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Author Topic: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Werewolves Win!)  (Read 21740 times)

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XerxesPraelor

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #850 on: May 29, 2014, 09:28:29 am »

Also, he'd been putting mild suspicion on me for being "erratic" which I don't think is either scummy or anti-town, and as town I've found that people suspecting me tend to be more likely scum than not.
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #851 on: May 29, 2014, 09:55:23 am »

Still haven't re-read.  :( I can happily get behind a vote: axxle. I have a gut and I'm going to listen to it.
This reads more like the Voltaire I've known before.
I was a little concerned before with you being so gun-ho for Axxle yesterday, and not much today.
But this makes more sense.

As far as Ichi, I don't know. I don't know what WW tunneling me means either.


I feel like you may be better at reading than me than others, but I am not sure.
Let's see, I think we've been in 2 games--one me as super inexperienced scum, and then HoC where I was basically an IC.

Aside from ADK, the rest of the people on my wagon are all mildly scummy to me.

And I now recall it was BA who earlier found Voltaire townie because of the watch and investigation on him (to answer ww's earlier question).

At any rate, I am happy with an Axxle lynch today. Nik is a little townier than before, but most of his posts are still votes. S_P hasn't been around much, but is he VLA? Oh, and Xerxes is very busy with another ongoing game--I've got mostly null reads on him. EgorK said he was rereading I believe; he's lurked so far though.

You recall this?  That confuses me.  Here are the posts in order:

I don't like a lurker lynch here. And I think a Voltaire lynch is not great, since he's been investigated twice. On pure statistics he's half as likely as anyone else to be scum.

If I could vote anymore, I think I'd be voting IG.

I don't like a lurker lynch here. And I think a Voltaire lynch is not great, since he's been investigated twice. On pure statistics he's half as likely as anyone else to be scum.

If I could vote anymore, I think I'd be voting IG.

The thing about Voltaire is that I'm not sure that a Watcher investigation proves anything. The fact that no one but you tried to kill or target him last night makes it slightly more likely that he's scum, not less, and we do have a "not mafia" result on him but there are 2 possible other scum teams and the SK's (though if Volt is scum he's probably on a team with Nik).

I don't like a lurker lynch here. And I think a Voltaire lynch is not great, since he's been investigated twice. On pure statistics he's half as likely as anyone else to be scum.

If I could vote anymore, I think I'd be voting IG.

The thing about Voltaire is that I'm not sure that a Watcher investigation proves anything. The fact that no one but you tried to kill or target him last night makes it slightly more likely that he's scum, not less, and we do have a "not mafia" result on him but there are 2 possible other scum teams and the SK's (though if Volt is scum he's probably on a team with Nik).
I concur. I get a bit of a scumbud vibe for people finding Voltaire townie for information that's not that conclusive.

I don't like a lurker lynch here. And I think a Voltaire lynch is not great, since he's been investigated twice. On pure statistics he's half as likely as anyone else to be scum.

If I could vote anymore, I think I'd be voting IG.

I think you have some good points. Voltaire is almost certainly town. I mean, yes, right now I am voting for EgorK because he is lurking. I mean that seems a bit suspicious to me, but maybe he has other things in life going on. I don't know. I guess I wished he was a little more active to get a better reading on him.

On Day 1, I felt IG was certainly town. However, he has a lot of analysis and talking going on which is a smart thing to do, especially if you are scum. I was thinking of voting him day 3 if he wasn't killed since someone who talks as much as him is likely to figure things out quicker. In other words, if he were not scum, he should be a prime target even if he has no PR simply because he seems like the type to put the pieces together. Also, him talking so much could be a way of him trying to look like town. But, the fact that he didn't die day 1 is perhaps telling. I mean, he was talking a lot in day 1. I would imagine scum would want to eliminate people that talk a lot. So, with that reasoning, I am going change my vote.

Vote: Ichimaru Gin

Still haven't re-read.  :( I can happily get behind a vote: axxle. I have a gut and I'm going to listen to it.
This reads more like the Voltaire I've known before.
I was a little concerned before with you being so gun-ho for Axxle yesterday, and not much today.
But this makes more sense.

As far as Ichi, I don't know. I don't know what WW tunneling me means either.
I feel like you may be better at reading than me than others, but I am not sure.
Let's see, I think we've been in 2 games--one me as super inexperienced scum, and then HoC where I was basically an IC.

Aside from ADK, the rest of the people on my wagon are all mildly scummy to me.

And I now recall it was BA who earlier found Voltaire townie because of the watch and investigation on him (to answer ww's earlier question).

At any rate, I am happy with an Axxle lynch today. Nik is a little townier than before, but most of his posts are still votes. S_P hasn't been around much, but is he VLA? Oh, and Xerxes is very busy with another ongoing game--I've got mostly null reads on him. EgorK said he was rereading I believe; he's lurked so far though.

How, at 5:45 PM, do you recall BA finding Voltaire townie, which happened at 6:27 PM?

I checked his posts.  No other mention of Voltaire's towniness.
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #852 on: May 29, 2014, 10:03:34 am »

Also, he'd been putting mild suspicion on me for being "erratic" which I don't think is either scummy or anti-town, and as town I've found that people suspecting me tend to be more likely scum than not.

Well, also, in the post where he did it:

Well, I am going back and rereading everything. I am still not done, but who really stands out to me is Xerxes. His voting and reasoning seems erratic, to me at least.

he's setting himself up for a justified vote against you.  Though he votes for EgorK next (while still maintaining suspicion of you).  I'm not sure of a scum reasoning for doing this unless one of you or EgorK are on the same team as Beyond Awesome.  Possibly to test the waters for getting wagons started.

Also, I think the manner in which he hopped on Ichi's wagon shows that Ichi and Beyond Awesome aren't of the same faction. 
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #853 on: May 29, 2014, 10:15:38 am »

I shouldn't have said "recall" in the last sentence of my post two posts above.  What I meant is how could you have been thinking about it if it hadn't happened at that time?  The tl;dr version is:

3:36: Joth says Voltaire is a bad lynch because of investigations
4:33: ADK disagrees with Joth about Voltaire being cleared
5:45: Ichi agrees with ADK and says people finding Voltaire townie are scummy (the only one of which is the confirmed treestumped town Joth)
(didn't quote) 5:47: I ask Ichi who these people are, Ichi says Joth and SP, we confirm Joth is town and SP didn't say it
6:27: BA says Voltaire is almost certainly town
7:14: Ichi recalls that at 5:45 he was thinking of something that happened in the future
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #854 on: May 29, 2014, 10:19:41 am »

ok, so maybe they're both scum on different teams?
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AndrewisFTTW

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #855 on: May 29, 2014, 11:08:44 am »

Vote Count 2.5

Ichimaru Gin (5): Archetype, A Drowned Kernel, Axxle, Beyond Awesome, Witherweaver L-1
EgorK (1): Nik
Axxle (1): Ichimaru Gin
Beyond Awesome (2): Voltaire, XerxesPraelor

Not Voting (2): EgorK, scott_pilgrim

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.
Day 2 ends on Monday June 2 at 9:30 PM FT. Please note: mail-mi will be going to Spain around the 4th or 5th. AndrewisFTTW will be the official mod from then until about June 15th or 16th.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2014, 12:27:43 pm by mail-mi »
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #856 on: May 29, 2014, 11:33:06 am »

Vote: Ichimaru. This is L-1
Ok. First of all, do you really think it's a good idea to put me at L-1 with no claim, like 5 days left, and likely very few members of town still alive?

6:27: BA says Voltaire is almost certainly town
7:14: Ichi recalls that at 5:45 he was thinking of something that happened in the future
Interesting™
I really don't have an answer to this. I thought that I remembered that BA was the one who had said it, but I guess not. That he then fulfilled what I thought he had done in the past is somewhat odd. I won't make any jokes about precognition, but I'm tempted to. ;D

I could lynch BA. Although his case on me was very scummy, he is new, so some of it could be due to that. But man, I mean Axxle totally sheeped my wagon and hasn't even really responded to any of the votes on him. They're my two preferences today.

Heh, but I'm still at L-1. Well I guess it's good that no one's hammered me yet. Again, I'll claim if necessary. Seriously though, if there are any real townies on my wagon, please unvote. Archetype's vote is weak, Axxle is sheeping, BA made a scummy case...it's all very suspect.

Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #857 on: May 29, 2014, 11:41:06 am »

Why would anyone hammer here?  That would certainly be a scummy thing to do.

I don't see any merit in waiting for L-1.  I think you should claim if you're going to.
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XerxesPraelor

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #858 on: May 29, 2014, 11:46:22 am »

Is this BA's first time? If so I'd prefer to not lynch them today at least.
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XerxesPraelor

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #859 on: May 29, 2014, 11:46:57 am »

I also think IG should claim.
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #860 on: May 29, 2014, 11:50:55 am »

Why would anyone hammer here?  That would certainly be a scummy thing to do.

I don't see any merit in waiting for L-1.  I think you should claim if you're going to.
Dude. It wouldn't really matter if there's a scum (combined scumteams) majority, would it?

And man. We're only halfway through D2 and the case on me sucks. Why are you and XP pressuring me to claim?

I'd really like to hear from other people. Preferably people that I have townreads on.

jotheonah

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #861 on: May 29, 2014, 12:04:47 pm »

Is this BA's first time? If so I'd prefer to not lynch them today at least.

Why is that at all relevant?
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #862 on: May 29, 2014, 12:06:41 pm »

Why would anyone hammer here?  That would certainly be a scummy thing to do.

I don't see any merit in waiting for L-1.  I think you should claim if you're going to.
Dude. It wouldn't really matter if there's a scum (combined scumteams) majority, would it?

And man. We're only halfway through D2 and the case on me sucks. Why are you and XP pressuring me to claim?

I'd really like to hear from other people. Preferably people that I have townreads on.

I don't follow the first point at all.  What do you mean combined scumteams majority?

The case on you does not suck.  Particularly the point about you scrambling to find anyone else scummy that you indicated that the only person around that is confirmed town is scummy.  And then a statement which could not have been true.  Also particularly is your constant appeals to your meta.  "Overly defensive Ichi is town Ichi", "I'm acting like I always do as town," etc.  (Yes those are paraphrased.)  Also particularly that you're jumping on the people that anyone could easily get traction for a wagon---Axxle, SP, who both narrowly avoided lynches yesterday so people should be eager to jump on them today.  And then BA after a good case is made against him.

You should claim now (if you're going to at all) because if you're not going to be lynched today, we should find someone else.  It's much worse to have that happen in the last day/hours before deadline.  What's the advantage to waiting?
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #863 on: May 29, 2014, 12:15:54 pm »

Why would anyone hammer here?  That would certainly be a scummy thing to do.

I don't see any merit in waiting for L-1.  I think you should claim if you're going to.
Dude. It wouldn't really matter if there's a scum (combined scumteams) majority, would it?

And man. We're only halfway through D2 and the case on me sucks. Why are you and XP pressuring me to claim?

I'd really like to hear from other people. Preferably people that I have townreads on.

I don't follow the first point at all.  What do you mean combined scumteams majority?

The case on you does not suck.  Particularly the point about you scrambling to find anyone else scummy that you indicated that the only person around that is confirmed town is scummy.  And then a statement which could not have been true.  Also particularly is your constant appeals to your meta.  "Overly defensive Ichi is town Ichi", "I'm acting like I always do as town," etc.  (Yes those are paraphrased.)  Also particularly that you're jumping on the people that anyone could easily get traction for a wagon---Axxle, SP, who both narrowly avoided lynches yesterday so people should be eager to jump on them today.  And then BA after a good case is made against him.

You should claim now (if you're going to at all) because if you're not going to be lynched today, we should find someone else.  It's much worse to have that happen in the last day/hours before deadline.  What's the advantage to waiting?
I mean that size of scumteam x + scumteam y, etc could be bigger than the size of town after you lynch me.

I distinctly mentioned BA's newness and factored that into whether I wanted to lynch him or not--I was not jumping on BA, so that point is illegitimate. Anyone is better than me since I don't know who else is town. You have tunneled me basically since D1, so I find your points about my legitimate reads on Axxle and S_P quite ironic considering that you were basically setting me up for a mislynch yesterday.

You say "narrowly avoided lynches" like you want to protect them or something. I think for sure at least one of them is scum. Yes, I have appealed to my meta, but no one seems to care about that. I guess I'll just claim now since you've got XP around to hammer me.

I am a Lover.

Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #864 on: May 29, 2014, 12:24:54 pm »

So if # scumteam x + # scumteam y > #town, why does that matter?  Why are only two scumteams used?

You said BA and Axxle were your two preferences for today.  Earlier you tried to peg SP by doing something scummy which he didn't do.  Those points aren't illegitimate.

This has nothing to do with the alignment of BA, Axxle, SP, except that they're likely different from yours.  They could still be scum.  The point I'm making is that it looks, to me, like you're trying to jump to the next-most-likely person to get lynched today.

I see a lot of Lovers on the list.  What was the card?
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #865 on: May 29, 2014, 12:29:03 pm »

So if # scumteam x + # scumteam y > #town, why does that matter?  Why are only two scumteams used?

You said BA and Axxle were your two preferences for today.  Earlier you tried to peg SP by doing something scummy which he didn't do.  Those points aren't illegitimate.

This has nothing to do with the alignment of BA, Axxle, SP, except that they're likely different from yours.  They could still be scum.  The point I'm making is that it looks, to me, like you're trying to jump to the next-most-likely person to get lynched today.

I see a lot of Lovers on the list.  What was the card?
Uh. I can't believe how hard you are working to misinterpret what I say and find it scummy. I said scumteam x and scumteam y , etc!!

I kept the card chapel

Please, is there anyone else around who is actually going to listen?

Everyone, if ww succeeds in killing me today, kill him tomorrow; I am almost sure he is scum.

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #866 on: May 29, 2014, 12:30:05 pm »

unvote
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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #867 on: May 29, 2014, 12:30:28 pm »

vote: xp
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #868 on: May 29, 2014, 12:30:42 pm »

Oh, sorry.  But I still don't get the sum greater than town thing.
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Witherweaver

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #869 on: May 29, 2014, 12:33:07 pm »

How do Lovers work?  Is the partner selected randomly, or does it come from another Lover role?
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #870 on: May 29, 2014, 12:36:14 pm »

How do Lovers work?  Is the partner selected randomly, or does it come from another Lover role?
I do not have a partner. Thus I can only assume that it, like everything else, was randomly card based and no one had another lover role.

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #871 on: May 29, 2014, 12:37:49 pm »

In this setup, everyone who picked a "Lover" role is a lover with each other. If one dies, they all die (I think that's how it works).

There are vanilla lovers but also the possibility for lovers within the various scum factions.

That said, the possibility of killing multiple town players with one lynch is probably a risk we don't want to take, so unvote.

PPE: Do you know you have no partner, or are lovers just not informed?
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #872 on: May 29, 2014, 12:39:00 pm »

In this setup, everyone who picked a "Lover" role is a lover with each other. If one dies, they all die (I think that's how it works).

There are vanilla lovers but also the possibility for lovers within the various scum factions.

That said, the possibility of killing multiple town players with one lynch is probably a risk we don't want to take, so unvote.

PPE: Do you know you have no partner, or are lovers just not informed?
Well my role PM said that I didn't have a partner. And I don't have a qt or anything.

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #873 on: May 29, 2014, 12:40:24 pm »

There is only one Mafia Lover and one Alien Lover.  Are they part of the same group as Town Lover from Chapel?  I know it says the "Loverizer" type roles creates different groups.
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Ichimaru Gin

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Re: Mafia XLIV: Donald's Greater Idea Mafia (Day 2!)
« Reply #874 on: May 29, 2014, 12:41:31 pm »

There is only one Mafia Lover and one Alien Lover.  Are they part of the same group as Town Lover from Chapel?  I know it says the "Loverizer" type roles creates different groups.
Well if they do exist, I at least can't communicate with them. It's a good question though.
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