Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6  All

Author Topic: Improving Online Dominion  (Read 29161 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

AdamH

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2803
  • Shuffle iT Username: Adam Horton
  • You make your own shuffle luck
  • Respect: +3832
    • View Profile
    • My Dominion Videos
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #100 on: October 21, 2015, 07:54:35 am »
+3

You people...

You say it's hard for anyone to understand their emotions, therefore you all know exactly what's going on in my head emotionally because it's hard for me to do it. That's completely ridiculous. I'd think that after two years (wait, has it been three already? We're close) of watching my videos and complaining about how "emotional" I am, maybe people would just realize that that's how I speak and that's part of who I am. Am I not in control of my emotions? I can think of two times where I've actually lost control of my emotions on anything related to you all in three years, and what did I do? I turned off the video and stopped streaming, I didn't write a post about it.

Very few of you have ever met me IRL, very few of you have directly interacted with me over the inernet. How can you possibly say you know my emotions better than I do? Like, that's super-condescending. We're all different people.

Quote
3) Despite the fact that there has been unwarranted hostility towards Making Fun on these forums, there has also been some pretty nasty behavior back on the part of Making Fun toward us, particularly from DavidtheDavid.

So isn't David not actually an employee of MF? Didn't I hear that somewhere? In any case, I don't read what he's saying as condescending. I'm not sure how you can, but maybe you can. OK. I don't know what to say to you.

To be perfectly honest, "David isn't an MF employee" might be one of the bigger cognitive backflips I've heard anyone make to defend MF.

Did you see me defending anyone with that statement? Like, actually read what I'm saying and don't put words in my mouth. If it feels like I'm being hard on you it's because both of your responses to my posts are things that are particularly grating to me, where you're misrepresenting what I say and who I am like you know better than I do what I mean. What did I do about it? I went to sleep so I wouldn't be emotional about it.

Never did I say that other people wouldn't find it condescending or not to their liking. People can think that if they want to, but I don't. Maybe this is because of the several PMs we've exchanged, maybe that helps, I dunno? The whole point of this thread is to appeal to some people who are speaking out of anger and try to get them to think critically about what they're saying. There are valid criticisms of MF to be had, I don't see why we have to resort to invalid ones that make us look like jerks and don't accomplish anything. There's plenty to whine about constructively.

The next paragraph came off a little angry so I think I should be done typing now. Better not type anything that people could use to tell me I'm being too emotional.
Logged
I respond to PMs.

iguanaiguana

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 604
  • Respect: +1042
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #101 on: October 21, 2015, 09:01:32 am »
+6

...

You are my favorite reptile.

And you are my favorite demonic hellspawn wrought from the anguish of sinners, sent from the pit, who bested me in combat using tactics unholy and vile.
Logged
You are my favorite reptile.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.
All iguanas are equal. But some iguanas are more equal than others.

jsh357

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2575
  • Shuffle iT Username: jsh357
  • Respect: +4330
    • View Profile
    • JSH Gaming: Original games
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #102 on: October 21, 2015, 09:20:45 am »
+17

I've met Adam irl. You guys are misrepresenting him. He's way more emotional than that. When we met he openly wept about how making his own shuffle luck in life brought him to that place.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 10:07:50 am by jsh357 »
Logged
Join the Dominion community Discord channel! Chat in text and voice; enter dumb tournaments; spy on top players!

https://discord.gg/2rDpJ4N

drsteelhammer

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1527
  • Shuffle iT Username: drsteelhammer
  • Respect: +1467
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #103 on: October 21, 2015, 09:56:07 am »
0

I don't think we should judge Adam's emotional state on account of meeting you. I mean it THE jsh357 we're talking about.
Logged
Join the Dominion League!

There is no bad shuffle that can not be surmounted by scorn.

assemble_me

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1407
  • Shuffle iT Username: assemble me
  • Dominion stream/yt junkie
  • Respect: +807
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #104 on: October 21, 2015, 10:08:38 am »
+8

I just wanted to point out that I love you all.

Take some free ASCII hearts:

<3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3
Logged
Join the f.ds Dominion league | My Twitch channel

... and none of his posts shall remain unedited

iguanaiguana

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 604
  • Respect: +1042
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #105 on: October 21, 2015, 10:10:06 am »
+7


Very few of you have ever met me IRL, very few of you have directly interacted with me over the inernet. How can you possibly say you know my emotions better than I do? Like, that's super-condescending. We're all different people.


Last night I wrote a long post on a variety of subjects and ran the risk of not expressing my viewpoint very well. Today I'm going back and looking at it and finding in particular the first point I made (addressed to you) pretty flawed. I didn't mean to imply that I knew what was going on in your head or to make any kind of broad judgment about how you handle emotions. Actually what I like most about your streams is what strikes me as an acute ability to keep a level head and make rational decisions even when you have really bad luck. I definitely think some people do not give you nearly enough credit for this ability and I'm sorry if I implied in any way that I am one of those people because I am not. I'm in a really weird position here actually because I am an AdamH fanboy in the same sense that you have said that you are a DXV fanboy. In fact if I got the chance to play dominion with you my reaction would probably be pretty similar to the reaction you had when you first got to play dominion with Donald X back on Isotropic.

If I could go back and rephrase everything I said last night, I think I would say something like this:

Unlike most people, I think AdamH is making a lot more correct points than the forum is giving him credit for here. The environment on the forums actually has been pretty toxic. I noticed it shortly after first coming here in January and I think that it has gotten a lot worse in the past couple of months. That said, I also want to give the majority of people here credit that AdamH is probably going somewhat too far in making statements that are defending Making Fun, especially considering that they have definitely made some bad gestures toward F.DS as a community. In particular, I'm not a huge fan of their PR guy. Yes, he's done plenty of good things for the company, but some of his statements went over the line and only contributed toward increasing the toxic atmosphere in these forums. If it is true that he doesn't like reading the posts here anymore, that situation is at least partially of his own making. At any rate, considering that there is bad blood on both sides, maybe the best route here would be to follow SCSN and collectively bury the hatchet. Considering that they are claiming that they will be able to increase their pace of work on this new version of Online Dominion, now looks like as good a time as any to give Making Fun another shot.

To Adam: I'm really sorry if I spoke to you in a way that you perceived to be condescending. It is always risky to come out and talk about a person that I do not know in full. I simply had not seen my perspective (I think, a more moderate one) represented anywhere in this thread and felt it would be constructive to the thread to offer it.
Logged
You are my favorite reptile.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.
All iguanas are equal. But some iguanas are more equal than others.

Witherweaver

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6476
  • Shuffle iT Username: Witherweaver
  • Respect: +7839
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #106 on: October 21, 2015, 10:13:40 am »
+3

I just wanted to point out that I love you all.

Take some free ASCII hearts:

<3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3

Stop getting emotional.
Logged

funkdoc

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 472
  • Respect: +414
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #107 on: October 21, 2015, 10:34:31 am »
+13

since my name got dropped itt i guess i should say some words~

honestly, i haven't been a big fan of a lot of what adam's been saying as of late, but i'm kind of an unusual case.  i come from a community entirely built around calling everybody garbage, in much harsher form than anybody on this forum ever has.  hell, you can beat 1000 other players to win a tournament, and top players will STILL think of you as a fraud because you used "cheap" strategies that are going to get patched out in the next update, or because there weren't any japanese players there, or whatever.  i'm not going to pretend that's a good thing...but i do think it breeds a good mentality in the people who can tolerate it and remain part of the scene.  that's still a hell of a lot more people than dominion has, fwiw.

so yea, i don't really mind ~negativity~.  mic and SCSN were absolutely BRUTAL to me when they happened to watch a league match that i streamed.  like, if i showed adam the logs i have, i bet he'd make another long-ass post about driving away newer players and such.  but i want to get better and that kind of stuff is exactly what i hope to get!

to get more on topic here...

since i got brought up as the Streaming Veteran, i can offer some thoughts on that.  i definitely agree that iso wouldn't have a hope in hell of attracting the kind of viewer base that could get anyone twitch partner, and some kind of visual engagement is necessary; chess is about the only exception, and even that stalwart needed a charismatic streamer with funny catchphrases.  that said, i would also argue that bad visual engagement is worse for streaming than no visual engagement at all, and this is why i don't think goko/MF can ever reach that level either.  the new animations, crystal ball, etc. are exactly the kind of shit that gets clowned on by today's gamers and prevents them from ever taking your game seriously.  beyond that, the general graphical style (avatars etc.) are also that horribly out of touch.  it's not a coherent "retro" aesthetic like you see in so many indie games today, and it's obviously not modern 3D graphics - it occupies a no man's land typically associated with facebook games and mobile shovelware.

i asked on twitter if anyone could see themselves paying $90 for a 2015 game that looked like MF dominion, and included a pic of the title screen.  the response? zero positive, a bit of negative, mostly crickets.  the last part might be the worst sign - not making people care enough to say anything is as good as a hard "no" from a company's perspective.  this is why it troubles me that MF seems to be assuming that getting on steam will make them the money they need - steam is AWFUL for indies/small-time devs.  it's just too crowded of a marketplace for anyone to stand out unless you get the kind of promotion that, say, undertale did, plus there's the fact that people are far more hesitant to pay $5 for an indie game than $70 for a "AAA" game.  i don't like MF's chances in the long run if this is the basket they're putting most of their eggs in.

because of these issues, i have given up any hope of getting my friends to play online dominion.  even for longtime gamers, visuals do matter quite a bit, and there's all the uncertainty over how good the finished product will be and whether it will last.  maybe people who just play eurogames won't be deterred, but the people i know have a hell of a lot more competing for their interest.

so that's where my negativity comes from here.  this is such a wonderful game, but it's giftwrapped in weeks-old sashimi with maggots crawling all over it.  adam acts like it's MF or nothing, but there's another option he's forgetting: quit dominion and look for a similarly great game with an actual good online experience.  there are more of those now than ever before, and it's obviously a far easier path to take if you never played dominion in the first place.

i truly *want* to be optimistic, but i've seen enough stories like this that by default i prepare for the worst...

microman

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 164
  • Stop "Making Fun" of me!
  • Respect: +67
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #108 on: October 21, 2015, 11:02:37 am »
+3

Yeah, ok like that's ever gonna happen.  Like Adam,  many of us fell in love with Dominion in a way that most people don't with other games.  This is FLIPPING DOMINION, and there is no way we are going to give up our favorite game just because an online gaming company can't "get it right".  We will never give up on the game we love.  Wow, I feel fired up now.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 11:04:29 am by microman »
Logged

drsteelhammer

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1527
  • Shuffle iT Username: drsteelhammer
  • Respect: +1467
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #109 on: October 21, 2015, 11:16:46 am »
+2

But the intentions are pretty different (also having background in online gaming). People are being rude for the sake of being rude, something I've never experienced in Dominion. Personally, I have never seen SCSN insulting somebody on any stream. Sure, he is pretty direct about how he sees certain strategies, but to me that's really helpful, even though it means your personal pride has to suffer for it, maybe. (I don't see why it should, though).

Sure, you could prefer another style, but that shouldn't be the choice of the one receiving feedback
Logged
Join the Dominion League!

There is no bad shuffle that can not be surmounted by scorn.

SCSN

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2227
  • Respect: +7134
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #110 on: October 21, 2015, 11:30:57 am »
+1

i asked on twitter if anyone could see themselves paying $90 for a 2015 game that looked like MF dominion, and included a pic of the title screen.

You should have gone the extra mile and included a proper animated gif. Those soap bubbles emanating from the cards aren't going to trick casual players into spending any money when they're perceived to be standing still.
Logged

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5388
  • Respect: +2771
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #111 on: October 21, 2015, 11:40:35 am »
+2

i asked on twitter if anyone could see themselves paying $90 for a 2015 game that looked like MF dominion, and included a pic of the title screen.

You should have gone the extra mile and included a proper animated gif. Those soap bubbles emanating from the cards aren't going to trick casual players into spending any money when they're perceived to be standing still.
Logged
Also you probably are an expert if you buy two bureaucrats early.

iguanaiguana

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 604
  • Respect: +1042
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #112 on: October 21, 2015, 12:04:47 pm »
+2

i asked on twitter if anyone could see themselves paying $90 for a 2015 game that looked like MF dominion, and included a pic of the title screen.

You should have gone the extra mile and included a proper animated gif. Those soap bubbles emanating from the cards aren't going to trick casual players into spending any money when they're perceived to be standing still.


Logged
You are my favorite reptile.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.
All iguanas are equal. But some iguanas are more equal than others.

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8104
  • Respect: +8886
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #113 on: October 21, 2015, 12:33:59 pm »
+2

Yeah, ok like that's ever gonna happen.  Like Adam,  many of us fell in love with Dominion in a way that most people don't with other games.  This is FLIPPING DOMINION, and there is no way we are going to give up our favorite game just because an online gaming company can't "get it right".  We will never give up on the game we love.  Wow, I feel fired up now.

I dunno about that, I as well as many other people stopped playing online Dominion when Iso went down. I would play more IRL than I do, but the people in my game group aren't into it as much as I am, with the exception of Jonts.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

iguanaiguana

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 604
  • Respect: +1042
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #114 on: October 21, 2015, 12:39:09 pm »
+1

Yeah, ok like that's ever gonna happen.  Like Adam,  many of us fell in love with Dominion in a way that most people don't with other games.  This is FLIPPING DOMINION, and there is no way we are going to give up our favorite game just because an online gaming company can't "get it right".  We will never give up on the game we love.  Wow, I feel fired up now.

I dunno about that, I as well as many other people stopped playing online Dominion when Iso went down. I would play more IRL than I do, but the people in my game group aren't into it as much as I am, with the exception of Jonts.

But you are already not playing for the forseeable future yeah? How many people who didnt stop playing then are going to stop playing now?
Logged
You are my favorite reptile.
Igu is town or trying the hardest he ever has as scum.
All iguanas are equal. But some iguanas are more equal than others.

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8104
  • Respect: +8886
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #115 on: October 21, 2015, 01:02:08 pm »
0

Yeah, ok like that's ever gonna happen.  Like Adam,  many of us fell in love with Dominion in a way that most people don't with other games.  This is FLIPPING DOMINION, and there is no way we are going to give up our favorite game just because an online gaming company can't "get it right".  We will never give up on the game we love.  Wow, I feel fired up now.

I dunno about that, I as well as many other people stopped playing online Dominion when Iso went down. I would play more IRL than I do, but the people in my game group aren't into it as much as I am, with the exception of Jonts.

But you are already not playing for the forseeable future yeah? How many people who didnt stop playing then are going to stop playing now?

The fact that I didn't like Goko as much as Iso was the main reason I stopped. Obviously MF and Goko are more similar than Iso was to Goko; I'm just saying that some people did stop playing because a company couldn't get an online implementation right.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11218
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (。 ω 。`)
  • Respect: +11893
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #116 on: October 21, 2015, 01:03:25 pm »
0

I dunno about that, I as well as many other people stopped playing online Dominion when Iso went down. I would play more IRL than I do, but the people in my game group aren't into it as much as I am, with the exception of Jonts.

Goko was still better than IRL though, even without Salvager.
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The Twitch channel where I stream DominionThe YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's albums for free

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5388
  • Respect: +2771
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #117 on: October 21, 2015, 01:10:37 pm »
+5

Online implementations don't really compete with physical copies of the game.  There is many a Friday a night that I went out to play FNM, which is sometimes inferior and has excessive downtime between rounds, instead of staying in and playing on Goko, because I wanted to get out of the house, see people face to face, etc.

The Tuesday nights when I stay in and decide I'm going to play Dominion or Hearthstone are where a more proper competition is taking place.  And I'm pretty sure that's how it is for most people.
Logged
Also you probably are an expert if you buy two bureaucrats early.

AdamH

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2803
  • Shuffle iT Username: Adam Horton
  • You make your own shuffle luck
  • Respect: +3832
    • View Profile
    • My Dominion Videos
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #118 on: October 21, 2015, 03:06:46 pm »
+5


We've talked about this a little bit already offline, I hadn't read this yet. Anyways, I feel like the only thing left to say here is a bunch of ASCII hearts, but there are already so many in this thread. Oh well. <3


adam acts like it's MF or nothing, but there's another option he's forgetting: quit dominion and look for a similarly great game with an actual good online experience.  there are more of those now than ever before, and it's obviously a far easier path to take if you never played dominion in the first place.

Yeah that's an option for some people, but not me, man. If Dominion Online was shut down forever and it never came back, what would I do? Well I would cry. A lot. If I ever stopped crying (doubtful) then I would just focus myself on the IRL Dominion scene I'm trying to cultivate locally (which has actually been going quite well recently, btw, and should be growing pretty quickly in the coming months). I will not let the reason Dominion Online doesn't take off be anything I could have done something about.


i come from a community entirely built around calling everybody garbage, in much harsher form than anybody on this forum ever has.

I have always had high expectations of this community and that will never change. There's a quote from the movie Stand and Deliver (which I watched because Wandering Winder recommended it to me <3) that says "people will rise to the expectations you set for them." If you think they're not reasonable, that's fine. You may be right, but I won't change them because of that. I will go down with the ship.
Logged
I respond to PMs.

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5388
  • Respect: +2771
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #119 on: October 21, 2015, 03:27:34 pm »
+4

Adam Horton is cray
Logged
Also you probably are an expert if you buy two bureaucrats early.

Chris is me

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2702
  • Shuffle iT Username: Chris is me
  • What do you want me to say?
  • Respect: +3367
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #120 on: October 21, 2015, 07:18:14 pm »
+4

You say it's hard for anyone to understand their emotions, therefore you all know exactly what's going on in my head emotionally because it's hard for me to do it. That's completely ridiculous. I'd think that after two years (wait, has it been three already? We're close) of watching my videos and complaining about how "emotional" I am, maybe people would just realize that that's how I speak and that's part of who I am. Am I not in control of my emotions? I can think of two times where I've actually lost control of my emotions on anything related to you all in three years, and what did I do? I turned off the video and stopped streaming, I didn't write a post about it.

Very few of you have ever met me IRL, very few of you have directly interacted with me over the inernet. How can you possibly say you know my emotions better than I do? Like, that's super-condescending. We're all different people.

That really, really wasn't what I was saying at all. The part of my post discussing emotions was pretty broad and general, and merely used some things you've done as a jumping off point for how we all could be emotionally charged, and how it can inform our perceptions of others and our logical conclusions without conscious awareness. I'm certainly not saying anything applies to you and nobody else; I thought the examples where I talked about people that weren't you (SCSN, me, etc) would make that more clear. I was trying to de-escalate by pointing out the different perspectives we're all coming from and why there can be so much tension over what's ultimately our preferences on how a card game simulator should look and feel. I was also trying to defend SCSN, who whole I don't see eye to eye on with a lot of things, honestly didn't seem like they were trying to antagonize you in this particular thread, just explaining himself and repeatedly offering to put it behind him.

My post, in summary:
> I think iguana was talking about your emotions due to the obvious passion and energy you put into your posts here along with defensiveness.
> We all have an emotional stake in all of this and it will always influence all of our actions, that's how I think humans are.
> SCSN wasn't really being a huge dick in this thread
> David's an agent and representative of MF and his actions reflect on the organization.
> David made a lot of great posts and a good faith effort, and he got way too much flak for it, but he was also sometimes condescending.
> Not all animations are equal.

I wrote the post at like 6:30 AM and that probably influenced my wording choice and stuff, so I probably didn't communicate my intentions well. I truly am sorry for that, I didn't intend to pick on you. I have a lot of respect for you and your streams; our F.DS Championship match was some of the best matches I've played all year, I really don't mean malice here.

Quote
Quote
3) Despite the fact that there has been unwarranted hostility towards Making Fun on these forums, there has also been some pretty nasty behavior back on the part of Making Fun toward us, particularly from DavidtheDavid.

So isn't David not actually an employee of MF? Didn't I hear that somewhere? In any case, I don't read what he's saying as condescending. I'm not sure how you can, but maybe you can. OK. I don't know what to say to you.

To be perfectly honest, "David isn't an MF employee" might be one of the bigger cognitive backflips I've heard anyone make to defend MF.

Did you see me defending anyone with that statement? Like, actually read what I'm saying and don't put words in my mouth.

>"So isn't David not actually an employee of MF?"
>"I don't read what he's saying as condescending. I'm not sure how you can..."
>"I don't know what to say to you"

My interpretation of these statements is that you're making two implicit points. 1 is that David by not being an employee of MF, isn't acting as their representative and we can't judge the company by their actions. 2 is that you didn't think David was being condescending and that you view interpretations that see him that way as ridiculous / unfounded. I'm not sure why you brought up that you didn't think he was being condescending and that you didn't understand how others could see him as condescending, if you weren't saying that. I'm really confused here, I'm not sure what you were trying to get across, if you weren't defending David's actions or MF as a company.

Quote
If it feels like I'm being hard on you it's because both of your responses to my posts are things that are particularly grating to me, where you're misrepresenting what I say and who I am like you know better than I do what I mean. What did I do about it? I went to sleep so I wouldn't be emotional about it.

I don't really mean to be critcial of healthy emotional responses to stress, but I mean, I made that post at like 7 AM dude. You replied about 45 minutes later. I don't think you went to bed.

Quote
Never did I say that other people wouldn't find it condescending or not to their liking. People can think that if they want to, but I don't. Maybe this is because of the several PMs we've exchanged, maybe that helps, I dunno? The whole point of this thread is to appeal to some people who are speaking out of anger and try to get them to think critically about what they're saying. There are valid criticisms of MF to be had, I don't see why we have to resort to invalid ones that make us look like jerks and don't accomplish anything. There's plenty to whine about constructively.

Honestly, I have to agree with your general point here - whining isn't constructive, doing stuff is. I really respect how you made a video highlighting the difficult to describe animation problem and sent it to MF for review. Clearly nobody had done that before, and the problem wasn't well understood before you did, and you directly led to fixing it. That's the kind of approach I hope people do more. (And I do realize that beta testers have given detailed, long descriptions of complaints and features that have been ignored before, I'm not trying to knock them or legitimize their frustration either.)

What does confuse me here, is the juxtaposition between "never did I say other people wouldn't find it condescending" and "we don't have to resort to invalid criticisims" - the implication here is that you think the criticisms of David's condescension / temperament aren't valid. What are you saying isn't valid, if not that?

Quote
The next paragraph came off a little angry so I think I should be done typing now. Better not type anything that people could use to tell me I'm being too emotional.

I never said anything about you being too emotional. I even said your feelings were valid (well, not invalid and not incorrect). I'm just talking about how it informs our actions, even when we're not obviously overcome by emotions. I'm beginning to think you weren't just talking to me and that maybe I'm being a bit shitty by assuming it was 100% directed at me.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 07:19:50 pm by Chris is me »
Logged
Twitch channel: http://www.twitch.tv/chrisisme2791

bug me on discord

pm me if you wanna do stuff for the blog

they/them

AdamH

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2803
  • Shuffle iT Username: Adam Horton
  • You make your own shuffle luck
  • Respect: +3832
    • View Profile
    • My Dominion Videos
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #121 on: October 21, 2015, 07:35:59 pm »
0

I'm beginning to think you weren't just talking to me

:)

I'm being a bit shitty by assuming it was 100% directed at me.

nah :P

Wow, I'm feeling terse tonight.
Logged
I respond to PMs.

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8165
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9544
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #122 on: October 22, 2015, 12:38:01 pm »
0

So, Chris is me's post took about 5 minutes to load on my phone, so at first I thought it was just an enormous, empty post of nothing, which, honestly, is what I feel this thread has devolved into.  AdamH, everyone else, this has just turned into one great big hateful circle jerk. Can't we just go back to talking about what we all came to this forum for in the first place? You know, Dominion?
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

AdamH

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2803
  • Shuffle iT Username: Adam Horton
  • You make your own shuffle luck
  • Respect: +3832
    • View Profile
    • My Dominion Videos
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #123 on: October 22, 2015, 12:53:34 pm »
+3

So, Chris is me's post took about 5 minutes to load on my phone, so at first I thought it was just an enormous, empty post of nothing, which, honestly, is what I feel this thread has devolved into.  AdamH, everyone else, this has just turned into one great big hateful circle jerk. Can't we just go back to talking about what we all came to this forum for in the first place? You know, Dominion?

I couldn't disagree more. Like, I wonder if you're being sarcastic here.

Many people who have responded to this thread still hold very different opinions from me. At least in here those disagreements are being treated with respect when they can't be worked out. In the other threads I've noticed a big decrease in the amount of venom in peoples' posts.

And even within this thread, there are people finding common ground when previously it was too loud to do so. I can go digging in these other threads now, asking specific (and important) questions of these people and now they understand I'm not just being antagonistic but I'm trying to be helpful.

I've gotten everything I wanted out of this thread, and yeah I think the discussion is sort of calming down, but this has been very theraputic for me and I don't think I'm the only one. I don't feel like the discussion here is getting in the way of other discussions that are happening that aren't about Dominion online. I also feel like it's restored a lot of my positive feelings about the community in general.

I don't feel any hate towards anyone in this thread right now. Not even dislike. Are you?
Logged
I respond to PMs.

werothegreat

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8165
  • Shuffle iT Username: werothegreat
  • Let me tell you a secret...
  • Respect: +9544
    • View Profile
Re: Improving Online Dominion
« Reply #124 on: October 22, 2015, 12:57:22 pm »
0

Maybe it's just my disinclination to read multiple posts quoting each other that are each practically essays.
Logged
Contrary to popular belief, I do not run the wiki all on my own.  There are plenty of other people who are actively editing.  Go bother them!

Check out this fantasy epic adventure novel I wrote, the Broken Globe!  http://www.amazon.com/Broken-Globe-Tyr-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B00LR1SZAS/

Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6  All
 

Page created in 0.5 seconds with 20 queries.