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Author Topic: Season two - Game reports & discussion: D + E  (Read 14262 times)

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silverspawn

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2014, 11:42:37 pm »
0

i'd like to offer a second perspective on the games

Quote
You both missed strongest engine there, torturer is mistake as it helps oponent more than you. A correct opening is contraband/silver and create menagerie engine, torturer just helps with hands that otherwise did not activate menagerie or altar fodder.

You start with contraband/silver and if oponent is smart to deny you altar gain a gold then get altar, ironmorgers, bakers, merchant guilds and for extra fun gaining provinces by graverobbing bakers gained by altar.

this doesn't sound correct. there is no way to deal with quickly enough to make menagerie a thing. it's only effective as a counter to torturers. the correct way to play this board is probably to focus heavily on ironmongers. open ironmonger/ironmonger, get alter with first 6$, baker/merchant guild with 5$, ironmonger with 4$. get some torturers later, and some menageries if your opponent gets torturers.

Quote
Well here you need to know what is important and what is not. Alchemist split is not as three alchemists are enough to draw all terminals consisting of 6 silvers, potion and trading post, a grand market split is important. So you should open silver/courtyard and get trading post, potion and 3 alchemists, 2 cartographers and as many gm you can, I could get 6 by turn 12. Altar is mistake as trading post trashes better except copper->cart but you do not need that many of them.
I don't think you go alchemists at all. You don't need a lot of draw, you just need a slim deck and lots of grand markets. open shanty town/silver and don't buy another treasure for the remainder of the game. Altar is better than trading post, as you don't want to have silver, but you might be forced to get trading post anyway. gained 5$'s should be exclusively cartographers or pillages.

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #26 on: August 02, 2014, 08:43:49 am »
0

i'd like to offer a second perspective on the games

Quote
You both missed strongest engine there, torturer is mistake as it helps oponent more than you. A correct opening is contraband/silver and create menagerie engine, torturer just helps with hands that otherwise did not activate menagerie or altar fodder.

You start with contraband/silver and if oponent is smart to deny you altar gain a gold then get altar, ironmorgers, bakers, merchant guilds and for extra fun gaining provinces by graverobbing bakers gained by altar.

this doesn't sound correct. there is no way to deal with quickly enough to make menagerie a thing. it's only effective as a counter to torturers. the correct way to play this board is probably to focus heavily on ironmongers. open ironmonger/ironmonger, get alter with first 6$, baker/merchant guild with 5$, ironmonger with 4$. get some torturers later, and some menageries if your opponent gets torturers.
Shelters dude, that makes a menagerie stronger and ironmorger weaker. You have problem that ironmonger and necro is only source of actions and wasting action on torturer is merchant guild you do not play.

Quote
Quote
Well here you need to know what is important and what is not. Alchemist split is not as three alchemists are enough to draw all terminals consisting of 6 silvers, potion and trading post, a grand market split is important. So you should open silver/courtyard and get trading post, potion and 3 alchemists, 2 cartographers and as many gm you can, I could get 6 by turn 12. Altar is mistake as trading post trashes better except copper->cart but you do not need that many of them.
I don't think you go alchemists at all. You don't need a lot of draw, you just need a slim deck and lots of grand markets. open shanty town/silver and don't buy another treasure for the remainder of the game. Altar is better than trading post, as you don't want to have silver, but you might be forced to get trading post anyway. gained 5$'s should be exclusively cartographers or pillages.
That is just awfully slow, Three silvers will get you to grand markets faster and what I tried its beated by alchemist bm of banker bot. You want to trash with altar which takes 2 cards, play pillage that takes card, play 2 spoils for grand market, have and have dead shanty town in hand. I do not see how you want double province when you need first spend two spoils for one grand market and need like 3 cartographers to match these, then you could on next two turns get single grand market and then you could do something interesting.
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assemble_me

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2014, 02:36:15 pm »
0

i'd like to offer a second perspective on the games

Quote
You both missed strongest engine there, torturer is mistake as it helps oponent more than you. A correct opening is contraband/silver and create menagerie engine, torturer just helps with hands that otherwise did not activate menagerie or altar fodder.

You start with contraband/silver and if oponent is smart to deny you altar gain a gold then get altar, ironmorgers, bakers, merchant guilds and for extra fun gaining provinces by graverobbing bakers gained by altar.

this doesn't sound correct. there is no way to deal with quickly enough to make menagerie a thing. it's only effective as a counter to torturers. the correct way to play this board is probably to focus heavily on ironmongers. open ironmonger/ironmonger, get alter with first 6$, baker/merchant guild with 5$, ironmonger with 4$. get some torturers later, and some menageries if your opponent gets torturers.
Shelters dude, that makes a menagerie stronger and ironmorger weaker. You have problem that ironmonger and necro is only source of actions and wasting action on torturer is merchant guild you do not play.

That games was with Estats, though: http://gokologs.drunkensailor.org/static/logprettifier.html?20140731/log.516cd2c1e4b082c74d7a166a.1406854100527.txt
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assemble_me

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #28 on: August 07, 2014, 04:10:56 pm »
+1

D5: EgorK vs assemble_me
My 4th game this season, this time against EgorK, the only opponent I played against last season. I'm doing well this season, so let's see how this game turns out today. Last season we played 3-3.
As always, I love to read about your thoughts on those games


Game 1:



Code: [Select]
Beggar, Pearl Diver, Develop, Great Hall, Steward, Storeroom, Urchin, Baron, Feodum, Bandit Camp
Provinces / Estates

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407341685651.txt

assemble me starts

We both build some enginy kind of decks here. He opens Steward/Silver. I decide that I also want to attack and go for Urchin/Urchin. I'm lucky to collide them in turn three already. I get a bunch of Bandit Camps, Stewards for the draw and Storeroom for +Buy. He goes for a very thin deck with money, two Stewards and a Bandit Camp. I'm not building for double Province turns here. Since we're even on points and I'm first player he goes for the penultimate province, but I can Province+Estate for the win. Mercenary might have been kind of risky here, but it probably payed off. Maybe a midgame Beggar could have been nice for Mercenary fodder.

1-0


Game 2:



Code: [Select]
Fishing Village, Masquerade, Navigator, Remodel, Silk Road, Wandering Minstrel, Golem, Royal Seal, Border Village, Nobles
Provinces / Estates

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407342160996.txt

EgorK starts

On 5/2 he opens Royal Seal/- and I of course open Masquerade on 3/4. I decide I just want to go for straight forward Masquerade Big Money and pick up Silver with it. He goes for Fishing Villages, Masquerades and Nobles. With a thin deck he can reliably buy a Province every turn. I didn't think just Nobles and Fishing Village would be good enough to build an engine but: I was wrong.

1-1


Game 3:



Code: [Select]
Poor House, Doctor, Fishing Village, Alchemist, Caravan, Feodum, Monument, Plaza, Inn, Tribute
Provinces / Shelters

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407343166520.txt

EgorK starts

We both try to build decks with lots of Monuments here. There's no +Buy but with a lot of Monument an engine seems nice still. I'd like to get a really thin deck and would gladly open Doctor on 4/3 or 5/2, but I have 3/4. He has 4/3 but goes for the Potion right away. So we both get Fishing Village and Potion first. I get Doctor on turn 3 for 4$. I don't think I will get a lot of money to make a big overpay viable so I rather want it early. We both start picking up Alchemists, Monuments and Fishing Villages. I also get some Caravans, he picks up an early Gold. With my thinner deck, I can play my Monuments more often and get a points lead. His mid game Doctors don't hit well. While he has already bought a Province I rather keep buying Alchemists and do still have a lead because I can always draw my deck and play all the Monuments (and win the Alchemist split 6-4). I think about just running piles but join him buying Provinces. Even my "oooops" moment ending my actions prematurely after drawing my deck can't stop me and I win convincingly.

2-1


Game 4:



Code: [Select]
Fishing Village, Masterpiece, Shanty Town, Sea Hag, Market, Pillage, Rebuild, Treasury, Vault, Wharf
Provinces / Estates

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407343797320.txt

EgorK starts

There's Rebuild which is always a big deal. There's also Sea Hag and I think it's hard to ignore Sea Hag here. He opens Fishing Village/Sea Hag where I open Silver/Sea Hag. I'm not not convinced that Rebuild is really better here and decide to join him building that Fishing Village / Wharf Engine, which is usually very strong. He gets his Wharf in turn 4 and also has a second one when I get my first one in turn 8. I get 6 curses and only pick up 3 Wharves and think I have to go for points aggressively. In the end, his better deck helps him to catch up and win. I feel Rebuild should have done better than that... The good news is I will start the last two games.

2-2


Game 5:



Code: [Select]
Cellar, Herbalist, Pawn, Menagerie, Steward, Herald, Treasure Map, Inn, Trading Post, Altar
Provinces / Estates

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407344768649.txt

assemble me starts

This is a nice engine board. There's everything you need except for an attack, the question really is which components you choose. We both decide Herald is the way to go. I open Steward/Silver where he opens Steward/Herald. I don't really like Herald as an opening here, it's not that great early and there are alternatives for draw and actions. My Silver helps me to an Altar in turn 5 which helps me to pick up extra Heralds. With a reasonable amount of Heralds I decide to pick up two Treasure Maps for the money, because that would be enough money for double Province turns, he just buys Golds the usual way. With both Treasure Maps in hand next turn I draw my deck and buy my first Province. One dud hand follows and I buy Menagerie + Pawn for reliability, then I have two double Province turns for the win. After the match, I realized that Treasure actually wasn't the best idea, as a Treasure Map revealed by Herald could have been really bad without the other one in my hand. Here it just worked perfectly. I guess sometimes even something dumb can pay off if you're lucky... I still like my early Silver and my Altar, they helped me for an early lead in building the engine.

3-2


Game 6:



Code: [Select]
Cellar, Lighthouse, Market Square, Bishop, Bureaucrat, Rats, Salvager, Scout, Ill-Gotten Gains, Border Village
Provinces / Estates

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140806/log.505d7a160cf2ef979299a48e.1407345430192.txt

assemble me starts

Here we have an IGG board, which is always a big, big deal, but there's also lot of trash for benefit stuff going on. Bishop and Salvager trash that stuff very well, IGG is nice fodder itself and there's also Border Village. You can also activate Market Squares for extra fun. There are also Rats, but no one went for them. I'm opening Silver/Salvager. He decides to open Bishop/Market Square, which signals he wants to trash more and hit 5$ less. I think Salvager is better in IGG games, but I also get a Bishop on a 4$. Turn 3 I can buy my first IGG which is always great as first player. He picks up three more Market Squares and another Bishop. I only get one Market Square and pick up Border Village + IGG whenever I can. After my third IGG he decides to join me in buying those. I can get two Provinces fast and my Bishop helps me for extra points. His extra Golds help him to catch up a bit but the game ends too fast for him.

4-2

Here we go, third 4-2 in a row and before my last match I have actually real chances to get promoted to C. Who would have thought that? Not me, for sure!
Good luck for Egor in his upcoming matches!
« Last Edit: August 08, 2014, 03:40:52 am by assemble_me »
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assemble_me

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2014, 08:15:23 am »
+6

D5: Victor Savenije vs. Assemble Meme

I'm playing for the promotion today! Wow, I wouldn't have expected that. My iso and goko rating both tell me I should struggle around the last positions in our division but the opposite is true: If I win, in other words, get at least 3.5 points, I will get promoted. I'm happy that I don't totally feel under pressure - as said before, winning this group would be a little sensation.


Game 1



Code: [Select]
Squire, Apothecary, Bridge, Herald, Talisman, Golem, Count, Knights, Rebuild, Soothsayer
Provinces / Shelters

Victor Savenije starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407868157008.txt

We have a great engine board here, but there's also Rebuild. He encourages me to ignore Rebuild, but I go for it anyway opening double Silver. He opens Silver/Potion. I go for Soothsayer on my first 5$ for extra Golds and Curses for him and pick up Rebuilds and Duchies afterwards. He builds a cool engine with all the available stuff here; Count for trashing, Herald and Golem as Draw/Village, Apothecary for more draw, Bridge as payload and also a knight. Before the game ends, he says he didn't consider the synergy between Knights and Bridges to go for Knights more heavily. But he doesn't need it, he gets two big turns and buys all the green cards for the win. So, the engine was probably much better here than Rebuild, I also think that my Soothsayer was a mistake against a strong trasher like Count, I probably should have picked up a Count myself to gain Duchies instead. For his deck, I'm not convinced you really need Potion. If you can get all Heralds uncontested in a thinned deck, that's a lot of draw. But if both players go for the engine, you probably want the potion cards... Anyways, it worked out very well for him.

0-1


Game 2



Code: [Select]
Vineyard, Chancellor, Treasure Map, Explorer, Mandarin, Market, Merchant Guild, Pillage, Rogue, Goons
Provinces / Estates

assemble meme starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407869356407.txt

Not a lot is going on on this board, I just want to play BM with Goons. Vineyard doesn't look really good with only Market and Goons as +Buy and no cheap cantrips. I'm going for a double Silver Opening. He has 5/2 and opens Pillage. After my second shuffle I can pick up two Goons. He picks up a Rogue along the way to recycle his Pillages which is OK I guess and goes for Goons, too. I'm getting a points lead as he doesn't follow me on Duchies right after four Provinces are gone. Duchies are emptied fast. There's only one Province left and I pick up two Mandarines as I try to hit 8$ to end the game for a win. But he has Goons both turns, so that I can't buy the province and with extra buys from markets he gets enough VP tokens and Estates to actually gain a seven point lead. With also the Estates gone, I decide to get more Goons and use all my buys for more VP tokens. I try the Mandarin trick again putting two Silvers on top of my deck and can finally hit 8$ for the win. So, although this board didn't look all that spectacular, the game was actually very tense with both me and him turning the tables when it had already looked quite hopeless for either of us. He says that it was probably a mistake on his side not to pick up any Golds. Maybe i should have delayed going for Duchies a little longer.

1-1


Game 3



Code: [Select]
Pawn, Apothecary, Bishop, Death Cart, Smithy, Butcher, Count, Explorer, Library, Mystic
Provinces / Estates

assemble meme starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407870348724.txt

I want to build an Apothecary engine here, Apothecary/Mystic looks really good. I want to go for it, adding Butcher to trash Estates into Pawns for +Buy, so I open Potion/Silver. He opens Bishop/Silver and tries to go for a golden Deck with Count for trashing. I'm a bit worried, I didn't see that from the start but Apothecary seems stronger here. He can't get his deck under control. I don't play optimally but still manage to take the lead and win convincingly.

2-1


Game 4



Code: [Select]
Duchess, Embargo, Squire, Forager, Death Cart, Scout, City, Mine, Minion, Expand
Provinces / Shelters

Victor Savenije starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407871977567.txt

The big thing here is Minion. I open Forager/Silver and he opens Forager/Death Cart. His Death Cart doesn't really help him early and I can win the Minion split 6-4, but it's not all that bad for him, because you can add Cities now for more draw. He gets a second Death Cart which helps him to a double Province turn. That means I'm behind and have to think a long time because I don't see a good way to come back. I add Duchies and pick up Duchesses with them for more money. I actually wanted to pick up a Death Cart myself somewhere, but couldn't find the right time for it. His Death Carts probably won the game for him, as I can't catch up.

2-2


Game 5



Code: [Select]
Nomad Camp, Walled Village, Apprentice, Counterfeit, Ghost Ship, Governor, Knights, Minion, Harem, Forge
Provinces/Estates

assemble meme starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407873303296.txt

Here we have another crazy Governor board with Counterfeit and Apprentice to help for more craziness. Forge could work too, but no one went for it here and probably the other components are just better.
I have to think for a long time if I want to open Governor or Counterfeit on 5/2. Ghost Ship seems possible, too. I decide to go for Governor first. He has 2/5 and chooses Counterfeit, adding Apprentice next. My next 5s are two Counterfeits. We both add a Nomad Camp along the way. With 4 Governors on both sides he has a big turn for double Governor winning the split 6-4, I pick up a second Apprentice and a Province. He can get a big quad Province turn next and I feel I'm almost dead. I'm having a "dud" hand without Apprentices or Governors, but I still have 10$ and two buys for double Duchy. The good thing is, he has a real dud hand with three Provinces and two Counterfeits. Now my good cards are to come, I blow up a Gold and an Estate with my Apprentices finding three Governors and enough money to remodel two Golds and buying the last Province.

3-2


Game 6



Code: [Select]
Chapel, Pearl Diver, Oasis, Watchtower, Wishing Well, Mining Village, Talisman, Trader, Haggler, Mint
Provinces / Estates

Victor Savenije starts

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140812/log.50e7525ee4b0b5b74140a6c0.1407874323064.txt

So this is my last game this season. I have to draw at least to get promoted. But so far today, the start player has always won. He opens Chapel/Haggler on 2/5 and I go for Chapel/Wishing Well on 4/3. I guess Haggler is much better but his Chapel misses the shuffle and also haggling the Mint doesn't work as you'd wish it would. Still, he manages to get the economy back into his deck faster and not having the opportunity to trash his Estates early turns out to be quite useful. We're even on Provinces but he has the extra Estate and I have to go for Duchies with lots of 8$ hands and he has to miss 5$, which almost can't happen here, and it doesn't. Maybe I should have gotten a second Silver over the second Wishing Well or the second Haggler. Not too sure if just ignoring Chapel would have been better here...

3-3


Wow, what a match. Actually it was pretty much fun. Thanks a lot to Victor/Zappie for playing and for having a nice chat along the way. As said before, I'm not terribly worried to have missed getting promoted; I would have liked the challenge but I probably would have gotten punched hard by those big boys in C ;). I've played well this season and can be proud with this result, but still, it was so close... [Add Freddie Mercury meme here ;)]
« Last Edit: August 13, 2014, 09:57:30 am by assemble_me »
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shark_bait

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2014, 08:58:23 am »
+2

Game 6 - His 5/2 is huge here but Chapel on T5 puts you in the lead.  Your turn 5 should be a Silver instead of Wishing Well.  The 1st WW is correct imo as you significantly lower your chances of drawing chapel on T5.  Then on T6, trash a single copper and estate instead of 2 copper and estate.  This allows you to buy another Silver instead of a worthless Pearl Diver.

If you did those things your deck would have, 1 Chapel, 1 Wishing Well, 4 Copper and 3 Silver.  Ignoring Cantrips for calculating money density you would have $1.25/Card.  In your deck you actually had $1/Card (also ignoring Cantrips).  BM/Chapel is usually pretty weak.  If you go for it you should have a pretty good reason to.  In this game you do because Haggler will be played often and will maintain your deck's integrity while greening.  However in BM/Chapel style games you need to be careful not to be too aggressive in trashing.  It should be noted that Mint can be skipped.  Haggler will just be better as it gives +$2 and with Province also gains Gold.

If you had done the things I mentioned on turns 5 and 6 I think you could have easily walked away with a win.
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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2014, 09:41:13 am »
0

Game 6 - His 5/2 is huge here but Chapel on T5 puts you in the lead.  Your turn 5 should be a Silver instead of Wishing Well.  The 1st WW is correct imo as you significantly lower your chances of drawing chapel on T5.  Then on T6, trash a single copper and estate instead of 2 copper and estate.  This allows you to buy another Silver instead of a worthless Pearl Diver.

If you did those things your deck would have, 1 Chapel, 1 Wishing Well, 4 Copper and 3 Silver.  Ignoring Cantrips for calculating money density you would have $1.25/Card.  In your deck you actually had $1/Card (also ignoring Cantrips).  BM/Chapel is usually pretty weak.  If you go for it you should have a pretty good reason to.  In this game you do because Haggler will be played often and will maintain your deck's integrity while greening.  However in BM/Chapel style games you need to be careful not to be too aggressive in trashing.  It should be noted that Mint can be skipped.  Haggler will just be better as it gives +$2 and with Province also gains Gold.

If you had done the things I mentioned on turns 5 and 6 I think you could have easily walked away with a win.

Thanks a lot for your thoughts. In many points what you say supports what I said and felt. I might have picked up that second Silver over the second WW myself (as seen in my post) but I probably wouldn't have come up with the idea of trashing only one Copper that next turn. And yeah, I mostly don't like Chapel in BM but with Haggler I thought it should be good. But I felt my build up was too slow, it took too long until I had my first Province+Gold turn. Now I have a clue why.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2014, 09:45:19 am by assemble_me »
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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #32 on: August 13, 2014, 10:57:02 am »
+1

Game 6 - His 5/2 is huge here but Chapel on T5 puts you in the lead.  Your turn 5 should be a Silver instead of Wishing Well.  The 1st WW is correct imo as you significantly lower your chances of drawing chapel on T5.  Then on T6, trash a single copper and estate instead of 2 copper and estate.  This allows you to buy another Silver instead of a worthless Pearl Diver.

If you did those things your deck would have, 1 Chapel, 1 Wishing Well, 4 Copper and 3 Silver.  Ignoring Cantrips for calculating money density you would have $1.25/Card.  In your deck you actually had $1/Card (also ignoring Cantrips).  BM/Chapel is usually pretty weak.  If you go for it you should have a pretty good reason to.  In this game you do because Haggler will be played often and will maintain your deck's integrity while greening.  However in BM/Chapel style games you need to be careful not to be too aggressive in trashing.  It should be noted that Mint can be skipped.  Haggler will just be better as it gives +$2 and with Province also gains Gold.

If you had done the things I mentioned on turns 5 and 6 I think you could have easily walked away with a win.

You like the Chapel/WW opening, though? I would be inclined to try Chapel/MV, hoping to trash it to gain an early Haggler. Looking at his actual draws, it seems that would have been unsuccessful: the draw was perfect for WW, and not good for MV; but still, having that optional $2+card floating around would have helped. It looks like it would have enabled a Haggler one shuffle earlier than in the actual game.
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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2014, 01:30:10 pm »
0

i'll be back
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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #34 on: August 21, 2014, 09:09:19 am »
0

shraeye vs AHoppy 2-4

Game 1: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Storeroom, Warehouse, Conspirator, Moneylender, Navigator, Rats, Golem, Cartographer, Rebuild, Grand Market
Rebuild game. I try to mix things up with Golem and a Grand Market as well. Tense finish, but in the end, I don't make it.
0-1

Game 2: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Doctor, Advisor, Tournament, Harvest, Highway, Hunting Party, Mountebank, Rabble, Rebuild, Soothsayer
Colony game, where the idea is to trash a bit with Doctor, use Mountebank to slow the other, and Hunting Party for consistency. Rebuild also plays a role in the endgame.
We both open doctor/Silver, and my doctor does very little for me early game.  I feel like I must have played it badly. On our first 5, we both ignore Rebuild (it's a Colony game) and buy Mountebanks; curses end up splitting 5-5. AHoppy gets a T9 Province and mixes in a Tournament; this is likely the deciding factor, and I'm unable to catch back up.
0-2

Game 3: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Candlestick Maker, Steward, Baron, Throne Room, Bandit Camp, Cache, Jester, Mystic, Torturer, Border Village
Border Village/Torturer is a good combo, Steward trashing helps thin to get there, and Jester also does a lot of damage.  Everything is helped by the presence of Throne Room.
Also Candlestick Maker helps me with consistency, and that's a card AHoppy looks off entirely.  I'm not sure that's the right decision, but I do get frustrated with having too many in my own deck.  Thus, the optimum is likely between 0 and 3. AHoppy ends up with Mystics, a card that I never really give a thought to unless there are obvious activators around (cards that let me put back things in particular order). I disagree with AHoppy's play of Steward for draw instead of trashing early on; but I think the game is decided by valuing Jester over Mystic, and winning the ThroneRoom split 7-3 to keep my engine running.
1-2

Game 4: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Duchess, Embargo, Haven, Great Hall, Herald, Remodel, Embassy, Rabble, Tactician, Expand
Very unclear what direction this board is suited for. Probably BM+Embassy is a strong option here, but I open 5/2 and don't want to get an early Embassy. We both settle for Tacticians and Rabbles also, which sort of gives too many terminals.
2-2

Game 5: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Stonemason, Marauder, Moneylender, Noble Brigand, Rats, Council Room, Mint, Stables, Upgrade, Nobles
A board with a lot of power at the 5-level.  AHoppy opens 5/2 and grabs upgrade, and I'm forced to open Moneylender/Silver trying to hit 5 and catch up. AHoppy hits a 5 copper turn and buys Mint, that early lead keeps him solidly in front the entire game. I try to play Noble Brigand to hold him back, but it doesn't work out, despite a high percentage of successful hits.
2-3

Game 6: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Pearl Diver, Apothecary, Alchemist, Death Cart, Council Room, Ghost Ship, Mystic, Rogue, Saboteur, Trading Post
There are again a lot of 5-cost cards, and we are forced to make the choice of what terminal we want.  I pick Rogue (incorrectly, though I get a bit lucky), and AHoppy picks Council Room. We both try to stock up on Alchemist/Apothecaries, but my 2nd potion is likely a mistake. Death Cart purchase on Turn 13 is very much a mistake.
2-4
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luser

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Re: Game reports & discussion: D + E
« Reply #35 on: August 21, 2014, 10:13:14 pm »
0

shraeye vs AHoppy 2-4

Game 1: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Storeroom, Warehouse, Conspirator, Moneylender, Navigator, Rats, Golem, Cartographer, Rebuild, Grand Market
Rebuild game. I try to mix things up with Golem and a Grand Market as well. Tense finish, but in the end, I don't make it.
0-1

Here potion was mistake as golem is more expensive than gold. What both of you ignored is warehouse which helps rebuild by cycling and avoiding situations when you cant rebuild estate because its in hand. It also synergizes with conspirators so I would open either moneylender/silver or conspirator/silver then get 2 rebuilds on 5 then duchy, conspirators at 4 and warehouses at 3, possibly getting warehouse on 4 when there would be too many conspirators.

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Game 2: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Doctor, Advisor, Tournament, Harvest, Highway, Hunting Party, Mountebank, Rabble, Rebuild, Soothsayer
Colony game, where the idea is to trash a bit with Doctor, use Mountebank to slow the other, and Hunting Party for consistency. Rebuild also plays a role in the endgame.
We both open doctor/Silver, and my doctor does very little for me early game.  I feel like I must have played it badly. On our first 5, we both ignore Rebuild (it's a Colony game) and buy Mountebanks; curses end up splitting 5-5. AHoppy gets a T9 Province and mixes in a Tournament; this is likely the deciding factor, and I'm unable to catch back up.
0-2
No deciding factors was mainly that initially he trashed estate instead copper with doctor and gave you curse+copper and got hunting party shuffle earlier than you, also having 6 silvers in colony game did not help. His province was likely mistake, prizes do not help that much here and its 3+ extra uniques. Also rebuild antisynergizes with hunting parties it will cause reshuffle and you will draw only junk discarded by parties for next few turns.

As game goes you should read article about hunting party, gold instead second hunting party was mistake as you want play mountebank each turn. I would open silver/silver, got mountebank followed by hunting parties, I would buy doctor when I could overpay to trash 5+cards

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Game 3: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Candlestick Maker, Steward, Baron, Throne Room, Bandit Camp, Cache, Jester, Mystic, Torturer, Border Village
Border Village/Torturer is a good combo, Steward trashing helps thin to get there, and Jester also does a lot of damage.  Everything is helped by the presence of Throne Room.
Also Candlestick Maker helps me with consistency, and that's a card AHoppy looks off entirely.  I'm not sure that's the right decision, but I do get frustrated with having too many in my own deck.  Thus, the optimum is likely between 0 and 3. AHoppy ends up with Mystics, a card that I never really give a thought to unless there are obvious activators around (cards that let me put back things in particular order). I disagree with AHoppy's play of Steward for draw instead of trashing early on; but I think the game is decided by valuing Jester over Mystic, and winning the ThroneRoom split 7-3 to keep my engine running.
1-2


Here with 5-2 I would get torturer and pray it slows down oponent a bit. Jester tends to be weaker than torturer unless you get lucky and hit opening buy. A 3-4opening is better as you could open baron/steward or double steward which will quicky trash, and with 6 get border villages+torturers for draw. A second steward is needed, you ended without any of coppers trashed. Here you need one candlestick maker for buy if you did not get baron, I would also get bandit camps for money, you do not need that many throne rooms with trim deck. I would add jester when you could draw deck to gain extra cards, junking here is sorta ignorable as with running engine steward will trash these.

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Game 4: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Duchess, Embargo, Haven, Great Hall, Herald, Remodel, Embassy, Rabble, Tactician, Expand
Very unclear what direction this board is suited for. Probably BM+Embassy is a strong option here, but I open 5/2 and don't want to get an early Embassy. We both settle for Tacticians and Rabbles also, which sort of gives too many terminals.
2-2
Here I would get embassy instead tactician and gold instead expand. Ahoppy heralds are look too slow as you could embargo them and trying remodel copper to duchess to herald looks slow and uninteded tactician could prematurely end turn.

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Game 5: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Stonemason, Marauder, Moneylender, Noble Brigand, Rats, Council Room, Mint, Stables, Upgrade, Nobles
A board with a lot of power at the 5-level.  AHoppy opens 5/2 and grabs upgrade, and I'm forced to open Moneylender/Silver trying to hit 5 and catch up. AHoppy hits a 5 copper turn and buys Mint, that early lead keeps him solidly in front the entire game. I try to play Noble Brigand to hold him back, but it doesn't work out, despite a high percentage of successful hits.
2-3
Here he got quite lucky but I think that with his mistakes you had chance. You should not get marauder which is ignorable here and get silver instead. For brigand I would try him at turn 5 hoping it hits his gold. then build stables engine.
However if he instead upgrading mint into gold and nobles instead upgrade estate then get few stables, gold, council room and use mint to hit double province territory you would not have much chances.

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Game 6: Video+commentary and the Log
Code: [Select]
Pearl Diver, Apothecary, Alchemist, Death Cart, Council Room, Ghost Ship, Mystic, Rogue, Saboteur, Trading Post
There are again a lot of 5-cost cards, and we are forced to make the choice of what terminal we want.  I pick Rogue (incorrectly, though I get a bit lucky), and AHoppy picks Council Room. We both try to stock up on Alchemist/Apothecaries, but my 2nd potion is likely a mistake. Death Cart purchase on Turn 13 is very much a mistake.
2-4
Here main problem was potion missing reshuffle. Here I would go for apothecary/mystic combo, possibly with trading post to trim deck.
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