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Author Topic: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.  (Read 7252 times)

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Moneymodel

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #25 on: January 21, 2016, 01:05:00 pm »
+1

Okay, looks like I'm good to go.
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #26 on: January 21, 2016, 01:13:53 pm »
+2

Awesome!

F.DS will be well-represented. Right now we have 9 people planning to come from the forums, and that doesn't include their guests. We have 19 confirmed entries right now and 9 maybes on top of that (I'd be pretty surprised if we didn't get most of them). The prize pool will be pretty nice :-)

The hype is real.
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AHoppy

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #27 on: January 28, 2016, 04:32:49 pm »
0

I'll be streaming a league match tonight, but before/after it, I'd like to get some 3p practice in for this. Anyone interested, I'll try to be on around 6-6:30ish

Infthitbox

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #28 on: January 28, 2016, 05:29:13 pm »
0

I'm game; need some practice.
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Roadrunner7671

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2016, 10:43:24 pm »
0

Hopefully Adam posts the kingdoms tonight, I'd like to talk about them.
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #30 on: January 30, 2016, 11:13:20 pm »
+7

Roadrunner won this, I think it was a pretty convincing performance. Well done, RR! <3

Here's the Google spreadsheet I used to organize this

Moneymodel took second, grsbmd got third. More standings when I get a bit.
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Roadrunner7671

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #31 on: January 30, 2016, 11:31:06 pm »
+4

Okay, I'll make a little post about my kingdoms. I played nine total games.

First game: Highway, Nobles, Chancellor, Conspirator, Duplicate, Bureaucrat, Ironworks, Peddler, Apothecary, Candlestick Maker.
Apparently this was a favorite of many, but I can't say I was a fan. I opened Candlestick Maker/Potion and proceeded to make an unreliable deck with all the cantrips but Peddler, one Duplicate and Candlestick Makers. The dream was to Duplicate Provinces, so I had a triple Province turn and several double Province turns. The Candlestick Makers and Highways(?) were gone and only two Nobles were left when I ended it.

Second game: Fishing Village, Noble Brigand, Masquerade, Guide, Mine, Scavenger, Throne Room, Distant Lands, Loan, Woodcutter

So I played Ben (he has the Michigan University logo as his profile picture, his username starts with the letter 'g.') and a non-forum opponent named Angie who was quite formidable. She tried a variant of BM and lost so many Golds to Ben's Brigands, but I nabbed a few as well. I lost the Distant Lands split but I got lots and lots of Provinces. I also picked up a Woodcutter for +buy, which neither of my opponents did. I think it was the right move. Oh, and I got two Guides and tried to Throne Room my Scavenger for reliability. I won this game, too.

Third game: Duke, Bridge, Witch, Village, Workshop, Herbalist, Messenger, Treasure Trove, Mission, Raid, Dungeon, Page
I played AHoppy on this board, and let me tell you: this board was very interesting! I warmed up to it after playing it. So you have Treasure Trove and Herbalist; those are excellent support for a Duke player. There's also this weak engine with Witch/Village/Dungeon/Bridge. AHoppy decided to play it bold and open Treasure Trove/Herbalist. My opponent, Patrick (who was quite good as well) and I both opened Witch/Page. Champion would be great here. AHoppy went for an early Duchy on his second shuffle, which was super weird. Patrick and I both built, but he lost when my Warrior hit his Warrior. I got Champion in play the turn the Curses ran out, which was just great. I was ready to get Duchies like both of my opponents, but AHoppy said 'Since it's a three player game, the person who doesn't go for Duchies wins.' I withdrew my hand from the Duchy pile and picked up more Witches, but Dungeon was the real MVP. Drawing two good cards and discarding two Curses was super good. I managed to get a load of Provinces and crush AHoppy, who got seven Duchies but no Dukes. Patrick only got 3-4 Duchies, but he did manage to pick up two Dukes. Regardless, he still came in third.

Kingdom: Wharf, Giant, Throne Room, Spice Merchant, Lookout, Mystic, Bazaar, Council Room, Highway, Stash, Training, Raid
Not much to talk about here. My opponent built his engine several turns faster then picked up nine Provinces. My other opponent picked up one Province, so I came in third place.

Onto the semifinals!

I'll edit this post later, I promise.
Still promise.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2016, 12:25:54 pm by Roadrunner7671 »
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2016, 03:23:30 pm »
+12

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enfynet

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2016, 08:12:28 pm »
0

It's over.
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assemble_me

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #34 on: February 01, 2016, 07:17:33 am »
+3

I better jump into the plane next time, it's only a 13 hours flight ;)
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #35 on: February 01, 2016, 08:39:07 am »
+7

I promised standings or something for this, I think. Here's what I've got:

Roadrunner got first place. He didn't win all of the games he played (I think he won 7 out of his 9?) but every time I remember looking at a game he was in, I thought to myself "Wow, RR is wiping the floor with his opponents." He really deserved the win here.

Moneymodel got second place. He had a rough start but had a strong performance in the semifinals, placing at the top of the scoreboard there. There was a tiebreaker game for the other two spots in the finals, but Moneymodel just got to sit and watch that.

Grsbmd got third place. His ability to find neat little tricks on every board is striking :P

Other notable F.DS-people placements: Infthitbox tied for fifth place, just one point short of making that tiebreaker match for the finals. Nana-king also made the semifinals.

I'll host another tournament, same place, on some Saturday in April. Once I get a date I'll post it here. It won't be "officially sanctioned by RGG" as they have determined that 3P is the best way to play Dominion, but it will consist of 2P games and will have an elimination-style bracket at the end instead of more Swiss stuff.
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Infthitbox

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #36 on: February 01, 2016, 10:00:55 am »
+4

So, some reflections on this, now that I've experienced the second part of the driving cost to attend:

3-player Dominion is significantly different than 2-player. I repeatedly found myself lost trying to balance what I was trying to do versus what two other players were trying to do. I also found myself making "questionable" decisions whose goal was to finish no worse than second, which usually had me finishing second. This worked for getting to the semis, and would have gotten me into the tiebreaker match for the finals if I had succeeded in forcing a second place instead of a second/third place tie in the first semi finals match.

The format of the semifinals irked me a little bit: we played each of the three semifinal boards once, but I ended up playing all of the boards with the same opponent (the other opponent was different each time). I'm not going to bother trying to figure out if its possible to avoid this scenario for all players, but it annoyed me.

The drive back was way, way worse than the the drive out. Instead of 9 hours of excitement, there was 9 hours of pondering mistakes and all the what-ifs.

I realized as I was leaving town that I'd been to Mason, OH before, for the W&S Open in 2010 or 2011. If you can manage to hold a tournament in August that overlaps with that, I will have a much easier time justifying the travel.

Probably the highlight of the trip was seeing and playing a game with the just-announced set. I got trashed in that game by SirSlugma, but the cards seem sweet. Can't wait.

So, 2P in April? We'll see.
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #37 on: February 01, 2016, 10:30:16 am »
+1

The format of the semifinals irked me a little bit: we played each of the three semifinal boards once, but I ended up playing all of the boards with the same opponent (the other opponent was different each time). I'm not going to bother trying to figure out if its possible to avoid this scenario for all players, but it annoyed me.

So for "officially sanctioned" tournaments, I have much less flexibility in terms of tournament format. The only 2-player games that should ever be played are tiebreaker games. All rounds must be Swiss, so no elimination-style stuff towards the end.

With a 9-person semifinal, if you only have three different kingdoms, then it's relatively easy to show that there's no other way to have matchups: you have three people at table A, none of them can play at table A for the second game, but there are only two other options and three people, so two of those three people have to play together for the second game. At that point they have to play the last game together as well. I could prevent this by either having more semifinal games to play (which is sort of difficult to do, but not impossible I guess) or by not having a cutoff like this for semifinals at all.

I don't think RGG makes me have the semifinal round at all, but what I'd like is to make it so that you aren't totally screwed if you don't win all of your games. Wiping all previous scores at some point makes this really easy to do and accounts for the idea that it may not always be possible for people with high initial scores to be paired up at any given point, even though I try to do that. You can have just one big Swiss round but if you start making your cuts at anything above 1/3 of the initial pool then you're getting close to either risking runaway leader(s) making the last game or two irrelevant or having it be like losing one game and being screwed (which one you tend towards depends on how many games you play before making the cut).

When I do my unsanctioned tournament, I just have an elimination bracket at the end instead of more Swiss, if that makes you feel any better. Ideas for adjustments to this tournament format are certainly welcome.

The drive back was way, way worse than the the drive out. Instead of 9 hours of excitement, there was 9 hours of pondering mistakes and all the what-ifs.

Driving up to U-Con for that Dominion tournament is easy for me, partially because there's a bunch of other stuff going on so it's easy for me to carpool up with some friends and make a weekend out of it. I wonder if it would help if I put together something on the Sunday morning/afternoon after the tournament for people to do, more like the game night that's happening around the tournament. The feedback I've gotten about the non-tournament parts of things has been only positive, maybe if there was more of that, it might help round out the experience for people who are travelling for this.

It turns out that 3P games take longer than 2P games -- I didn't really have a chance to hang around with a lot of F.DS people after the tournament since the store was about to close. Yeah I got to talk a lot with some people but there was much less time for that than I expected there to be. So I would certainly like something like that to happen. It would not be hard to drum up interest among the local crowd for Sunday games, either. We're all a bunch of addicts and if we had a place to play 24/7, I don't think any of us would eat or sleep, and we'd all get fired from our jobs, since we'd just be there all the time.

One other question: now that this is gaining some popularity, I'm getting more feedback on lots of things. One of the pieces of feedback I got is that the prize pool seemed a little small. Of course this is because the entry fee is small. Do people agree with this? Would people be willing to pay more of an entry fee for the chance at a larger prize pool? The important thing to me is that people are playing Dominion, so I figured I should go as small as possible for entry fee, but maybe bigger is better?

That reminds me. Roadrunner paid the entry fee for him and his mom in $2 bills. Story checks out.
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Voltaire

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #38 on: February 01, 2016, 10:59:07 am »
+2

I'm a fan of a low entry fee, but I wouldn't care if it went up to $10. I'm (almost certainly not) going to win anything, and neither will most players. But I completely get it's fun to chase the big prize pool, people obviously play the lottery.

I also adore 3-player tournaments. It's almost as though Dominion is still high-skill or something, the strongest players keep winning these luck-fests somehow.  ;)
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Infthitbox

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #39 on: February 01, 2016, 12:57:45 pm »
+2

The format of the semifinals irked me a little bit: we played each of the three semifinal boards once, but I ended up playing all of the boards with the same opponent (the other opponent was different each time). I'm not going to bother trying to figure out if its possible to avoid this scenario for all players, but it annoyed me.

So for "officially sanctioned" tournaments, I have much less flexibility in terms of tournament format. The only 2-player games that should ever be played are tiebreaker games. All rounds must be Swiss, so no elimination-style stuff towards the end.

I'm interested in how they define "swiss" for this purpose: the actual "swiss" tournament structure doesn't touch anything other than 2p games.


Quote
I don't think RGG makes me have the semifinal round at all, but what I'd like is to make it so that you aren't totally screwed if you don't win all of your games. Wiping all previous scores at some point makes this really easy to do and accounts for the idea that it may not always be possible for people with high initial scores to be paired up at any given point, even though I try to do that. You can have just one big Swiss round but if you start making your cuts at anything above 1/3 of the initial pool then you're getting close to either risking runaway leader(s) making the last game or two irrelevant or having it be like losing one game and being screwed (which one you tend towards depends on how many games you play before making the cut).

When I do my unsanctioned tournament, I just have an elimination bracket at the end instead of more Swiss, if that makes you feel any better. Ideas for adjustments to this tournament format are certainly welcome.

I'd rather just play more swiss rounds and cut to a final.


Quote
The drive back was way, way worse than the the drive out. Instead of 9 hours of excitement, there was 9 hours of pondering mistakes and all the what-ifs.

Driving up to U-Con for that Dominion tournament is easy for me, partially because there's a bunch of other stuff going on so it's easy for me to carpool up with some friends and make a weekend out of it. I wonder if it would help if I put together something on the Sunday morning/afternoon after the tournament for people to do, more like the game night that's happening around the tournament. The feedback I've gotten about the non-tournament parts of things has been only positive, maybe if there was more of that, it might help round out the experience for people who are travelling for this.

Yeah, that would be better. Having the actual tournament only last 9 hours and having nothing before/after kinda sucks. It would be hard to sell any of my friends on making the trip with nothing else going on.

Quote
One other question: now that this is gaining some popularity, I'm getting more feedback on lots of things. One of the pieces of feedback I got is that the prize pool seemed a little small. Of course this is because the entry fee is small. Do people agree with this? Would people be willing to pay more of an entry fee for the chance at a larger prize pool? The important thing to me is that people are playing Dominion, so I figured I should go as small as possible for entry fee, but maybe bigger is better?

I don't know how other people feel about this, but I'd have preferred a higher entry fee/ higher prize structure. Even considering the fact that I didn't expect to finish in the money (and didn't), I would have paid up to even like $50 to play the tournament. Compared to travel costs, the entry fee was almost irrelevant in determining the true cost of the tournament.
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SirSlugma

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #40 on: February 01, 2016, 01:04:29 pm »
+3

First of all, I just want to thank Adam for hosting an awesome event! I had a good time Dominioning, gamimg, and meeting folks, and everything was smoothly organized and run, so much kudos to you for that. Congrats to roadrunner for wrecking the tourney, even without Scout!

To respond to the previous comments, I think most things seem perfectly fine as is. Entry fee and prizes are fine, though I would be just as ok with $10. It seems preferable to have an extra board or 2 for the semifinals to make sure you have new opponents for every match, but that would depend on the number of sets you have available and the difficulty of that logistically. I was super impressed with your spreadsheet and how smoothly the Swiss rounds went. You seem to have everything in order, so I'd leave it to you to decide whether that's viable. As far as time goes, yeah, games were longer than 2p but I don't think unreasonably so and I think most players moved things along quickly.

As far as the tournament went, I got frustrated with bad luck on one board but of course that was compounded by my poor opening and subsequent overterminaling. I really need to improve my play with Hermit, that card is super high skill and I am not good with it at all haha. I was very impressed by my opponent's play on the Hermit/Hamlet/Bank megaturn board, I really wasn't sure it was worth going for so I edged and ended up caught in between two superior decks with a weird 3p game of pile chicken going on.
The other two boards went well enough for me; my Doctor open on the Lab/Treasury/Cutpurse board got me to a super slim deck right away, and everyone else Cutpursed each other to death while my coppers were gone.  Think I might have been in trouble if everyone else just goes Vault-BM there but that's 4p for you haha. The Page/Witch board was awkward and slow, and I'm not sure you even bother with the Travellers because Witch BM into Treasure Trove and Duchy/Duke seems pretty strong in a board where you can't build much of a deck.

I'm curious to see how others played these boards, or what other weird kingdoms were out there that I didn't get to see.  But I'm definitely interested in coming to the next event. 2p live sounds like a lot of fun.

Edit: writing a post this large on my phone is hard.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2016, 01:06:19 pm by SirSlugma »
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #41 on: February 01, 2016, 01:59:05 pm »
+1

For those who don't want to go to the Google doc, I'll copy the kingdoms used in the tournament here. Tables 1-10 were used in the prelims:

TABLE 1
   Highway (Hinterlands)
   Nobles (Intrigue)
   Chancellor (Base)
   Conspirator (Intrigue)
   Duplicate (Adventures)
   Bureaucrat (Base)
   Ironworks (Intrigue)
   Peddler (Prosperity)
   Apothecary (Alchemy)
   Candlestick Maker (Guilds)

TABLE 2
   Fishing Village (Seaside)
   Noble Brigand (Hinterlands)
   Masquerade (Intrigue)
   Guide (Adventures)
   Mine (Base)
   Scavenger (Dark Ages)
   Throne Room (Base)
   Distant Lands (Adventures)
   Loan (Prosperity)
   Woodcutter (Base)

TABLE 3
   Duke (Intrigue)
   Bridge (Intrigue)
   Witch (Base)
   Village (Base)
   Workshop (Base)
   Herbalist (Alchemy)
   Messenger (Adventures)
   Treasure Trove (Adventures)
   Dungeon (Adventures)
   Page (Adventures)
   Raid (Adventures)
   Mission (Adventures)
   Shelters

TABLE 4
   Treasury (Seaside)
   Doctor (Guilds)
   Cutpurse (Seaside)
   Forager (Dark Ages)
   Vault (Prosperity)
   Courtyard (Intrigue)
   Laboratory (Base)
   Catacombs (Dark Ages)
   Cellar (Base)
   Haven (Seaside)

TABLE 5
   Hamlet (Cornucopia)
   Bank (Prosperity)
   Hermit (Dark Ages)
   Merchant Ship (Seaside)
   Spice Merchant (Hinterlands)
   Library (Base)
   Duchess (Hinterlands)
   Watchtower (Prosperity)
   Moneylender (Base)
   Masquerade (Intrigue)
   Pilgrimage (Adventures)
   Seaway (Adventures)

TABLE 6
   Throne Room (Base)
   Wharf (Seaside)
   Giant (Adventures)
   Council Room (Base)
   Stash (Promo)
   Lookout (Seaside)
   Highway (Hinterlands)
   Bazaar (Seaside)
   Spice Merchant (Hinterlands)
   Mystic (Dark Ages)
   Training (Adventures)
   Raid (Adventures)
   Shelters

TABLE 7
   City (Prosperity)
   Workshop (Base)
   King's Court (Prosperity)
   Ill-Gotten Gains (Hinterlands)
   Masquerade (Intrigue)
   Conspirator (Intrigue)
   Rabble (Prosperity)
   Great Hall (Intrigue)
   Band of Misfits (Dark Ages)
   Armory (Dark Ages)

TABLE 8
   Scavenger (Dark Ages)
   Duke (Intrigue)
   Mountebank (Prosperity)
   Ironmonger (Dark Ages)
   Bazaar (Seaside)
   Counterfeit (Dark Ages)
   Treasure Trove (Adventures)
   Border Village (Hinterlands)
   Moat (Base)
   Hermit (Dark Ages)
   Pathfinding (Adventures)
   Summon (Promo)

TABLE 9
   Grand Market (Prosperity)
   Giant (Adventures)
   Militia (Base)
   Upgrade (Intrigue)
   Embassy (Hinterlands)
   Fishing Village (Seaside)
   Nobles (Intrigue)
   Remake (Cornucopia)
   Peddler (Prosperity)
   Beggar (Dark Ages)
   Inheritance (Adventures)
   Platinum and Colony

TABLE 10
   Warehouse (Seaside)
   Baker (Guilds)
   Duchess (Hinterlands)
   Butcher (Guilds)
   Island (Seaside)
   Apprentice (Alchemy)
   Caravan Guard (Adventures)
   Menagerie (Cornucopia)
   Rabble (Prosperity)
   Shanty Town (Intrigue)

Table 11 here was used as the tiebreaker match for the finals:
TABLE 11
   Goons (Prosperity)
   Royal Seal (Prosperity)
   Great Hall (Intrigue)
   Tactician (Seaside)
   Pawn (Intrigue)
   Secret Chamber (Intrigue)
   Vault (Prosperity)
   Trading Post (Intrigue)
   Poor House (Dark Ages)
   Squire (Dark Ages)
   Trade (Adventures)
   Training (Adventures)
   Platinum and Colony
   Shelters

These three were used for the semifinals:
SEMIS/FINALS 2
   Horn of Plenty (Cornucopia)
   Caravan Guard (Adventures)
   Lookout (Seaside)
   Merchant Guild (Guilds)
   Fishing Village (Seaside)
   Scout (Intrigue)
   Farmland (Hinterlands)
   Soothsayer (Guilds)
   Fortress (Dark Ages)
   Watchtower (Prosperity)
   Seaway (Adventures)
   Pathfinding (Adventures)

SEMIS/FINALS 3
   Governor (Promo)
   Silk Road (Hinterlands)
   Apothecary (Alchemy)
   Prince (Promo)
   Count (Dark Ages)
   Laboratory (Base)
   Witch (Base)
   Jack of All Trades (Hinterlands)
   Merchant Guild (Guilds)
   Throne Room (Base)
   Save (Adventures)

SEMIS/FINALS 4
   Ranger (Adventures)
   Expand (Prosperity)
   Lost City (Adventures)
   Port (Adventures)
   Pawn (Intrigue)
   Mining Village (Intrigue)
   Poor House (Dark Ages)
   Forager (Dark Ages)
   Bridge Troll (Adventures)
   Feast (Base)
   Expedition (Adventures)
   Plan (Adventures)

...and the Finals kingdom:
   Stonemason (Guilds)
   Border Village (Hinterlands)
   Stables (Hinterlands)
   Gardens (Base)
   Talisman (Prosperity)
   Market Square (Dark Ages)
   Moat (Base)
   Upgrade (Intrigue)
   Margrave (Hinterlands)
   Grand Market (Prosperity)
   Borrow (Adventures)
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Moneymodel

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #42 on: February 01, 2016, 02:40:04 pm »
+5

Video

See, here's the thing about Prosperity and Lay's Baked chips. Prosperity has VP chips. Every time you get a chip, you eat a chip. That way, you eat your chips in more moderation than you would if you were buying Provinces. Unless you're playing a Goons engine; in that case, that's where the 80% less fat comes in. It's not as bad to eat a lot at once because they're not as bad for you.

TABLE 1: I started buying Peddlers here way too late. I went for Apothecary starting on T3/T4, but didn't end up needing it. Opened Ironworks/CM, used Ironworks to get Highways and Duplicates. I managed to get two Highways in play and call two Duplicates on a Province buy just as piles were emptying, taking the win.

Did not play tables 2-4

TABLE 5: Here, I used Hamlet and Watchtower to build an engine that turned its wheels and didn't do much else, so I took last place. No one saw Hamlet/Seaway/Madman/Bank. Masquerade/BM would have beaten what any of us were doing, I think.

TABLE 6: I lost because I did not open Wharf. I went for Throne Room-Giant before anyone else, trashing deathwing's Highways and cursing infinitehitbox. Then my Throne Rooms got Gianted and I stopped doing much of anything.

Did not play 7 or 8

TABLE 9: This is really my kind of engine. I built it soundly and won comfortably. Not much else to say about it.

TABLE 10 (Semi-final qualifier): I used Shanty Town/Rabble AND Warehouse/Menagerie for draw, just in case one didn't come together, and Butcher for payload, trashing and buying Gold. I pulled through here just in time for the win.

TABLE 12: Horn megaturn. Watchtower as draw was very tight, especially with little real trashing and opponents' Soothsayers drawing me cards. So I bought Pathfinding to put my card token on Fortress. When I would have dudded, I Lookout-trashed Fortress to put it in my hand on multiple occasions. I tried to improve my Lookouts in the mid-game by setting them up with Scout, but I never drew them together! Either way, I won this one.

TABLE 13: This played like a straightforward Governor game with Count support. I gained several Duchies on the last turn and ended the game in second place.

TABLE 14: I got a slow start to this game as a result of not opening Bridge Troll, but I still ended up winning. Ranger was great help with that; it gave me the draw and last buy I needed in the last turn.

In the final game, the choice was obviously between engine and Talisman/Market Square/Gardens. Grsbmd went for Gardens and Roadrunner and I went for the engine. In hindsight, I wonder if contesting Gardens would have been the right move, because it might have ended the game too fast for the engine to pile Provinces. My engine was worse than RR's because I didn't trash aggressively in the beginning, which made it more difficult to use my Market Squares for payload. If I hadn't acquiesced and greened early, I probably would have gotten third. That brought a lesson full circle from my first game in the tournament: no matter how many players there are, when an engine is the best strat on the board, the player who executes it well comes in first, and the player who executes it poorly comes in last.
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nana-king

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #43 on: February 01, 2016, 03:20:20 pm »
+3

Thanks for putting on such a great tournament Adam!  It was awesome getting to see people I had met at U-Con as well as to meet new f.dsers.  I love being able to put a face to your names.

After a horrible showing at U-Con I felt a lot of redemption making it into the semi-finals.  I started out the day on the first board and as usual didn't really look at the cards properly.  This led me to believe the apothecary was scrying pool.  So when both of my opponents bought potions I was confused.  It wasn't until the first apothecary was played that I finally understood what card it was...doh!  Roadrunner and I had the same strategy but he was able to execute much better with the draw and money he got off his apothecaries.  Highway + Duplicate = Duplicate provinces. 

After that I got sent to the four player games and did surprisingly well.  The travelers game with witch felt like it required very little skill on my part.  Voltaire killed it and quickly worked his way up the travelers line.  Per usual my travelers missed shuffles like it was their job (perhaps Voltaire was paying them on the side to do so).  But I realized early on that dungeons were going to be huge in sifting through the curses so I bought three and was Messengered one.  That made it so I was able to pick up provinces and squeak out second place. 

I went straight distant lands on my third game and won easily.  I never bought a silver the whole game because everyone else was hitting Noble Brigand hard.  This was my first ever tournament win so it felt good. 

My final prelim game was against Infthitbox and AHoppy.  I was a little intimidated going in but buying an Armory early gave me the boost I needed over Infthitbox in the end.  AHoppy had some horrific shuffle luck which was good for me but sad none the less. 

I was ecstatic to find out that I not only made the semis but I was tied for second going into them!  Then things went down hill.  I got paired with MoneyModel for the semis.  That was unfortunate because he has some skillz (I think that's what happens when you wear an awesome Dominion hoodie).  I thought I was going to have one more turn on the first board but MoneyModel found the extra buy he needed to win (it was there but we forgot to count it until late in his turn).  I felt a little demoralized going into my second board then I had some abysmal luck with my Watchtower and I fell apart.  My managed to get second in that game, but I played awful.  My consolation was that MoneyModel played the strategy I wanted to.

Then came the final board of the semis and it was a battle of the titans.  Husband against Wife with poor MoneyModel stuck with us.  Grsbmd and I play 2 games IRL a night on average so playing against each other wasn't anything new.  What was difficult for me was that I knew that even if I won, I wasn't going to make the finals; but if Grsbmd won he had a chance.  Adam told me not to king make, which my competitiveness wouldn't allow for anyways, but it was hard not to.  Alas, all my worry was for naught because Ben pulled off the W.  I really thought I had beat MoneyModel in this game but he ended up beating me by a few points. 

So major props to MoneyModel for beating me in all three semi games.  I hope that you are at the next tournament so I can try to get some redemption.

The best thing about playing in these tournaments with my husband is that we have two horses in the race so to speak.  So even though I lost I still got to take home a prize, and we bought the Kingdom Builder expansion with his winnings ;)

   
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liopoil

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #44 on: February 01, 2016, 04:09:18 pm »
0

Quote
TABLE 5
   Hamlet (Cornucopia)
   Bank (Prosperity)
   Hermit (Dark Ages)
   Merchant Ship (Seaside)
   Spice Merchant (Hinterlands)
   Library (Base)
   Duchess (Hinterlands)
   Watchtower (Prosperity)
   Moneylender (Base)
   Masquerade (Intrigue)
   Pilgrimage (Adventures)
   Seaway (Adventures)
This is a nice watchtower board. Don't you dare mention library, library is awful, it costs way too much.
Quote
SEMIS/FINALS 2
   Horn of Plenty (Cornucopia)
   Caravan Guard (Adventures)
   Lookout (Seaside)
   Merchant Guild (Guilds)
   Fishing Village (Seaside)
   Scout (Intrigue)
   Farmland (Hinterlands)
   Soothsayer (Guilds)
   Fortress (Dark Ages)
   Watchtower (Prosperity)
   Seaway (Adventures)
   Pathfinding (Adventures)
This is just ridiculous!
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ben_king

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2016, 01:36:27 pm »
+6

First things first, great job hosting the tournament Adam!  It was really smoothly run and a lot of fun.

Second, I changed my username.  It turns out that having an unpronounceable string of letters for a username makes it hard to tell people at a meetup what your username is.  So now I'm the Dominion player formerly known as grsbmd, but henceforth known as ben_king.

There were a lot of really fun boards here, but the one I find myself still thinking about a few days later is the finals board:

Quote
Stonemason (Guilds)
   Border Village (Hinterlands)
   Stables (Hinterlands)
   Gardens (Base)
   Talisman (Prosperity)
   Market Square (Dark Ages)
   Moat (Base)
   Upgrade (Intrigue)
   Margrave (Hinterlands)
   Grand Market (Prosperity)
   Borrow (Adventures)

I had a hunch that my opponents were both planning to build an engine here (they seemed to be eyeing the top row of more expensive cards during the planning time), so that would allow me to go for Gardens largely uncontested, and there's some really great support for Gardens here.  I focused on getting Talismans and Market Squares early, using my Talismans to pick up a bunch of Silvers so that I'd still be able to buy Gardens after discarding from Margrave. 

It seems like there are two ways here that a Gardens strategy could win here: (1) empty piles before my opponents have their engines up and running (this seems tricky since 12 Gardens is a lot, but maybe Moat or Stonemason is a possible third pile) or (2) have such a large deck by the time Provinces run that 6-8 Provinces is not enough to beat me.  I'm not totally sure which option is better, as Talismans allow for a crazy number of gains per turn, either to empty piles or simply add Coppers to my deck for option 2.

Anyway, I didn't realize until the game was almost over that I should have been buying a Borrow almost every turn.  When I was getting hit by Margrave, I was making sure that I got $4 in hand, discarding Market Squares (which have the risk of drawing an Estate or Gardens).  But I should have simply been buying a Borrow any time that I didn't hit $4 and keeping the Market Squares in hand to increase the size of my deck.  Since I got hit by Margrave on almost every turn toward the end, the -1 card token is barely even relevant.

If I had played things right, I think I might have been able to eek out 2nd, and if everything had gone just right maybe even 1st.  Anyway, I had a blast and am thrilled to have finished at 3rd.  I can't wait for the next tournament!
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AdamH

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Re: 3P tournament. Cincinnati, OH, Sat. Jan. 30, 2016, 1PM. All expansions.
« Reply #46 on: February 03, 2016, 08:01:32 am »
0

I've done some thinking about the feedback I've received over tournament format. I went and re-read the guidance I got from RGG about this stuff, I have some ideas.

Thoughts on that are here (it makes more sense to put it there than here).
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