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Author Topic: Embargo tokens on an empty pile  (Read 6765 times)

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Co0kieL0rd

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Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« on: March 13, 2015, 09:27:49 am »
+4

I haven't found a thread about this: Do Embargo tokens (or any kind of tokens) remain on a Supply pile even when it has been drained empty? I mean, it could happen that a card gets returned to that pile via Ambassador and everyone defends against it with Lighthouses and there are still Curses left in the Supply.
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Donald X.

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2015, 09:32:56 am »
+8

I haven't found a thread about this: Do Embargo tokens (or any kind of tokens) remain on a Supply pile even when it has been drained empty? I mean, it could happen that a card gets returned to that pile via Ambassador and everyone defends against it with Lighthouses and there are still Curses left in the Supply.
Embargo tokens remain on an empty pile.
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Co0kieL0rd

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2015, 09:46:10 am »
+3

I haven't found a thread about this: Do Embargo tokens (or any kind of tokens) remain on a Supply pile even when it has been drained empty? I mean, it could happen that a card gets returned to that pile via Ambassador and everyone defends against it with Lighthouses and there are still Curses left in the Supply.
Embargo tokens remain on an empty pile.

Thank you. And for that matter; can I put Embargo tokens on empty piles?
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Burning Skull

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2015, 10:03:56 am »
+4

Thank you. And for that matter; can I put Embargo tokens on empty piles?

Yes.

Flip5ide

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2015, 09:40:18 pm »
0

Thank you. And for that matter; can I put Embargo tokens on empty piles?

Yes.

How are you sure of this?
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pacovf

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2015, 10:11:33 pm »
+9

Thank you. And for that matter; can I put Embargo tokens on empty piles?

Yes.

How are you sure of this?

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Seprix

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2015, 11:52:58 pm »
0

I haven't found a thread about this: Do Embargo tokens (or any kind of tokens) remain on a Supply pile even when it has been drained empty? I mean, it could happen that a card gets returned to that pile via Ambassador and everyone defends against it with Lighthouses and there are still Curses left in the Supply.
Embargo tokens remain on an empty pile.

Thank you. And for that matter; can I put Embargo tokens on empty piles?

Obviously since you can't do it on Goko, you aren't allowed to in real life, because #GokoWasBetter
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ben_king

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2015, 01:48:31 am »
+2

Are you sure you can't do it on Goko?  I'm pretty sure I embargoed an empty pile the other day.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2015, 07:47:05 am »
+1

You absolutely can put Embargo tokens on an empty pile on Goko. I just did it.

Seprix

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2015, 10:01:19 am »
+3

Pretty sure you guys are playing Isotropic.
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Marcory

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2015, 12:27:02 am »
+3

Usually you would Embargo an empty pile because you only wanted to use Embargo for its coins. But . . . ***EDGE CASE ALERT***

. . . if you're really good, you can Embargo an empty pile, (say, Border Village), return a copy of that card to the supply with Ambassador, buy it again, topdeck the gained Curse with Watchtower, Scheme your Ambassador, and then Curse everyone else during your ensuing Outpost turn. This is especially good if you three-pile on your Outpost turn and win the game by the curses you Ambassadored.

(+1 to anyone who has actually done this).
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 12:29:03 am by Marcory »
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Seprix

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2015, 12:34:21 am »
+3

Usually you would Embargo an empty pile because you only wanted to use Embargo for its coins. But . . . ***EDGE CASE ALERT***

. . . if you're really good, you can Embargo an empty pile, (say, Border Village), return a copy of that card to the supply with Ambassador, buy it again, topdeck the gained Curse with Watchtower, Scheme your Ambassador, and then Curse everyone else during your ensuing Outpost turn. This is especially good if you three-pile on your Outpost turn and win the game by the curses you Ambassadored.

(+1 to anyone who has actually done this).

Twice.
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Dominionaer

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2015, 08:16:06 am »
0

. . . if you're really good, you can Embargo an empty pile, (say, Border Village), return a copy of that card to the supply with Ambassador, buy it again, topdeck the gained Curse with Watchtower, Scheme your Ambassador, and then Curse everyone else during your ensuing Outpost turn.

Why do you not Kings Court-ing the Ambassador in the Outpost turn?
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Watno

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2015, 08:30:24 am »
0

Because he doesn't have a King's court, obviously
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Simon (DK)

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2015, 08:40:48 am »
0

Usually you would Embargo an empty pile because you only wanted to use Embargo for its coins. But . . . ***EDGE CASE ALERT***

. . . if you're really good, you can Embargo an empty pile, (say, Border Village), return a copy of that card to the supply with Ambassador, buy it again, topdeck the gained Curse with Watchtower, Scheme your Ambassador, and then Curse everyone else during your ensuing Outpost turn. This is especially good if you three-pile on your Outpost turn and win the game by the curses you Ambassadored.

(+1 to anyone who has actually done this).

There is a big problem in this:
If you return Border Village with Ambassador and then buy it again, it means that the opponents have either Moat or Lighthouse. Otherwise they would have gotten it from the Ambassador attack.
But if they have Moat or Lighthouse, then you wont hit them when you Ambassador the Curse in your Outpost turn.

So you need an even bigger edge case: throw in a Minion or Pillage on your Outpost turn, so they reveal Moat to not gain Border Village, but they don't have it anymore when they gain Curses.
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Deadlock39

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2015, 10:00:34 am »
0

A Minion or Pillage that they choose not to use Moat on?

You can get a card back in the supply by returning two in a 2 player game, so I think that has to be your scenario. It is questionable due to the fact that you can just buy the curse, but I guess you get to trade a Border Village in for a card that costs less than it, so it isn't completely equivalent to buying the Curse.

Watno

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2015, 10:32:14 am »
+1

You can simply return 2 Border Villages
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faust

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2015, 11:25:23 am »
0

It also works if they have Trader in hand and you make them discard that. But its kinda hard to find a reason why you would reveal Trader to Border Village. (+1 to anyone who finds a scenario where it's optimal for you to ambassador 1 BV and for your opponent to reveal Trader to it) Another possibility is Vault, and they discard the Moat.
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Burning Skull

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2015, 11:56:21 am »
0

a scenario where it's optimal for you to ambassador 1 BV and for your opponent to reveal Trader to it

Player A has a points lead (the difference in points is less than 6). He has no money in hand. Two piles are empty, there is one BV in supply, and one Province in supply. So player A ambassadors one BV to end the game on piles. Player B has a Province hand, so he prevents piles from running by revealing trader, and he ends the game with a win on his next turn.

Edit: it doesnt actually work. Sorry. Too much beer.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 12:22:18 pm by Burning Skull »
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Simon (DK)

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Re: Embargo tokens on an empty pile
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2015, 01:11:06 pm »
0

Man I talk about a person forgetting attack reactions, and then I do it myself :)

Marcory talks about everyone else getting a Curse. I know everyone else can just be 1 person, but it'd be cool if it works with more.

I think Trader is a very good option here. The opponents choose to reveal it to the Border Village to try to prevent a 3 pile ending, and then you discard the Traders with Minion or Pillage.
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