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526

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 07, 2019, 03:27:30 pm »

So it is possible to answer that, but not the post immediately afterwards?Vote: DatSwan

In #492 you made a case that EFHW wasn't getting enough scrutiny for list of actions you found suspect. Did your opinion change before #1042-#1045?

No, after.

Was it a trap?

527

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 07, 2019, 02:36:41 pm »

So it is possible to answer that, but not the post immediately afterwards?Vote: DatSwan

In #492 you made a case that EFHW wasn't getting enough scrutiny for list of actions you found suspect. Did your opinion change before #1042-#1045?

528

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 07, 2019, 09:46:50 am »

And I did already say. The MiX wagon was scummy as fuck. He was clearly just an enthusiastic newbie, which makes me confident that (experienced) scum just jumped on the wagon to help the mislynch

As I think the wagon was super scummy, I think it's likely to have more than 1 scum on it. I don't think 6 town could actually have found him scummy rather than just a newbie

I'm trying to understand why this looked scummy as F. I also, don't think the question about how one can conclude there are two scum on MiX is answered or at least the analysis is substandard.

1. The mason who is an experienced player and their likely partner voted for MiX. My newb understanding is they get to talk in private about what they are seeing, engage in cooperative analysis, among other things. So respected town voted for MiX. You are ignoring this ~fact when stating "at least 2 scum are on MiX... and aserting it's scummy as F." 

2. In my assessment at least 3 people on MiX are town so why can't there be more. Only scum would know how many town where on MiX.

3. I thought the constant questions, flip-flopping the votes, jumping from newly forming wagon to wagon, the IRL FoS, etc. where highly suspect for a non-newb. He claimed to have played online mafia in a quicker format, he claimed to read previous games and know players meta, he had the right vocabulary of someone who shouldn't be treated as a newb, and yet you are overselling his newbness. If one does not code MiX newb, then it is ~reasonable to see why his behaviors could be interpreted as scum. I can see if one gave him newb status why one would view this behavior as less scummy on the spectrum, but not scummy at all? I mean scummy as F is like it is obvious to all that there is a near zero percent chance MiX is scum.

I am actually the only newb in this game (Ari played IRL) meaning I have never played in any form, I did not read any games, I did not read mafia strategy [sans to look up a couple words], my only experience is an explanation of how to play the game from my IRL partner, and discussion with them about some of their previous games at the time they were being played.

IF one is town
AND there is a chance all or all but one of the people on MiX are town
AND ignoring the fact that mason(s) were on MiX
WHILE saying the MiX wagon was scummy as F
THEN this is a dangerous/careless position for a town to take.   

529

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 06, 2019, 08:03:58 pm »

I'm over 30 by at least a teenager.

530

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 06, 2019, 01:43:31 pm »

Warning: Long post mostly data/coding.
Answers2: shrae's question on my read of rae.

After a thorough review/coding of all Rae's posts, I am leaning firm town for her. I don't see anything that is scummy, asks for reasons all votes, challenges votes on her, challenges analysis, teases, and jokes. At worst I see some not helpful discussion on theory. I could be missing something and it seems even smart well intentioned people in this thread disagree about conclusions. This message also enters my calculus.

Random other thought: Does silver's mistaking raerae/shraeye for newbs mean we can exclude silver/raerae, silver/shraeye as possible scum pairings?

The data and coding of all Rae's posts up to this point. Hyperlinked to aid town in jumping to posts with ease.
Key: A2= Answers to, ?2 = Question to, A?2 = Answer and questions to. 
65 Upset people beat her to wagon. *vote: shrae*
69 ?2-ari  is buddying good/bad
71 A2-ari  used too many words in reply *vote: ari*
128 ?2-shrae to clue in why gave joseph, faust, eddie 1 guess
130 A2-ari many wagons day 1 good bc can look back on interactions
131 ?2-shrae why care about their opinions (128)
135 ?2-mix Big wagons better than what… small wooden, etc.?
138 A2-mix votes are pointless w/o discussion… sheeping bad cases says nothing.
146 A2-mix Big RSV wagons are bad bc L2 on D1 no discussion
158 ?2-mix - shrae didn't post reason for mix vote, did u dscss in ur QT.
160 ?2-ss - Why db8 & ari town? ss said pretty sure on db8 & ari probably
161 A2-ari - mix gets FoS bc not freaking out, RR says can go both ways
163 A2-mix *vote: shrae* has xplaining to do re: #158
165 ?2-faust so ur the 3rd on rae?
176 A2-mix more Re: #158 - mix might defend scumbuddy case on him
180 A2-ss thanking for quick response see #178 evidence of towny posts
181 ?2-ss Scummy bc I'm ? For believing case not exist yet? #179
192 ?2-mix Re: #158 shrae didn't say reason. *vote: shrae*
235 A2-shrae hate when ur right
238 ?2-shrae Cute, but why vote for mix?
292 All - Don't accuse player of lying for IRL event. It sucks
295 A2-ds - Justfctn for ds's townead on RR bad. Accuses of buddying. (More Text)
298 ?2-eddie Quickhammer good for town?
316 A2-faust I'll vote when I please, don't vote on single post unless from role mssg
317 A2-ds will read later bc RL stuff
329 Reads on Everyone .. db8-new, faust-twnish, mail
330 A2? *vote: mix* bc mix cointroductions - evidenced
367 A2-LL Snarky but correct how to scumhunt w/o answers & interactions
370 A2-faust Rae's shrae case hinged on mix interaction, may be tunneling shrae
371 ?2-LL Why shrae towny, since LL claimed didn't know meta
375 A?2 @ds why faust towncred, bc he said? @faust U wouldn't let assertion fly for others?
390 ?2-joe Why voting rae? No reason.
404 A?2-LL I play my way. Looking for anything particular in my response?
405 A2-efhw Re: shrae/mix QT slip. Town shouldn't defend case against self.
422 ?2:-joe Justification of vote by joe 4 rae based on others play, is rubbish
431 A2-joe not helping town with sheep votes absent of reason
463 A2-ds faust assertion he is town, isn't a reason he is town
467 A2-ds D1 to early to claim other than normal game. RMM could be Different
470 A2-ds faust assertion as town is not reason to accept as fact, rubbish logic.
474 A?2-ds Getting now where, what if faust claimed not town aligned or 3rd party
512 A2-ALOT Eddy, ds, faust, mix
543 ?2-mail reason for vote on rae?
545 ?2-mail why vote for rae, what have people been "saying"?
557 All Review of wagons on mix and LL gives reads on db8, shrae, ari, self, LL, joe, Mail-me.
562 A2-mix *vote: mail* since no reason for vote on rae is given.
563 A2-db8 Should we end d1 with no lynch, yes in general good practice.
569 A2-mail-me No reason to vote, jk about having something together.
573 ?2-mail vote today?
614 A?2-faust D1 shouldn't end w/ RSV or Sheeping. Why ru good with that? People dfnd ur votes!
619 A2-joe Never give reasons rae is scum
621 A2-ds vote change from mix 2 mail bc sheeping scummy for later
622 A2-mix mail shouldn't be getting pass for sheeping this game
623 Unvote mail given #622
627 A2-efhw mail meta no longer includes sheeping
628 ?2-ds vote for me based on what?
633 ?2-ds Why am I scummy, ds doesn't give any reasons
635  Rebuke of absence of reasons, mix 2 eager to jmp on any wagon, vote: mix
641  *vote: mix* forgot to bold in #635
928 A2-efhw shrae/rae not online at EOD, LL said partner not on.
934 A2-shrae replying to mssg bout shrae/rae not online, re:mason
939 A?2-db8 No rules against status tracking, thoughts about mason claiming?
945 A2-shrae faust twny, generating convo & using logic
959 A2-shrae faust not scmmy 4hammer bc 2hammer > not 2hammer
996 ?2-ds You denying shrea is the other mason?
1016 A2-joe Never give reasons rae is scum
1031 A2-faust Twn should know reasons, why ok w/ not sharing. joe no! reason! rae scum
1040 A2-db8 D1 should share, sans cop reviewing wagon
1049 ?2-ds then correct me
1062 A?2-ds isn't sharing better in outlined scenarios
1066 A2-ds share or not 2share that is the ? rae says share
1071 ?2-shrae Reason for eddie vote?
1108 A2-db8 ds gave reasons, don't agree with some, bad that rae on his list of possible scum
1109 ?2-mail thoughts on joe, db8, ss?
1128 A?2-joe Asserting db8,rae,ari scumteam? @faust not vote bc old mix/shrae theory bad more later

531

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 06, 2019, 12:42:05 pm »

It is notable that the largest portion of MiX's core wagon yesterday - Debatepro, raerae, ari (and also recently shraeye, but he just unvoted) - are all not voting. I would really like to see them push someone other than MiX at some point in this game. The lack of voting so far is stalling the game.

EFHW, who is your top scumread?

Maybe it's because they're scum and haven't decided which mislynch wagon to create/join yet?

Scum gains nothing by pausing when they could push for a quick lunch. Also, you calling that the scumteam then, Joseph

I think it's 2 of them

I asked you for the logic/math behind 2 people on MiX are scummy and your reply in #1020 doesn't answer my question about how you came to that conclusion. Can you elaborate as I am trying to understand why?

532

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 06, 2019, 09:43:39 am »

It is notable that the largest portion of MiX's core wagon yesterday - Debatepro, raerae, ari (and also recently shraeye, but he just unvoted) - are all not voting. I would really like to see them push someone other than MiX at some point in this game. The lack of voting so far is stalling the game.

EFHW, who is your top scumread?

Maybe it's because they're scum and haven't decided which mislynch wagon to create/join yet?

I moved to unvote bc clearly the shraeye vote was a blunder?? The most compelling cases to me right now are Ari bc I thought the EOD shenanigans was suspect also (+ss's vote) and EFHW. I want to read EFHW's defense against the DatSwan's case because it seemed compelling. If forced to pick right now, i'd pick one of those two.

This is me forcing you to pick.

Totally upfront, I had lots of responses to your "nudge" queued up, but they are mostly the a$$h0l3 ego in my head, so I'm going to let them float away.

EFHW has not responded and she said she would, the more time that goes on with out adequately refuting such a thorough case, the more problematic it becomes in my eyes.

Right now the player I trust the most is SS. Vote: Arishipshape

533

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 06, 2019, 07:30:19 am »

It is notable that the largest portion of MiX's core wagon yesterday - Debatepro, raerae, ari (and also recently shraeye, but he just unvoted) - are all not voting. I would really like to see them push someone other than MiX at some point in this game. The lack of voting so far is stalling the game.

EFHW, who is your top scumread?

Maybe it's because they're scum and haven't decided which mislynch wagon to create/join yet?

I moved to unvote bc clearly the shraeye vote was a blunder?? The most compelling cases to me right now are Ari bc I thought the EOD shenanigans was suspect also (+ss's vote) and EFHW. I want to read EFHW's defense against the DatSwan's case because it seemed compelling. If forced to pick right now, i'd pick one of those two.

534

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 05, 2019, 07:13:29 pm »

@Ari, @RaeRay, @Mail-Mi, & @Joseph what do you think of DatSwan’s analysis and conclusions in posts #1042-#1045?

535

Forum Games / Re: Drunk Mafia VI: Phoenix

« on: February 05, 2019, 10:49:22 am »

Same as didds.

On Friday 2/15 I can play 9pm-12ish am (CST)
On Saturday2/16 I can play 8pm-12ish am (CST)

/in - ish

BTW, 11pm is way past my bed time so im really pushing it.

536

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 04, 2019, 10:06:54 pm »

Re: information sharing

Maybe getting bogged down in the line-by-line, and maybe i'm misreading, but i think the crux of Datswan's case is that in some situation it's OK to withhold info if your town. I think Faust even said this in day 1 see #753.

Is this usually controversial?

537

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 04, 2019, 09:31:32 pm »

@SS what do you think about Datswan's analysis and conclusions?

538

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 04, 2019, 04:39:20 pm »

I think refusal to share reasons for things is something we should generally discourage. It can be justified in some scenarios, but most of the time it's not good.

Do you have some examples we can be on the look out for? In my world it's the only thing one can evaluate because anyone can make an assertion.

539

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 04, 2019, 01:06:16 pm »

So by my own logic, there would be 2 scum in {Debatepro, shraeye, raerae, mail-mi, LaLight, EFHW, Faust}. Scummiest people there IMO are raerae and Debatepro

Can you explain the math (logic) behind why there are 2 scum in that list? Curious, so i can use in the future.

Why would you include LaLight in this list? Lastly, who is your best guess as LaLight's mason partner?

540

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 04, 2019, 07:08:13 am »

Unvote Interested in hearing from SS and what they think.

541

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 11:19:50 pm »

DebatePro, thoughts on raerae

There where 8 votes on MiX if you count the post hammer vote for s by SS.

At least two of those votes are town and I’d say the SS is probably town as well because  they gave the best defense of MiX as town.

So there are 5 left and probability is that at least one or more of those is scum. Given that, I’ll be rereading each of them more carefully. I don’t recall an overly scummy feel for anyone besides MiX so... I’ve got some work to do.

542

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 10:50:54 pm »

Yes, I don’t buy the dunce hat routine and the immediate vote on you (MiX’s main suspect) seeming to be a way to go about rectifying him voting on MiX. I think it’s odd, hence eyebrow raising.

I'm not avenging or mourning. I know three things for certain: MiX, LaLight, and Debatepro are town. I put on the dunce hat, because I said I would and well it's better to make fun of yourself then to beat yourself up for mistakes.  Also, Lalight said if MiX wasn't scum, he’ll eat his tie. @LaLight How did it taste? So even an experienced player with a superpower can get it wrong.

I didn’t even realize Shraeye was breadcrumbed as the Mason. However, I’ll engage you in your thought experiment.

The Dialogs: Staring Debatepro playing The Dunce and at least one other experienced player as scum. (Pick your favorite)

• Debatepro: I want to put a duncecap on a caricature of myself. 
• ExperiencedScumBuddy: So smart, you should draw attention to yourself and play poor MiX card.
• Debatepro: I knew I was good at this game.
• ExperiencedScumBuddy: Also, you should immediately draw more attention to yourself by voting for the other potential mason.
• Debatepro: Awesome, thanks for the advice... wait who is the other mason?
• ExperiencedScumBuddy: [Rolling eyes] Shraeye
• Debatepro: That really works with my MiX plan, because MiX was on them. We're like two levels deep. [Throws hand up for high-five, then realizes no one is there]
• ExperienedScumBuddy: Great plan, good luck see you in Night 2.
• Debatepro: Wait, what if they WIFOM this plan.
• ExperiencedScumBuddy: Point out Lalight said he would eat his tie and even he was the mason and got it wrong.
• Debatepro: Got it, thanks!
• ExperiencedScumBuddy: Wait one more thing, if you feel cornered, tell them all we concocted this plan, tell them all the details, they will think it's so obsurd that it might just save you.
• Debatepro: All right chumps, let's do this....

Look... I know I tunneled MiX but clearly some other towns voted for him as well, so we just need to figure out who is scum. If you vote for me ... at the end of N2, there will be 4 town out of the game.

543

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 07:25:52 pm »

...this is an example of why it is a bad idea to track it ...Also, anyone at anytime can just set their status to perm "offline"

I understand the downside to tracking, but are there rules against it?

544

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 07:10:12 pm »

Paired with the fact that shraeye and I were the only ones not online at deadline and LL said he was waiting for his partner to get on.

How does one know if you are online, is this something I should track?

545

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 06:25:31 pm »

What about LaLight's breadcrumb suggesting that Shraeye is probably his partner?

Is this the breadcrumb? 

@faust, huh? why? Say so now!

Because obviously shraeye is LaLight's partner.

He is? Sorry, not obvious to me, obviously.

I find it hard to belive when you were the one who pointed this post out to me:

shraeye sounds like town

nice to be in a game with mail-mi

Not me. I mean, it might have been in my summary. But ok, unvote. It's a non-starter in any case given that.

546

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 2)

« on: February 03, 2019, 05:13:30 pm »

Vote: Shraeye

I will stay on Shraeye until one of the folks who had clear town > null-town read on MiX's comes up with a more persuasive case.

547

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)

« on: February 01, 2019, 04:40:10 pm »

Why do you suspect Faust wanted to withhold reasoning from the town? And do you think he was right about those hypotheticals, or I? Be honest, spare me no logic.

If Faust is a live after N1... suspect away.

548

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)

« on: February 01, 2019, 04:21:37 pm »

There are 11 people watching this thread right now. Why are only we three posting?

I voted in post 70...

549

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)

« on: February 01, 2019, 04:03:57 pm »

So for fun let's look at the two biggest wagons. 
looks at MiX and raerae's wagons

...Don't forget about LaLight!... lots of text

If, against all odds, you flip town, I will make this my mafia bible.

Really because so much has happened in like 300 posts... the a half FoS for you.

550

Mafia Game Threads / Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 1)

« on: February 01, 2019, 03:58:20 pm »

If there is any other information that anyone wants from me, now is the time. Ask now, or said information will be lost forever.

Rank each player from townyness to scummyness.