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[RTT]

In the German Version the 2 Cards : Fortune Teller and Soothsayer are both translated to: Wahrsagerin 
just noticed that a few weeks ago and wanted some tips how to play when both of them are in the Kingdom with something like Mystik, Wishing Well, Doctor, Journeyman, Contraband ... (all Cards where you name a card )

I wrote the German Facebookteam about it and they answered that they told the publisher about it so that they can think about changing that in future Versions.

[DStu]

I think I would just include the package name like
Guilds.Soothsayer and Cornucopia.Fortune_Teller

[Watno]

Isn't Soothsayer translated as "Wahrsager" in German (the male form)?
Of course this is still not ideal, but allows to distinguish them.

[RTT]

its 100% the same name Wahrsagerin at least in my version ... i layed the cards next to each other and compared them

[Kirian]

Isn't Soothsayer translated as "Wahrsager" in German (the male form)?
Of course this is still not ideal, but allows to distinguish them.

Maybe I'm mistaken, but isn't the Soothsayer also female?

[SCSN]

I'd just enjoy the quirk for what it is and accept that it makes WW and Mystic a bit stronger, Contraband weaker and leaves Doctor and Journeyman about the same.

[SirPeebles]

I'd just enjoy the quirk for what it is and accept that it makes WW and Mystic a bit stronger, Contraband weaker and leaves Doctor and Journeyman about the same.

It impacts a few other cards too, like Menagerie, Hunting Party, Harvest, and Fairgrounds.  Each is somewhat weaker.

[Asper]

Isn't Soothsayer translated as "Wahrsager" in German (the male form)?
Of course this is still not ideal, but allows to distinguish them.

I believe RTT might have an earlier version, as my copy of Guilds has "Wahrsager", too (while Cornucopia has the female  "Wahrsagerin").

[Awaclus]

WW and Mystic

For some reason, the first time I read this post, I thought you were talking about yourself and Wandering Winder.

[popsofctown]

I learned in my medieval literature class that "sooth" means truth so a soothsayer is a "truthteller".  In that way it can possibly be telling truth about what's happening right now, which kind of matches the difference between the cards.

[GwinnR]

I think in the newest version, Soothsayer is male (Wahrsager): http://www.dominion-welt.de/Downloads/DomGuildD_SR_72dpi.pdf (page 2 and 8).

The problem is, that the translater only knew Base and Guilds.
In the german forums, we collect errors in the translations and now told them to make it better than Hans im Glück. Fortunately they did, but sometimes it was hard to explain the edge cases with expensions the translater didn't know ;-)

[LastFootnote]

I think in the newest version, Soothsayer is male (Wahrsager): http://www.dominion-welt.de/Downloads/DomGuildD_SR_72dpi.pdf (page 2 and 8).

The problem is, that the translater only knew Base and Guilds.
In the german forums, we collect errors in the translations and now told them to make it better than Hans im Glück. Fortunately they did, but sometimes it was hard to explain the edge cases with expensions the translater didn't know ;-)

What are the German forums like, anyhow? I took five years of German in high school, but unfortunately I've forgotten a lot of it. Are there any interesting insights over there? Any conversations that we haven't really had here on f.DS?

[Kirian]

I think in the newest version, Soothsayer is male (Wahrsager):

Which is ridiculous, as that is quite clearly a female.

[Holger]

I think in the newest version, Soothsayer is male (Wahrsager):

Which is ridiculous, as that is quite clearly a female.

The German version uses male versions for almost all names that are gender-neutral in English, unfortunately. E.g. Peddler and Explorer are also translated as male ("Hausierer", "Entdecker"), in spite of the female illustrations.

[silverspawn]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

[Asper]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

The Dark Ages rulebook did the same. Instead of the originals example turn they made up their own - which included processing a Fortress into a Duchy.

[Holger]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

I was also surprised by this "invented rule"; but maybe Donald changed Crossroads from this at the last minute, and HiG only forgot to update the rulebook?

[Asper]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

I was also surprised by this "invented rule"; but maybe Donald changed Crossroads from this at the last minute, and HiG only forgot to update the rulebook?

I doubt it. The Hans im Glück Verlag made so many mistakes translating the dominion cards from the first game on, and the rulebooks are just the ugly tip of the iceberg (even though there are even more mistakes there). Many cards are printed wrong, though luckily it doesn't matter often for most of them (Pirate Ship, Procession and Tournament are cases where it always does). Most of the pre-hinterlands cards that do something on gain or buy are just caused by people not thinking much about it, and honestly i don't blame them for Thief not "gaining" Treasures or letting Chancellor "discard your deck". I mean, who could have known that made a difference? But would it have been asked too much to learn from that and do it better later, for example with Scavenger? Obviously.

[silverspawn]

it also says i can reveal trader for attacks and a whole bunch of effects trigger both on buy and on gain, even though the same rulebook clarifies that you always gain a card after you bought it

[markusin]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

I was also surprised by this "invented rule"; but maybe Donald changed Crossroads from this at the last minute, and HiG only forgot to update the rulebook?

I doubt it. The Hans im Glück Verlag made so many mistakes translating the dominion cards from the first game on, and the rulebooks are just the ugly tip of the iceberg (even though there are even more mistakes there). Many cards are printed wrong, though luckily it doesn't matter often for most of them (Pirate Ship, Procession and Tournament are cases where it always does). Most of the pre-hinterlands cards that do something on gain or buy are just caused by people not thinking much about it, and honestly i don't blame them for Thief not "gaining" Treasures or letting Chancellor "discard your deck". I mean, who could have known that made a difference? But would it have been asked too much to learn from that and do it better later, for example with Scavenger? Obviously.

Yeah it's hard to blame them too much. Donald X. designed these cards knowing what was to come in the future. The translators didn't.

But then, Urchin with +buy instead of +1 Action (or was it +1 card)? What on Earth is that!?

[GwinnR]

Yeah, there are some silly mistakes. You can find them here: http://forum.dominionblog.de/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1338#p23453

We hope, that ASS will make it better now, and they corrected some of the mistakes in the Base-game when they released it. Let's hope for the best for the other expensions.

[Holger]

this is slightly off topic, but i just read through my hinterlands rulebook, because i was waiting for something and had nothing to do.

for crossroad it says (~literal translation): If you play Crossroads for the rist time this turn, you get +3 actions. For every crossroads you play after the first one, you just gain +1 action. If you play this card f.e. through the throne room (base set) twice (and haven't played a crossroads before), you gain +3 actions the first time, the second time another +1action, so +4 actions total.

let's just make up wrong information and explain it!

I was also surprised by this "invented rule"; but maybe Donald changed Crossroads from this at the last minute, and HiG only forgot to update the rulebook?

I doubt it. The Hans im Glück Verlag made so many mistakes translating the dominion cards from the first game on, and the rulebooks are just the ugly tip of the iceberg (even though there are even more mistakes there). Many cards are printed wrong, though luckily it doesn't matter often for most of them (Pirate Ship, Procession and Tournament are cases where it always does). Most of the pre-hinterlands cards that do something on gain or buy are just caused by people not thinking much about it, and honestly i don't blame them for Thief not "gaining" Treasures or letting Chancellor "discard your deck". I mean, who could have known that made a difference? But would it have been asked too much to learn from that and do it better later, for example with Scavenger? Obviously.

Yeah it's hard to blame them too much. Donald X. designed these cards knowing what was to come in the future. The translators didn't.

Well, I'd have expected Donald/Rio Grande to tell the translators that these subtleties may be relevant for future expansions; after all, Donald had created (preliminary versions of) most of the expansion cards  before the base set release.
But most of HiG's mistakes (including all mistakes from Prosperity, Hinterlands and Dark Ages) were already wrong when published, and can only be attributed to carelessness or trying to "improve" the original wordings. (The Crossroads mistake can't, which is why I wondered on another rational explanation for it.)

OTOH, I think all cards also work when played in the mistranslated version; some people might even prefer to play with the mistakes, as they make Tournament and King's Court slightly weaker and Forge a little stronger.

[Donald X.]

Crossroads did not change at the last minute. I don't know how they managed to get that wrong.

I think the main issue is just, that publishers are used to "friendly" wordings, when games with enough rules-on-cards require "precise" wordings. There were a few cases where the translator asked me if a certain rewording would work or not; I guess there were other cases where he didn't ask.

[Holger]

Crossroads did not change at the last minute. I don't know how they managed to get that wrong.

Thanks for debunking my theory . It's great to get answers directly from the author on this.
There's no excuse for the weird translation, then. (I admit that I sometimes tend do consider Crossroads as always non-terminal as well, but that's because I don't re-read the card every time, which a translator should do.) I suppose Crossroads would be too close to strictly better than Scout if it always gave an Action...

I think the main issue is just, that publishers are used to "friendly" wordings, when games with enough rules-on-cards require "precise" wordings. There were a few cases where the translator asked me if a certain rewording would work or not; I guess there were other cases where he didn't ask.

Yes, probably. According to the German forum, HiG even refused to admit most of the more subtle mistakes they made when they were pointed out by forum members; they seemed to have no serious playing experience with several expansions themselves...

[Asper]

Even the new german version of the base game isn't that much to my liking. While they fixed older mistakes like Chancellor and Thief, Feast now says "Trash this. Gain a card costing 5$ for this." The new "for this" ("dafür") implies that the trashing is condition for the gain, which is of course wrong with Throne Room...

Just mentioning this because you wrote about "friendly" wordings, Donald - i bet they just thought it sounded more plausible this way...