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Author Topic: The 10 words card summary challenge  (Read 49478 times)

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ehunt

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #75 on: March 29, 2015, 04:56:31 pm »
+1

In 2p there's no question, just buy all the duchies. You can finetune this if you are certain the game is about to end, but I honestly expect that to improve your win-rate over the naive buy all the duchies algorithm by less than 1%.

In multiplayer it's genuinely important to worry, because there's more duchies and the game ends. I think the 4 and alternate strategy is not so bad in multiplayer. Probably the optimal strategy is closer to 6 and then Dukes. But I don't know.

Anecdotal evidence: after every Duke game I've played for years, I've asked myself "would it have changed the outcome if I had bought the mathematically optimal number of Dukes/Duchies?" (i.e. count my 5 cost victory cards and maximize profit). The answer has been yes exactly once, and even then I am not taking into account denying duchies to my opponent.

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Captain Stupendous

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #76 on: March 29, 2015, 05:06:19 pm »
+2

Menagerie: Works with discard for benefit and virtual money. Seldom ignorable.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2015, 05:14:02 pm by Captain Stupendous »
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sudgy

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #77 on: March 29, 2015, 05:39:31 pm »
+4

Unless the game is close to being over I think it's best to get all of the duchies.  It's easier to not get all of the duchies if you don't.

Also, check this out: Smileys are on, and I'm still able to say 8) 8)

PPE: OH MY GOODNESS I DISCOVERED A SECRET SMILEY IF YOU DO :)) IT MAKES :))
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   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

WanderingWinder

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #78 on: March 29, 2015, 05:41:58 pm »
+2

Unless the game is close to being over I think it's best to get all of the duchies.  It's easier to not get all of the duchies if you don't.

Also, check this out: Smileys are on, and I'm still able to say 8) 8)

PPE: OH MY GOODNESS I DISCOVERED A SECRET SMILEY IF YOU DO :)) IT MAKES :))

Well, not in a multiplayer game - by the time you get 12, the game will have been over a while ago.

eHalcyon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #79 on: March 29, 2015, 10:27:50 pm »
0

Unless the game is close to being over I think it's best to get all of the duchies.  It's easier to not get all of the duchies if you don't.

Also, check this out: Smileys are on, and I'm still able to say 8) 8)

PPE: OH MY GOODNESS I DISCOVERED A SECRET SMILEY IF YOU DO :)) IT MAKES :))

Darn it, I was catching up on this thread and I was going to do this before I saw your post!
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Polk5440

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #80 on: April 02, 2015, 12:11:31 pm »
+2

Workshop: Not just for gardening! It grabs cheap engine components, too.

Tunnel: Golds are not always good. At game's end, points are.

Great Hall: 1VP. Great Ironworks target. Scrying Pool likes it; Smithy doesn't.
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eHalcyon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #81 on: April 02, 2015, 01:45:51 pm »
+1

Workshop: Not just for gardening! It grabs cheap engine components, too.

Tunnel: Golds are not always good. At game's end, points are.

Great Hall: 1VP. Great Ironworks target. Scrying Pool likes it; Smithy doesn't.

I would drop the "1VP" because it is ambiguous in word count. ;)
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LastFootnote

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #82 on: April 02, 2015, 02:01:55 pm »
+4

Workshop: Not just for gardening! It grabs cheap engine components, too.

Tunnel: Golds are not always good. At game's end, points are.

Great Hall: 1VP. Great Ironworks target. Scrying Pool likes it; Smithy doesn't.

I would drop the "1VP" because it is ambiguous in word count. ;)

Great Hall: Combos with cards that care about type. That's it, really.
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Polk5440

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #83 on: April 02, 2015, 02:08:29 pm »
+1

Workshop: Not just for gardening! It grabs cheap engine components, too.

Tunnel: Golds are not always good. At game's end, points are.

Great Hall: 1VP. Great Ironworks target. Scrying Pool likes it; Smithy doesn't.

I would drop the "1VP" because it is ambiguous in word count. ;)

Hmmm. In that case:

Great Ironworks target. Scrying Pool likes it; Smithy does not.
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Polk5440

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #84 on: April 02, 2015, 02:32:09 pm »
+4

Secret Chamber: Doesn't stop you from gaining a Curse. Combos with Crossroads.

Saboteur: Usually a weak attack, but watch out for King's Court.

Governor: Get them all, gain Golds, draw big, remodel to Provinces.

Stash: An expensive Silver. Chancellor or Scavenger helps in weak kingdoms.
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JW

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #85 on: April 02, 2015, 04:54:46 pm »
+5

Ambassador: Rarely ignore. Get two. Return two coppers over one estate.

Following up on my previous formula:
Urchin: Rarely ignore. Three Urchins, two Mercenaries. Trash down, build engine.

Cultist: Rarely ignore, except Vineyards. Get lots. Easy on other terminals.

Rebuild: Rarely ignore, unless strong engine. Win Duchy split in mirror. 
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Voltaire

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #86 on: April 02, 2015, 05:36:07 pm »
+5

Hey, I'll try!

Thief - Usually weak. Can help opponent. Gets better with many players.
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Marcory

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #87 on: April 02, 2015, 07:49:07 pm »
0

Ruined Market Sometimes this is a key buy in engine games.
Ruined Library The second-best Ruin; tolerable when Throning it.
Abandoned Mine Might not be so bad with Double Tactician.
Ruined Village Best Ruin of all for Peddler and Conspirator.
Survivors Sets up Tunnels; Scout/Navigator engine, anyone?
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Willvon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #88 on: April 04, 2015, 11:37:24 pm »
0

Count: So many choices. Can't decide, but I do love trashing.
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Marcory

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #89 on: April 04, 2015, 11:43:28 pm »
0

Scavenger Deceptively strong. Plows through junked decks. Way better than Chancellor.
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Willvon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #90 on: April 04, 2015, 11:51:21 pm »
0

Courtyard: Hand is good this time, but even better next turn.

Bandit Camp: A village is great, but the Spoils really help later.

Worker's Village: A village is great, but another buy revs my engine.

Fishing Village: A village is great, but double village and coin, WOW!
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ephesos

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #91 on: April 05, 2015, 01:09:32 am »
0

Adventures!
Lost City: Strictly better Lab, but at what cost? Don't open.
Magpie: Lab for treasures, otherwise failed Wishing Wells that multiply themselves.
Hero: Good with Prosperity. Takes forever to get. Exchange for Champion?
Guide: Counters discard, Minion, and bad shuffle luck. Makes engines consistent.
Duplicate: Smuggle yourself, but controlled. Doesn't help you actually hit 6.
Coin of the Realm: Prevents terminal collision. Cheap, but needs buy. More consistent Village?
Amulet: JoaT choice on duration. Trasher with benefit when you don't.
Swamp Hag: Conditional Witch for cash. Sets up Madmen. Like Sea Hag?
Hireling: Instant Princed Ruined Library, but do you even want that?
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eHalcyon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #92 on: April 05, 2015, 01:23:34 am »
+4

Adventures!
Lost City: Strictly better Lab, but at what cost? Don't open.
Magpie: Lab for treasures, otherwise failed Wishing Wells that multiply themselves.
Hero: Good with Prosperity. Takes forever to get. Exchange for Champion?
Guide: Counters discard, Minion, and bad shuffle luck. Makes engines consistent.
Duplicate: Smuggle yourself, but controlled. Doesn't help you actually hit 6.
Coin of the Realm: Prevents terminal collision. Cheap, but needs buy. More consistent Village?
Amulet: JoaT choice on duration. Trasher with benefit when you don't.
Swamp Hag: Conditional Witch for cash. Sets up Madmen. Like Sea Hag?
Hireling: Instant Princed Ruined Library, but do you even want that?

Feels premature to do these.  The point of the summaries is to give succinct strategic advice, right?  It's probably too soon for anybody to give solid advice for these when most people haven't even played one game with them.

Hero especially doesn't work when most of us don't know what the other cards in the line do.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2015, 01:25:21 am by eHalcyon »
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swedenman

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #93 on: April 05, 2015, 05:00:59 am »
+2

Ruined Library The second-best Ruin

Um
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Flip5ide

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #94 on: April 05, 2015, 05:20:38 am »
+7

Scrying Pool

Bring a pillow. Open tabs. Open potion. Open sleeping pills.
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Willvon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #95 on: April 05, 2015, 10:57:33 am »
0

Bazaar: Village is great, but expensive for just extra coin.
City: Expensive village. Race to buy. Empty another pile - turbocharged.
Crossroads: Cheap village. Good late game, alt-victory cards. Actions only once.
Village: The one that started it all. Just don't become village idiot.
Mining Village: Village is great, but trashing for coins can win games.
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ehunt

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #96 on: April 05, 2015, 12:15:36 pm »
+4

duchess: if you'd take a free copper, consider a free duchess
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Allerseelen

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #97 on: April 05, 2015, 11:29:34 pm »
0

Moneylender: Solid, early spiking. Plan for mid-game trashing—except with Mountebank.
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Asper

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #98 on: April 06, 2015, 08:39:52 am »
+3

Coppersmith: Care to gamble for an early Prince or King's Court?
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eHalcyon

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Re: The 10 words card summary challenge
« Reply #99 on: April 06, 2015, 10:49:45 pm »
+5

City: Expensive village. Race to buy. Empty another pile - turbocharged.

I highly disagree with this one.  I'm finding City really difficult to sum up, but my best try is:

City: Ignorable unless pile(s) empty quickly.  Better with more players.  Groupthinky.


City is just an expensive village until a pile empties, which is not a trivial requirement.  It's often overestimated and highly susceptible to group-think; if everybody is going for Cities and they drain the pile quickly, of course it's going to matter.  But if only one player is going for Cities with no support (University, maybe?  Eh...) then their deck won't be doing much until 10+ turns later.  By the time they level up their Cities, the game is almost over.  And even then, the Cities aren't much better than a Lab if they haven't gotten other payloads to play with all their +actions.

Part of the group-think arises from the fact that groups often play with more than 2, in which case piles will empty more quickly.  Cities are thus better in multiplayer, which feeds into groupthink and makes Cities even better than they should be.

City is best if there is some other pile that is likely to run out and good payloads.  Run out Curses or Ruins, maybe, or a popular cheap pile like Peddler.  Use Cities to draw and play a bunch of Bridges or Goons, perhaps.

But yeah, that's a lot to summarize in 10 words.  It's not usually a "race to buy" card though.





On a more general note, I think a lot of the recent summaries are just that -- summaries of the card text themselves.  But just stating what the card does isn't helpful; I can just read the card itself for that.

(Edit: formatting)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2015, 12:36:40 am by eHalcyon »
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