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Author Topic: Yet another Adventures review  (Read 14113 times)

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LastFootnote

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2015, 11:42:23 am »
0

I assume you're using hyperbole, but if the a 4-player game ends on Estates, Curses, and Coppers, your opponents are either morons or they're trolling you. That's just not how it goes.

Mountebank slog?

I'm not saying that no game ever ends on those three piles, but it's rare, even with Mountebank. I guess if you have no trashing, no sifting, etc., etc., it could happen. If you have so many Curses, though, chances are you're blocking almost every Mountebank before too long.
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AdamH

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2015, 11:42:55 am »
0

Yeah I don't think 4P Dominion is worth playing. If any attack is present you just don't get to do anything that game. Most of the time you're playing Big Money and you break for Duchies because Provinces are never attainable. If there's a junking attack, just forget it. You're in for the long haul on a game where Estates, Curses, and probably Coppers run out. I don't think there's anything fun about that, I'd rather build an engine, but even on an engine board you can't really build anything cool with two Villages. Something about potatoes again.

I assume you're using hyperbole, but if the a 4-player game ends on Estates, Curses, and Coppers, your opponents are either morons or they're trolling you. That's just not how it goes.

Mountebank slog?

The one game I'm thinking of had Mountebank in it, but man if Province is an unattainable thing no matter what you do, it just feels so, so bad.
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JW

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2015, 11:49:40 am »
+1

Increasing the number of Provinces or requiring 4 piles to be empty to end the game can make 4 player games more skill-based, and less likely to end in a very small number of turns.

4 player games use 16 of each VP card and only end when 4 piles are empty instead of 3. Would make the game less of a sprint for VP.
I like the game length in terms of turns more with 4 Provinces per player, but made it 3 for 4 players due to the game length in terms of minutes. For sure if the minutes aren't an issue for you then 16 Provinces for 4 players is a good variant. I don't know what the best number of empty piles would be, I would have to do testing.

Moving a bit away from full-random Kingdom selection can also help 4 player games. Skip Cultist and Rebuild, toss Scout and the other weakest cards while you're at it. The limited number of Kingdom cards per person exacerbates the issue of dud cards reducing strategic options, and if more Kingdom cards are worth getting, piles don't run as quickly.
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werothegreat

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #28 on: May 13, 2015, 12:52:27 pm »
+1

Your friends sound like jerks!

Yeah but they're the only people I can get to hang out with me  :P

I'd hang out with you, but I'm pretty sure we're in different states.  And making friends can be a bitch sometimes, especially if you move to a new area where you don't know anyone.
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Polk5440

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #29 on: May 13, 2015, 01:53:53 pm »
+1

Yeah I don't think 4P Dominion is worth playing. If any attack is present you just don't get to do anything that game. Most of the time you're playing Big Money and you break for Duchies because Provinces are never attainable. If there's a junking attack, just forget it. You're in for the long haul on a game where Estates, Curses, and probably Coppers run out. I don't think there's anything fun about that, I'd rather build an engine, but even on an engine board you can't really build anything cool with two Villages. Something about potatoes again.

I assume you're using hyperbole, but if the a 4-player game ends on Estates, Curses, and Coppers, your opponents are either morons or they're trolling you. That's just not how it goes.

Mountebank slog?

The one game I'm thinking of had Mountebank in it, but man if Province is an unattainable thing no matter what you do, it just feels so, so bad.

I like that with more people Duchy is a viable option. Sometimes it feels like a true alt vp.
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belugawhale

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #30 on: May 13, 2015, 01:56:07 pm »
+1

When I play multiplayer, we randomize 10+number of players, and everyone vetos one card.
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swedenman

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #31 on: May 13, 2015, 02:29:46 pm »
0

Yeah I don't think 4P Dominion is worth playing. If any attack is present you just don't get to do anything that game. Most of the time you're playing Big Money and you break for Duchies because Provinces are never attainable. If there's a junking attack, just forget it. You're in for the long haul on a game where Estates, Curses, and probably Coppers run out. I don't think there's anything fun about that, I'd rather build an engine, but even on an engine board you can't really build anything cool with two Villages. Something about potatoes again.

I assume you're using hyperbole, but if the a 4-player game ends on Estates, Curses, and Coppers, your opponents are either morons or they're trolling you. That's just not how it goes.

Either that or you're playing a game with Noble Brigand and Mountebank. For those who aren't aware, new players will think Noble Brigand is really, really good. To such an extent that they might buy nothing but Noble Brigands until the pile's gone. And then they'll think the game's bullshit when everyone starts revealing double Copper every single time.

Anyway, yeah, I already sort of said this, but I'd like to elaborate. Any more than 3 players in Dominion just makes the game dumb for me. I mean, it might be okay with no attacks, but attacks are a big part of the game and where you see most of the player interaction and I just don't want to play without them. At least not by default. Newbie players always love the shit out of Villages (I actually had to take the time to explain why Villages provide literally no benefit if you don't have any other actions in your deck; one player I played with was trying to tell me that you could use Villages to draw your entire deck and buy really expensive things), so good luck getting enough of your own Villages to build a functional engine. And piles empty SUPER aggressively, especially if you have a solid gainer like Haggler on the board, so it almost always ends up being a race for Duchies, and that's just not my idea of a fun game. And I don't mean that in an "I'm really good at the game so I only want to play it ultra-competitively" sort of way, I mean it's actually no fun even if you don't take it seriously at all. Nothing that cool ever happens, every game feels about the same, and at the point when the game is over nobody understands what I did to deserve the win. And why should they? All I did was start buying Duchies before everyone else.

Anyway, that's my rant. If you enjoy 4-player Dominion then more power to ya, but in general I'd recommend finding a better 4-player board/card game.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2015, 02:31:56 pm by swedenman »
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LastFootnote

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #32 on: May 13, 2015, 02:46:22 pm »
+1

Anyway, yeah, I already sort of said this, but I'd like to elaborate. Any more than 3 players in Dominion just makes the game dumb for me. I mean, it might be okay with no attacks, but attacks are a big part of the game and where you see most of the player interaction and I just don't want to play without them. At least not by default. Newbie players always love the shit out of Villages (I actually had to take the time to explain why Villages provide literally no benefit if you don't have any other actions in your deck; one player I played with was trying to tell me that you could use Villages to draw your entire deck and buy really expensive things), so good luck getting enough of your own Villages to build a functional engine. And piles empty SUPER aggressively, especially if you have a solid gainer like Haggler on the board, so it almost always ends up being a race for Duchies, and that's just not my idea of a fun game. And I don't mean that in an "I'm really good at the game so I only want to play it ultra-competitively" sort of way, I mean it's actually no fun even if you don't take it seriously at all. Nothing that cool ever happens, every game feels about the same, and at the point when the game is over nobody understands what I did to deserve the win. And why should they? All I did was start buying Duchies before everyone else.

Anyway, that's my rant. If you enjoy 4-player Dominion then more power to ya, but in general I'd recommend finding a better 4-player board/card game.

I think this is more an indictment of playing with rookie players as it is 4-player. I play two games of Dominion every Friday during lunch and usually they're 4-player games. Sometimes 3-player or 5-player. I'd say that about half the games end on Provinces and even when they don't, we get to build reasonable decks. We do not avoid using Attacks. I guess it's just a function of the players being at least halfway competent.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #33 on: May 13, 2015, 03:02:33 pm »
+3

I'd rather build an engine, but even on an engine board you can't really build anything cool with two Villages.

I guess what it comes down to is: if building engines is the only way you get joy from Dominion, then 4-player games will provide you with much less joy than 2-player games.
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xyz123

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #34 on: May 13, 2015, 03:44:25 pm »
+2

My experience of real life games is similar to that already posted. People seem to like to play in large groups but paradoxically do not like having to wait a long time between turns. One person I know regards building engines as poor sportsmanship as long turns are no fun for everyone else. They have their own rule where you are limited to three action cards per turn.
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AdamH

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #35 on: May 13, 2015, 03:53:31 pm »
+1

I'd rather build an engine, but even on an engine board you can't really build anything cool with two Villages.

I guess what it comes down to is: if building engines is the only way you get joy from Dominion, then 4-player games will provide you with much less joy than 2-player games.

I mean, I guess this is kinda close to being accurate. I love games where you look for synergies and you get to build your engine and watch it go. I also love games where that's challenging. So if I can see all the parts of an engine but I can't build it, that's frustrating; I think "why am I doing this other thing that isn't as good when I can just play 2P Dominion which is awesome?" Sure I don't always want it to be possible but 2P Dominion strikes the perfect balance of that for me.
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LastFootnote

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #36 on: May 13, 2015, 03:53:45 pm »
+1

My experience of real life games is similar to that already posted. People seem to like to play in large groups but paradoxically do not like having to wait a long time between turns. One person I know regards building engines as poor sportsmanship as long turns are no fun for everyone else. They have their own rule where you are limited to three action cards per turn.

Sounds like they'd like Tempoum better.
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Donald X.

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #37 on: May 13, 2015, 03:55:50 pm »
+2

Did Donald (or Jay or anyone else) ever actually say that Guilds would be the last expansion? I recall Donald saying that Guilds was the last regular/planned expansion, and therefore any new expansion would be irregular and/or was not yet planned.
I don't know if Jay did, but it wouldn't be like him. I said repeatedly that maybe there would be more expansions, but that no more were planned.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=73.0
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hockeysemlan

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #38 on: May 13, 2015, 07:09:45 pm »
0

My friends play 4-players a lot now when Adventures out. We're all midscilled players and then it's a lot of fun. Sure, crazy things happens (Giant is unstoppable, Hireling is OP in a riduculus way) but that's what Dominion is about in a way, especially when playing more for the fun of it then for pure competition. Absolutely, we do miss the strategic, controlled part, but if you know the game on some level it's pretty easy to construct kingdoms that doesn't get locked down in a unsatisfying way and the one who wins our games always do it by a skilled decision somewhere on the road and not by random luck.

Don't play 4-players with noobs, I guess. If not, it's not that bad imho. To get the feel of new cards this is the most exciting way I can imagine. (That I'm saying getting crushed several times today. I will never buy a duration IRL again. NEVER.)
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dondon151

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #39 on: May 13, 2015, 11:41:43 pm »
+2

In a 2P game I can chant ymyosl to myself

I would love to see this, preferably in the form of an incantation.

My [former] RL play group refuses to play Dominion with me online with the exception of one person who doesn't mind losing all that much, and I end up getting super salty when I lose because there's the expectation for me to win every game and always figure out the best strategy in a given kingdom.
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Cuzz

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #40 on: May 21, 2015, 12:36:40 pm »
+2

Did Donald (or Jay or anyone else) ever actually say that Guilds would be the last expansion? I recall Donald saying that Guilds was the last regular/planned expansion, and therefore any new expansion would be irregular and/or was not yet planned.
I don't know if Jay did, but it wouldn't be like him. I said repeatedly that maybe there would be more expansions, but that no more were planned.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=73.0

Question that I didn't feel like making a new thread for, but seems to almost fit here:
I was away from this forum for like a year, and just popped my head in to discover there's a new expansion! Can anyone point me to the threads where the rumors/announcements for Adventures first appeared? Thought that might be an entertaining read.
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Awaclus

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #41 on: May 21, 2015, 12:38:11 pm »
0

Did Donald (or Jay or anyone else) ever actually say that Guilds would be the last expansion? I recall Donald saying that Guilds was the last regular/planned expansion, and therefore any new expansion would be irregular and/or was not yet planned.
I don't know if Jay did, but it wouldn't be like him. I said repeatedly that maybe there would be more expansions, but that no more were planned.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=73.0

Question that I didn't feel like making a new thread for, but seems to almost fit here:
I was away from this forum for like a year, and just popped my head in to discover there's a new expansion! Can anyone point me to the threads where the rumors/announcements for Adventures first appeared? Thought that might be an entertaining read.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?board=64.0
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Jimmmmm

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2015, 05:54:09 pm »
0

Did Donald (or Jay or anyone else) ever actually say that Guilds would be the last expansion? I recall Donald saying that Guilds was the last regular/planned expansion, and therefore any new expansion would be irregular and/or was not yet planned.
I don't know if Jay did, but it wouldn't be like him. I said repeatedly that maybe there would be more expansions, but that no more were planned.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=73.0

Question that I didn't feel like making a new thread for, but seems to almost fit here:
I was away from this forum for like a year, and just popped my head in to discover there's a new expansion! Can anyone point me to the threads where the rumors/announcements for Adventures first appeared? Thought that might be an entertaining read.

Hi Cuzz!
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Cuzz

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Re: Yet another Adventures review
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2015, 06:23:53 pm »
0

Did Donald (or Jay or anyone else) ever actually say that Guilds would be the last expansion? I recall Donald saying that Guilds was the last regular/planned expansion, and therefore any new expansion would be irregular and/or was not yet planned.
I don't know if Jay did, but it wouldn't be like him. I said repeatedly that maybe there would be more expansions, but that no more were planned.

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=73.0

Question that I didn't feel like making a new thread for, but seems to almost fit here:
I was away from this forum for like a year, and just popped my head in to discover there's a new expansion! Can anyone point me to the threads where the rumors/announcements for Adventures first appeared? Thought that might be an entertaining read.

Hi Cuzz!

Yo
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