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Author Topic: Robz vs Pirate Ship  (Read 17291 times)

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silverspawn

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #50 on: May 22, 2014, 10:07:31 am »
+1

Pirate Ship won me the game, I'm pretty sure. You can't avoid it I don't think. Bane was Menagerie



Code: [Select]
Scrying Pool, Forager, Great Hall, Menagerie, Pirate Ship, Quarry, Silk Road, Young Witch, Explorer, Laboratory, Forge

http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?/20140522/log.51467e35e4b0de86766bf3f3.1400767049026.txt

uhhhhhhhhhhh really? looking at this board, my feeling is that you can easily trim your deck down to lots of action cards and 2 quarries, and get provinces via forge. the absence of +actions makes it harder, but you can still get a province 2 of 3 turns, if you do it like this

t1: play explorer, gain silver, buy 5$
t2: forge 5$ and silver into a province, buy 5$
t3: forge 5$ and 3$ into a province, buy 3$

and once the provinces pile runs low, you can sacrifice your explorer and some other early bought carsd to gain the last provicnes. that's not the fastest thing in the world, but it should beat pirate ship easily.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 08:01:33 am by silverspawn »
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Davio

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #51 on: May 22, 2014, 10:10:48 am »
0

Pirate Ship was very much ignorable here.
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KingZog3

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #52 on: May 22, 2014, 11:03:03 pm »
0

Pirate Ship was very much ignorable here.

My opponent bought Quarry and then I trashed it that very turn. I dunno, perhaps.
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silverspawn

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #53 on: May 24, 2014, 01:44:55 pm »
+1

let me show all of you how it's done  8)



Code: [Select]
Fool's Gold, Forager, Masterpiece, Trade Route, Island, Pirate Ship, Duke, Mystic, Royal Seal, Possession
viewer

Now, I'm pretty sure this is a board where you really can't get around pirate ship. Yes, there is mystic, but there is also fools gold. If you go mystic, the pirate ship player can just mass fg, which is better than mystic. If you contest fg, you feed his pirate ship and your fg's are going to be really useless. and note that mystics aren't even that great because it's a duchy/duke slog

maybe something with masterpiece works... that's the only thing I could see beating pirate ship.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2014, 01:46:33 pm by silverspawn »
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markusin

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #54 on: May 24, 2014, 04:54:07 pm »
0

let me show all of you how it's done  8)



Code: [Select]
Fool's Gold, Forager, Masterpiece, Trade Route, Island, Pirate Ship, Duke, Mystic, Royal Seal, Possession
viewer

Now, I'm pretty sure this is a board where you really can't get around pirate ship. Yes, there is mystic, but there is also fools gold. If you go mystic, the pirate ship player can just mass fg, which is better than mystic. If you contest fg, you feed his pirate ship and your fg's are going to be really useless. and note that mystics aren't even that great because it's a duchy/duke slog

maybe something with masterpiece works... that's the only thing I could see beating pirate ship.
That's an interesting one. My thinking here is you get a few Pirate Ships and spread them out with a good Masterpiece overpay, then hit the Duchies/Dukes when you don't need to attack with pirate ship. Certainly, not needing to hit $8 with Duchy/Duke helps a lot.

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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #55 on: May 24, 2014, 05:01:32 pm »
0

Since Robz isn't posting here anymore, I'll just keep score based on popular opinion.
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #56 on: May 24, 2014, 05:33:40 pm »
+1

let me show all of you how it's done  8)



Code: [Select]
Fool's Gold, Forager, Masterpiece, Trade Route, Island, Pirate Ship, Duke, Mystic, Royal Seal, Possession
viewer

Now, I'm pretty sure this is a board where you really can't get around pirate ship. Yes, there is mystic, but there is also fools gold. If you go mystic, the pirate ship player can just mass fg, which is better than mystic. If you contest fg, you feed his pirate ship and your fg's are going to be really useless. and note that mystics aren't even that great because it's a duchy/duke slog

maybe something with masterpiece works... that's the only thing I could see beating pirate ship.
That's an interesting one. My thinking here is you get a few Pirate Ships and spread them out with a good Masterpiece overpay, then hit the Duchies/Dukes when you don't need to attack with pirate ship. Certainly, not needing to hit $8 with Duchy/Duke helps a lot.

Interestingly, I'm not sure this rock-paper-scissors scenario counts. The deck without Pirate Ship still beats the deck with Pirate Ship. The Pirate Ship deck beats the Fools Gold deck, but you don't go for the Fools Gold deck because there is Pirate Ship.

(Additionally, I'm not 100% convinced the Fools Gold deck cant beat the PS deck anyway.)
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #57 on: May 24, 2014, 05:35:16 pm »
0



Code: [Select]
Beggar, Moat, University, Woodcutter, Pirate Ship, Salvager, Smithy, Thief, Harvest, Fairgrounds
Obligatory post.  His Ships were more interested in Potions that any amount of precious metal.... hits my Potion on Turns 3, 8, 11 and 15.  Kinda needed to buy Universities for my engine.

There hasn't been a consensus on this one yet.
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MVPs: M97
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #58 on: May 24, 2014, 05:37:07 pm »
0



Code: [Select]
Beggar, Moat, University, Woodcutter, Pirate Ship, Salvager, Smithy, Thief, Harvest, Fairgrounds
Obligatory post.  His Ships were more interested in Potions that any amount of precious metal.... hits my Potion on Turns 3, 8, 11 and 15.  Kinda needed to buy Universities for my engine.

There hasn't been a consensus on this one yet.

There should be. Pirate Ship has no chance here. None whatsoever. I'll gladly accept the Copper trashing. At worst, I can gain Harvests and use them for money or feed them to my Salvager. I also have Beggar to undo whatever Pirate Ship does, although that will probably be needless.
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #59 on: May 24, 2014, 05:38:04 pm »
0


Code: [Select]
Chapel, Fool's Gold, Conspirator, Ironworks, Pirate Ship, Hunting Party, Stables, Wharf, Hoard, King's Court
Maybe if we knock it up another notch.

Bam!


Code: [Select]
Duchess, Fool's Gold, Chancellor, Village, Woodcutter, Pirate Ship, Festival, Knights, Mint, King's Court
Log: http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20130525/log.50a208ebe4b0058ff63ee808.1369522493514.txt

This is a pretty old game, and I don't know how optimal our play was. Just like TrojH's game, it has Fool's Gold, Pirate Ship, and King's Court. But here, there's also Knights. Fool's Gold and King's Court are safe from Knights, but not much else is safe. KC/Knights is particularly frustrating as it can allow 1 knight to trash 3 others. Not much draw here either.

Here, I open with Pirate Ship hoping to take away my opponent's FGs and I figure they'll become devastating once they are KC'ed. My opponent responds by getting Mint to trash a bunch of treasure. The game no doubt degenerates into a long Knight war.

I'm thinking this would have been a clear rush for FG had it not been for Pirate Ship.

This one hasn't been commented on at all, I don't think.
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Wins: M39, M41, M48, M96, M97, M102, M105
Losses: M40, M43, M45, BM17 (?), RMM13, RMM17, RMM20, NM7, ZM18, M100, M109
MVPs: M97
Mod/Co-Mod: M46, M49, M52, NM10

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #60 on: May 24, 2014, 05:43:37 pm »
+3


Code: [Select]
Chapel, Fool's Gold, Conspirator, Ironworks, Pirate Ship, Hunting Party, Stables, Wharf, Hoard, King's Court
Maybe if we knock it up another notch.

Bam!


Code: [Select]
Duchess, Fool's Gold, Chancellor, Village, Woodcutter, Pirate Ship, Festival, Knights, Mint, King's Court
Log: http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20130525/log.50a208ebe4b0058ff63ee808.1369522493514.txt

This is a pretty old game, and I don't know how optimal our play was. Just like TrojH's game, it has Fool's Gold, Pirate Ship, and King's Court. But here, there's also Knights. Fool's Gold and King's Court are safe from Knights, but not much else is safe. KC/Knights is particularly frustrating as it can allow 1 knight to trash 3 others. Not much draw here either.

Here, I open with Pirate Ship hoping to take away my opponent's FGs and I figure they'll become devastating once they are KC'ed. My opponent responds by getting Mint to trash a bunch of treasure. The game no doubt degenerates into a long Knight war.

I'm thinking this would have been a clear rush for FG had it not been for Pirate Ship.

This one hasn't been commented on at all, I don't think.

Why would you want to play Pirate Ship? You have Knights to King!
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silverspawn

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #61 on: May 24, 2014, 08:23:56 pm »
+1

Quote
Interestingly, I'm not sure this rock-paper-scissors scenario counts. The deck without Pirate Ship still beats the deck with Pirate Ship. The Pirate Ship deck beats the Fools Gold deck, but you don't go for the Fools Gold deck because there is Pirate Ship.

(Additionally, I'm not 100% convinced the Fools Gold deck cant beat the PS deck anyway.)

nono, there is no rock-paper-scissors scenario. you want to open forager/pirate ship, like i did, get a second forager and a second pirate ship, and if by that time your opponent has not picked up a pirate ship of his own, like it happened in my game, you go fools gold. if your opponent just went fools gold, he will lose, because your pirate ship will hit his fools gold, and you contested him, so he isn't going to have many, and your pirate ships which will always hit will win the game. if your opponent went mystics he will lose, because you have lots of fg in a small deck. if your opponent went masterpiece, he will lose, because you have lots of fg in a small deck. if your opponent went pirate ship of his own, well, then it doesn't matter, because both sides have pirate ship. in any case, pirate ship wins.

i completely agree that pirate ship is bad in the other 2 kingdoms.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2014, 08:29:22 pm by silverspawn »
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markusin

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #62 on: May 25, 2014, 12:10:27 am »
+1


Code: [Select]
Chapel, Fool's Gold, Conspirator, Ironworks, Pirate Ship, Hunting Party, Stables, Wharf, Hoard, King's Court
Maybe if we knock it up another notch.

Bam!


Code: [Select]
Duchess, Fool's Gold, Chancellor, Village, Woodcutter, Pirate Ship, Festival, Knights, Mint, King's Court
Log: http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20130525/log.50a208ebe4b0058ff63ee808.1369522493514.txt

This is a pretty old game, and I don't know how optimal our play was. Just like TrojH's game, it has Fool's Gold, Pirate Ship, and King's Court. But here, there's also Knights. Fool's Gold and King's Court are safe from Knights, but not much else is safe. KC/Knights is particularly frustrating as it can allow 1 knight to trash 3 others. Not much draw here either.

Here, I open with Pirate Ship hoping to take away my opponent's FGs and I figure they'll become devastating once they are KC'ed. My opponent responds by getting Mint to trash a bunch of treasure. The game no doubt degenerates into a long Knight war.

I'm thinking this would have been a clear rush for FG had it not been for Pirate Ship.

This one hasn't been commented on at all, I don't think.

Why would you want to play Pirate Ship? You have Knights to king!
The knights were kinged, and eventually they trashed each other. You want to have some way to win in the aftermath. FG is a good option, as it's safe from knights and helps you get to KC and knights fast in the first place. This is where the Pirate ship can take advantage of the situation. Also note that you still keep the pirate ship tokens even if the pirate ships are trashed.
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SCSN

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #63 on: May 25, 2014, 02:16:09 am »
+2

Quote
Interestingly, I'm not sure this rock-paper-scissors scenario counts. The deck without Pirate Ship still beats the deck with Pirate Ship. The Pirate Ship deck beats the Fools Gold deck, but you don't go for the Fools Gold deck because there is Pirate Ship.

(Additionally, I'm not 100% convinced the Fools Gold deck cant beat the PS deck anyway.)

nono, there is no rock-paper-scissors scenario. you want to open forager/pirate ship, like i did, get a second forager and a second pirate ship, and if by that time your opponent has not picked up a pirate ship of his own, like it happened in my game, you go fools gold. if your opponent just went fools gold, he will lose, because your pirate ship will hit his fools gold, and you contested him, so he isn't going to have many, and your pirate ships which will always hit will win the game. if your opponent went mystics he will lose, because you have lots of fg in a small deck. if your opponent went masterpiece, he will lose, because you have lots of fg in a small deck. if your opponent went pirate ship of his own, well, then it doesn't matter, because both sides have pirate ship. in any case, pirate ship wins.

i completely agree that pirate ship is bad in the other 2 kingdoms.

I'd have agreed had Duke been something silly like Counting House, but with Duke on board Fool's Gold should be ignored entirely and a Pirate Ship/Forager open sounds awfully slow. Opening Silver/Silver, getting Duchy on 5 and Masterpiece on 6-7 (probably twice before switching to Duchy entirely?) should win here.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2014, 02:17:25 am by SheCantSayNo »
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #64 on: May 28, 2014, 11:31:31 pm »
0

Got one!



Code: [Select]
Doctor, Fortune Teller, Feodum, Mining Village, Pirate Ship, Cache, Pillage, Tactician, Altar, Hunting Grounds

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140528/log.516ddc20e4b082c74d7cbc04.1401333006670.txt

Double tac/pirate ship. Seriously.
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MVPs: M97
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #65 on: May 29, 2014, 12:00:02 pm »
0

Got one!



Code: [Select]
Doctor, Fortune Teller, Feodum, Mining Village, Pirate Ship, Cache, Pillage, Tactician, Altar, Hunting Grounds

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140528/log.516ddc20e4b082c74d7cbc04.1401333006670.txt

Double tac/pirate ship. Seriously.

no... you can easily trash coppers with doc and you can build a double tac/mv/ft engine that hits 8$ each turn without much trouble
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #66 on: May 29, 2014, 12:27:59 pm »
0

You would need 8 fortune tellers to hit $16 unless you're trashing mining villages, but then you wouldn't have enough actions for all the fortune tellers. If you're doing double tac here I would think you need to double province every turn.
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MVPs: M97
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Robz888

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #67 on: May 29, 2014, 12:31:18 pm »
0

Got one!



Code: [Select]
Doctor, Fortune Teller, Feodum, Mining Village, Pirate Ship, Cache, Pillage, Tactician, Altar, Hunting Grounds

http://gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?20140528/log.516ddc20e4b082c74d7cbc04.1401333006670.txt

Double tac/pirate ship. Seriously.

The double Tac Pirate Ship plan isn't awful, but I think the problem here is that your opponent welcomes your help in trashing his starting Coppers. I think you could setup some sort of thing with Altar, where you Altar your crap cards into Pillages, play Pillage, draw up the Spoils with Hunting Grounds, play them, repeat. Or he can just do his own Tac thing with Fortune Tellers, Mining Villages, Altar. A savvy player can do a lot of cool gain-stuff tricks here with the Altar/Doctor, Hunting Grounds, possibly even Feodum.

Yeah, I don't hold out much hope for the Pirate Ship guy here, as always. A key test for me is, "Do I have to buy Silver--a lot of Silvers, individually, one at time?" The answer here is clearly no.
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #68 on: May 29, 2014, 12:41:57 pm »
0

I would love to see that in action because I have no idea where to begin on something like that.
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MVPs: M97
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #69 on: May 29, 2014, 01:03:11 pm »
0

Why is it that the one time Pirate Ship saved my life the log didn't get saved?
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   Quote from: sudgy on June 31, 2011, 11:47:46 pm

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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #70 on: May 29, 2014, 02:41:56 pm »
0

Quote
You would need 8 fortune tellers to hit $16 unless you're trashing mining villages, but then you wouldn't have enough actions for all the fortune tellers. If you're doing double tac here I would think you need to double province every turn.
- why? just get to 4 ft, 3 mv and play ft/mv/ft/mv/ft/mv/ft/tac, and if you have 2 coppers left in your deck, you can double province on your last turn
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #71 on: June 12, 2014, 03:32:39 am »
+3



Code: [Select]
Chapel, Lookout, Mining Village, Pirate Ship, Remake, Butcher, Outpost, Pillage, Royal Seal, Stables
http://www.gokosalvager.com/static/logprettifier.html?/20140611/log.505d732a51c359e6597efeb8.1402533568897.txt
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #72 on: June 12, 2014, 04:26:19 pm »
+3

You really think so? I don't know, man. I'd think Butcher, Mining Village and Pillage could get it done without the Ship. There's no +buy, so what benefit are you getting from PS that trumps other available virtual coin?
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #73 on: June 12, 2014, 08:43:14 pm »
+1

You really think so? I don't know, man. I'd think Butcher, Mining Village and Pillage could get it done without the Ship. There's no +buy, so what benefit are you getting from PS that trumps other available virtual coin?

Turns off enemy Stables. Whatever deck you want isn't going to have many treasures anyways though...but if you don't get PS I can see Stables being a big problem. I think it's a scenario where you would like to get Stables, but the threat of Pirate Ship makes it not worth it.

I think MV-Butcher-Pillage sounds pretty competitive too though, maybe pick up 1 Remake to get going early and trash it to the Butcher you'll get from it?
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Re: Robz vs Pirate Ship
« Reply #74 on: June 12, 2014, 09:24:00 pm »
+2

You really think so? I don't know, man. I'd think Butcher, Mining Village and Pillage could get it done without the Ship. There's no +buy, so what benefit are you getting from PS that trumps other available virtual coin?

For sure, in terms of economy Butcher is a terminal $2, Mining Village a one-shot $2 that costs $4 (can't replace itself), and Pillage a delayed one-shot $6 (can barely replace itself). You can't create a sustainable economy from that, as the gamelog illustrates.
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