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Author Topic: Monument as a counter to Possession  (Read 2727 times)

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Co0kieL0rd

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Monument as a counter to Possession
« on: July 07, 2015, 05:31:46 pm »
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http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?/20150707/log.516e0c71e4b082c74d7d0d79.1436304183181.txt

Quote
Kingdom: Crossroads, Sage, Urchin, Monument, Procession, Remodel, Smithy, Explorer, Market, Possession

Colony board. My opponent gained a Possession in turn 11. At this point, I was already ahead in VP via Monument. He started possessing me anyway and kept buying and playing more Possessions. I forfeited my original plan of going for Possession (or Platinum or Colony) and just kept buying Monuments and discarding my Potions to his Mercenaries to deny him more Possessions. In the end, I ended the game by piling Monument, Procession and Explorer, yes, Explorer!

Obviously my opponent made several huge mistakes, and kept repeating them: playing my Monuments and attacking me with Merc before possessing. My guess is that Possession is just a big trap here, as the Monument "defense" is so effective. Should Possession generally be ignored when the opponent has Monuments?
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Asper

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2015, 07:24:33 pm »
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I wonder whether your opponent thought he'd get those VP tokens? I'm not too familiar with Goko's interface, so it might be totally not a thing. Also, it's nice to see how you reacted to the situation :)
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Co0kieL0rd

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2015, 07:44:17 pm »
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I wonder whether your opponent thought he'd get those VP tokens? I'm not too familiar with Goko's interface, so it might be totally not a thing. Also, it's nice to see how you reacted to the situation :)

I wasn't sure either but one should assume the possessing player doesn't get the VP. Anyway he should have noticed after the first play of Monument but he kept doing it :P
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ehunt

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2015, 05:07:39 am »
+1

Explorer is also a great Possession counter in a Province game. With colonies, I'm not sure.
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SCSN

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2015, 08:25:25 am »
+1

How about KC-Monument as a defense against KC-Possession?

Quote
Andrew Iannaccone: turn 12
...
Andrew Iannaccone   plays King's Court
Andrew Iannaccone   plays Possession
Andrew Iannaccone   plays Possession
Andrew Iannaccone   plays Possession

Quote
SheCantSayNo: turn 12 [possessed]
...
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips

SheCantSayNo: turn 12 [possessed]
...
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips

SheCantSayNo: turn 12 [possessed]
...
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays King's Court
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips
SheCantSayNo   plays Monument
SheCantSayNo   receives 1 victory point chips

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140519/log.5101a6c4e4b02b7235c3860f.1400493620188.txt
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Co0kieL0rd

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2015, 09:25:46 am »
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Uh, did you have VP counter disabled and AI was unaware that he would not receive the VP? Even then, you can see that your own score isn't going up on Goko. Was that just a show-off game in which AI was supposed to make you win?
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SCSN

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2015, 09:57:58 am »
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Uh, did you have VP counter disabled and AI was unaware that he would not receive the VP? Even then, you can see that your own score isn't going up on Goko. Was that just a show-off game in which AI was supposed to make you win?

Neither of those. Good players can misjudge things too...
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Co0kieL0rd

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2015, 02:09:57 pm »
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So is it ever a good idea to play Possession if your opponent uses mainly Monument? Or, the other way around, is Monument a valid counter against Possession?
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Mic Qsenoch

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2015, 02:22:30 pm »
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Monument can make Possession turns worse, there's not much more to say about it in the general case. If their deck is pure Monument playing, well it's not a great Possession target, but still not impossible to have situations where you can get more benefit out of it than them. If their deck is more of a mix and you only need to play 1-2 of their Monuments to get something nice with their deck it could still easily be worth it.

I'd say Bishop and Goons are even harder to get good usage out of when Possessing.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2015, 02:23:58 pm by Mic Qsenoch »
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DG

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Re: Monument as a counter to Possession
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2015, 02:42:33 pm »
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So is it ever a good idea to play Possession if your opponent uses mainly Monument? Or, the other way around, is Monument a valid counter against Possession?

All cards that give vp tokens can be a good counter to possession. There are a number of different ways to play your original kingdom though so you have to judge during play whether your opponent is making a deck that is worth possessing. In short, an opponent will probably be happy to give you one monument vp if they can buy a colony on a possession turn. If you try to get more monuments into play then you'll need a procession engine and the opponent will gain cards during a possession turn.
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