Hagglers.

The trigger:
Buy Doctor ($3), overpay a lot. Use Tunnel discard+Trader to gain 40 Silver ($120). Use Tunnel discard to gain 30 Gold ($180). Trash 10 Squires to gain 10 Goons ($60). Trash 10 Catacombs to gain 10 Border Villages ($40) and 10 Black Markets ($30). Trash 8 Hunting Grounds to gain 8 Duchies ($40) and 8 Duchesses ($16). Trash 2 Hunting Grounds for 6 Estates ($12).

Call 9 Duplicates to gain 9 more Doctors ($27). Gain 10 Pages ($20) and 2 Duchesses ($4) and via Haggler.

Total:
3+120+180+60+40+30+40+14+12+27+20+6 = 552


EDIT: Mid-turn gaining allows you to trash the last Hunting Grounds for the last Duchy.

Fun fact: This empties all Kingdom piles, the Silver and Gold pile and the Estate and Duchy pile.

I have some unused Haggler gains, but no space left for $2 costs. Too bad Haggles cannot gain Estates.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 07:40:24 pm by faust »
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majiponi

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2015, 09:21:37 pm »
0

21 Events allowed? Or just two?
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singletee

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2015, 09:40:13 pm »
0

21 Events allowed? Or just two?

Any number of events are allowed.

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2015, 10:34:00 pm »
0


Let's try to collect everything...

Kingdom:
Catacombs
Doctor (Bane)
Border Village
Black Market (contains: Tunnel, Trader, Candlestick Maker, Native Village, Ambassador, Young Witch, Watchtower, Scheme, University, Develop, Counting House)
Squire
Goons
Haggler
Duplicate
Hunting Grounds
Duchess
Page

Inheritance
Ferry

Setup:
Buy all cards in the BM deck, then return Black Market to the supply with Ambassador. Use Hermit/Scheme to gain 10 Madmen. Buy 10 Squires, 9 Duplicates, 10 Catacombs, 9 Hunting Grounds, 7 Estates, 9 Hagglers. Put Ferry token on Haggler, inherit Hagglers, put Ferry token on Border Village. Play CM for sufficient amount of coin tokens. Put a Champion into play.

Set up Native Village with 9 Hagglers, 2 Estates, Trader, Watchtower, Scheme, University, Develop, Counting House. Play University, gain the last Haggler, put it on top of your deck with Watchtower. Play Scheme, draw Haggler. Play Develop, trash Counting House, put last Hunting Grounds and the last Duplicate on top of your deck. Play all Hagglers and Estate-Hagglers.

The trigger:
Buy Doctor ($3), overpay a lot. Use Tunnel discard+Trader to gain 40 Silver ($120). Use Tunnel discard to gain 30 Gold ($180). Trash 10 Squires to gain 10 Goons ($60). Trash 10 Catacombs to gain 10 Border Villages ($40) and 10 Black Markets ($30). Trash 8 Hunting Grounds to gain 8 Duchies ($40) and 8 Duchesses ($16). Trash 2 Hunting Grounds for 6 Estates ($12).

Call 9 Duplicates to gain 9 more Doctors ($27). Gain 10 Pages ($20) and 2 Duchesses ($4) and via Haggler.

Total:
3+120+180+60+40+30+40+14+12+27+20+6 = 552


EDIT: Mid-turn gaining allows you to trash the last Hunting Grounds for the last Duchy.

Fun fact: This empties all Kingdom piles, the Silver and Gold pile and the Estate and Duchy pile.

I have some unused Haggler gains, but no space left for $2 costs. Too bad Haggles cannot gain Estates.

You could improve score by inheriting estates as duplicate and gaining lots of rats.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2015, 10:36:09 pm by luser »
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majiponi

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #20 on: November 25, 2015, 11:23:56 pm »
0

Kingdom:
Squire, Black Market, Death Cart, Duplicate, Rats, Cache, Haggler, Border Village, Goons, Prince

Events:
Quest, Travelling Fair, Ball, Inheritance

Black Market Deck:
Candlestick Maker, Hermit, Tunnel, Urchin, Village, Bridge, Trader, Rogue, King's Court, 2 Attacks


Setup:
Black Market: 1
Duplicate: 9
Haggler: 9+1(Inherit)
Prince: 3
Candlestick Maker: 1
Hermit: 1
Tunnel: 1
Urchin: 1
Village: 1
Bridge: 1
Trader: 1
Rogue: 1
King's Court: 1
Attack: 2
Copper: 59
Curse: 9
Ruins: 9
Estate: 11
Duchy: 7
Province: 7
Colony: 7
Madman: 10
Mercenary: 10
Spoils: 15



Travelling Fair(49)
Quest(29) => gain 30 Gold
Ball(5, Squire(10) => Goons(10))
Ball(5, Death Cart(10) => DC(10), Silver(20))
Ball(10, Rats(20))
Buy Colony
gain Platinum(12)
gain Prince(7)
gain Border Village(10) (call 9 Duplicates)
   & Cache(10) => CC(10), Silver(20)
754 coins
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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2015, 01:20:39 am »
0


Sorry, I meant that you could have any number of events available in the kingdom. You can use them to set up, but all the cards gained that count for the total must be from a single card buy and effects cascading from that.

singletee

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Re: Highest Total Value from One Buy
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2015, 01:39:21 am »
+4

Kingdom:
Embargo (Bane)
Duchess
Black Market
Market Square
Duplicate
Band of Misfits
Haggler
Cultist
Hoard
Border Village
Prince
Colony
Platinum
Events:
Ferry
Lost Arts
Inheritance


Black Market Deck:
Young Witch (to get 11th Kingdom pile)
Watchtower (to trash incoming cards)
Graverobber (to replay BOM-as-Embargo arbitrarily many times)
Trader (to gain the Silver pile from incoming Curses)
Scrying Pool (to allow you to easily draw your actions)
Hermit (to allow you to easily draw the rest of your deck)
Workshop (to gain last stuff from piles)
Ironworks (to gain last stuff from piles)
Village (for more actions)
Bazaar (for more actions)
King's Court (to boost stuff)
Throne Room (to boost stuff)
Royal Carriage (to boost stuff)
Raze (to trash away unwanted junk then itself)
Baker (to afford any purchase)


Setup:
40 Embargo tokens on Colony (play Band of Misfits as Embargo then Graverob it)
Ferry on Haggler
Lost Arts on Haggler
Inherited Haggler
9 Duplicates on Tavern Mat
Royal Carriage on Tavern Mat


Supply:
10 Embargo
10 Duchess
 9 Black Market
 1 Market Square
 1 Duplicate
 0 Band of Misfits
 1 Haggler
10 Cultist
 0 Hoard
10 Border Village
10 Prince
15 Potion
 1 Estate
All other cards are fully stocked.


Trash:
7 Copper
Potion
Black Market
Graverobber
Baker
Raze
Hermit


Turn:
Hand is Scrying Pool, Madman, King's Court, Ironworks, Workshop
Play Scrying Pool, drawing 10 Band of Misfits, 8 Haggler, 9 Market Square, 10 Estate, Throne Room, Village, Bazaar, Hoard
Play 10 Band of Misfits as Haggler
Play Throne Room on King's Court
   Play King's Court on Ironworks, gaining Market Square, Duplicate, and Haggler
   Play King's Court on Village, drawing 3 Hoard
      Call Royal Carriage on King's Court
         Play King's Court on Bazaar, drawing 3 Hoard
Play Workshop, gaining Estate
Play Madman, drawing 3 Hoard, Market Square, Duplicate, Haggler, and Estate (deck and discard are now empty)
Play Duplicate, putting it on Tavern Mat
Play 9 Haggler
Play 11 Estate
Play 10 Hoard


Buy:
Buy Colony
   Gain Curse (x40)
      Reveal Trader to gain Silver instead (x40)
   Gain Gold from Hoard (x10)
   Gain Border Village from Haggler
      Gain Cultist
         Reveal Watchtower to trash Cultist
            Discard Market Square to gain Gold (x10)
            Shuffle, getting a deck with 9 Market Square on top
            Draw 3 Market Square
         Call Duplicate to gain Cultist
            Reveal Watchtower to trash Cultist
               Draw 3 Market Square
         Call Duplicate to gain Cultist
            Reveal Watchtower to trash Cultist
               Draw 3 Market Square
               Discard Market Square to gain Gold (x9)
      Call Duplicate to gain Border Village (x8)
         Gain Duchy (x8)
            Gain Duchess (x8)
   Gain Gold from Haggler
   Gain Border Village from Haggler
      Gain Cultist
   Gain Cultist from Haggler (x5)
   Gain Platinum from Haggler
   Gain Platinum from Estate (x11)
   Gain Prince from BOM-Haggler (x10)
   Gain Colony

   
Total cards: 8 Duchess, 6 Cultist, 10 Border Village, 10 Prince, 40 Silver, 30 Gold, 12 Platinum, 8 Duchy, 1 Colony
Total value: ____645____
« Last Edit: November 26, 2015, 02:14:26 am by singletee »
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