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Author Topic: Tavern Brawl Discussion  (Read 95770 times)

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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #275 on: October 07, 2015, 02:55:33 pm »
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Could Ancestral Call work? Hm.  Probably not as well :(
You'd need to mulligan for your big drops, and it'd be risky because your opponent is probably doing the same. It seems more like an anti-synergy to me.

You could run tons of big drops safely though, because it's impossible to draw them apart from your starting hand.

As for your assumption about the meta, I don't know what to expect.  If you really think people are mulliganing for big stuff in this format I don't know whether that's true but if it is true that is indeed problematic.
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ycz6

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #276 on: October 07, 2015, 05:55:01 pm »
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Could Ancestral Call work? Hm.  Probably not as well :(
You'd need to mulligan for your big drops, and it'd be risky because your opponent is probably doing the same. It seems more like an anti-synergy to me.

You could run tons of big drops safely though, because it's impossible to draw them apart from your starting hand.

As for your assumption about the meta, I don't know what to expect.  If you really think people are mulliganing for big stuff in this format I don't know whether that's true but if it is true that is indeed problematic.
Well, my thought was that since you're gonna have a perfect curve anyway, there's no point in mulliganing for early game cards, so you might as well try to make sure you draw your biggest threats. Maybe that's not the right approach though, I have seen some aggressive decks with multiple 1/2/3 drops do well.
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KingZog3

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #277 on: October 07, 2015, 06:20:30 pm »
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I think it's best to mulligan for mid game cards, and have a few good ones. Like healbot/loatheb and you can have options then. Otherwise, Secret Pally is good, since you guarentee all your secrets in your deck. Just tune it with some big late game drops, but you'll always curve minibot+muster.
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chairs

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #278 on: October 07, 2015, 07:40:07 pm »
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I love the idea of running a lot of card draw in conjunction with astral communion (and no other 4-drop). you chuck a couple card draws afterwards to refill your hand, and now you've got the extra crystals to keep burning.

blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #279 on: October 07, 2015, 07:53:44 pm »
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Interesting brawl format. The first player advantage is massive though (since the extra card doesn't really matter, and the coin doesn't do a lot when you can play on curve every turn anyway).

Edit: And for what it's worth, I've been playing Secret Paladin and have yet to face a deck that felt competitive with it except in the mirror. I started with non-secret Paladin because that way you guarantee a good turn 1, but Mysterious Challenger seems to be worth sometimes having a weak turn 1. (I got crushed in the mirror playing non-secret vs secret, so that convinced me to switch.) I'm using the curve Minibot -> Muster -> Kings -> Belcher -> Challenger -> Boom, and though turn 8+ tends to not matter a lot, Kel'Thuzad/Tirion, then Alexstrasza. The reasoning for Kings is that it's a strong proactive play the turn after a Muster. I see my opponents sometimes running Loatheb (which appears to be standard in ranked secret Paladin), but because spells are weak in this format, I don't think it's as effective as Belcher. Variable-cost minions are nice to draw in your starting hand: I'm running Sea Giant and Molten Giant, and have occasionally got use from the Sea Giant, and not yet from the Molten Giant although there are games where I would have liked to have it in my hand.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 08:13:39 pm by blueblimp »
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #280 on: October 07, 2015, 09:13:08 pm »
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Well, obviously once this strategy gets overpopular enough, counter decks can just run one of the cards Blizzard provided that  fully counters Muster.

OH WAIT
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KingZog3

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #281 on: October 07, 2015, 11:49:05 pm »
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You can't draw molten giants. Their value only changes once they are in your hand. Unless you run extra card draw.
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #282 on: October 08, 2015, 01:21:43 am »
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You can't draw molten giants. Their value only changes once they are in your hand. Unless you run extra card draw.
I know. That's the reason to run them: you only want to put in 1 card per mana cost if you possibly can, because that gives you your best possible curve every time.

Edit: Also I just lost to a very interesting Astral Communion deck. The curve went Shieldbearer -> Doomsayer -> Shade -> Astral Communion, and my opponent put no 5 and 6 drops in his deck at all, so that he would just draw a random card; turned out his turn 5 draw was Deathwing, not bad. I only lost the game because of losing all 3 Ragnaros coin-flips at the end though, and I had won an earlier game against the same opponent, so I think his deck is still weaker. But it's an interesting concept and maybe can be refined into something strong.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 01:24:40 am by blueblimp »
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #283 on: October 08, 2015, 02:39:23 am »
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I like how this brawl allows you to see your opponent's deck idea clearly from even one game.

I just lost a couple to a different take on secret paladin that had some neat ideas. In my deck, I was running chow and secretkeeper, hoping to draw one either in opening hand or instead of a secret on turn 1.

What my opponent did with his deck was to simply play out a secret on turn 1, then play a doomsayer on turn 2. It's very hard to clear the doomsayer at that point. (I managed it in the second game, but even then, redemption brought it back. :( ) For his turn 4 draw, he chose Dread Corsair, which I think is bad, but does allow him to develop an additional secret if he has one in hand. On 5, he chose Quartermaster instead of Blecher, which I can believe might be better. And on 9, he chose Kraken (compared to my Alexstrasza), which gave him lethal. I can see the argument for Kraken, since it has similar stats, but a more flexible battlecry.

Another couple interesting things about his deck: he runs Target Dummy, which picked up significant value by defending his mustered dudes (as did the Dread Corsair). Seems good, as my Sea Giant simply sat in my hand as I always had something better to do. He also runs 5 secrets (Repentance being one), which I'm sure is good, as Repentance is strong in the mirror.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #284 on: October 08, 2015, 04:51:53 am »
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I just made a regular dragon priest deck and won my first game for the pack.  Didn't put much thought into it at all.
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Awaclus

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #285 on: October 08, 2015, 08:32:19 am »
+1

I just made a regular dragon priest deck and won my first game for the pack.  Didn't put much thought into it at all.

I did this, but with midrange Hunter.
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #286 on: October 08, 2015, 08:33:51 am »
+1

I just made a regular dragon priest deck and won my first game for the pack.  Didn't put much thought into it at all.
You're missing out on personal growth dude
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #287 on: October 08, 2015, 08:38:49 am »
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I now feel dumb for running Nourish and Azure drake in my Astral Communion deck.  I should have just run no 5's like that other druid.


I tried my aggroburn shaman, since it feels like the main reason I lose with that deck is the games where I don't draw Doomhammer, and I can guarantee I draw Doomhammer.  I won at least half my games but I didn't feel it was truly strong.

I tried guaranteed Hobgoblin and managed hobgoblin hobgoblin innervate goldshire footman goldshire footman.  And I had rampant growth'ed that out a turn earlier than you'd normally be able to.  And I STILL lost.

You're supposed to play stuff on curve though, it is not Hobgoblin's brawl.

And yet, I want to try Conceal -> Doomsayer -> Alarm-o-bot, which is also not on curve (pretty sure that's better than Ancestral call)
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markusin

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #288 on: October 08, 2015, 11:14:53 am »
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I just made a regular dragon priest deck and won my first game for the pack.  Didn't put much thought into it at all.
You're missing out on personal growth dude
Actually I feel a Dragon Priest variant is decent in this Brawl because it has really strong minions on the 1-4 mana curve. I used a Dragon Priest deck with Twilight Whelp and Northshire Cleric as my only 1-drops, Wyrmrest as my only 2 drop, Dark Cultist/Blackwing Tech/SW:D as my only 3 drops, Twilight Guardian as my only 4 drops, Sylvanas and Lightbomb as my only 6 drops, then Ysera and Mind Control and some other stuff like Voljin/Azure/Corruptor at 5.

My first try I beat an Astral Communion deck with lots and lots of fatties (no real card draw). The trickiest part about facing that deck was the turn 3 King Mukla. Bananas aren't so good if your plan was to play stuff on curve.

I haven't played against Secret Pally yet (and I don't have Mysterious Challengers to play it myself) but I hope Lightbomb and SW:D would give my deck a chance against it.
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Grujah

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #289 on: October 08, 2015, 05:54:09 pm »
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I did a
Argent Squire Coin Argent Squire -> Annoyo -> Bloodmage -> Enchance-o-mehano for the win.

I've also seen a video of
Turn 2 Mana Adict
turn 3 Rockbitter, Rockbitter, Coin, Windfurry. :D
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #290 on: October 08, 2015, 06:09:31 pm »
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It's pretty frustrating playing against opponents who run multiple cards at the same mana cost (except when it's required for the deck archetype, like if you're playing a deck with secrets and also put minions at that cost). Like, I lost a secret paladin mirror to my opponent's equality consecrate. But running equality seems so bad in this format, because often you can't play it on turn 2. So maybe you can run it if you put other cards at 2. But once you start doing that, you're essentially just playing the awful ranked slot machine, hoping to draw your cards in the right order, instead of making a deck that plays to the format. So yeah, a ranked deck that gets strong draws will beat a deck built to be consistently strong on this brawl, but it's so boring to play those games. There's a reason I don't bother playing ranked much...
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #291 on: October 09, 2015, 03:38:47 am »
+2

I've written a little bit about the deck I'm currently using for this brawl: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/344945-clockwork-card-dealer-secret-paladin. I haven't recently seen an opponent in the mirror that makes me think "I should be running that instead", although there are some tech choices that might be viable if all you care about is winning the mirror (Ironbeak Owl, Blood Knight, Harrison Jones...).
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #292 on: October 09, 2015, 09:58:53 am »
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That deck is probably, like, the exact solution to this tavern brawl.  Unless it actually gets popular enough that you can expect mirrors and somehow want to go for mirror tech
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #293 on: October 10, 2015, 07:06:45 am »
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I wouldn't be surprised if there's another odd choice like Doomsayer that turns out to be surprisingly OP in this brawl. I wouldn't have thought of Doomsayer myself, but after stealing the idea from the opponent who did it, I'm convinced it's an amazing choice. Even when you're playing as P2, you can nearly always get the Doomsayer to proc (sometimes with help from Redemption, Dummy, etc.), giving you board initiative and disrupting whatever plan your opponent had for their curve.
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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #294 on: October 10, 2015, 07:10:28 am »
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Mana Wraith is slightly interesting, although I've neither used nor seen it used to great effect.
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #295 on: October 10, 2015, 07:13:10 pm »
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Mana Wraith is slightly interesting, although I've neither used nor seen it used to great effect.
Without having tried it, I wouldn't think it'd do much as P2. Like imagine your opponent plays Zombie Chow T1, then there's no point where you can play the wraith and not have it immediately removed, in which case it's effectively a vanilla 2/2.
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popsofctown

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #296 on: October 10, 2015, 08:55:37 pm »
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Mana Wraith seems pretty inneffective against Muster BoK too
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sitnaltax

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #297 on: October 14, 2015, 09:33:19 pm »
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This "randomonium" Brawl is easily my least favorite to date. You can't even plan ahead with the cards in your hand, and it feels like 80% of the games go to whoever lucks into a huge unanswerable minion on round 1 or 2.
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blueblimp

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #298 on: October 14, 2015, 09:46:23 pm »
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This "randomonium" Brawl is easily my least favorite to date. You can't even plan ahead with the cards in your hand, and it feels like 80% of the games go to whoever lucks into a huge unanswerable minion on round 1 or 2.
I assume the idea with this pair of brawls was to try out a low-RNG brawl (last week) and a high-RNG brawl (this week) and compare the play statistics on them.
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werothegreat

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Re: Tavern Brawl Discussion
« Reply #299 on: October 14, 2015, 11:03:09 pm »
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Turn 1: Dread Infernal
Turn 2: Mal'Ganis

Turn 1: Doomguard
Turn 2: Demonheart

:D
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