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Author Topic: Homage to the Best Card  (Read 2289150 times)

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Minotaur

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5375 on: September 09, 2015, 12:22:37 am »
+3



And the cards in RBCI aren't even bad anymore...
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5376 on: September 25, 2015, 01:33:17 pm »
+19

« Last Edit: September 25, 2015, 03:10:10 pm by UmbrageOfSnow »
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Elanchana

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5377 on: September 27, 2015, 12:58:01 pm »
+19

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5378 on: October 12, 2015, 12:17:07 pm »
+4

"You can discard those Coppers, I don't have Masquerade in hand"



"Don't bother banning Province, I don't even have $8"



"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"

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GendoIkari

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5379 on: October 12, 2015, 12:27:14 pm »
+6

"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"


See, the first 2 are a good example of fair bluffing in Dominion... but I'm pretty sure that I would call this one flat-out cheating. What cards someone just gained should be public knowledge, and if playing with Smugglers, then that question should have to be answered honestly. Otherwise Smugglers cannot be legally played correctly.
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qmech

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5380 on: October 12, 2015, 01:31:35 pm »
+9

"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"

See, the first 2 are a good example of fair bluffing in Dominion... but I'm pretty sure that I would call this one flat-out cheating. What cards someone just gained should be public knowledge, and if playing with Smugglers, then that question should have to be answered honestly. Otherwise Smugglers cannot be legally played correctly.

Sure, now all you want to do is play Smugglers correctly.  But if we start answering questions honestly, where does it end?  Full text logs?  Deck trackers?  Sometimes you have to draw a line in the sand.
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A Drowned Kernel

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5381 on: October 12, 2015, 03:51:30 pm »
+2

"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"


See, the first 2 are a good example of fair bluffing in Dominion... but I'm pretty sure that I would call this one flat-out cheating. What cards someone just gained should be public knowledge, and if playing with Smugglers, then that question should have to be answered honestly. Otherwise Smugglers cannot be legally played correctly.

I suppose you could say that once Smugglers has been played, then you have to honestly answer what cards your opponent gain, but if your opponent is asking before they played the Smugglers "what did you gain last turn," then you're not necessarily obligated to answer honestly or at all. I'm not advocating playing this way, you're being kind of a dick if you do, but I don't see why that would be illegal.
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GwinnR

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5382 on: October 12, 2015, 04:03:27 pm »
0

"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"

See, the first 2 are a good example of fair bluffing in Dominion... but I'm pretty sure that I would call this one flat-out cheating. What cards someone just gained should be public knowledge, and if playing with Smugglers, then that question should have to be answered honestly. Otherwise Smugglers cannot be legally played correctly.

Sure, now all you want to do is play Smugglers correctly.  But if we start answering questions honestly, where does it end?  Full text logs?  Deck trackers?  Sometimes you have to draw a line in the sand.
There is a big difference between the Smuggler and your decktracking examples! You don't NEED to know which cards you have in you draw pile or elsewhre, to play the game right and with correct rules. So there is no NEED to answer that questions.
But if you play a Smuggler and don't get a (correct) answer of which your opponent bought last turn, this is against the rules. Smuggler says you HAVE TO get that card, no matter if you want it, your opponent wants it or if someone answers a question (correctly).
So at least after playing the Smuggler it is the only way to play correctly. So in my opinion, you should say it before, even if it is no nessecary to play it correct, but it is a small step between asking and playing the Smuggler.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5383 on: October 12, 2015, 04:54:43 pm »
+5

"I didn't gain anything last turn so there's no point playing Smugglers"


See, the first 2 are a good example of fair bluffing in Dominion... but I'm pretty sure that I would call this one flat-out cheating. What cards someone just gained should be public knowledge, and if playing with Smugglers, then that question should have to be answered honestly. Otherwise Smugglers cannot be legally played correctly.

I suppose you could say that once Smugglers has been played, then you have to honestly answer what cards your opponent gain, but if your opponent is asking before they played the Smugglers "what did you gain last turn," then you're not necessarily obligated to answer honestly or at all. I'm not advocating playing this way, you're being kind of a dick if you do, but I don't see why that would be illegal.

Well the thing is that playing most games IRL, including Dominion, relies upon open communication for the purposes of knowing the gamestate. Players shouldn't be required to carefully watch and track each movement that their opponents make; this would slow games down greatly. Instead, I expect to be able to use communication to find out what my opponent just did.

Like, if he buys a Death Cart, I'd much rather he just honestly answer "which ruins did you get" (if I care to know) than to take the time to grab one, wait until everyone who cares has had a chance to remember what's there, then grab the next. Or in this or any other game, if I want to know how many cards someone has in his hand, I'd rather be able to ask and get an honest answer than to be expected to take the time to make sure he's holding them in such a way that doesn't hide the number, then count them myself. To be more general, IRL gaming is a mostly social experience; people may be chatting about stuff while waiting for a player to take his turn. If he uses his buy while an opponent happened to not be paying attention, then he should be required to tell people what he bought. Perhaps a tournament setting would be different.
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Minotaur

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5384 on: October 12, 2015, 11:49:45 pm »
0

Great, so now Speed Dominion is going to be a thing.  Dominion full-deck Monte.....
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5385 on: October 13, 2015, 12:59:07 am »
+4

I use a home stenographer to keep track of the game state when I play in real life.

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5386 on: October 13, 2015, 10:43:14 am »
+2

This discussion is exactly why i dislike Treasure Hunter. I mean, i can keep in mind that the best card i can smuggle was a Lab, but how many Spoils my opponent marauded, how many Silvers he hunted, how many Coppers and Golds are in his Treasure Trove and how many Farmlands he remodelled into Provinces? For a card i mostly play so Warrior the worst card ever can't trash it? Mandatorily...? It's almost as if the Page line wasn't bad enough allready.
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5387 on: October 13, 2015, 10:47:16 am »
0

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5388 on: October 13, 2015, 10:48:09 am »
+2

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5389 on: October 13, 2015, 10:50:35 am »
0

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?

Well, they don't for Smugglers.  Or wait, can you Smuggle a Graverobbed card?
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GwinnR

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5390 on: October 13, 2015, 10:56:21 am »
+2

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?

Well, they don't for Smugglers.  Or wait, can you Smuggle a Graverobbed card?
I think you can Smuggle a Graverobbed card.
"Gain" meens "take from the Supply". If your opponent gained a card, which is not in the Supply, Smuggler can't gain it, because it doesn't say "from the [non-Supply]-pile".
A Graverobbed card is gained from the trash, so it is gained. And as there is a Supply-pile, where Smuggler finds this card, he should gain it too.
Treasure Hunter is only counting tha cards, your opponent gained, so there is no problem, such as with Smuggler.
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Asper

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5391 on: October 13, 2015, 11:12:17 am »
+3

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?

Well, they don't for Smugglers.  Or wait, can you Smuggle a Graverobbed card?

Rules question: If i unintentionally Golem my Smugglers after my opponent played Marauder and bought a Curse, can i try to gain a Spoils and fail? I assume the answer is yes.

Edit: According to the Wiki, you can choose to gain a card even though it is from an empty pile. So probably this should work, too...? It's also interesting to note that Workshop doesn't let you choose an empty pile.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2015, 04:30:09 pm by Asper »
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GendoIkari

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5392 on: October 13, 2015, 11:46:01 am »
0

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?

Well, they don't for Smugglers.  Or wait, can you Smuggle a Graverobbed card?

Of course you can... Smugglers tells you to gain a copy of a card that your opponent gained... a Graverobbed card is in every way a card that your opponent gained, and if it's a Supply card, then there's no trouble gaining a copy of it.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5393 on: October 13, 2015, 11:49:01 am »
+2

Do non-Supply cards gained count for Treasure Hunter?  What about cards gained from the trash?

They both count. Why wouldn't they?

Well, they don't for Smugglers.  Or wait, can you Smuggle a Graverobbed card?

Rules question: If i unintentionally Golem my Smugglers after my opponent played Marauder and bought a Curse, can i try to gain a Spoils and fail? I assume the answer is yes.

Edit: According to the Wiki, you can choose to gain a card even though it is from an empty pile. So probably this should works, too...? It's also interesting to note that Workshop doesn't let you choose an empty pile.

This one is tricky. I remember the discussion where Donald clarified that you can choose an empty pile for Smugglers but not for Workshop. It's because with Smugglers, the instruction is basically "choose any card your opponent gained last turn. Gain a copy of the chosen card." With Workshop, the instruction is basically  "choose a non-empty Supply pile where the card on top costs up to $4. Gain the top card of that pile."

I'm inclined to agree with you; you could choose a non-supply card and fail to gain it. Not sure though.
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Donald X.

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5394 on: October 13, 2015, 05:57:14 pm »
+6

This one is tricky. I remember the discussion where Donald clarified that you can choose an empty pile for Smugglers but not for Workshop. It's because with Smugglers, the instruction is basically "choose any card your opponent gained last turn. Gain a copy of the chosen card." With Workshop, the instruction is basically  "choose a non-empty Supply pile where the card on top costs up to $4. Gain the top card of that pile."

I'm inclined to agree with you; you could choose a non-supply card and fail to gain it. Not sure though.
Workshop in fact is "choose a physical card visible in the supply costing up to $4." You do not choose a pile or check a pile for emptiness.

Smugglers meanwhile starts with choosing a card the player to your right gained.
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5395 on: October 22, 2015, 04:39:54 pm »
+9

When someone Swindles one of your key cards

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5396 on: October 24, 2015, 03:19:57 pm »
+16

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5397 on: October 26, 2015, 11:28:13 am »
+4

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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5398 on: October 26, 2015, 11:53:46 am »
+9



From:
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Re: Homage to the Best Card
« Reply #5399 on: October 26, 2015, 12:11:55 pm »
+3

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