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Author Topic: Kingdom from card pool  (Read 2436 times)

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market squire

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Kingdom from card pool
« on: October 23, 2014, 06:28:22 pm »
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Hello everybody! :)

As there are many cards in Dominion (and we'll get even more, yay!), the chance gets bigger and bigger to get stupid/ uninteresting kingdoms. Like, 10 Villages or so, you know.
I would like to share with you my idea to generate Dominion kingdoms with smaller card pools that have a theme to push the game into a specific direction.


The card pools are, for now:

Beginner.
Simple cards without hard decision-making.
Cantrips.
All around cards that replace themselves and the top of the deck.
Copper.
Cards from this pool benefit from Copper.
Slog.
Build up a huge pile!
Money.
For quick games using Big Money.
Chains.
For long games using Action chains.
Buys.
Cards that make buying decisions more interesting.
Curses.
You'll get cursed and need to find the best way to live with it.
Attacks.
The interaction pool: Attacking, defending, and supporting.
Sifting.
Sifters and cards that play well with them.
Combo.
Cards that you want to collide with each other (or other cards).
Cost.
Playing with the cost - trash for benefit.
Trash.
Cards that care about trashing.
Power cards.
A meetup of all the really strong cards.


I won't list all the card pools in detail, but you can see them in my Excel Kingdom Generator.
This has been some work for me over a few years, but it was quite easy to translate it in English.
So here you can download the Excel Sheet.
I don't know if your program manages to read German formulas, but my Excel translates English as well. So please ask if it doesn't work for you.

How to use:
  • All colored cells have a dropdown list for you to choose from. Choose a card pool and the sets you own. You may also scroll down and choose single cards that must (or mustn't) be in the kingdom.
  • If you want to play irl, just print out the kingdom (2 kingdoms per sheet).
  • For online play, there is a big cell with all the names in the whole kingdom. Just copy its content and put it into the Salvager Kingdom Generator.
  • To generate a new kingdom, refresh with F9.

The basic document (a normal kingdom generator) was from BGG and has been tweaked by many authors since then.
If you like to change formulas and things, some columns are hidden and some cells have white text.

How it works:
  • Each card gets a random number, the 10 highest numbers will be the kingdom.
  • Some numbers will get modified if you picked "yes"/"no" for it or its set.
  • The numbers are also modified by the chosen card pool. Normally, they are just multiplied by 0 or 1. Some pools have specific requirements (e.g. "Curses" wants at least one Curser), then it will be multiplied by a huge number.
  • There is an extra table to determine a Bane card, but it will only appear if Young Witch is in the Kingdom. Modifications have the same effect here.
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market squire

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2014, 11:29:33 am »
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No interest here?

Do you prefer just playing random sets? The card pools don't give you obvious strategies. They are designed to generate interesting kingdoms with different ways to go for, even if they sometimes use the same basic strategy (like, "make Copper useful").

I encourage you to download the file and have a look at it.
I'd really like to learn what you think about such card pools. Also, the card pools themselves are not carved in stone.

Or does the file not work for you?
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KingZog3

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2014, 12:30:29 pm »
+1

How much more interesting will this be than full random? Completely random kingdoms are inteesting in that you could have a board with no obvious strategy and you need to make the best of it. If all kingdoms had a village, a draw card, and attack etc... then games would get more and more similar.

I don't think this is a terrible idea though.
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Awaclus

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2014, 01:29:49 pm »
+2

I downloaded the file, tried it a dozen times, and it kept giving me Great Hall and Scout.
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Hydrad

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2014, 01:33:05 pm »
+2

I downloaded the file, tried it a dozen times, and it kept giving me Great Hall and Scout.

But the combo!
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market squire

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2014, 01:55:30 pm »
+1

I downloaded the file, tried it a dozen times, and it kept giving me Great Hall and Scout.

But the combo!
What a random happenstance!

I guess the chances for a specific combo are just much bigger in such a card pool.

If you don't like these cards, you have at least 4 options:
You can "no" them in the list.
You can change the card pool (the 0s and 1s in the "cantrip" column).
You can cry and destroy the computer.
You can choose another card pool.
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enfynet

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2014, 03:24:55 pm »
+1

I selected "No" for Base Set and Intrigue and kept getting cards from those sets.

Edit: I also used formatting to highlight the sets by color, for easier visual reference.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2014, 03:38:33 pm by enfynet »
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market squire

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2014, 03:58:51 am »
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I selected "No" for Base Set and Intrigue and kept getting cards from those sets.

Edit: I also used formatting to highlight the sets by color, for easier visual reference.
Oups, i messed up with the order of the cards, which means the cards didn't match to their proper expansions. Now everything should be right.

I didn't like to use too much color in the sheet to keep it plain and simple to understand.


Edit: I added a Black Market deck (just for people who like to have a specific deck irl).
Also, the Promos are now all at the top of the list because they shall be easy to find.
All cards in the list got their text (as mouseover comment)! This mostly dates back from the BGG file.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2014, 09:40:06 am by market squire »
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market squire

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Re: Kingdom from card pool
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2014, 05:29:43 pm »
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To give you some better idea of how this works, I will now give you a card list as an example.


But before I do, just a clarification:
If all kingdoms had a village, a draw card, and attack etc... then games would get more and more similar.
This is not how the card pools work. They are intended to be something like "flexible kingdoms" - you don't need all the sets to play them. Randomness is just scaled down by using not all the cards during setup. Few pools need a specific card to work, but most of them don't (as the following).


This is card pool no. 2, "Cantrips". Its theme is, as already mentioned, cards with +card +action, but also about the order of the top cards of the deck.

What do you think about this card pool? Is the theme too restrictive for strategies? Also, which cards would you change?
Do you think games using such card pools could be better (more fun) than full random?

Base Set
Cellar
Workshop
Bureaucrat
Spy
Laboratory
Market

Intrigue
Great Hall
Shanty Town
Wishing Well
Conspirator
Ironworks
Scout
Minion

Seaside
Pearl Diver
Lookout
Caravan
Ghost Ship
Treasury

Alchemy
Vineyard
Apothecary
Scrying Pool
Familiar

Prosperity (no Platinum/ Colony)
Talisman
Quarry
Grand Market
King's Court
Peddler

Cornucopia
Hamlet
Fortune Teller
Menagerie
Horn of Plenty
Hunting Party

Hinterland
Crossroads
Oasis
Scheme
Cartographer
Haggler
Highway
Stables

Dark Ages (no Shelters)
Vagrant
Market Square
Sage
Urchin
Ironmonger
Band of Misfits
Junk Dealer
Mystic

Guilds
Candlestick Maker
Advisor
Herald
Baker

Promo
Governor
Prince
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