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51
Dominion General Discussion / Madman wording
« on: March 05, 2013, 01:57:31 pm »
Madman says: "...return to the madman pile. If you do..."

What is the edge case where you play a madman and it doesn't return to the madman pile?

I assume it's some sort of lose-track thing, but we were playing the other night and couldn't come up with a way a card can get scooped up from in play.

Maybe it's a theme for Guilds?

Ed

52
Game Reports / Is losing the FG split 6/4 THAT bad?
« on: March 01, 2013, 08:57:16 pm »
My opponent made a vulgar comment and disappeared.

Turn 5.

I'm pretty sure with equal play you still have a 40% or so shot of winning after losing the split. Am I wrong?

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201303/01/game-20130301-172837-a667edb8.html

53
Dominion Articles / Combo: Sage/Vineyards
« on: February 28, 2013, 11:39:10 am »
Really short for an "article" and pretty simple:

If there are cheap cards, and some way to buy them with an existing card (in the sample game it was Bridge), you can just do the following:

(1) Open Sage/Support card
(2) Buy a potion
(3) Buy Vineyards if you have a potion in hand, otherwise a Sage, otherwise a $2 card that the Sage will skip over


You want to get as many of the vineyards as you can before the other guy sees what you are doing.
Sage is a great card for getting the Potion in hand (and the other support card). It skips everything except the support card, the potion and the other sages - so you can cycle super quickly.
Sage usually falls apart in the end game when it starts drawing your Green, but it doesn't have that flaw when you are going Vineyards.

In this game I was so confident with my ability to cycle I was even BUYING ruins when I couldn't afford Havens - they counted as actions for my vineyards. My opponent who opened Marauder (normally a very good opening) was just feeding me more power to my vineyards.

Here is the sample game:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/28/game-20130228-075508-6950caea.html

(Glad I got in 3.5 Dark Ages games on iso before the server reset... Idea: What if there was an extension for Chrome that made  Goko look and feel like iso... Then people who liked Goko the way it was could play that way. And people who preferred iso could do that too (and even play each other). I have no problem paying Goko money, but I really don't enjoy the interface... It would be great to play with DA cards all the time...)

Ed

54
Game Reports / Is Coppersmith-Cartographer-Counting House a real thing?
« on: February 25, 2013, 09:48:07 pm »
It felt like it was working here, but just barely. And there weren't a lot of other options...

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/25/game-20130225-184606-304c3777.html

No other draw made it tough, and no extra buy meant one-Colony turns were the best I was going to do. I think the Fishing Villages were mistakes. Villages would have been better. I ended up picking up Havens when I couldn't get to $5 for a Cartographer. Not sure if that was right either...

Ed

55
Dominion General Discussion / MTG cards as Dominion cards
« on: February 21, 2013, 04:03:15 pm »
I played MTG when it first came out, so I really only know the early cards. But I started thinking, given DXV has said MTG is his favorite game he didn't design, and it's obviously a card game that involves having a deck that interacts with itself, are there Dominion cards that have similar effects to early MTG cards? And is anything obvious missing?

Some key cards and their "equivalents":

Ancestral Recall: Smithy
Timetwister: Outpost
Wheel of Fortune: Minion
Channel: Vault/secret chamber
Black Lotus: gold
Demonic Tutor: Scavenger
Clone: band of misfits
[enchantment that lets you control the other guy's creature]: Possession

I'm sure many of you are far more familiar with MTG cards than I am. Interesting that two of the cards I thought of didn't have their "equivalents" until Datk Ages. Here's betting that one of those early MTG cards pops up with a Guilds equivalent,...

Ef

56
Game Reports / And that's how you pull a tie from a loss...
« on: February 21, 2013, 02:24:19 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/21/game-20130221-112046-62265483.html

His deck: 7 Highways, 6 Pawns, 5 Conspirators, 2 Tacticians, 1 Fishing Village, 7 Coppers, 3 Estates
He just played a Tactician.

I'm pretty sure on his next turn he empties the provinces.

I finish my action-portion of my turn with $19 and 4 buys. We are currently tied.

My buy phase:
 ednever buys a Conspirator.
   ednever buys a Conspirator.
   ednever buys a Pawn.
   ednever buys a Pawn.
   (ednever reshuffles.)
   (ednever draws: an Estate, a Copper, 2 Throne Rooms, and a Tactician.)

Pawns, Highways, and Conspirators are all gone.
InClass and ednever rejoice in their shared victory!


Whew! An extra buy would have been nice for the win, but I'll take the tie this time...

Ed

57
Game Reports / PPR forever
« on: February 11, 2013, 09:32:57 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/11/game-20130211-171409-18342e62.html

No +buy and we could both draw our decks (one with Torturers, one with Scrying Pools)

I only won because I didn't trash my initial Estates.

Amazing that we could both draw our decks after loading them with 3 provinces and 4 duchies!

Ed

58
Game Reports / Couldn't have done it without Develop
« on: February 10, 2013, 05:24:49 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/10/game-20130210-142136-eac952b0.html

Could have played the last turn better (Remodel the Peddler into a Province, Salvage the Tactician and pick up an extra duchy or something), but it worked anyway.

I likely could have been beaten if he started going for piles. Two were gone and I needed the Throne Rooms. I brought the TR down to 4 left, but if he had gone at them I would have been done for.

Ed

59
Game Reports / Putting it all together
« on: February 07, 2013, 10:06:06 pm »
This is a great game to demonstrate "putting it all together". I'll write up more on it later, but here is the game:
Bishop, Colony, Envoy, Feast, King's Court, Library, Mine, Native Village, Pirate Ship, Platinum, Shanty Town, and Wishing Well

At the bottom of the post is the gamelog. But before reading it, think a little about the board and how it could evolve.

Note a few things:
1- There is no +buy, so ending with a big KC mega-turn is basically out of the question
2- It's a Colony game, so it will go long
3- Only +actions are not great options: Shanty Town, Native Village and King's Court (kind-of)
4- Only +draw is Envoy - which makes it difficult to connect what you want, or Library, which isn't great when stacked with KC
5- Only trashing is Bishop - which helps out the other guy as much as you
6- Mine is interesting as it lets you upgrade to Platinums - especially with King's Court in play

-=-=-
I've never written with that black out before, but here's my attempt. Hopefully it works.

"The Answer"

There are two key cards here that aren't mentioned in the list above. The first is Feast! By King's Courting Feast you can pick up three cards in a turn (+ your buy -> but one of those gains needs to be another Feast). You need to do that if you want to keep getting food for your Bishops to trash - since with KC a single Bishop can trash three cards a turn!

The second key card is Pirate Ship. Cards like PS (and Sab) become brutal with King's Court. By picking up a bunch of them and KCing them I managed to destroy my opponents entire economy. He was left with a single bishop as his only source of cash. The best he could do, if he KC'd it was pick up a silver - but that left him open to me Pirate Shipping him all over again. Instead he managed only a copper for a few turns to build his way back up. But if you are resorting to buying copper for cash on a Colony on turn 20, you know you are  in trouble.

So, why I think this game is interesting:
1- You need to build an engine without any real effective +actions
2- You need to use King's Court like crazy, but without a mega-turn
3- Alt-VP is key, but you need to use a trick - King's Courting Feast - in order to pull it off
4- If you did all that you would still likely lose to a modified money deck (King-'s Court->Mine->Envoy->Colonies), so you need to use attacks to slow him down - and the attack is the lowly Pirate Ship
5- You need to have patience and be willing to fall behind

The game wasn't played perfectly by a long shot (I missed getting a Feast even one turn), but it was pretty enjoyable.


Love to hear thoughts.


The log:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201302/07/game-20130207-185121-c330a625.html

Ed

60
Dominion General Discussion / How to play the "iconic" kingdom
« on: January 31, 2013, 06:54:21 pm »
From the DXV interview thread:


"I can pick a poster child for each set though.

Main: Laboratory
Intrigue: Nobles
Seaside: Wharf
Alchemy: Golem
Prosperity: Bank
Cornucopia: Fairgrounds
Hinterlands: Haggler
Dark Ages: Graverobber"

So that's your 8-card kingdom.

How do you play it?
(pretty clear you open silver/silver anyway...)

At first glance i thought it was obvious, but the more I look the more I see cool options.

Ed

Ed

61
Game Reports / Why Menagerie is a high skill card
« on: January 31, 2013, 11:53:10 am »
I'm a little proud of this game.

Menagerie is my Achilles heel. I experience no better satisfaction playing Dominion than when I get a Menagerie-draw engine work.
I also really really like Monument Engines - that allow you to play 6 or so per turn letting you delay Province buys - sometimes forever.

This one Kingdom combined both.

Monument was the only 'come back' VP available, but otherwise it was a great Menagerie board: Inn, Mine, Great Hall, Farming Village (for Monument plays). Salvager is a 'good enough' trasher here, but had the huge downside of letting the other player trash provinces for provinces and speed up the game. Thankfully my opponent didn't catch on to that idea until near the end.

I was still afraid by the end I wouldn't be able to come back, but I pulled it off with 5 Duchies on turn 17, and a buy everything green that was left turn 19, to sneak in a victory.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/31/game-20130131-084449-7d0005cb.html

Likely would have been beaten by a Big-Money that used Salvager effectively, but not near as much fun.

Ed

62
Game Reports / Conflicting Kingdom
« on: January 28, 2013, 02:26:33 pm »
Apothecary, Baron, Chapel, Conspirator, Contraband, Library, Lookout, Native Village, Potion, Royal Seal, and Scrying Pool

Chapel is go-to - especially with Conspirators. But maybe Lookout is better as it's +1 Action? Or wait. There's Apothecary, so maybe you want to hold on to your coppers. So Chapel it is. But wait, your +buy is Baron, so maybe you want to keep your Estates? But Scrying Pool+Conspirator doesn't want the Estates or the Coppers. Hm... In any case I'm going to want to build an engine, so I might want more then one terminal buy. Contraband could work there, but it doesn't fit with either Apothecary or Scrying Pool. Maybe play multiple Barons? But then I need actions. Only actions are Native Village. And it works great for tucking things away with Apothecary. I guess that could work. Wait. Library? That works great with Native Village. It could even work with Conspirators. But not with Apothecary or Scrying Pool.

Hold on. Maybe it's some weird combination of all that? Is there a synergy I'm not seeing.

OK. I'll go Apothecary to pick up coppers, Scrying Pool to draw the actions Apothecary lines up, Conspirator to get extra cash (and get picked up by the Pools), Baron for extra buys, Native Village for the extra actions. Maybe a single Contraband (since he won't know what I'm picking up on any given turn - so many options).

OK. I'm set.

Now what do I open with? Baron? Potion? And what about my $3? Lookout? Chapel? Silver? Copper?

Really interesting game:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/28/game-20130128-111553-2294e28e.html

(We both ended up doing a similar strategy. I invested a little more in the engine with extra buys and ignoring Province until my second last turn - and it paid out. P1 advantage helped, but I don't think he could have got a province on his next turn anyway)

Fun one. If the Kingdom challenge was still open I would have submitted this baby for sure.

Ed

64
Game Reports / Maybe the dumbest game of Dominion ever
« on: December 27, 2012, 02:00:13 pm »
Possession
Masquerade
King's Court

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/27/game-20121227-104750-3085e760.html

He avoided Masq. I went with two (three eventually) and sent two over to him.
I won when he gave up (I'm pretty sure he shouldn't have. I had just Masq'd his single province over to me - but there were only two empty piles and he had a ton of KC's and possessions - and I still had a Masq with no way to trash it). But after the madness started I have no idea how the game was going to end or how to play a strategy correctly.

I chose to buy Possessions and KC's over Provinces. And bought a bunch of Villages to draw down that pile. When I possessed him, I sent over Possessions, KCs followed by Green. But Province over Possession.

But really I had no idea. Here's our conversation during the game:

10:31 ednever: hi
10:31 ednever: gl
10:31 huskyhawk: u2
10:37 ednever: oops [I bought an IGG while possessing him]
10:37 huskyhawk: haha :D
10:38 huskyhawk: there is a possession
10:38 huskyhawk: i was starting to think i had tricked myself into not actually getting them
10:40 ednever: Masq-Possession games are a little dumb
10:40 ednever: in 2p
10:40 huskyhawk: definitely
10:40 huskyhawk: i hadnt thought about going for a deck that buys masqs then given them to the other person
10:40 huskyhawk: i tried to counter it through getting possessions
10:40 huskyhawk: but i cant seem to find them in here, haha
10:40 ednever: yeaH
10:41 ednever: Masq is so fast it's often the only way
10:41 huskyhawk: yeah, with an opening 5-2 split
10:41 huskyhawk: i guess i could have just gone masq
10:41 huskyhawk: would have been hard though
10:42 huskyhawk: there it is [I play KC-Possession and then play KC-Masq while on his turn]
10:42 huskyhawk: gg
10:42 ednever: hm
10:42 huskyhawk: i assume its over, isnt it?
10:43 ednever: Don't think so
10:43 ednever: The game is a mess
10:43 ednever: I don't know how it ends
10:43 huskyhawk: well, kc-masq draws are the way, imo
10:43 ednever: yeah
10:43 ednever: But when do the piles empty?
10:43 huskyhawk: i guess when you feel like ending it and winning
10:43 huskyhawk:
10:43 huskyhawk: right?
10:44 ednever: How?
10:44 huskyhawk: you have full deck control over both of us
10:44 huskyhawk: you can just dictate how the game goes from here
10:44 ednever: Nope
10:44 ednever: We both have Masc and Possessions
10:44 ednever: If I buy any Green then you can just steal it back
10:45 huskyhawk: yeah, i guess id need to start drawing kcs with possessions to pull it in
10:45 huskyhawk: idk tho
10:45 ednever: I honestly don't know how to play this
10:45 ednever: it may just come down to pure luck
10:45 ednever: on who gets what draw
10:46 huskyhawk: sigh
10:46 huskyhawk: that hurts [I hit KC-Masq again on his turn]
10:46 huskyhawk: again... [I send over his only province]
10:46 ednever: That might do it
10:47 huskyhawk: yeah, i needed to draw a possession
10:47 huskyhawk: to have a chance
10:47 huskyhawk: and i cant seem to doso
10:47 huskyhawk: lol
10:47 huskyhawk: gg

Ed

65
Dominion General Discussion / A thread to Share Scout kingdoms
« on: December 26, 2012, 02:25:11 pm »
If people are sharing double Tactician Kingdoms, I think it's only right we start sharing kingdoms where the most dominant card in Dominion remains dominant when it "depends on the kingdom". Obviously I mean Scout.

If you play a kingdom where Scout is a good buy, go ahead and share them here.
If you disagree with a position, argue that here too.

Here's the kingdom that inspired the thread:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/26/game-20121226-111726-2009839d.html

Key cards:
1- Great Hall
2- Ghost Ship to slow the other guy down
3- No villages (so only one terminal per turn)
4- Peddlers for $s
5- Lookout (to thin the deck) for Peddlers
6- Spice Merchant - for more deck thinning and early +buys (before you start playing GS every turn)
7- Haven as a nice $2 for the plan (even though I never hit $2 and couldn't buy a Peddler)

Share more Scout kingdoms!

Ed

66
Game Reports / 8 Empty piles
« on: December 26, 2012, 01:55:49 pm »
OK. Maybe a little gratuitous, but I wanted to see how many piles I could grab at the end.

Didn't play it perfectly (to meet that goal). I definitely could have empties 1-2 more. Maybe even three.

Fun times.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/26/game-20121226-105328-ba8e5056.html

67
Game Reports / Choices when the other player has resigned
« on: December 24, 2012, 11:00:22 pm »
My opponent resigned during my turn on this game:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/24/game-20121224-182424-fa9bb48e.html

The bot selected which pile I couldn't buy when I played contraband.

Interestingly enough, it selected 'curse'. I think it auto-chooses the card you would least want to buy?

Unless it was much smarter than I thought...

I was ahead by 3 points. 2 piles gone. 2 curses left. I play Contraband. The right choice to block is "Curse" - and that's what the AI did...

Ed

68
Game Reports / My first Stale mate!
« on: December 23, 2012, 11:19:49 pm »
Dominion is incredibly designed to avoid any possibility of a stale mate.

Almost every way to win involves buying down VP cards - which cause the game to end. The only exceptions are Goons, Bishop and Monument. Goons and Bishop need to keep buying things to get the VP - which almost always brings the game to an end. In theory one could play a Monument engine that doesn't buy anything - but in practice the +$2 it gets every time it's played encourages you to pick up green at some point - and eventually end the game on provinces...

But today I played a game that actually turned into a stale mate. I've never seen anything like it:

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/23/game-20121223-200910-3b7bbb65.html

Basically the scenario was this:
- 2 Embargos on Provinces
- The only +buy was Contraband
- Cities were in play and had been split pretty evenly
- Border Villages were already empty - so Level 2 Cities

Neither one of us wanted to empty a 2nd pile - it would let the other person get the City +buys and end it on their terms.

Both Cities and Monuments were down to one card. I was working my way through Envoys when my opponent gave up (I had the edge on Monuments - 5 to 4, and I had got started on getting the moument VP a little earlier than he did). But when I got the Envoys down to 1, I wasn't sure what I should do next. I think pick up a Contraband. He gets forced to name one of the two single-card piles. I start running down a fourth pile until it has one card in it and I can play Contraband and empty two of the three piles he lets me.

Would have been a weird drawn-out ending.

anyone else ever had a true stale-mate? Or something close to it?

I guess it can happen with Possession mirrors a little - but even there you try to buy as much green as you can...

Ed

69
Game Reports / 20 turns to 8 provinces, with Festival and Navigator?!?!
« on: December 20, 2012, 10:47:45 am »
What happened here?

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/20/game-20121220-073151-ad4f3b76.html

I thought I had a great strategy here - Picking up islands, great halls, bazaars and a festival or two, then transition into Vineyards. The Island+Great Hall+Vineyards means I could pick up a ton of VP, and keep my deck flowing.

It seemed to work, but my opponent just flew through the Provinces- picking up 8 in just 20 turns. His only support was money, Navigator and Festival (and an Inn at the end).

I know Navigator is under-valued, but this seems a little ridiculous.

What am I missing here?

Ed


70
Game Reports / Is Workshop+Vineyards a "Thing"
« on: December 14, 2012, 12:04:57 pm »
 8:56 King's Skort: is ws/vineyard really a thing? seems like it shouldn't be a thing

Good question. I didn't see anything else on this board and thought it would be a fun thing to try, but is it dominant? Maybe on a weak board?

The Spice Merchant helps my cycling - but I kept buying copper to recharge him, so not a ton. And cantrip would have been about the same.
Ended up picking up 4 potions (the most I've ever had I think) to drive down the Vineyards pile.
And a $2 card was handy on some Spice Merchant, Potion, Copper, VP hands.

But could this work in a more general sense?

The game:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/14/game-20121214-090019-3544844b.html

Ed

71
Game Reports / Why "playing around" is worth it
« on: December 14, 2012, 11:53:51 am »
Here is the set:
Apprentice, Baron, City, Explorer, Fishing Village, Mining Village, Remodel, Smugglers, Stables, and Venture

What's the strategy?

What if you open 5/2?

I decided right from the start to try something I thought was pretty exotic. Usually when I do that it crashes and burns (rarely it results in a new go-to combo like Develop-Vineyards. Usually it amounts to a mess and losing 7 provinces to 1). This time it wasn't a good two-card combo, but really cool 4-card (maybe 5-card) one. It even involved a strategy of remodeling coppers into Estates - which is usually a HUGE mistake.

Here the game if you want to cheat:
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/14/game-20121214-084908-888fb922.html

Ed

72
Game Reports / This is how you empty piles!
« on: December 10, 2012, 09:01:59 pm »
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/10/game-20121210-175845-270e0231.html

— Your turn 16 —
....You do a bunch of stuff...
You play an Oasis.
... You draw a Province and get +1 action and +$1.
... You discard an Estate.
You play an Oasis.
... You draw a Copper and get +1 action and +$1.
... You discard an Estate.
You play an Oasis.
... You draw a Potion and get +1 action and +$1.
... You discard an Estate.
You play an Oasis.
... (You reshuffle.)
... You draw an Estate and get +1 action and +$1.
... You discard an Estate.
You play an Oasis.
... You draw an Estate and get +1 action and +$1.
... You discard an Estate.
You play a Haggler.
... You get +$2.
You play a Haggler.
... You get +$2.
You play 2 Potions, a Gold, and 7 Coppers.
You buy a Border Village.
... You gain a Haggler.
... You gain a Haggler.
... You gain a Haggler.
You buy a Border Village.
... You gain a Haggler.
... You gain a Haggler.
... You gain a Duchy.
You buy a Border Village.
... You gain an Oasis.
... You gain an Oasis.
... You gain an Oasis.
You return an Alchemist to the top of your deck.
You return an Alchemist to the top of your deck.
(You reshuffle.)

Hagglers, Oases, and Scrying Pools are all gone.


Ed

74
2012 / Upsets
« on: December 06, 2012, 03:12:46 pm »
I've been looking through the brackets and I realized what I'm really looking for is seeing upsets - when a much lower anked person wins against a much higher ranked person.

I thought I would strat a thread to keep track of them - for everyone who doesn't want to go through all four challonge sheets every day. If you see an upset post it here (or if you are upset yourself...)

So far:

Round One:

Gardens:
bjmartin (49) over qmech (16)
Mad Dog (45) over Silent Revenge (20)
shraeye (53) over Cherdano (12)

Witch:
Lowpants (49) over Fumachu (16)
SirPeeples (47) over Powerman (18)
Lord Hegie (51) over Qvist (14)

Thief:
Indur (40) over AgileCaveman (25)
Ipnotaizig (45) over Vichu (20)
PitzerMike (44) over Loppo (21)
Zappie (47) over pechoho (18)

Chapel:
MBergstrom (44) over Schneau (21)
EgorK (39) over Moomi (26)


Will Lord Hegie be the new RisingJaguar? We will have to wait and see...
(Lord Hegie currently leads for the biggest upset so far in the tournament - seed 51 over a seed 14! Maybe there should be an award for the biggest upset - defined by the absolute difference in seed level between the two players?)


Ed

Ed

75
Game Reports / Game Analysis: Depriving your opponent
« on: December 06, 2012, 03:00:23 pm »
This is a great game to help understand the value of depriving your opponent of what he needs most. I think both players played it pretty well.

The cards:
Adventurer, Alchemist, Chancellor, Contraband, Embargo, Expand, Fairgrounds, Potion, Trader, Village, and Wharf

I opened Silver/Silver to get to Wharf quickly.
The Mime opened 5/2 and picked up Wharf/Embargo

The best thing the Mime could do was get an Embargo out on Wharf before I had a chance to pick one up. Unfortunately luck was not on his side. But his turns 3/4 get him another Wharf and an Expand.

At that point The Mime doesn't have any Villages, so I see an opportunity to deprive him of the extra actions he needs to get a chain going. I start spamming the villages with far more than I need. I end up getting a 8/2 split.

He hits the Embargos and blocks out anything he thinks I need, while using Trader to stop the Embargo from working on him.
I pick up a Trader and 3 Embargos to try to do the same to him.

The interactions between Embargo, Trader and Expand means that one has to be very careful about what one buys on any given turn.

As the end game approaches I see an opening and start taking down Estates to try and end the game on piles. He sees it (maybe too late?) and Embargos Estates as well. I'm very close to being able to end it a few times, but can't quite manage it. Finally I get my chance and turn a Duchy into a province to be ahead of 3VP. Then buy an Estate and an Embargo, picking up (two curses), to take it by 2 VP.

Great game. Every game is better when Embargo is around. And even better when you mix that with Trader and a card like Expand or Remodel.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/06/game-20121206-093015-10c4c23e.html

Ed

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