Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1]

Author Topic: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant  (Read 2285 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2476
    • View Profile
Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« on: August 04, 2015, 08:03:56 pm »
0

Hello! As of right now, almost all of these ideas I came up with in the past week, so probably most of them are bad! I have not done any playtesting, nor have I read too much of this subforum or designed cards before so many of my ideas may have been already tried. Many cards do not have names, and I haven't put too much thought into the wording yet. The wording I will fix later, so I'd prefer feedback on the actual ideas unless it is ambiguous.

This expansion is vaguely intend to replace alchemy. No, this is not a parody or redo of that one fan set, but it might be just as bad. I would obviously only ever play with these IRL, and honestly I'm not sure how much of that I will be doing either. I do not own alchemy IRL and I do not plan to, because P-stone and Scrying pool are a pain to play with and I don't think Dominion needs possession or transmute, and so the expansion is by far the worst investment for me. But if you like alchemy, you could totally play with this and Alchemy.

Oh, and the variant bit. That's just house rules which could make the game a fair bit different, hopefully for the better. That is:

-Tweaks to a few existing cards, such as making TR optional.
-Use 5 curses/ruins per player instead of the normal 10 for every player after the first
-Use 16 of the victory cards when possible with 4 players
-Play with a 4-pile rule in 3P and 5-pile rule in 4P.

And finally the biggest change: Curses cost -1. Wow, so thematic, it fits with the VP and all. But how does this work? If you buy a curse, you actually gain a coin; so a bit like borrow, except you still lose a buy. Further, with TfB it's cost is treated as -1. If you salvage it you lose a coin, if you upgrade you gain a copper, if you apprentice it (alchemy!) you have to discard a card. With cost-reduction in play, curses cost 0.

Okay, now to the cards. The expansion, right now unnamed, I think should have 150 cards (that's standard for a small expansion, right?). It doesn't now, but fitting it to 150 I'll do later.

First, there are new base cards in every game, costing 1, 4, 7, and 10. Wow! Surely this messes something up, so please point it out.

Penny Collector - action - $1
+1 card
+1 action

Numismatist - action - $4
Reveal your hand and gain a treasure costing up to twice the number of treasures in your hand, putting it on top of your deck.

Exchange - action - $7
Do this any number of times: Return a card from your hand to the supply and take a card from the supply whose cost in coins is at most that of the returned card and put it into your hand.

Blacksmith - action - $10
+5 cards
(this is only in the game when platinum and colony are in the game)

There are a lot of tweaks to be considered to these. Numismatist doesn't have to topdeck, Exchange could be too crazy. I am thinking that the first should have 20 copies, the second 10, then 6, then 4. They are intended to be generally weak. They probably change the game in a lot of unpleasant ways I haven't anticipated yet. But now there is a base card of every price -1 to 11, with none duplicated!

Now some more random cards, without much of a theme:

Snake Chamber - Snake: see posted in Haddock's thread, idea credit to him. Link and text later.

Alloy - Victory - $6
Worth 1 point at the end of the game for every two different costs which appear in your deck.

^^kind of thematic, but dull as it is almost always worth 4, 5 with just a little work with a curse.

Liquifier - Action - $4

Trash a card from your hand. If it's an...
Action card, gain two victory cards each costing at most one more than the cost of the action.
Treasure card, +1 card, +2 actions
Victory card, +1 buy, +2 coins

^^Intended to replace transmute

Unnamed1 - Action - $3
+2 actions
Reveal the top 3 cards of your deck, put the revealed coppers into your hand and put the rest back on top.

^^I don't really like this card, something will need to change about it.

Unnamed2 - Action - $3

+2 actions
Do this any number of times: Spend an action and draw a card

^^I like this card. I think it's pretty well balanced and interesting enough.

Unnamed3 - Action - $2
Reveal your hand, for each action card, +1 action
--------------
When you gain this card, trash your hand.

^^may be too crazy.

Electrician - Action - $5
+2 cards
+1 buy
+1 coin
You may discard any number of cards. For each card discarded this way, take an electricity token.
You may spend any number of electricty tokens. For every two tokens spent (rounded down), draw a card.

^^I doubt this works as-is, but hopefully it can be made to work.

I think I want a treasure, maybe another attack, and something else that uses electricty tokens, maybe for something else.

Anyway, I anticipate editting this post a lot, hopefully it will eventually look nicer and have nicer cards in it!
« Last Edit: August 05, 2015, 11:43:29 am by liopoil »
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2476
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2015, 08:04:15 pm »
+1

Reserved for something, maybe.
Logged

shmeur

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 141
  • I'm a Dominion card lol.
  • Respect: +111
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2015, 08:52:41 pm »
+1

Unnamed2 should be +2 Actions (maybe +something else) because otherwise it's possible that there will be no source of extra actions.
Logged
"I can move mountains; I can work a miracle."

scott_pilgrim

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1029
  • Respect: +1998
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2015, 09:36:51 pm »
+1

Unnamed2 should be +2 Actions (maybe +something else) because otherwise it's possible that there will be no source of extra actions.

Well Conspirator also has that problem, but I think I like it better as +2 Actions anyway.  It's probably really weak as it is, but with +2 Actions it's at least a cantrip and it's really flexible.

Edit: Oh wait, this would require at least a village, so you're right, this is a lot worse than Conspirator in that regard.
Logged

Asper

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4995
  • Respect: +5260
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2015, 11:11:32 am »
0

And finally the biggest change: Curses cost -1. Wow, so thematic, it fits with the VP and all. But how does this work? If you buy a curse, you actually gain a coin; so a bit like borrow, except you still lose a buy. Further, with TfB it's cost is treated as -1. If you salvage it you lose a coin, if you upgrade you gain a copper, if you apprentice it (alchemy!) you have to discard a card. I can't think of any other potential weird things off the top of my head.

I hope that i'll be able to write a little more soon, but for now i'm just going to point out that discarding a card is not the same as drawing -1 card. If anything, you'd have to topdeck a card.
Also, if i play Bridge (cards don't cost less than ), what happens with Curses?

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2476
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2015, 11:13:59 am »
0

Yes, the discard is different, just an arbitrary rule for the sake of having a rule.

We'll say that curses cost 0 with bridge/highway/princess in play.

I'll edit a few things, including making Unnamed2 give 2 actions.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2015, 11:17:09 am by liopoil »
Logged

Asper

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4995
  • Respect: +5260
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2015, 11:23:29 am »
0

About Unnamed2, have you seen my Town and Road? They do a very similar thing and solve the issue with a Village automatically being in the supply. I appreciate your variant of the idea doesn't go crazy with Champion (Road does this, though not with +1 Action tokens, as it's not part of the supply).

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2476
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2015, 11:33:57 am »
0

Wait, why does it need a village in the supply? It will still give you a choice between necro, cantrip, or vanilla moat. That's weak, but that's alright. When there's a village it is a bit stronger.
Logged

Asper

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4995
  • Respect: +5260
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2015, 12:41:35 pm »
0

Sorry, i was a bit in a rush and read your card as +2 Cards, not +2 Actions  :-[
It's obviously a completely different idea, then. Forget my self-advertising...

Considering what it actually says, i think it's a very cool concept and also looks balanced at .

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7065
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +9768
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2015, 12:52:38 pm »
+1

Sorry, i was a bit in a rush and read your card as +2 Cards, not +2 Actions  :-[
It's obviously a completely different idea, then. Forget my self-advertising...

Considering what it actually says, i think it's a very cool concept and also looks balanced at .

It originally was +2 Cards, so it's possible you were just remembering the previous version.

About the current version (with +2 Actions): it reminds me of a classic fan card I first saw in WanderingWinder's Conquest expansion.

Quote
Medical Tent: Action, $4
+2 Cards
Discard any number of cards. +1 Action per card discarded.

I am certain that this has to cost $5, and would probably be a pretty decent $5. I think its biggest weakness design-wise is that it's strength might change too little depending on the Kingdom. It's universally useful. But hey it's a village, and they can maybe get away with that.

Unnamed2 is weaker. Maybe it's enough weaker to cost $3. It also has more feel-bad moments, though, as you use up your last Action to draw an Action card that you now can't play.
Logged

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7065
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +9768
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2015, 12:57:07 pm »
0

Perhaps Unnamed2 could be:

Unnamed2: Action, $3
+2 Actions
Do this any number of times: Look at the top card of your deck, and you may pay an Action to put that card into your hand.
Logged

liopoil

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • Respect: +2476
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2015, 01:03:18 pm »
0

Asper I think my edit was actually after your post, so no worries

I'm intending you to be allowed to spend one action at a time, making it less likely for you to draw dead.

Unnamed2 is similar to that card in text, but comparing its strength doesn't seem to relevant. I'd rather compare to steward, another $3 card that draws 2, or something else if you want.

I think Unnamed2 will usually not spend any actions. But choosing between necro and moat or just cantrip gives nice consitency to a village-smithy deck.

PPE: Hmm, that's nicer maybe, but significantly stronger. Note even if you run out of actions, you get to look at the next card. Could be fine at 4, we'll see if I want to change the cost.
Logged

Asper

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4995
  • Respect: +5260
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2015, 01:14:53 pm »
0

Actually, now that i think of it, your card is still a bit similar to Road. Just that your's is self-supporting to a certain degree, and never fails you completely. Also, unlike my take at it, yours doesn't need an additional card in the supply and also doesn't combo as insanely with Champion. Chapeau to that.
I think it's a lot more powerful than it looks, though, as you can still play it as +2 Cards, just with all those more save options on top.

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7065
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +9768
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2015, 01:15:55 pm »
0

Asper I think my edit was actually after your post, so no worries

I'm intending you to be allowed to spend one action at a time, making it less likely for you to draw dead.

Unnamed2 is similar to that card in text, but comparing its strength doesn't seem to relevant. I'd rather compare to steward, another $3 card that draws 2, or something else if you want.

I think Unnamed2 will usually not spend any actions. But choosing between necro and moat or just cantrip gives nice consitency to a village-smithy deck.

PPE: Hmm, that's nicer maybe, but significantly stronger. Note even if you run out of actions, you get to look at the next card. Could be fine at 4, we'll see if I want to change the cost.

Well my point in comparing them was mostly: I'd prefer a version that doesn't have that feel-bad decision of spending an Action to possibly draw a dead Action card.
Logged

Awaclus

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11163
  • Shuffle iT Username: Awaclus
  • (。 ω 。`)
  • Respect: +11832
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2015, 01:20:50 pm »
0

Note even if you run out of actions, you get to look at the next card.

I know! You could fix that by making it "You may pay an Action to look at the top card of your deck. If you do, put that card into your hand".
Logged
Bomb, Cannon, and many of the Gunpowder cards can strongly effect gameplay, particularly in a destructive way

The Twitch channel where I stream DominionThe YouTube channel where I make musicDownload my band's albums for free

LastFootnote

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7065
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +9768
    • View Profile
Re: Liopoil's Small Expansion and Variant
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2015, 01:29:09 pm »
0

Note even if you run out of actions, you get to look at the next card.

I know! You could fix that by making it "You may pay an Action to look at the top card of your deck. If you do, put that card into your hand".

 ::)

Joking aside, I actually like the fact that you can look at the top card of your deck even with no Actions left. It's a cool little bonus.
Logged
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.082 seconds with 20 queries.