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Author Topic: Tavern Brawl Discussion  (Read 213511 times)

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markusin

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #400 on: December 03, 2015, 04:30:43 pm »
0

I think the main thing holding me back from playing this Brawl repeatedly is the ratio between the amount of time it takes to get through and how much control you have over your victory. I think in practice you can tell who has the major edge by turn 9-10 though.
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chairs

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #401 on: December 03, 2015, 04:36:44 pm »
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Knife juggler is the most OP crap you can get in the first turn or two. You just keep flooding knife jugglers and say, one taunt minion, and is incredibly tough to counter as some classes.

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #402 on: December 04, 2015, 01:32:31 am »
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My opponent got a Clockwork Gnome.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #403 on: December 04, 2015, 08:58:53 am »
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Knife juggler is the most OP crap you can get in the first turn or two. You just keep flooding knife jugglers and say, one taunt minion, and is incredibly tough to counter as some classes.

I don't know, I got an early flamewaker and pretty soon there was no way for the opponent to come back.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #404 on: December 04, 2015, 09:15:45 am »
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I just pulled out a turn 1 Sen'jin with three Coins in hand.  My opponent immediately resigned.
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Jorbles

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #405 on: December 04, 2015, 01:04:56 pm »
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My opponent got a Clockwork Gnome.

I don't understand why people pick this, it's pretty terrible in this mode. But then people are playing as Shaman in this mode and then losing the board the turn after they play a card with overload, so I think people are having trouble learning to play it.
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #406 on: December 04, 2015, 06:14:43 pm »
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It seems like there's something wrong or screwy with the implementation.  The cards left in your deck always immediately increases by 1 when you play a card, but if you wait and redraw your hand and add up how many cards you've gained, your total deck size is never correct based on what it tells you it should be.

The probability of drawing certain cards also feels off.  I have had opponents spray their chickens and spare parts like crazy and still continually draw their non-starting cards a lot, while using lots of restraint on the 1 mana cards had no discernible effect on my probability of drawing them.  I tried spamming the spare parts and chickens myself in a subsequent game, and still couldn't tell a difference, and still seemed to get my non-starting cards a lot.

Drawing two copies of the same non-starting card should happen from time to time, but I haven't really seen it happen.

I think they got it working to a point where you can't prove it's not doing what it says it's doing without 1000 automated trials, so they got it through QA that way, but I suspect it's not quite right.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #407 on: December 04, 2015, 07:25:18 pm »
+2

I'm not entirely sure what you think the problem might be, but everything you describe sounds like expected behaviour if it works how they say it does: that all cards, whether you play them or not, end up back in your deck by the end of the turn.  You shouldn't expect to draw duplicates if you only have one of a card in your deck.
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ycz6

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #408 on: December 04, 2015, 08:34:59 pm »
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I'm not entirely sure what you think the problem might be, but everything you describe sounds like expected behaviour if it works how they say it does: that all cards, whether you play them or not, end up back in your deck by the end of the turn.  You shouldn't expect to draw duplicates if you only have one of a card in your deck.
Yeah, I was under the same impression as pops before I realized that playing cards doesn't actually make you more likely to draw them in future turns.
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Titandrake

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #409 on: December 04, 2015, 09:06:53 pm »
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I'm not entirely sure what you think the problem might be, but everything you describe sounds like expected behaviour if it works how they say it does: that all cards, whether you play them or not, end up back in your deck by the end of the turn.  You shouldn't expect to draw duplicates if you only have one of a card in your deck.

Wow, I actually had the same misconception.

The way I've made sense of it to myself is to imagine that every minion in your hand is actually a spell that says "Summon this minion." Whenever you play a spell, shuffle it back into your deck. At the end of your turn, shuffle your hand back into your deck.

I got confused because there was a minion in play and a copy of that card in the deck, but that's not the same as 2 copies of that card in the deck after ending your turn.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #410 on: December 04, 2015, 09:17:50 pm »
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I'm not entirely sure what you think the problem might be, but everything you describe sounds like expected behaviour if it works how they say it does: that all cards, whether you play them or not, end up back in your deck by the end of the turn.  You shouldn't expect to draw duplicates if you only have one of a card in your deck.
Yep. Played cards and cards left in hand go back in the deck, and don't multiply themselves (you still have just one copy). You can only get rid of cards via removing them from your hand or deck via other mechanics, such as discard.

So feel free to spam everything from your hand. Just maybe don't draft Voidcaller if you have another demon you want to keep.
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ycz6

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #411 on: December 04, 2015, 09:41:38 pm »
+1

Astral Communion = Chapel?

(Or Count, maybe...)
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KingZog3

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #412 on: December 05, 2015, 04:09:34 am »
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I'm not entirely sure what you think the problem might be, but everything you describe sounds like expected behaviour if it works how they say it does: that all cards, whether you play them or not, end up back in your deck by the end of the turn.  You shouldn't expect to draw duplicates if you only have one of a card in your deck.
Yep. Played cards and cards left in hand go back in the deck, and don't multiply themselves (you still have just one copy). You can only get rid of cards via removing them from your hand or deck via other mechanics, such as discard.

So feel free to spam everything from your hand. Just maybe don't draft Voidcaller if you have another demon you want to keep.

But you can play a card, then draw it. Do you CAN get more than 1 copy of a card on the board. I play Knife Juggler, then it goes in my deck, I draw it, play it again next turn. You can't have more than 1 copy of a card in your deck, but you can have more than 1 copy in play.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #413 on: December 05, 2015, 04:39:45 am »
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They'll multiply if you can play them multiple times per hand, or just play and then return to hand, though.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #414 on: December 05, 2015, 06:49:25 am »
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They'll multiply if you can play them multiple times per hand, or just play and then return to hand, though.

If you mean cards in deck then you can only multiply by removing something from play, either to hand or in some Malorne type way.  You can get multiple copies of a minion in play with one copy in your deck, but you can't get multiple copies of the card in your deck just by playing it a lot, even multiple times per turn.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #415 on: December 05, 2015, 06:55:50 am »
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If you mean cards in deck then you can only multiply by removing something from play, either to hand or in some Malorne type way.  You can get multiple copies of a minion in play with one copy in your deck, but you can't get multiple copies of the card in your deck just by playing it a lot, even multiple times per turn.

How can you play a card a lot if you don't remove it from play somehow?
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qmech

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #416 on: December 05, 2015, 08:25:38 am »
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If you mean cards in deck then you can only multiply by removing something from play, either to hand or in some Malorne type way.  You can get multiple copies of a minion in play with one copy in your deck, but you can't get multiple copies of the card in your deck just by playing it a lot, even multiple times per turn.

How can you play a card a lot if you don't remove it from play somehow?

Cards go back in your deck when you play them, not when the minion they spawn dies, so you can play a minion then redraw its card whilst the first minion is still on the board.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #417 on: December 05, 2015, 08:26:18 am »
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Cards go back in your deck when you play them, not when the minion they spawn dies, so you can play a minion then redraw its card whilst the first minion is still on the board.

It's not the same card, it's a copy.
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qmech

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #418 on: December 05, 2015, 08:36:10 am »
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That's true, but you removed a copy of the card from your deck when you drew it in the first place so the effect is the same.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #419 on: December 05, 2015, 08:37:41 am »
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That's true, but you removed a copy of the card from your deck when you drew it in the first place so the effect is the same.

No it's not, since the original copy is still in play.
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qmech

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #420 on: December 05, 2015, 08:49:49 am »
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That's not a card, it's a minion.

Maybe it's easiest if I just say explicitly how it works.

You start your turn with some number of cards in your hand.  If you

- play a card, it resolves and then a copy goes into your deck;
- discard a card through something like Soulfire, it is gone never to be seen again;
- still have a card in your hand at the end of your turn, a copy goes into your deck.

Resolving a minion card means summoning the corresponding minion.  There is a distinction between minion cards in hand and minions on the board, but this is the first time it's really come up.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #421 on: December 05, 2015, 09:22:10 am »
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That's not a card, it's a minion.

Well, it's still that minion you return to your hand, not a copy of it.
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qmech

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #422 on: December 05, 2015, 09:33:31 am »
+2

I think we're now in violent agreement.  The original question was whether you could stuff your deck with copies of X just by playing X a lot.  You can't, but I don't think you are claiming that you can.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #423 on: December 05, 2015, 09:39:11 am »
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I think we're now in violent agreement.  The original question was whether you could stuff your deck with copies of X just by playing X a lot.  You can't, but I don't think you are claiming that you can.

If you play the same instance of X more than once per turn, you can, which is what I was saying.

EDIT: actually it doesn't even need the "per turn" there.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 09:40:12 am by Awaclus »
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qmech

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #424 on: December 05, 2015, 09:43:47 am »
0

Definitely violent agreement.  :D

They'll multiply if you can play them multiple times per hand, or just play and then return to hand, though.

If you mean cards in deck then you can only multiply by removing something from play, either to hand or in some Malorne type way.  You can get multiple copies of a minion in play with one copy in your deck, but you can't get multiple copies of the card in your deck just by playing it a lot, even multiple times per turn.

I was querying whether your "they" meant cards, which is what the previous posters were discussing.  Apparently it didn't, it meant minions in play.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 09:45:52 am by qmech »
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