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[Archetype]

Welcome to ZM19: Russian Roulette Mafia!

Signups:
1. Jimmmmm
2. ashersky
3. scott_pilgrim
4. chairs
5. e
6. Hydrad
7. silverspawn
8. jotheonah
9.

Basic Mafia Ruleset

CHANGES IN RED BECAUSE RED GOES FASTER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT
The Golden Rule:

Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun!  Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game.

Please read The Civility Pledge before signing up for any mafia game on this site.  If you have not /pledged there, you cannot play.

Excessive personal attacks or uncivil behavior may be dealt with by modifiers or modkills. There will be a zero tolerance policy for personal attacks. Please don't do it!

Game Summary:

Mafia is a social deduction game.  There is an "informed minority" (the mafia) and an "uninformed majority" (the town).  The mafia know who each other are, and are trying to be the only people left alive.  The town doesn't know who anybody else is, and are trying to find and lynch all of the mafia.  The mafia, to make sure the town doesn't know who they are, must pretend to be town to win.  The mafia usually can kill at night, to help them in being the only ones left alive.

1. General Gameplay and Etiquette:

1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind.  Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings unless your role PM specifically allows it.  Mafia members may communicate at night and during the confirmation stage.
3. If you have a role with a Night action your choices are due to all mods by the posted deadline (generally 48 hours from Night start during the first few Nights; later Nights may have shorter deadlines).  If we do not receive your PM by the posted deadline you will forfeit your actions.  In case of multiple submissions, the last valid one before the deadline will be used.  If your Night action was mandatory, it will be decided randomly.
4. Roles with Night actions will not be able to submit an action on Night 0 (i.e. during the confirmation stage).
5. Any player with a Night action may instead submit a “No Action” PM to let the Mods know that you do not want to perform your expected action that Night phase.
6. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 24 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.

2. Voting, Deadlines, and Player Death:

1. A simple majority (rounded up) of all living members must agree on one person for a lynch to occur prior to deadline.
2. Once you have reached a simple majority no further unvoting will change someone’s fate.  Further votes will also be ignored.
3. Once a player is lynched the game enters twilight until the mods lock the thread; all players including the one who was lynched may continue to post during twilight.
4. There will be 96 Hour Day deadlines and 24 Hour Night deadlines. This is subject to change (at the mod's discretion) based upon player count/availability/other.
5. Whoever has the most votes on them at deadline will be lynched if a majority hasn't been reached. Ties will be decided by random.org.
6. Please submit votes as: Vote: PlayerName.  Votes will NOT be counted if they are not bold or do not follow this syntax! Obvious abbreviations or nicknames will be counted so long as they are unambiguous.
7. Please submit vote revocations as either Unvote: PlayerName or Unvote. Unvotes are not necessary before changing votes.
8. You may Vote: No Lynch - a simple majority of these vote types are required to send the game to Night phase without a lynch.
9. Once you are killed (either via lynch or night kill) you may no longer post in the game or in Quicktopics. This means that you do not even get a “Bah” post. The dead in this game are silent.
10. If the thread is locked, you may not post.  Threads can be locked for various reasons, but no matter what the reason, you may not post.  The mod may forget to lock the thread, but if they say it is locked, it is still locked.
11. Do not edit or delete posts.  We don't want some players having more information than others.  If you want to clarify posts, feel free to double post. Mods will not edit posts for you.

3. Miscellaneous/Mechanics:

1. Bold, colored text is reserved for the Mods.  No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is cryptography.
2. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please PM the Mods privately.  Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
3. The Mods may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently.  Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed.  These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game. This includes incorrectly tallied Vote Counts.
4. Please bold all requests to the Mods so that they don’t get missed.
5. Prods of missing players will be issued upon request after 48 hours of no activity or upon request after 24 hours of no activity.  A prodded player has 48 hours to respond or risks replacement.  A player who has been prodded 2 times is subject to replacement under rule 3.10 without further notice.
6. Please do not discuss ongoing games, it can unintentionally affect the other game.
7. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, which may include modkill(s) if needed.
8. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread.  Treat this game as a commitment.  Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging.
9. Players who discover they are too busy to play in a game or want to leave the game for civility issues are not allowed to officially /out in the thread.  A request to /out must only be done via a PM to the moderator.  Please do not use this as a manipulation technique.  (Note players may continue to threaten to /out or imply that they might as long as it does not include an official request).  Requests to /out are final once submitted.  There will be no /outing and then /inning back into the game so make sure that when you /out you have thought it through and really want to do it. Players that can't be replaced will simply be mod-killed.Please make sure you understand the commitment you are making to the game before joining.
10.If a player wants to /out, they may be replaced by anyone on D1-N1.  On D2-N2, no one from the speccy may replace the player.  After this, a player who /outs may not be replaced.  It is up to the mod's discretion whether to modkill the player or do something else under these circumstances. This will be my guideline for replacements, though I may change that based on the individual situation.

Helpful Links:

Wiki Links:

--Main Wiki Page

--Newbie Guide

--Frequently Asked Questions

--Commonly Used Abbreviations

--Mafia Theory

Forum Links:

--Vacation/Limited Access announcements

--Mafia Lingo/Dictionary

[Archetype]

Setup:

2 Mafia Goons
7 Townies

Mechanics:
- Each Townie is holding a gun to their head. At the beginning of the game, each gun's status is Empty.
- Mafia start with 12 "bullets". Pregame, they may exchange up to 8 of them. For every 2 they exchange, they choose a player. They become Hated and take one less vote to be lynched at the start of the game.
- Instead of a factional kill, the Mafia loads bullets. Each night, a Goon can target 0, 1, or 2 Townies and secretly place a bullet into their gun. This changes each gun's status to Loaded.
- For every bullet they didn't load out of the maximum 2, they choose a player. They become Hated and take one less vote to be lynched.
- Each night, a Townie has two choices: Fire the Gun or Bow Out
- If they fire a Loaded gun, they die.
- If they fire an Empty gun, they become Loved and take more less vote to be lynched.
- If they bow out with a Loaded gun, they live.
- If they bow out with an Empty gun, they become Hated and take one less vote to be lynched.
- Hated-ness stacks. Players are never notified whether or not they are hated or how much so.
- If, at the beginning of any given day, a player is Hated more than or equal to the number of votes required to lynch, they immediately die.
- When scum hand out "Hated", it will not count if it would make the player die at the beginning of following day. 

Other Notes:
- Deaths due to Hated-ness and gunshot are indiscernible.
- If a consensus hasn't been reached by deadline, each Hated counts as a Vote against the player.
- If a Townie fails to submit an action by deadline, they will default to "Fire the Gun".
- If a Goon fails to submit an action by deadline, they will default to "Target 0 players".

PMs:

Welcome, [Player Name], to ZM19: Russian Roulette Mafia! You are a Mafia Goon. You win when the majority of players are Mafia-aligned or nothing can prevent that from occurring

[Player Name] is your partner in crime. You can talk with him here during the night: [QT Link]
You have a collection of 4 bullets. Each night, one of you must target 0, 1, or 2 other players and secretly load a bullet into their guns. This will change the gun's status to Loaded. If they choose to fire a loaded gun, they die! But if they fire an empty gun, you will become Hated and take one less vote to be lynched the following day.

/confirm by posting in your QT or by messaging me back.

Welcome, [Player Name], to ZM19: Russian Roulette Mafia! You are a Vanilla Townie. You win when all threats to the Town have been eliminated. A Town-aligned player does not still need to be alive.

You have a gun pressed to your head. It's status is Empty.
Each night, you have two choices: Fire the Gun or Bow Out.
If you fire a Loaded gun, you die.
If you fire an Empty gun, whichever Mafia member loaded the bullets becomes Hated and takes one less vote to be lynched the following day.
If you bow out with a Loaded gun, you live.
If you bow out with an Empty gun, you become Hated and take one less vote to be lynched for the rest of the game.

/confirm by messaging me back

[Archetype]

This game's flavor and setup are derived from the infamous game of Russian Roulette. You can read all about it here!

If you notice anything potentially game-breaking about the setup, please feel free to notify me. I'd rather make changes now than during the game.

[Jimmmmm]

/in

ZM is blitz right?

What's your definition of a personal attack?

[Archetype]

/in

ZM is blitz right?

What's your definition of a personal attack?

The same stuff, but an emphasis on this:

In practice, remember that it is just a game, and though a player may be lying to you and distorting every word you say, that player is not an evil person outside of the context of the game. By the same token, if someone accuses you of lying and distorting every word he says, you should not assume that that player is accusing you of being evil outside of the context of this game.

I know it can get heated, but don't assume that the person you're arguing with is anti-Jimmmmm just because they don't agree with you.

[Archetype]

...and it looks like I put this on the wrong board. Can you move it, Robz?

[Jimmmmm]

/in

ZM is blitz right?

What's your definition of a personal attack?

The same stuff, but an emphasis on this:

In practice, remember that it is just a game, and though a player may be lying to you and distorting every word you say, that player is not an evil person outside of the context of the game. By the same token, if someone accuses you of lying and distorting every word he says, you should not assume that that player is accusing you of being evil outside of the context of this game.

I know it can get heated, but don't assume that the person you're arguing with is anti-Jimmmmm just because they don't agree with you.

I tend to assume that everyone is anti-Jimmmmm. Works pretty well most of the time.

[ashersky]

/in

...and it looks like I put this on the wrong board. Can you move it, Robz?

You know I'm a mod too, right?  I moved it for you.

[Archetype]

/in

...and it looks like I put this on the wrong board. Can you move it, Robz?

You know I'm a mod too, right?  I moved it for you.

Woah! I need to pay more attention to those star thingies...

[pacovf]

Is the choice of whether you shoot yourself or you bow out public? Might affect whether this is broken or not (although the fact that this is blitz means town can't pull off excessively elaborate plans, so it should be fine).

[ashersky]

Is the choice of whether you shoot yourself or you bow out public? Might affect whether this is broken or not (although the fact that this is blitz means town can't pull off excessively elaborate plans, so it should be fine).

You've clearly never played with me.

My guess is not public.  The Hated test on D2 works, though.

[ashersky]

No bullets N0, correct?

[ashersky]

Arch, I'm worried that no one pulls the trigger, ever.

Like, shoot loaded and die is bad.  Bow out empty and Hated is not as bad.  Plus, the bonus for a loaded bow out is better than an empty shot.

Combine that with no lynch for two days.  If 7 townies bow out, scum is double-hated guaranteed, unless they use 0 bullets.  Then it's a stalemate.

I say ban No Lynch and increase bullets if you want town making tough choices at night.  Or a better bonus for empty shots (like, just flip the empty shot with loaded bow out, since pulling the trigger is the bigger risk).

[faust]

I think the whole "hated" mechanic is problematic in that it potentially turns later days into to a race of "who can quickhammer first"?

[Voltaire]

/tag

[scott_pilgrim]

/in

[Archetype]

Ok.
I like the No-Lynching idea. I'll make it so whichever player has the most votes on them at deadline is lynched, but each Hated counts as a vote too.

I could be wrong, but that stalemate scenario may not quite happen the way you described it.

Say, on D1, Town!ash proposes your plan of having everyone bow out. That night, scum simply loads no bullets and Town all get Hated. If you continue doing that (5 times, I think), all the Town will be Hated equal to the number of votes needed to lynch and they die. So I don't think that exact scenario will occur, but a mandatory lynch should prevent stalemates in general from happening.

But I guess the problem is Bowing out being better than Shooting a majority of the time. I simulated with a 50/50 chance for each player to do either one. So maybe Town shooting an empty gun gives a random scum a Hated...? But that would make scum want to load more bullets, which would make Town want to bow out more...

Maybe when a Townie bows out with a bullet, scum gets it back?

My worst fear is that Town will just flip a coin or something to determine what they'll do.

[mail-mi]

/in

[ashersky]

The key to the theme here is having to shoot a gun that's pointed at your own head, not knowing if it's loaded.

You are giving town the option to not pull the trigger, and there's no incentive to ever shoot, currently.  Even hated x4 is better than dead.  Quick hammer outs scum, after all.

If no lynch goes away, the to lynch number will get smaller, so that makes Hated worse as the game progresses.

[yuma]

/tag. Previous games have shown I can't play blitz games of any kind but I would love to watch.

[chairs]

ah hell, /in.

I agree with Ash that there's a niggling concern of "how do you make bowing out only equally as attractive as taking the shot?" but I'm not quite sure how to fix it (though I think the plurality lynch w/hated as hidden votes is a great start).

[Archetype]

Ok, I liked ashersky's idea, but changed it a bit to make it fairer for the Mafia. Changes to the original setup in the 2nd post.

I did come up with a second way to do this idea. Ashersky's suggestion is a lot more clean cut than mine, but I really like the atmosphere of mine. When a Townie fires an empty gun, they become Loved (take one more vote to be lynched). Basically, instead of punishing Mafia, it helps Town. But why would a Townie shoot themselves N1? They can't get Hated until after then. So pregame, Mafia can make people Hated. The number of people they make hated is dependent upon the number of bullets they choose to start with. Less bullets, more pregame hating (hey, that sounds like Fifa). This creates a couple cute things:

1. Town really wants to vote. All the Hate is on the Townies, so if they don't vote at all a Town member is guaranteed to be lynched.

2. Since Hating and Shooting deaths are indistinguishable, it makes it harder to guess how many bullets/hating Mafia chose.

However, it also creates a few problems:

1. If a Town member shoots themselves twice in a row, they take one more vote to be lynched. And it's easily tested by running them up to L-1. Simple fix is to cap it out so they can only break even, but thats sort of lame. And insinuates them to go back and forth between Shoot and Hide. Which limits the fun for them. You could have the excess Loved translate into a Hated for scum, or have it be gifted to a random Townie in need of some love to combat their hate. But both sound kind of gimmicky and against the "This is your all up to you" mentality of the shooting minigame. Another option is to allow scum to add Hatedness manually over the course of the game or introduce another mechanism to randomly or specifically add Hated-ness. But both of these could get messy fast.

2. Why would Town shoot to help themselves? This is the main problem...if a Townie has a chance of killing themselves, who cares if one of their Hateds is gone? No real way to solve this unless you hurt scum too or help other townies. But the random Townie adds some luck into a skillful blitz game. Hurting scum after breaking even would be the most likely thing, but kinda dilutes coolness factor #1.

I've been racking my brain all day to come up with a way to do my idea, but i can't think of anything. I'm sure I could come up with some complicated side mechanic, but that decreases the simplicity of the original idea, which I want to stay true to - especially since this is blitz.  So if anyone can think of a nice and simple way to create those two coolness factors (which are super cool!), I'll do that. Otherwise, I'll simulate the new setup in the second post when I get home from work tommorow and we'll get a game up and running.

[Archetype]

Also, sorry for any grammar errors. That was a lot to type on mobile.

[ashersky]

I definitely think the "rewards" and "punishments" for shooting and bowing out make sense now, and are probably about right for forcing decisions.

Thinking through game play, I'm wondering if we'll end up with some stagnant days with fears of voting due to not knowing the Hated count.  I do think the whole thing promotes straight scumhunting since you won't want to run up wagons.

On the Loved/Hated idea you are playing with...let's think this through.

Let's say mafia starts N0 with 14 bullets (2xtown).  For each 2 bullets they trade in, they can add 1 Hatedness to a towny.  That let's them make 5 out of 7 Hated on D1 and still have 4 bullets, as the normal setup states.  Is that too much?

What if the N0 Hated are told?  I like that idea.

[pacovf]

Have you considered the possibility of removing/reducing the weight of your vote the day after you bow out?

For example (probably not balanced, just to illustrate the idea):

-if you bow out with a loaded gun, nothing happens and the mafia recovers the bullet;
-if you bow out with an empty gun, you become hated (cumulative) and your votes for the next day are ignored (although they are still counted in vote counts);
-at the beginning of the night, if no one was lynched during the day, the player with the most votes + hatedness (or one chosen randomly among all the players with the highest votes + hatedness) is killed, and the death is indistinguishable from a gunshot.

EDIT: if you like the theme and want to add chaos:
-if you bow out with a loaded gun, nothing happens to you, but you transfer the bullet in your gun to the next player (1 to 2, 2 to 3, etc., 9 to 1).