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[2.71828.....]

The speculation doesn't seem to be quite as good this time as with previous expansions. It may be because all the best speculators ended up being play testers and are now sworn to secrecy ...

What did the groundless speculation look like last time? I think it only really picked up when the name of the set was announced.

yeah, I mean, we aren't going to see this set for another 6 months at least I would assume.  There is plenty of time for further speculation to get "better"

[Polk5440]

I am hoping there won't be new token types or new mats.

[Awaclus]

I had a dream about a couple of new cards. One card was something like this:

$3 Action
+1 Action
Take a X token (the token had a name, but I forgot what it was). You may spend any number of X tokens. For each token spent, look at the top card of your deck and discard it or put it back. (I think it could have also had the option to trash the card?)

The other was a $5 Action with +1 card and +$1, and it did something else too, but I don't remember what it was. It had two words in its name, but I also forgot what those words were.

[silverspawn]

dreams about new card are awesome

[jsh357]

Well, Jay finally revealed it today so I can talk about it.

Dominion's moved away from the typical board game format and participating in an experimental new method of delivery: cards being inserted directly in to dreams.  You'll see the new cards gradually appear and be able to play with them in an idealistic environment, greatly improving your experience.

News article here: http://riograndegames.com/getMedia/89

[enfynet]

Well, Jay finally revealed it today so I can talk about it.

Dominion's moved away from the typical board game format and participating in a experimental new method of delivery: cards being inserted directly in to dreams.  You'll see the new cards gradually appear and be able to play with them in an idealistic environment, greatly improving your experience.

News article here: http://riograndegames.com/getMedia/89

That's pretty impressive. No wonder they did so much play testing with fds members.

[Axxle]

$3 Action
+1 Action
Take a X token (the token had a name, but I forgot what it was). You may spend any number of X tokens. For each token spent, look at the top card of your deck and discard it or put it back. (I think it could have also had the option to trash the card?)

With an ability like that? Must be the Bomb tokens.

[ashersky]

Dim Onion: Anagrams


Confirmed: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=5799.msg432848#msg432848

[eHalcyon]

Dim Onion: Anagrams


Confirmed: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=5799.msg432848#msg432848

Hornet Moor
$4 - Action
Play an action card from your hand.  After resolving it, play it again.

Iron Captors
$4 - Action
If this is neither the first nor the second Action you've played this turn: +1 Card; +1 Action; +$2.  Otherwise, +$2.

Eager Mine
$3 - Action
+1 Card; +1 Action.
Reveal your hand.  If ever card revealed is differently named, +2 Cards.

Graph Creator
$5 - Action
+1 Card; +1 Action.
Set aside your hand.  +4 cards.  You may put any number of cards from your hand on top of your deck.  Discard your hand.  Return the set aside cards to your hand.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Graph Creator
$5 - Action
+1 Card; +1 Action.
Set aside your hand.  +4 cards.  You may put any number of cards from your hand on top of your deck.  Discard your hand.  Return the set aside cards to your hand.

Not strictly the same as Cartographer, since if you discard a tunnel and gain a gold, you can't then reveal your set aside watchtower to topdeck it.

[pacovf]

Graph Creator
$5 - Action
+1 Card; +1 Action.
Set aside your hand.  +4 cards.  You may put any number of cards from your hand on top of your deck.  Discard your hand.  Return the set aside cards to your hand.

Not strictly the same as Cartographer, since if you discard a tunnel and gain a gold, you can't then reveal your set aside watchtower to topdeck it.

But Cartographer and Graph Creator are not the same cards, the same way Menagerie and Eager Mine aren't either.

[eHalcyon]

Graph Creator
$5 - Action
+1 Card; +1 Action.
Set aside your hand.  +4 cards.  You may put any number of cards from your hand on top of your deck.  Discard your hand.  Return the set aside cards to your hand.

Not strictly the same as Cartographer, since if you discard a tunnel and gain a gold, you can't then reveal your set aside watchtower to topdeck it.

But Cartographer and Graph Creator are not the same cards, the same way Menagerie and Eager Mine aren't either.

Both of them are weaker.

[Rubby]

Dim Onion: Anagrams


Confirmed: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=5799.msg432848#msg432848

Mr. Dark Agent
$6 - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
+$2
________
When you buy this, if you have any Copper in play, +1 Buy and you do not gain this.

Mare Pasture
$4 - Action
Trash another Mare Pasture from your hand. If you do, gain four Golds. Trash this.
________
While this is in play, when you gain a card, put it on top of your deck.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Mr. Dark Agent
$6 - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
+$2
________
When you buy this, if you have any Copper in play, +1 Buy and you do not gain this.

Moar edge cases! If you play two highways and buy this with a Talisman in play, you can still gain the copy even if you have copper in play.

[Rubby]

Mr. Dark Agent
$6 - Action
+1 Card
+1 Action
+1 Buy
+$2
________
When you buy this, if you have any Copper in play, +1 Buy and you do not gain this.

Moar edge cases! If you play two highways and buy this with a Talisman in play, you can still gain the copy even if you have copper in play.

Nice. You can also avoid trashing a played Hermit while getting nothing in your buy phase. I can think of an edge case for Mare Pasture too.

[JacquesTheBard]

Mr. Dark Agent is likely even stronger than expected, because with cost reduction down to 0, you can generate in infinite number of buys. Merchant Guild and Goons are quite happy about this.

[Kirian]

The speculation doesn't seem to be quite as good this time as with previous expansions. It may be because all the best speculators ended up being play testers and are now sworn to secrecy ...

What did the groundless speculation look like last time? I think it only really picked up when the name of the set was announced.

I think the real speculation started not when the name was announced, but when Donald's description was posted.  Ironic cheese destroyers and all that.

[Rubby]

Mr. Dark Agent is likely even stronger than expected, because with cost reduction down to 0, you can generate in infinite number of buys. Merchant Guild and Goons are quite happy about this.

Wow, you're right, it's totally OP. Should replace the +1 Buy in the on-buy clause with -1 coin token and -1 VP token. Although that could make it bad if someone plays a Piss Nooses on you.

[thespaceinvader]

Mr. Dark Agent is likely even stronger than expected, because with cost reduction down to 0, you can generate in infinite number of buys. Merchant Guild and Goons are quite happy about this.

How so?  It costs you a buy to buy it, it gives you one back when you fail to gain it.  Net 0 buys.  Unless I'm missing something major.

I suppose you can USE infinite buys to buy it meaning that you can spend your spare buys on it the way you would instead on copper or peddler, but it'll never give you any more buys than you started with to use I don't think?

[Lekkit]

You buy it, get a coin token, unbuy it, rinse and repeat for infinite coin tokens/vp chips.

[market squire]

Some serious speculations from me as fan card maker (although this doesn't say much, most of Donald's cards have been soo much better than cards I could think of, every expansion had big surprises to me):

Considering that the set has 400 cards, it is quite obvious that there will be "extra" (i.e. non-kingdom) cards. Donald could make another set of just kingdom cards like Hinterlands, but Hinterlands was only 300, and at the given level of complexity, new mechanics are needed. Donald always filled out the card space efficiently, my guess is there will be about 30 kingdom cards (~330 total), so there'd be space for ~70 extra cards.

What could be done with these?

• Other basic cards, as we know from Alchemy and Prosperity (although I can't imagine what to do here).
• Ancillary non-supply piles, as we know from Cornucopia and Dark Ages.
• Alternative starting cards like Shelters, maybe to replace Coppers, or Cantrips that are just added to the starting deck.
• Non-gainable cards that are used for bookkeeping (to mark supply piles - maybe too similar to Embargo/ Trade Route; to mark any player), to count stuff (e.g. how often you shuffle, how often you gained a card), or as Events (like neutral attacks that take place each round or when a player triggers it).

Guesses on the kingdom cards themselves are much harder.

The big themes that are already covered by the existent expansions are flexibility, future, currency/ Actions, buys/ Treasures, variety, gains/ Victory, trash/ cheap, and... again flexibiliy/ future I guess?
There could be overlaps in themes, but Donald always gives us something new as well.

New general themes that come into my mind at the moment are:

• Consistency (it's already covered by Prince, but there could still be things to do here.)
• New sort of interaction (Donald is very cautious with such things but maybe something a la "7 Wonders: Babel"?)
• Cards with different deck speeds (see my idea "queue pile")
• Timing flexibility (like coin tokens, just more in general, see LFns "Activation cards")
• Twist on endgame (cards that do things before you score; or special conditions for VP cards).

[Awaclus]

• Other basic cards, as we know from Alchemy and Prosperity (although I can't imagine what to do here).

Gunpowder!

[markusin]

I am hoping there won't be new token types or new mats.

I've been thinking about this, and I think a new mat can actually be cool if the same mat was referenced by multiple cards in the set and hence the cards can interact with each other through the mat. I was thinking something that stores action cards for future use, a natural extension from storing coins for future use.

Below are some cards I thought of that make use of a "Reserves" mat to store actions  Cards placed on the mat by one card can be used by another card in the set that also uses the mat. They have no name because I'm not feeling creative today.

---

Speculation Card A: Draw
Action - $4
+2 Cards
Choose one: Discard all cards on your Reserves mat and place up to 2 Action cards from your hand onto your Reserves mat; or play all cards on your reserves mat in any order.

---

Speculation Card B: Gainer
Action - $3
+ $2
Choose one: Place an Action card from your hand onto your Reserves mat; or place a card from your Reserves mat on top of your deck and gain a card costing up to $1 more than it.

---

Speculation Card C: Village
Action - $4
+2 Actions
Choose one: +1 card; or put a card from your Reserves mat into your hand
-
While this is in play, when you gain a card, you may place it onto your Reserves mat.

---

A variant of Card C could cost $3 and not provide the +1 card option.

[Awaclus]

I am hoping there won't be new token types or new mats.

I've been thinking about this, and I think a new mat can actually be cool if the same mat was referenced by multiple cards in the set and hence the cards can interact with each other through the mat. I was thinking something that stores action cards for future use, a natural extension from storing coins for future use.

Below are some cards I thought of that make use of a "Reserves" mat to store actions  Cards placed on the mat by one card can be used by another card in the set that also uses the mat. They have no name because I'm not feeling creative today.

---

Speculation Card A: Draw
Action - $4
+2 Cards
Choose one: Discard all cards on your Reserves mat and place up to 2 Action cards from your hand onto your Reserves mat; or play all cards on your reserves mat in any order.

---

Speculation Card B: Gainer
Action - $3
+ $2
Choose one: Place an Action card from your hand onto your Reserves mat; or place a card from your Reserves mat on top of your deck and gain a card costing up to $1 more than it.

---

Speculation Card C: Village
Action - $4
+2 Actions
Choose one: +1 card; or put a card from your Reserves mat into your hand
-
While this is in play, when you gain a card, you may place it onto your Reserves mat.

---

A variant of Card C could cost $3 and not provide the +1 card option.

Card C is extremely powerful. It's a village and it auto-Islands all the green cards that you buy. I think you might want to at least make it mandatory to put the gained cards on the Reserves mat, but that might not nerf it enough.

[werothegreat]

Or change it to "When you gain an Action, you may put it on your Reserves mat."