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[Simon (DK)]

Now I could get 200+ curses, could be improved with doctor overpay.

Starting hand is watchtower, talisman, horn of plenty.

Play talisman then horn of plenty gaining squire, trash it for cultist to draw talisman, horn of plenty, counterfeit. Repeat ten times and buy curses with 10 counterfeits and 10 tailsmans.

Nice, but doesn't that only give 11 buys * 11 Curses = 121 Curses?

[Awaclus]

Now I could get 200+ curses, could be improved with doctor overpay.

Starting hand is watchtower, talisman, horn of plenty.

Play talisman then horn of plenty gaining squire, trash it for cultist to draw talisman, horn of plenty, counterfeit. Repeat ten times and buy curses with 10 counterfeits and 10 tailsmans.

Nice, but doesn't that only give 11 buys * 11 Curses = 121 Curses?

You can Counterfeit a Counterfeit.

[Simon (DK)]

Now I could get 200+ curses, could be improved with doctor overpay.

Starting hand is watchtower, talisman, horn of plenty.

Play talisman then horn of plenty gaining squire, trash it for cultist to draw talisman, horn of plenty, counterfeit. Repeat ten times and buy curses with 10 counterfeits and 10 tailsmans.

Nice, but doesn't that only give 11 buys * 11 Curses = 121 Curses?

You can Counterfeit a Counterfeit.

Lol. I've done this so many times in my own posts, and then I forget it in yours
20buys * 11 Curses = 220 Curses.
You could overpay for a Doctor to trash 9 Catabombs, but that wouldn't be worth it using a buy on.

[Simon (DK)]

Now I could get 200+ curses, could be improved with doctor overpay.

Starting hand is watchtower, talisman, horn of plenty.

Play talisman then horn of plenty gaining squire, trash it for cultist to draw talisman, horn of plenty, counterfeit. Repeat ten times and buy curses with 10 counterfeits and 10 tailsmans.

I hate you so much right now (not really, just kidding). This method can be used to gain more Silvers than my solution had, and it's a much simpler solution.

[ephesos]

Now I could get 200+ curses, could be improved with doctor overpay.

Starting hand is watchtower, talisman, horn of plenty.

Play talisman then horn of plenty gaining squire, trash it for cultist to draw talisman, horn of plenty, counterfeit. Repeat ten times and buy curses with 10 counterfeits and 10 tailsmans.

Add in a few Ventures and Contraband, maybe? Also, start with a 5 card hand, so 2 more cards can be added.
Starting with 10 Talismans, 4 Counterfeits, 4 Contraband, and 4 Ventures in hand:
Counterfeit a Counterfeit(3 times) leaving 4 more Counterfeit plays
Counterfeit 4 Ventures, playing 6 Ventures, 6 Counterfeits(4 of which Counterfeit Contraband), and 2 Contrabands.
Playing Talisman 10 times, Venture 14 times, Counterfeit 13 times and Contraband 10 times, for a total of +23 buys and 67 coins. So 264 Curses.

Or, buy 253 Curses and a Doctor overpay by 64, trashing 10 Catacombs for 10 Curses and trashing 50 other cards. So 263 Curses, and Doctor overpay isn't really worth the extra buy when going for Curses.

For other puzzles:

Buy Estate 23 times for 46 coins, leaving a 20 overpay on Doctor trashing 10 HG, 10 Catacombs for a total of 253+40=293 Estates

Swap out a Contraband for a Trader, so down to 22 buys. Buy Curse 20 times revealing Trader, overpay Doctor by 32 trashing 10 HG, 10 Catacombs, and 12 Feoda, revealing Trader on the gained Doctors and Estates, overpay Masterpiece by 31 for 31 Silvers, revealing Trader on the gained Masterpieces, for a total of 220+76+41=337 Silvers. I think you can do better with Bank and Masterpiece, though.

[Simon (DK)]

Thanks to luser I can now get 422 Silvers with 0 actions:

Kingdom:
Black Market (contained Venture, Watchtower, Quarry and contains Young Witch)
Counterfeit (empty)
Tunnel
Doctor
Cultist
Feodum
Hunting Grounds
Contraband
Talisman (empty)
Horn of Plenty
Catacombs


Hand: Watchtower, Horn of Plenty, Counterfeit, Counterfeit and Quarry.
Play Quarry.
Counterfeit chain:
Play Counterfeit.

Do this 4 times:
Play Counterfeit.
Play Horn of Plenty, gain Cultist, trash with Watchtower, draw Counterfeit, Talisman and Contraband.
Play Horn of Plenty again, gain Cultist, trash with Watchtower, draw Counterfeit, Talisman and Horn of Plenty.

Play Counterfeit.
Play Horn of Plenty, gain Cultist, trash with Watchtower, draw Talisman, Contraband and Trader.
Play Horn of Plenty again, gain Cultist, trash with Watchtower, draw Talisman, Contraband and Venture.
Play 4 Counterfeits and 5 Contrabands.
End of Contraband chain.
Play Venture, discard 9 Tunnels, reveal Trader to get 9 Silvers, hit and play Contraband.
Play 10 Talismans.
Play Contraband.

Total: 65$ and 32 buys.

Buy Doctor, overpay by 36$ and trash 9 Feodums, 9 Hunting Grounds, 9 Catacombs (reshuffle) and discard 9 Tunnels. Apply Trader to the Estates and Golds to get Silvers instead. Total: 72 Silvers.
Buy 31 Curses, gain 10 copies for each Curse, apply Trader to all of them to get 31 * 11 = 341 Silvers.
Total: 422 Silvers.

Any ideas how to improve this?

[Simon (DK)]

By drawing Contraband instead of Trader and not buying Doctor, the same method can be used to gain 33 * 11 = 363 Curses.

[Simon (DK)]

I think you can do better with Bank and Masterpiece, though.

Philosopher's Stone is better than Bank.
Masterpiece isn't allowed.

[-Stef-]

Any ideas how to improve this?

You could look into gaining a Mandarin with Horn of Plenty at some point to replay your treasures later.

[TheOthin]

Any ideas how to improve this?

You could look into gaining a Mandarin with Horn of Plenty at some point to replay your treasures later.

Well, just the ones that weren't trashed.

But still, there might be something there... It really is on-gain, so you can trigger it while you're in the middle of playing Treasures and just keep playing them. That's brilliant.

[ghostofmars]

Any ideas how to improve this?

You could look into gaining a Mandarin with Horn of Plenty at some point to replay your treasures later.

Could somebody call CC to empty the supply without an action?

[Seprix]

All of this debate is intense. Wow. Just wow. You can do just about anything with no actions. So...


Let's up the ante. How many Colonies can you gain with no actions?

[Simon (DK)]

Any ideas how to improve this?

You could look into gaining a Mandarin with Horn of Plenty at some point to replay your treasures later.

I think this will work best with Mandarin instead of Contraband. I don't need the Contrabands to get buys when I can play the Counterfeits again. Doing this I should also look at putting Rats in the Kingdom instead of Catacombs for extra draw. It looks very promising.
There were also at least 1 other card I wanted Doctor to hit, but there weren't enough spots in the Kingdom. I can put 1 of each in the Black Market.
I'm going to bed now (it's way too late for me) and will look at it tomorrow.

[Simon (DK)]

All of this debate is intense. Wow. Just wow. You can do just about anything with no actions. So...


Let's up the ante. How many Colonies can you gain with no actions?

A lot. You can play a lot of inflated Philosopher's Stones to get a lot of money.

[liopoil]

Just how inflated can P-stone get again?

[Simon (DK)]

Just how inflated can P-stone get again?

I had a solution for 140 Silvers on the previous page that used Philosopher's Stone. I counted it at 68$, but that solution didn't allow for it to count treasure cards (other than the 10 gained Silvers), because I needed help from Venture to trigger a reshuffle. Adding Rats to the kingdom will also increase it a little.

[Awaclus]

Just how inflated can P-stone get again?

I had a solution for 140 Silvers on the previous page that used Philosopher's Stone. I counted it at 68$, but that solution didn't allow for it to count treasure cards (other than the 10 gained Silvers), because I needed help from Venture to trigger a reshuffle. Adding Rats to the kingdom will also increase it a little.

There is an unlimited supply of Estates, Curses, Silvers and now Colonies. Can't it get as inflated as you want?

[Davio]

We can just agree that you can play a single Treasure card which provides as much $ as you need.

The buys and gains from the Treasures are more important.

[Simon (DK)]

I didn't use enough time on it today to finish it, but I've found a great combo to start with that is only limited by the supply piles. This combo can be used for anything that requires a lot of buys and/or $:

Needed supply piles to make the combo:
Watchtower/Black Market
Quarry/Black Market
Counterfeit
Venture
Horn of Plenty
Rats
Cultist
Mandarin

Hand: Watchtower, 3 Counterfeits and Venture.
Play Counterfeit.

Loop:
Play Counterfeit.
Play Venture, hit all remaining Ventures except 1 and hit Quarry.
Play Venture again, hit Horn of Plenty, gain Rats, trash with Watchtower, draw Horn of Plenty.
Trash Venture.
Play Counterfeit.
Play Horn of Plenty, gain Cultist, trash with Watchtower, draw 2 Counterfeits and a Venture.
Play Horn of Plenty again, gain Mandarin, put all treasures on top of your deck.


This can be done 10 times. If the supply piles were infinite, it would be possible to continue it infinitely.

The plan for my Silvers solution now is to start with this a lot of times. Then move on to gaining Rats with Counterfeited Horn of Plentys to get some more draw.

[silverspawn]

I thought this combo was a known thing. well, I've heard of it before at least.

[Davio]

Mandarin / HoP is a known thing, but it has never been worked out to this extent.

[liopoil]

I made a puzzle a year ir two ago - most coins fron only treasure. that used HoP/Cultist/mandarin

[Seprix]

Let's try something else then.

How many Estates can you gain using only one action, and one special treasure? The definition of a Special Treasure is any treasure with words on it that require you to do something or can do something like it is an action/reaction card.

All Special Treasures:
(Diadem, Spoils, Fool's Gold, Loan, Masterpiece, Philosopher's Stone, Quarry, Talisman, Cache, Contraband, Counterfeit, Horn of Plenty, Ill-Gotten Gains, Royal Seal, Stash, Venture, Hoard, and Bank)

Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Potion, and Harem are not Special Treasures.

You can still buy special Treasure if it gives you usages (such as Masterpiece), but only one special treasure can be in your deck at the start of your turn.

A second rule is that you MUST USE the Treasure in question. If you say you're doing the Ill-Gotten Gains treasure but don't actually use it, it isn't the best possible combination with that card. It must not only be in your deck, but you must also use it. I recognize that a lot of the cards will have the same solution, but with a plethora of action cards to choose from, this could be an interesting thing to try for at least a few solutions.

What would be cool is the best combo that you can possibly do with each Special Treasure.

I'll try it out in a second.

[Seprix]

Diadem

Hand: Squire, Watch Tower, Diadem, Platinum, Platinum

Play Squire as +2 Buys. Play Diadem and Platinums for $13. (Not +1$ for Watchtower, since Diadem works with Actions, not Action Cards). Buy two HG and trash for 6 Estates.

Spoils

Hand: Squire, Watch Tower, Spoils, Platinum, Platinum

Play Squire as +2 Buys. Play Spoils and Platinums for $14. Buy and trash out HG for +6 Estates and +1 Estate buy. I feel like this is going to be all of them pretty much.

Fool's Gold

Hand: Squire, Watch Tower, Fool's Gold, Platinum, Platinum

Play Squire as +2 Buys. Play Fool's Gold and Platinums for $12. Buy and trash out HG for +6 Estates. Eh.

Loan

Same as Fools Gold.

Masterpiece

Same as Fool's Gold.

Philosopher's Stone

With this, you can theoretically use Squire and buy up to 3 HG to trash for +9 Estates.

Quarry

You can buy 3 HG for +9, which seems to be the limit for most of these cards.

Cache

Same as Spoils.

Contraband

Extra buy on Contraband can be used with Margrave to draw enough money to get 3 HG to trash.

Counterfeit

Squire +Buy, Counterfeit the Platinum for a +3Buy and $21. That's 3 HG and an Estate. 10 Estates.

Horn of Plenty

This could be used for an extra Estate gain, but not HG without using Margrave for the extra +Buy.

Ill-Gotten Gains

Same as Fool's Gold.

Royal Seal

Same as Diadem.

Stash

Same as Diadem.

Venture

Extra Platinum doesn't matter, same as Fool's Gold.

Hoard

Same as Diadem.

Bank

Extra money doesn't matter all that much, still only a +HG gain.

Or you could just overpay Doctor by +20 with the hand of x4 Platinum and Special Treasure with almost every single card to trash every single HG and Catacombs for a total of 40 Estates plus or minus a few Estates, depending on your Special Treasure's cost and
buy count.

While showcasing Counterfeit's power, overall, this absolutely sucks. No real fun. There has to be a way to just have a different strategy with every single Treasure Card without having more or less the same strategy with every card.

Hrm.. Silver Gain would be better to try out, but it would be the same thing with every Treasure. This is quite the dilemma. Ugh.