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Author Topic: Alternate Newbie First Board?  (Read 1898 times)

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werothegreat

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Alternate Newbie First Board?
« on: November 21, 2011, 02:18:12 am »
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I take it upon myself to introduce Dominion to as many people as possible, as I love the game and think lots of people should play it.  However, this leads to the problem that about half the time I play Dominion, it's with Cellar, Market, Mine, Militia, Moat, Remodel, Smithy, Village, Woodcutter, and Workshop.  I have the list memorized.  And while the games can still be interesting, and there are new strategies to try every time, it nonetheless gets a little redundant.  So I thought I'd ask this forum if they could conceive of any different sets of 10 to try on n00bs.  It doesn't have to be completely different - just different enough that I don't get deja vu every time.  Also bear in mind I only have Base, Intrigue, Prosperity and Alchemy at the moment, so while suggestions from other expansions are good, and helpful to other readers, they are perhaps not so helpful to me personally.  Thanks!
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lympi

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Re: Alternate Newbie First Board?
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2011, 03:32:24 am »
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I have played "First Game" a lot. I feel your pain. I too am a Dominion pusher, so it kinda goes with the territory.

The thing is, "First Game" is a great board. It's simple but not too simple; it's got vanilla cards, trashers, drawers, an attack, some defense, everything. It teaches the fundamentals really well.

I think the most important part of "First Game" though— and this is a subtle thing— is it has multiple choices at every price point.

Dominion is ultimately a game of making choices about what to buy, and the more choices you have, the more interesting any given game is.

So my advice is this: if you tweak the "First Game" just tweak one or two cards (Workshop and/or Woodcutter, I'm looking at you), and make sure you keep the cost spread pretty much the same. So 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 4, 4, 5, 5.

Rookies are notoriously Action-heavy, so while keeping the 8 of the 10 cards in the sub-5 range is kinda boring, it's also sort of necessity.

Here are some potential tweaks to spice things up for you, but still keep it relatively simple for them:
  • Swap out Cellar for Courtyard - they both help massage poor draws in different ways.
  • Swap out Militia for Bureaucrat - a slightly less overt Attack that nudges n00bs towards better money with the free Silver.
  • Swap out ________ for Laboratory - Just to demonstrate the inversion and cost difference between Village and Laboratory.
  • Swap out Workshop for Steward - Pawn leads to too much AP for new players, Steward is just right.
  • Swap out Smithy for Envoy (if you have it… Amazon Big Box?) - It ups the interactivity, and keeps players engaged when it isn't their turn.
  • Swap out Remodel for Moneylender - Remodel can be a tough sell to demonstrate the benefits of trashing, since those benefits are not seen immediately… Moneylender is a bit more tangible.
If you pick up Cornucopia next, Menagerie is huge for new players; it's cheap and they always seem have a hand with no duplicates. Probably because they're always buying one of everything. (<- I feel like this could be the basis of a really lame Dominion standup routine: "Man, you ever see a newbie during their Buy phase… they're all 'Oh, I'll buy one of these, and one of these…'")
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Octo

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Re: Alternate Newbie First Board?
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2011, 08:39:18 am »
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I would with both sentiments expressed so far - First Game does get repetitive, but also it is a really good teacher.

The thing about first games is that people are learning the rules, and not the strategy. I've thought about steward and moneylender at times, but I'm hesitant because while that's basic stuff for us it's the third or fourth step for new players I find. The strength of trashing only becomes apparent when you have a yardstick to measure it against, when you have a feel for the speed of a deck without it. Mid-late game the effect of trashing is neglible, and early game you'll likely have to explain why its good, which I would rather avoid (I'd rather explain that buying is good first!)

Still, solid suggestions all round for swap-ins from lympi. Bureacrat especially, it's not as 'mean' as militia. Courtyard, not thought of that before, yeah that's a good shout. Also depends on the crowd - maybe just balls out and whack in the torturer! :D
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Jorbles

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Re: Alternate Newbie First Board?
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2011, 01:59:53 pm »
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You could replace the Mine with the Trading Post. It has similar principles but it showcases trashing in a much more effective manner. One thing I find frustrating about the first game is that there isn't anything that lets you immediately learn about the benefits of trashing. Trading Post is one of the best trashers to showcase the benefits of trashing without being confusing (Remodel and Mine are usually just too slow to really show it well, and Chapel is just confusing for new players who usually just see it as a counter for Witch).
« Last Edit: November 21, 2011, 02:02:27 pm by Jorbles »
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ChaosRed

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Re: Alternate Newbie First Board?
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2011, 02:15:32 pm »
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Not to sound too dissonant to the spirit of the thread I hope, but I have to say that I love the original starting board. I think it was really well-crafted and is a really good entry into the game.

Overall, I think base set is a really elegant design, there's a lot of careful thought put into base set. It remains probably my favorite expansion, just because its simplicity makes it very elegant.




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