Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[sudgy]

(you can tell what expansion I'm working on in my program)

Alright, so whether a Duration stays out is always confusing.  Here are all of my questions (I think I have the answers but I'm just making sure):

1. All Durations other than Haven, Tactician, and Outpost under any circumstances stay out, right?
2. For all of those Durations, Throne Room always stays with them, right?
3. If you play Haven with no cards in hand or deck/discard, you don't put a card on the Haven, it get's discarded like normal, right?
4. If you play Throne Room with Haven with one card left in your hand/deck/discard and are only able to put one card on the Haven, the Haven stays out but the Throne Room doesn't, right?
5. If you play Throne Room on Tactician, the Tactician stays out but the Throne Room doesn't, right?
6. Same thing with Outpost?

[LastFootnote]

That all seems correct, but I think #1 is a weird thing to specifically ask. It's just: does this card set up an effect for a later turn? If so, it stays out. Otherwise, it doesn't.

[sudgy]

That all seems correct, but I think #1 is a weird thing to specifically ask. It's just: does this card set up an effect for a later turn? If so, it stays out. Otherwise, it doesn't.

Well, it's more for the program I'm making.  If there's never a time Wharf doesn't stay out, do I need to bother in my program trying to check if Wharf needs to stay?  At the part that checks whether or not to discard the Durations it will first see if it's one of those three cards.

[LastFootnote]

That all seems correct, but I think #1 is a weird thing to specifically ask. It's just: does this card set up an effect for a later turn? If so, it stays out. Otherwise, it doesn't.

Well, it's more for the program I'm making.  If there's never a time Wharf doesn't stay out, do I need to bother in my program trying to check if Wharf needs to stay?  At the part that checks whether or not to discard the Durations it will first see if it's one of those three cards.

I guess it seems better if you just do that as part of playing the card? Have it do this-turn effects, then set a flag on the card for it to stay out if it's going to do something on a future turn. Definitely don't make the next-turn effect dependent on the card being in play.

I don't know how your program works, so this is all just guesswork.

[Asper]

6. Same thing with Outpost?

Shouldn't TR stay out to show that you only draw three cards at the end of your extra turn? It's still playing Outpost twice, and while Outpost has no effect on the next turn, it has one on the turn it's played the second time.

[LastFootnote]

6. Same thing with Outpost?

Shouldn't TR stay out to show that you only draw three cards at the end of your extra turn? It's still playing Outpost twice, and while Outpost has no effect on the next turn, it has one on the turn it's played the second time.

If you Throne Room Outpost on a normal turn, it tells you to only draw 3 cards in this turn's Clean-up phase twice. The second play doesn't stack. It does not reach into next turn's Clean-up phase.

If you Throne Room Outpost on an Outpost turn, it tells you to only draw 3 cards in this turn's Clean-up phase twice. The second play doesn't stack. It does not reach into next turn's Clean-up phase.

Either way, the Throne Room isn't doing anything and shouldn't stay in play.

[sudgy]

Another question: If I've Throne Roomed a Duration, next turn I can choose to resolve it once, then another card (say a Princed forced-trasher), then back to the second time resolving it, right?

[sudgy]

Also, is there any start-of-turn effect other than Prince that you care about the order you do them in?

[silverspawn]

Also, is there any start-of-turn effect other than Prince that you care about the order you do them in?

no

can't answer the first question.

[PSGarak]

Another thing to consider: Chained TR/KC + Durations.

From what I understand, if you TR a TR and play one duration and one non-duration, then one TR stays out and one gets collected at end of turn. But if you TR a TR and play two different durations, then both TRs stay out. If you KC a KC (or TR), and two or more KCs play durations, then both KCs stay out. Do not neglect to consider the case of triple-(or-greater)-TR, and also do not neglect that duration leaf nodes may occur at different tree depths.

[sudgy]

I thought I remember hearing that just the latest TR/KC stays out...  Is there anywhere Donald says what you said?

[amalloy]

Another thing to consider: Chained TR/KC + Durations.

From what I understand, if you TR a TR and play one duration and one non-duration, then one TR stays out and one gets collected at end of turn. But if you TR a TR and play two different durations, then both TRs stay out. If you KC a KC (or TR), and two or more KCs play durations, then both KCs stay out. Do not neglect to consider the case of triple-(or-greater)-TR, and also do not neglect that duration leaf nodes may occur at different tree depths.

This is nonsense. In both of your first two examples, only one TR stays out. The rule is that KCs and TRs only stay out if they directly played a duration card. If you play KC 1 on KC 2, it doesn't matter what KC 2 does: KC 1 will never be left out in the duration area.

[AJD]

Another question: If I've Throne Roomed a Duration, next turn I can choose to resolve it once, then another card (say a Princed forced-trasher), then back to the second time resolving it, right?

Right.

[ConMan]

Another question: If I've Throne Roomed a Duration, next turn I can choose to resolve it once, then another card (say a Princed forced-trasher), then back to the second time resolving it, right?

I'd say yes, because back on your previous turn you played the Duration twice, which created two separate "At the start of your next turn" effects, so by that point it's functionally as though you played two separate cards.

[GendoIkari]

Wait a minute here...

1. Outpost always stays out under any circumstances, doesn't it? Even if it can't let you take an extra turn, because you've already had 2 turns in a row, Outpost still stays out to remind you to draw 3 cards instead of 5. So only Haven and Tactician have the possibility of not staying out, don't they?

2. I thought a Throne Room that was used to play a Duration would always stay out, even if the second play of the Duration doesn't have an additional effect (TR+Tactician)? Has Donald said otherwise; that with TR+Tactician the Throne Room doesn't stay out?

[florrat]

1. The first Outpost during your turn always stays out, indeed. If you play two Outposts in the same turn, I have no idea whether it stays out (apparently not according to others). I can imagine both: the second outpost does have an effect (draw 3 instead of 5 cards), but that effects happens to coincide with another effect, so it's not really an extra effect.

2. Yes, Donald has specifically said that with TR + Tactician, the TR doesn't stay out, since the second play of Tactician didn't have an effect.

[Donald X.]

1. The first Outpost during your turn always stays out, indeed. If you play two Outposts in the same turn, I have no idea whether it stays out (apparently not according to others). I can imagine both: the second outpost does have an effect (draw 3 instead of 5 cards), but that effects happens to coincide with another effect, so it's not really an extra effect.

Outpost doesn't have enough information to ever go away early, even barring the hand size thing; the check for "would this be a 3rd consecutive turn" happens right when that turn is about to happen, which is after we already failed to discard Outpost. It could be that some other card (e.g. Possession) caused an extra turn for someone else to happen that squeezed in-between and allowed both Outpost turns to happen.

Tactician meanwhile already "knows" that it won't do anything later if you didn't discard any cards - no future event was set up. Throne Room goes away if it's not actually representing something extra to happen later, and this is addressed in the rulebook, albeit tersely.

[florrat]

So all Outposts always stay out, and all Throne Rooms which played an Outpost also always stay out.

[Donald X.]

So all Outposts always stay out, and all Throne Rooms which played an Outpost also always stay out?

It's tempting to edit your post so that's a period. Yes, since Outpost always stays out, Throne on one must also.

[florrat]

It's tempting to edit your post so that's a period.

Ok 

[Simon (DK)]

So all Outposts always stay out, and all Throne Rooms which played an Outpost also always stay out?

It's tempting to edit your post so that's a period. Yes, since Outpost always stays out, Throne on one must also.

If you played more than 1 Outpost in a turn, or Throne Roomed (or King's Courted or Processioned) an Outpost, will it be cleaned up in the Outpost turn, or will it stay out and only draw 3 cards in the clean up phase in the Outpost turn?

[zporiri]

(you can tell what expansion I'm working on in my program)
1. All Durations other than Haven, Tactician, and Outpost under any circumstances stay out, right?

Unless someone plays a scheme and chooses to put it on top of their deck

[sudgy]

(you can tell what expansion I'm working on in my program)
1. All Durations other than Haven, Tactician, and Outpost under any circumstances stay out, right?

Unless someone plays a scheme and chooses to put it on top of their deck

Ah, right.  Then the effect still happens, but the Throne Room will be discarded if you played a Throne Room on it, right?

[AJD]

(you can tell what expansion I'm working on in my program)
1. All Durations other than Haven, Tactician, and Outpost under any circumstances stay out, right?

Unless someone plays a scheme and chooses to put it on top of their deck

Scheme does not affect how long a Duration card remains in play.

[sudgy]

(you can tell what expansion I'm working on in my program)
1. All Durations other than Haven, Tactician, and Outpost under any circumstances stay out, right?

Unless someone plays a scheme and chooses to put it on top of their deck

Scheme does not affect how long a Duration card remains in play.

Oh, right, Scheme can't choose first-turn durations.  I forgot about that.