Topic: Card design challenge - topdeck before draw (Read 6838 times)

werothegreat · « **on:** March 10, 2015, 05:51:03 pm »

Courtyard draws three cards, then topdecks a card. If it topdecked first, it would essentially just be +2 Cards without the topdecking part. The challenge for you, then: can you design a card that intentionally topdecks before drawing, and has a valid reason for doing so?

Awaclus · « **Reply #1 on:** March 10, 2015, 05:57:46 pm »

Does it have to be a good design? If not, then this will do:

Hot Air Balloon
$3 Action

Topdeck a card from your hand. Draw until you have 6 cards in hand. You may set aside any Action cards drawn this way, as you draw them; discard the set aside cards after you finish drawing.

liopoil · « **Reply #2 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:00:05 pm »

Woaaaah it's a watchtower-library hybrid!

TheOthin · « **Reply #3 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:17:34 pm »

My first thought was a Spy effect. Like Hot Air Balloon, it falls into the "maybe discard it instead of drawing it" category.

But what else? Maybe a Crossroads or Menagerie effect where you draw based on the contents of your hand.

Jimmmmm · « **Reply #4 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:28:19 pm »

Maybe topdeck then draw and reveal, and discard any duplicates?

pacovf · « **Reply #5 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:34:55 pm »

Quote

Lunatic
+1 Action
Put one card from your hand on top of your deck for every Lunatic in play.
+1 card per card in your hand.

Quote

Earl
Put one card from your hand on top of your deck.
Trash your hand.
+3 cards

Quote

Intern
+1 Action
Put two cards from your hand on top of your deck.
Set aside your hand. Draw one card per coin the cheapest set aside card costs.
Discard the set aside cards.

They are all pretty contrived though.

pst · « **Reply #6 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:36:11 pm »

Topdeck a card
Trash your hand
+5 cards

But of course there's no real reason the saved card couldn't be set aside instead.

liopoil · « **Reply #7 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:38:14 pm »

Quote from: pst on March 10, 2015, 06:36:11 pm

Topdeck a card
Trash your hand
+5 cards

But of course there's no real reason the saved card couldn't be set aside instead.

This is... too good to be balanced at any cost?

pubby · « **Reply #8 on:** March 10, 2015, 06:47:12 pm »

Minion Jr.
+1 Action
You may topdeck a card. If you do, discard your hand and draw 4 cards.

eHalcyon · « **Reply #9 on:** March 10, 2015, 07:31:35 pm »

Technically Satisfies the OP
$2 - Action
Put a card from your hand on top of you deck. Draw 3 cards from the bottom of your deck.

Edit:

Slightly more interesting version...

Charnel
$2 - Action
Put a card from your hand on top of your deck.
+3 Cards

While this is in play, when you would draw from the top of your deck, draw from the bottom instead.

Maybe also make it affect revealing cards, but as is, it does weird things with some cards like Wishing Well. Top-deckers are better at setting up your next turn with this card.

SCSN · « **Reply #10 on:** March 10, 2015, 08:08:23 pm »

Modern Lab

+1 Action. Topdeck a card. If you do, shuffle your drawpile, +3 Cards.

Medieval Doctor

You may topdeck a card. If you do, trash your drawpile, +1 Card.

Jimmmmm · « **Reply #11 on:** March 10, 2015, 08:12:47 pm »

Quote from: SheCantSayNo on March 10, 2015, 08:08:23 pm

You may topdeck a card. If you do, trash your drawpile, +1 Card.

Trash it, or place it in the trash?

SCSN · « **Reply #12 on:** March 10, 2015, 08:31:48 pm »

Just trash, so that e.g. Fortress ends up in your hand.

liopoil · « **Reply #13 on:** March 10, 2015, 09:00:24 pm »

Quote from: SheCantSayNo on March 10, 2015, 08:31:48 pm

Just trash, so that e.g. Fortress ends up in your hand.

I'm not sure that this works, just like the chancellor discard does not trigger tunnel.

eHalcyon · « **Reply #14 on:** March 10, 2015, 09:05:28 pm »

Quote from: liopoil on March 10, 2015, 09:00:24 pm

Quote from: SheCantSayNo on March 10, 2015, 08:31:48 pm
Just trash, so that e.g. Fortress ends up in your hand.
I'm not sure that this works, just like the chancellor discard does not trigger tunnel.

Chancellor doesn't trigger Tunnel because it says "put your deck into your discard pile" instead of "discard your deck". That's the only distinction between the two wordings Jimmmmm asked about. Just "trash" will trigger on-trash effects.

jomini · « **Reply #15 on:** March 10, 2015, 09:09:06 pm »

$5
Roulette wheel:

Place a card from your hand on top of your deck
Draw the top 5 cards:
If all cards are uniquely named, trash a card and discard the rest.
If there are two pairs of named cards, discard those four cards, and draw the remaining card.
Otherwise, draw the most commonly named card and return the rest to the top of your deck in any order.
+1 card, +1 action

liopoil · « **Reply #16 on:** March 10, 2015, 09:11:21 pm »

Quote from: eHalcyon on March 10, 2015, 09:05:28 pm

Quote from: liopoil on March 10, 2015, 09:00:24 pm
Quote from: SheCantSayNo on March 10, 2015, 08:31:48 pm
Just trash, so that e.g. Fortress ends up in your hand.
I'm not sure that this works, just like the chancellor discard does not trigger tunnel.

Chancellor doesn't trigger Tunnel because it says "put your deck into your discard pile" instead of "discard your deck". That's the only distinction between the two wordings Jimmmmm asked about. Just "trash" will trigger on-trash effects.

ahh, right. Still, it seems weird that you would have to look through your draw pile to resolve on-trash effects. Cool idea though, rewards deck tracking more than any other card.

Burning Skull · « **Reply #17 on:** March 11, 2015, 05:54:41 am »

Code: [Select]

Another Better Smithy, 5$
Look at your discard pile. You may put a card from your discard pile on the top of your deck.
+3 cards

Flip5ide · « **Reply #18 on:** March 11, 2015, 06:51:24 am »

Chicken Dinner
$3 Action

Place a card from your hand on top of your deck.
+3 cards
If you placed a card on top of your deck, +1 respect.

ephesos · « **Reply #19 on:** March 12, 2015, 12:42:56 pm »

Escort
Place a card from your hand on top of your deck.
You may play a card from your hand. If you did, +3 cards.

Escort chaining is prevented, but it is +3 Cards, +1 Action with a condition, so it's kind of like Menagerie. Also, if the Action you play is terminal, so is the rest of the chain, and it all has to be in your shrinking hand, since you don't get to draw until you resolve the whole stack. Villages make this really powerful though, as well as spammable cantrips. But hey, we have Scrying Pool.

eHalcyon · « **Reply #20 on:** March 12, 2015, 01:16:35 pm »

Quote from: ephesos on March 12, 2015, 12:42:56 pm

Escort
Place a card from your hand on top of your deck.
You may play a card from your hand. If you did, +3 cards.

Escort chaining is prevented, but it is +3 Cards, +1 Action with a condition, so it's kind of like Menagerie. Also, if the Action you play is terminal, so is the rest of the chain, and it all has to be in your shrinking hand, since you don't get to draw until you resolve the whole stack. Villages make this really powerful though, as well as spammable cantrips. But hey, we have Scrying Pool.

How is chaining prevented?

ephesos · « **Reply #21 on:** March 12, 2015, 11:16:19 pm »

Well, you can't chain an Escort to draw an Escort. So it's much less powerful than say Cultist.
You can chain them if they're all in your hand, but you lose the draw of the last one. So you really have to play 3 from your hand to get a significant benefit, or be able to end the chain with something else.
Also, you can't start your turn with more than 3 without durations to draw you more, since your hand size decreases as you play them.

xyz123 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 24, 2015, 04:04:04 pm »

I can think of a couple of possibilities.

1) The benefit you get depends on the type of card you topdeck.

For example.

Put a card in hour hand on top of your deck.

If it is a victory card + 3 cards
an action card + 3 actions
a treasure card + 3 coins

This might be too swingy though, some cards being very weak and others being very strong.

2) A variation on Taxman's attack.

Put a treasure card on top of your deck. Each other player discards a copy of it or reveals a hand with no matches. If no other player discarded the card you may put it back in your hand.

sudgy · « **Reply #23 on:** March 24, 2015, 05:25:54 pm »

Oh yeah, I had an Adventures dream recently where there was a card that I can't remember the name of but the picture was mostly Scout (maybe with a bit of Herald mixed in?) that said "+ 1 Buy. Honor your lord [note: like, the guy who rules over your land] by putting a card on top of your deck. +3 Cards."

EDIT: It cost $3 too.

ashersky · « **Reply #24 on:** March 24, 2015, 07:21:49 pm »

How about...

Quote

Card Name
$4 Action

+1 Action
Reveal your hand. Place up to 4 Victory Cards on top of your deck.
Reveal the top 4 cards of your deck. Put the revealed Victory cards into your hand. Put the other cards on top of your deck in any order.

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Author Topic: Card design challenge - topdeck before draw (Read 6838 times)