Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[brokoli]

Is anyone else disappointed that Ratcatcher doesn't combo with Rats?

Why it couldn't ?

[Jimmmmm]

Is anyone else disappointed that Ratcatcher doesn't combo with Rats?

Why it couldn't ?

Well yeah you can use it to trash your Rats. But generally with both cards available (assuming you want trashing and there's nothing better), unless there's a good reason to get Rats, you just get Ratcatchers.

[enfynet]

Is anyone else disappointed that Ratcatcher doesn't combo with Rats?

Why it couldn't ?

Well yeah you can use it to trash your Rats. But generally with both cards available (assuming you want trashing and there's nothing better), unless there's a good reason to get Rats, you just get Ratcatchers.

Well, Ratcatchers are cheap, so if you find yourself infested with Rats, it wouldn't be a bad idea pick up a couple to help cull your deck.

[Awaclus]

Is anyone else disappointed that Ratcatcher doesn't combo with Rats?

Why it couldn't ?

Well yeah you can use it to trash your Rats. But generally with both cards available (assuming you want trashing and there's nothing better), unless there's a good reason to get Rats, you just get Ratcatchers.

Naturally. You're already paying Gandalf to catch your rats, so why would you want to buy even more rats?

[Jimmmmm]

Is anyone else disappointed that Ratcatcher doesn't combo with Rats?

Why it couldn't ?

Well yeah you can use it to trash your Rats. But generally with both cards available (assuming you want trashing and there's nothing better), unless there's a good reason to get Rats, you just get Ratcatchers.

Well, Ratcatchers are cheap, so if you find yourself infested with Rats, it wouldn't be a bad idea pick up a couple to help cull your deck.

Maybe. You'd rather your Apprentice/Bishop/Salvager/Remodel/etc catch them instead.

[swedenman]

Plan seems a little less valuable for trashing Copper just because it means you have to keep the Copper in hand (thus costing you $1 that turn).

Okay, but isn't that technically the case for any trasher that isn't TfB?

[werothegreat]

I just realized Ranger and Giant don't have to conflict; you use terminal draw at the start or middle of your turn, and you use coin/attack payload at the end of it.  Just use two of each, making sure you use both Rangers before you use both Giants.

[enfynet]

I just realized Ranger and Giant don't have to conflict; you use terminal draw at the start or middle of your turn, and you use coin/attack payload at the end of it.  Just use two of each, making sure you use both Rangers before you use both Giants.

Why would order of play matter? So long as you don't alternate R-G-R-G it would work. R-G-G-R or G-R-R-G do the same thing as R-R-G-G. Assuming you have the 4 actions to play.

TR-TR-R-G works too.

[eHalcyon]

Plan seems a little less valuable for trashing Copper just because it means you have to keep the Copper in hand (thus costing you $1 that turn).

Okay, but isn't that technically the case for any trasher that isn't TfB?

No, because with regular trashers you can just trash your hand and that's it.  Maybe you end your turn without buying anything afterwards, or you buy something cheaper instead.  With Plan, you need to buy something specific before you are able to trash.  Since you care about what you are buying, costing you that $1 hurts you a little bit more.

[Willvon]

I love alt-Victory cards. So Distant Lands was one of the first ones I looked at in the rule book. At first I thought maybe there was a card in the expansion that makes you take it off the mat or call it. But once you get it on the mat, that 4VP is secure, right? The problem is when you have to use an action for it that you would prefer to use for something else, or whether you take the chance late in the game that you buy it and may not get to play it before the game ends. Am I looking at this right or is there something that I am missing?  Obviously if you have Duke in that kingdom, you go for Duchies. But as long as you have an engine going where you have the actions wouldn't this always be a better purchase than Duchy, maybe even Island, as long as you have the $5?

[jonts26]

If you have an engine drawing your deck every turn and you have spare actions and its not the last turn and you don't need a 3 point buffer to keep your opponent from ending the game, then yes this is strictly better than duchy. That's a lot of conditions though. But really, at that point you aren't trying to compete with duchy. You're competing with more engine stuff or if you're greening you're trying to balance non clogging these with clogging provinces.

[werothegreat]

If you have an engine drawing your deck every turn and you have spare actions and its not the last turn and you don't need a 3 point buffer to keep your opponent from ending the game, then yes this is strictly better than duchy. That's a lot of conditions though. But really, at that point you aren't trying to compete with duchy. You're competing with more engine stuff or if you're greening you're trying to balance non clogging these with clogging provinces.

Were you the one who Duplicated all the Distant Landses?

[jonts26]

If you have an engine drawing your deck every turn and you have spare actions and its not the last turn and you don't need a 3 point buffer to keep your opponent from ending the game, then yes this is strictly better than duchy. That's a lot of conditions though. But really, at that point you aren't trying to compete with duchy. You're competing with more engine stuff or if you're greening you're trying to balance non clogging these with clogging provinces.

Were you the one who Duplicated all the Distant Landses?

I did do that. Fun times.

[Beyond Awesome]

One interesting thought that has occurred to me is that you can put a lot of Royal Carriages on your mat and have just a single Bridge out and then Royal Carriage the same Bridge multiple times. This sort of reminds me a lot of NV/Bridge. I have a feeling this can definitely be a thing.

[eHalcyon]

One interesting thought that has occurred to me is that you can put a lot of Royal Carriages on your mat and have just a single Bridge out and then Royal Carriage the same Bridge multiple times. This sort of reminds me a lot of NV/Bridge. I have a feeling this can definitely be a thing.

Probably needs a bit more support than that, since Royal Carriage is a $5.  NV/Bridge is potent because the components are so cheap.  I can definitely see that working though.

[Beyond Awesome]

So, anyway, here are my thoughts on the kingdom cards. I posted my thoughts on the Events earlier.

I will say this. I misread Plan and thought the ability was on play which would just be absurd. As it is though, I really like the card. Put it on Wishing Well or Caravan or something and that's really good trashing right there.

Anyway, onto the kingdom cards.

Amulet: I think with this on the board, you have to open Amulet/Amulet or Amulet with another trasher. If it is the only trashing, this is pretty good. Yah, it doesn't draw cards like Steward, but it does give coin later on, so yah, I think this card is solid, probably on the same power level as Forager or just a notch below.

Artificer: This card really needs an engine to work, but in the right engine this can be brutal. Draw to X loves this and so does Scrying Pool. At the very least, it's a Peddler, so there's that. I think as far as $5 costs go, this is probably somewhere in the middle but on the boards where it shines it can be really good like HoP good or better even.

Brdige Troll: So, a Double Bridge that can't be Throned. I guess that's pretty good. The second turn it's out makes it non-terminal. The attack seems kind of weak, but you are getting two Bridges over two turns. I do like how the card title references the original Bridge. I think power level, this is probably somewhere around Artificer. You don't get the coin from Bridge though, although you take a coin away. If you need +Buy this can be pretty handy and engines do like cost reducers. The only problem is that this competes with other 5 cost cards.

Caravan Guard: I know there is a lot of controversy over this guy. A lot of people think he's weak. Honestly though, having a cantrip at $3 is fine. I mean how often do I want Silver anyway. I think more often than not this guy is better than silver. Sure, the Peddler effect is delayed and he misses reshuffles more often, but he seems pretty good. Also, against Minion attacks or discarding attacks, this seems pretty good against those. I think people are underestimating this card. CG is not amazing or anything, but not terrible. I think it's a decent $3 and a card that people will often buy a lot of. Honestly, this seems better to me than Market Square most of the time.

Dungeon: A weird warehouse. I like that the sifting happens twice. Also, on your second turn, you start with a 5-card hand, so it doesn't cost a card like Warehouse. I think this is pretty solid and anytime you would want Warehouse, you would probably want this. Honestly, I would not surprised if this were actually a better card than Warehouse. It does have the potential though to trigger unwanted reshuffles.

Duplicate: Workshop that gains $6 cost cards and that I can save later. Seems solid. You can also save this for the late game with Highway, play two of them and then Pile Drive the Provinces. I can see that being an interesting deck that would probably work honestly. As far as workshop variants goes, I think this is on the same power level as Ironworks, maybe a little stronger because $6 is better than $4.

Gear:  Seems like good draw. The setting aside part is pretty cool. I think it's good, but I'm not sure how good. I think playing Smithy or anything that draws 3 or more is probably better to play than this most of the time. Still though, I can see myself buying this card a fair amount of times.

Giant: I'm still not sold. I guess it's decent. Maybe playing with it more will change my mind. My guess is this is on a similar power level to Jester.

Guide: This card seems insanely strong. A power $3 for sure. There are so many times where getting a new hand is the best choice. This helps get to attacks quicker, you can upgrade Page/Peasant quicker. You can get rid of dud hands. You can also play out your engine, have your components miss the reshuffle and then call this to discard your bad hand. So, yah, this card is AMAZING!

Haunted Woods: I have done a little playing with this card. Okay, one game against myself. I have found that drawing on your next turn is really, really good. This is not Smithy. This is a delayed Hunting Grounds that does not eat up an action on your next turn. Playing two at once means you get an 11 card starting hand next turn. Don't underestimate this card. As far as card draw goes, this is probably one of the best card drawers in the game honestly.

Hireling: Seems solid, but worth skipping if you can find another way to draw out your engine. Well, getting one or two early can help. I mean starting each turn with a 6-card hand is pretty good actually. This is probably a mid-level 6-cost card.

Lost City: Seems good, but not a village I want too many. I think the drawback can really help the opponent, but engines often need draw and Villages and this gives both. I think it's good. I think it's a card I will buy on many, many boards, but I don't think it is broken or anything. It's probably on the same power level as Bazaar. Early on, this gives more draw reliability, but then I would switch to bazaar if both were on the board.

Magpie: From the little I have played with this card, it seems pretty strong. A lot of times, it ends up being a lab. Later on, it does lose it's strength. But, it's still really good. This is up there with Iron Monger, Caravan and friends. So, a very solid card.

Messenger: Umm.... Yah, that's all I have to say. I mean, maybe I need +buy. Chancellor effect is okay, but nothing earth shattering, but why would I want to give my opponent a card that I also want? I'm not sold on this card.

Miser: I think I would take Moneylender over this, but it does have the benefit of providing a lot of $ later on in the game. I see the Pirate Ship comparisons, but man this shits on PS. That card is so bad. This is actually useful. In Colony games, this can also help you reach Platinum and Colony more easily, or it can be a terminal Plat itself. Overall, I think this card is okay, but usually there will likely be a better trasher you want instead. I guess you can pair it with something like Raze or Forager though.

Ranger: This card is not reliable, but drawing 5 cards is better than 3. I think this card will be better than a lot of people realize. And, you might just need the +buy anyway. Still though, more often than not, a card like Smithy will be better, but I can also see this a lot of times being your only form of terminal draw. In other words, this card is decent, but not great, and yah, there are many times where you will just skip this, I think.

Ratcatcher: Seems pretty good. This is also an amazing defense against junking attacks, except Cultist. This is probably too slow for Cultist. This reminds me of Hermit in some ways, but you can also trash copper with it.

Raze: Another decent trasher. Forager is probably better, but this is non-terminal and can trash itself. If this were the only trasher on the board, I will probably open Raze/Raze.

Royal Carriage: So, it's a throne I can save for later, but with a few more uses. It seems decent. It does compete with the $5 price point, but being able to get this to line up with just the right card seems pretty good. This is probably a mid-tier $5 cost card, maybe a bit better. I don't think it is a power $5 though by any stretch of the imagination.

Swamp Hag: Against engines, this can really shut them down. Often people want to buy 2 or 3 or more cards in a turn. At the very least, this can slow down the engine player. Most other curse givers are probably better, but man, most junking attacks are OP. This actually seems to be of a reasonable power level. I do think this card is probably stronger than a lot of people may realize. We will see though. It's different. That's for sure. The +$3 seems okay, but nothing special.

Transmogrify: I'm just not sure on this card. I'm sure there are it's uses. I'm sure it's a fun card. I'm not sure though if it is a powerful card. I guess being able to upgrade a $4 cost to a $5 cost can be decent. This is probably an average $4 at best most of time. Though, Fortress loves card.

Wine Merchant: Seems weak and is probably weak most of the time, unless you need that +Buy or extra economy for some reason. Next!

Port: Yes! I do love me some villages. This is solid. I do think Minstrel and Plaza are probably better, but this is still really good because most engines love villages. Yah, this is a power village for sure.

Coin of the Realm: I think this is a card that people will only want to buy 1 or 2 of, but that extra reliability can really help a lot. I think it's solid. I wouldn't spam this like other villages, but the fact that I can just wait to call it is handy.

Relic: This is sort of a non-terminal Milita/Ghost Ship thing. Seems good. Probably not super strong because it's just one card, but the attack can still hurt an opponent. I love how it's a treasure attack.

Treasure Trove: Okay, Dominion has become pretty enginey lately, but I think alt. vp strategies love this card. It even seems pretty decent in big money. This car doesn't excite me though.

Distant Lands: Hmm, I'm not sure. I guess if I have the payload, buying one every turn in an engine can help while an opponent buys Provinces and gets their deck clogged. I think it's solid. But, I also think it takes the right kind of engine, or you have to plan your strategy accordingly. I mean, if your plan is just to mega-turn and pile drive Provinces, this probably isn't worth it. It does seem pretty good though for an alt. vp deck card.

Anyway, my overall impression is that this set looks really fun. Honestly, I'm not a fan of DA's super trash theme. I love trashing. Junk Dealer is awesome. I just felt the tfb cards were really tacky. I mean trashing squire, cultist, hunting grounds, etc. are very situational. And, DA only games feel like you are playing something other than Dominion. So, I know DA is a lot of people's favorites, but it wasn't Mine. Also, it had a lot of oppressive/linear cards like Cultist, Rebuild, and Urchin. This expansion seems much more up my ally. And, I'm really excited about the events. I can't wait to see how they change things. Also, on another note, this expansion feels like Dominion to me.

[Jimmmmm]

One interesting thought that has occurred to me is that you can put a lot of Royal Carriages on your mat and have just a single Bridge out and then Royal Carriage the same Bridge multiple times. This sort of reminds me a lot of NV/Bridge. I have a feeling this can definitely be a thing.

Probably needs a bit more support than that, since Royal Carriage is a $5.  NV/Bridge is potent because the components are so cheap.  I can definitely see that working though.

But once you've got all the pieces it's super easy to trigger right? If you have 6 Royal Carriages in your Tavern and you play a Bridge with a Copper in hand, you can empty the Provinces. Also, Carriages themselves can help you get to $5 when paired with say a terminal Silver, or even better a Bridge.

[werothegreat]

Might as well do this since everyone else is.  Thoughts on cardses!

Coin of the Realm: Awesomeness incarnate.  One of my favorite villages.  I'll take the pile, please.

Page: I can see Treasure Hunter getting ridiculous in Feodum games, and Hero is kind of ballsy, but I really, really dislike what Champion does to games.  It's like, as soon as everyone has a Champion, nothing that normally matters in Dominion matters at all.  There are no terminals, there are no attacks.  Just do whatever the hell you want.  Harrumph.  Get off my lawn!

Peasant: Much better.  Soldier's discard is a better attack than Warrior's trashing, Fugitive is a decent sifter, Disciple is ridiculously awesome, and Teacher is my bro.  Let's go put an Action token on Hunting Grounds, dawg.

Ratcatcher: I like it.  It's definitely slow, and you definitely need more than one.  Certainly not as weak as some people on here would have you believe.

Raze: I like this as well.  Finally, a useful trasher that gets rid of itself when it's no longer needed.  Though why the hell is this guy ripping up wallpaper in the art?

Amulet: I'll take two.

Caravan Guard: Me likey.  I'll take a bunch, and play them all whenever you attack me.  Free money this turn!

Dungeon: Definitely better on the second turn.

Gear: Meh.  I'll have to play with it some more to see if it's all that good.

Guide: Pick up one (or two, but no more than that) if you don't want a Silver.  Save it for when you need it.  If you use it at least once, it was worth it.  Goes well with Ratcatcher.

Duplicate: It's growing on me.  Make sure you get use out of them, and don't just let them sit on your Tavern mat so you can get five Duchies on your last turn.

Magpie: Pretty baller.

Messenger: I suspect this will be sort of an inverse Rebuild - more interesting than its power really deserves.

Miser: Me likey.  Hoard my Coppers and get rich!  And unlike Moneylender, those Coppers still count towards Gardens.

Port: Delightfully silly and just all kinds of awesome.

Ranger: Get two.  Or at least even numbers.

Transmogrify: I suspect this will be middle of the road in terms of power.

Artificer: This one's pretty awesome.  Combos nicely with Haunted Woods, which gets you to just the right handsize.

Bridge Troll: Get two.  Or three.  Or four.  Bridge now, bridge later?  Sign me up!

Distant Lands: If you're going to go for them, really go for them.  Hit that pile.

Giant: FEE FIE FOE FUM I SMELL THE COST OF DOMINION CARDS

Haunted Woods: Better than it at first looks.

Lost City: Honestly, the penalty is overwhelmed by how great this card is.

Relic: Hehehe.  I like this one.  I particularly like buying a Lost City after playing one.

Royal Carriage: All sorts of awesome.  It can never be drawn dead!  It can stack on the same card!  Can't do one-shots, though.    BUT IT'S PURPLE

Storyteller: Tricksy.  Likes engines... that have Treasures in them.

Swamp Hag: Quite nice, but would be better if Adventures didn't have quite so many ways to avoid buying cards.

Treasure Trove: I can appreciate its BM-ness.  I certainly like it better than Cache.  I really want to play it in a Gardens game.

Wine Merchant: I like this guy.  Look at that adorable troll-face.  Card's not too shabby, either.  Money makes the vorld go around...

Hireling: FOR THE REST OF THE GAME is quite nice.

Alms: Use this for a 4/4 opening!  Or better yet, a 5/4 opening!  Never buy anything costing less than $4 again!  Plays well with cost reducers.

Borrow: Makes openings... interesting. 

Quest: Niche.

Save: I'll just save that Moat/Treasure Map/Throne Room for next turn.  It's like Haven, except optional.  And cheaper.  Which is better.

Scouting Party: Eh, I'm not really sold on the 3 card discard being mandatory.  Maybe if it were "up to..."

Travelling Fair: ONCE A YEAR WE THROW A PARTY HERE IN TOWN

Bonfire: Now burn the Coppers, Ralphie!  Burn 'em all!

Expedition: Delicious, if you have an extra buy.  Definitely something I'd buy on a Mission turn.

Ferry: Best thing since sliced bread.  Open Ferry/Goons.  Hell, Ferry/Hireling, then move the Ferry somewhere else.  Definitely better on a 3/4 opening, rather than 4/3.

Plan: I'd only use it if a board had no other trashing.

Mission: Handy, if you have useful things to do that aren't buying.

Pilgrimage: Eh, don't think I'm a fan of wasting two buys for this.  At least I only have to buy Ranger and Giant once.

Ball: Good against Swamp Hag/Haunted Woods.  Mediocre otherwise, methinks.

Raid: Feodum games?  Excellent.  Big money games?  Not too shabby.  Engine games?  Go away.

Seaway: This seems well-balanced, and something I'd use regularly.

Trade: Bonfire is better, honestly.

Lost Arts: Me likey. 

Training: Me likey, though not as much as Lost Arts.

Inheritance: Craziest batshit thing ever made, but seems like a hell of a lot of fun.

Pathfinding: Expensive, but probably worth it if you have a good target.  The question is, do you put this on your "Village", or your "Smithy"?

Overall impression:

[enfynet]

Haunted Woods: Better than it at first looks.

I knew I picked the right avatar. 

[Jimmmmm]

Relic: Hehehe.  I like this one.  I particularly like buying a Lost City after playing one.

Doesn't that make the Lost City penalty worse, since 4->5 is a bigger difference than 5->6?

[eHalcyon]

Caravan Guard: I know there is a lot of controversy over this guy. A lot of people think he's weak.

That's not what the "controversy" was about.  I don't think anybody has been arguing about the power level, though some people started interpreting the discussion that way.

One interesting thought that has occurred to me is that you can put a lot of Royal Carriages on your mat and have just a single Bridge out and then Royal Carriage the same Bridge multiple times. This sort of reminds me a lot of NV/Bridge. I have a feeling this can definitely be a thing.

Probably needs a bit more support than that, since Royal Carriage is a $5.  NV/Bridge is potent because the components are so cheap.  I can definitely see that working though.

But once you've got all the pieces it's super easy to trigger right? If you have 6 Royal Carriages in your Tavern and you play a Bridge with a Copper in hand, you can empty the Provinces. Also, Carriages themselves can help you get to $5 when paired with say a terminal Silver, or even better a Bridge.

Yeah.  I just think that you'll need some support to get Royal Carriages quickly enough.  If that's what you're focusing on, you're not really doing much else with your deck.  And if you do call on a Carriage, you're going to need time before you get it back into your tavern.  I'm thinking you could do with support like Horse Traders (consistent $5 hands) or Duplicate (get RCs more quickly) or Ferry (hitting $3 is very manageable).  There are lots, probably.  I don't think it can be a two card combo like NV/Bridge is.  Then again, maybe it's not too slow just to RC-Bridge early to buy more RCs.

Pilgrimage: Eh, don't think I'm a fan of wasting two buys for this.  At least I only have to buy Ranger and Giant once.

2 buys gets you 3 cards of value.  If you play it right, it's a net profit.

Relic: Hehehe.  I like this one.  I particularly like buying a Lost City after playing one.

Doesn't that make the Lost City penalty worse, since 4->5 is a bigger difference than 5->6?

I'm not sure what you mean.  You play Relic, everybody takes -1 card token.  You buy Lost City, they lose that token.  Basically, Relic nullifies the Lost City penalty.  Or are you saying that you'd rather your opponents have a 6 card turn and then a 4 card turn rather than two 5 card turns?  Keep in mind, the -1 token could also be removed if they play a Smithy or something.

[eHalcyon]

The more I think about Gear, the more I'm convinced that it's going to be one of the stronger $3 cards.  I think the most relevant comparison is actually Courtyard, not Haven.  Courtyard lets you look at more, but Gear can match it for final hand size if you don't set aside any cards.  Also note that if you set aside 0, Gear gets discarded right away.  If you do set aside a card, your next turn is better than it would be with Courtyard because it's a Haven effect, not a topdeck.  Moreover, you can set aside a second card if you wish.  Consider that if you set aside 2 cards, your next turn is comparable to a Wharf turn!

Also, I just remembered an observation I had about the two traveller lines -- they actually parallel each other in effects.

Page and Peasant both have 2 vanilla bonuses (covering all 4 vanilla bonuses between them).
Treasure Hunter and Soldier both give virtual coin.
Warrior and Fugitive both draw cards.
Hero and Disciple both gain cards (Treasure and Action, respectively).
Champion and Teacher both make your other action cards better.

Also, Soldier and Warrior (different levels of traveller but thematically similar) get better based on other cards in play.

[iguanaiguana]

Watch John Oliver talk about Bridge troll games: