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Messages - Jorbles

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4476
Help! / Re: Pirate Ship beats double Jack???
« on: January 16, 2012, 05:28:12 pm »
I actually simulated this a little while ago and if it's just straight DoubleJack vs DoublePirateShip than Jack usually beats Pirate Ship. I think it was like 65/35. Your opponent likely got lucky.

4477
Help! / Re: Chapel + X
« on: January 12, 2012, 02:07:03 pm »
Jack decks do very well against greening, but maybe not quite as well as a dedicated venture deck. That said, your opponent did not build a dedicated venture deck. And as WanderingWinder pointed out, DoubleJack should beat Jack/Chapel pretty handily, and you should be able to simulate that to check.

I think this illustrates a larger point. Most people who read this forum know that chapel is one of the strongest cards in the game. But they tend to forget it's only because of how good it is for engine games. It's mediocre in big money games, losing to quite a few cards head to head. The reasoning is simple: spending turns doing nothing but trashing slows you down and you need some way to catch up. Usually this is with a big engine with multiple buys. A dedicated big money deck doesn't waste those first few precious turns trashing.

Confirmed. DoubleJack wins 62.5% of the time vs JackChapel.

Code: [Select]
{
  name: 'JackChapel'
  author: 'Jorbles'
  requires: ["Jack of All Trades", "Chapel"]
  gainPriority: (state, my) -> [
    "Province"
    "Duchy" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 5
    "Estate" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 2
    "Gold"
    "Jack of All Trades" if my.countInDeck("Jack of All Trades") < 1
    "Chapel" if my.countInDeck("Chapel") < 1
    "Silver"
  ]
}

4478
Help! / Re: Chapel + X
« on: January 12, 2012, 01:45:57 pm »
I don't think your opponent actually intended to trash only Coppers. Your opponent only drew her Chapel with an Estate once in the game and she trashed it (turn 8). That said Ventures are extremely strong with Chapels, but she only bought 2. I don't think it was the deciding factor. LadyFern is a good player, but I think she had a bit of luck on her side here. I imagine Jack has a 60/40 advantage here (maybe a little bit higher), but sometimes the better plan loses.

Also I should point out, you did break PPR on turn 12, but I think a Venture deck might deal with greening a bit better than a Jack deck so that might have been the right move.

4479
Help! / Re: What's the right way to play Fool's Gold on a Colony set?
« on: January 11, 2012, 02:04:22 pm »
I’m going to disagree with some of the other posters and say it was correct to go for Fool’s Gold in this situation, but only because your opponent is also going for them (which he clearly was starting from his first purchase). They may not be the best strategy on this board, but if your opponent buys 10 FGs unanswered you’re going to lose. That said I think you ended up relying on your FGs too much and your economy broke down.

I think where this game went south is when you didn’t invest in Platinums and your opponent did. On turn 11 you had $11 money and two buys (Bridge had reduced the cost of everything by $1 also), but you bought Rabble+Inn, instead of Platinum+Scout or Platinum+Bridge or just Platinum. Though I'd be interested in seeing how it might have ended if someone had followed RisingJaguar's suggestion and ignored Colonies attempting to end the game on Provinces or Three-Piling (some sort of Vineyard strategy would seem necessary to come into play here, which I have a hard time envisioning as there aren't the sort of cheap actions that really gets big points there)

Also as Epoch said if you had tried to engineer a Mint buy to clear out Coppers it would have been a big help, also.

4480
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Win the Fool's Gold rush - as second player!
« on: January 10, 2012, 04:19:13 pm »
It's the only $2 with a +Buy.

You forgot Pawn. Which should be able to replace Hamlet in the solution. Herbalist also has +buy, but wouldn't work for this.

Doh, you're right.

I'm surprised at the level of complexity Voltgloss had in mind when he came up with this puzzle originally, but I do like how many different interactions there are that allow this to be solved.

4481
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Win the Fool's Gold rush - as second player!
« on: January 10, 2012, 03:40:00 pm »
I knew there had to be a way to use Hamlet. It's the only $2 with a +Buy. ftl's solution should also work with Council Room subbed in for Margrave.

4482
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Win the Fool's Gold rush - as second player!
« on: January 10, 2012, 02:23:00 pm »
Use a Thief.

Open Thief/FG, on turn 3 and 5 steal a FG from your opponent. On turn 6 they'll buy the last FG, but you'll have 6 and they'll have 4.

4483
2011 / Re: Schedule and Results, Part II
« on: January 10, 2012, 01:21:48 pm »
I suspect that from this point on every match is going to be discussed in detail by those of us who are still following the tournament. Would it make sense for the results to be posted as their own topic on this board so the discussions about matches don't get confusing and are easy to sort when we're looking at forum updates?

4484
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Free points!
« on: January 10, 2012, 01:09:58 pm »
If there's something like a Remodel or Salvager on the board, you'd obviously want to take max Provinces in the hopes of just Remodelling or Salvaging your Provinces so you could eat up the existing ones.

4485
Dominion General Discussion / Re: (New?) Turn 3 Province!
« on: January 08, 2012, 09:01:13 pm »
If you're smart, you buy gold...
But also, there are many known turn 3 province things. There's a whole thread...

Link?

4486
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Copper-scaled victory
« on: January 08, 2012, 05:19:39 pm »
$6
Worth 1 VP for every 2 Coppers in your deck

This version introduces some tension: You want a lot of Copper in order to boost their value, but flooding your deck with Copper actually makes this card harder to buy (unlike the $4 version), so you have to thread the needle of boosting your Copper density, but not so fast as to make the $6 victory card unaffordable.

Thoughts?

This seems overpowered as they are worth more than a Duchy with a single copper. I think $7 would be a more reasonable cost.

One thing I like about this idea is that it would actually make one of the worst cards in the game a lot stronger. Thief would be the ultimate counter to this card!

4487
Game Reports / Re: Ambassador/Tunnel vs. IGG/Remake
« on: January 06, 2012, 04:57:07 pm »
Looking at this further I think your opponent made a big mistake rushing IGGs here because there are two counters here, one is yours where you build a Tunnel strategy so you come up from the end of the IGG rush in a slightly superior position, but an even better counter to his rush is to buy a Trader, then the IGG pile will run out before the Curse pile and he won't be able to 3-Pile the game.

Your opponent could have done some things a bit better, but I think he managed to find a rare board where an IGG/Remake strategy is fairly weak. He'd have been better off going for some sort of Highway/Woodcutter, BigMoney variant or mirrormatching you.

4488
Game Reports / Re: Ambassador/Tunnel vs. IGG/Remake
« on: January 06, 2012, 04:48:01 pm »
I was a little confused by your non-mention of Ambassador after your post title (but then I realized you meant Adventurer/Tunnel not Ambassador). I think it's worth mentioning that your Adventurer/Tunnel combo would have been extremely weak without some trashing of your Coppers from Remake and Moneylender. Cards like Adventurer are really weak unless you can get the Coppers out of your deck.

I guess the main thrust of why that game is interesting though is that your opponent should have thought twice about rushing IGGs when it was likely that you were going to empty a VP point pile, putting you in a superior situation for a 3-Pile ending.

4489
Help! / Re: Chapel / Conspirator vs Chapel / Silver
« on: January 05, 2012, 07:31:50 pm »
It may still end up losing to Envoy/BM, but I don't think ChapelEnvoy plays optimally as it does things like this (this is bear in mind from rspeer's simulator, not Geronimoo's):
Code: [Select]
== EnvoyChapel's turn 3 ==
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
Coins: 3, Potions: 0, Buys: 1
EnvoyChapel buys Silver.
EnvoyChapel draws 5 cards: [Chapel, Estate, Copper, Envoy, Copper].

== EnvoyChapel's turn 4 ==
EnvoyChapel plays Envoy.
(EnvoyChapel shuffles.)
EnvoyChapel draws [Copper, Copper, Copper, Estate, Estate].
BigEnvoy chooses for EnvoyChapel to discard Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
EnvoyChapel plays Copper.
Coins: 4, Potions: 0, Buys: 1
EnvoyChapel buys Silver.
(EnvoyChapel shuffles.)
EnvoyChapel draws 5 cards: [Copper, Silver, Copper, Copper, Envoy].

It has a terminal collision on turn 4 and instead of using the Chapel to trash the junk it plays the Envoy. I think in early game you're better off trashing your Coppers and Estates as quickly as possible. Plus this would avoid triggering the reshuffle and missing both your actions on the next run through the deck (though the simulators are bad at triggering reshuffles correctly anyways).

This is the code I used for EnvoyChapel.
Code: [Select]
{
  name: 'EnvoyChapel'
  requires: ['Envoy', 'Chapel']
  gainPriority: (state, my) -> [
    "Colony" if my.countInDeck("Platinum") > 0
    "Province" if state.countInSupply("Colony") <= 6 \
               or state.countInSupply("Province") <= 6
   
    "Duchy" if 0 < state.gainsToEndGame() <= 5
    "Estate" if 0 < state.gainsToEndGame() <= 2
    "Platinum"
    "Gold"
    "Envoy" if my.countInDeck("Envoy") < 1
    "Chapel" if my.countInDeck("Chapel") < 1
    "Silver"
    "Copper" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 3
  ]
}

It's possible that even though it's playing incorrectly it may still not be as good as EnvoyBigMoney, but that's completely up in the air.


4490
Help! / Re: Chapel / Conspirator vs Chapel / Silver
« on: January 05, 2012, 06:21:04 pm »
Depending on what's in the Black Market deck I'd either open Chapel/Envoy or Chapel/Black Market. You have to worry about terminal collision a little, but it doesn't seem that important as by the mid game you won't be playing your Chapel at all. Without +Cantrips or card drawing Villages out there I don't think a Conspirator chain is going to be that strong.

4491
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: In which Sarah king's courts a golem
« on: January 05, 2012, 06:04:53 pm »
Ohhh that wasn't clear to me when I read it, but I guess that given that Davio's solution also works.

4492
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: In which Sarah king's courts a golem
« on: January 05, 2012, 02:34:13 pm »
Hell, it could even be
1 Swindler: Swindling the opponent's $5 action card into a Duchy (action card stack was empty, no other $5's around) and his 8 Silk Roads hit another VP target, so this gains him 8 + 3 = 11 VP. Since Sarah was already 1 point behind, the best she can do with her 1 Buy is buying a Colony for "just" 10 VP, still 2 VP short of a win/tie.

This solution doesn't actually work because we know Sarah has multiple buys because her hand drew those cards from multiple Council Room plays as stated in the original post.

4493
Dominion General Discussion / Re: More Fun With (Un)popular Buys
« on: January 05, 2012, 02:17:31 pm »
Least:
$6 Adventurer
$5 Counting House; Stash; Harvest; Cache; Explorer
$4 Navigator; Coppersmith; Bureaucrat
$3 Chancellor

I buy 3x as many Navigators as the population. Otherwise this looks a lot like my least-buys.
Again, this is a Counting House board; else just straight Big Money.
This is most probably a Chancellor/Stash board.

I was going to try and simulate this, but dominionate can't play Stashes yet. When it does get implemented, the code for a Cache/Counting House strategy that is marginally better than Big Money is here.
Code: [Select]
{
 name: 'CountingCache'
 author: 'Jorbles'
 requires: ["Counting House", "Cache"]
 gainPriority: (state, my) -> [
   "Province"
   "Duchy" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 5
   "Estate" if state.gainsToEndGame() <= 2
   "Counting House" if my.countInDeck("Copper") >= 11 and
my.countInDeck("Counting House") == 1
   "Counting House" if my.countInDeck("Counting House") == 0
   "Cache"
   "Silver"
   "Copper"
 ]

4494
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Air travel with Dominion
« on: January 03, 2012, 04:43:04 pm »
Perhaps they were worried about the Contraband
Or his Ill-Gotten Gains.

4495
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Evaluate your best and your worst board
« on: December 29, 2011, 05:32:55 pm »
We should get the finalist's in the tournament to play their boards based on this thread (or the other one, but I think this one has more variability). What better way to challenge the top players then to get them to play to their strengths, their opponent's strengths, their weaknesses and their opponent's weaknesses.

4496
Unfortunately, Hinterlands makes even this house rule a pain to implement. We used to play our first two hands at the same time. You draw your first hand, see that you have 2, 3, 4, or 5 Coppers and then choose your first two cards and shuffle. That shaved a little time in the grand scheme of things, and it wasn't that big of a deal in terms of seeing what others buy first (in our group anyway).

Hinterlands changed that. If you buy a Mandarin, Noble Brigand, or Nomad Camp in your first hand, you no longer can rely on having a 5/2 or 4/3 split.

So, mirrored hands of 5/2 and 3/4 are not specific enough. Now, you would have to mirror CCEECECCCC or CCCCCCCEEE.

Unless you're willing to go through and stack all the decks the same after revealing one, mirrored hands may not work out anymore. It'd be fine for Isotropic, of course.

The order people buy things in can determine strategies, for example you might not want to buy that Library if no one opens with a Militia. Perhaps more importantly though, can't you just spend the first two hands talking with your friends?

4497
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Really bad Dominion joke
« on: December 29, 2011, 04:42:50 pm »
I'm curious too, this also applies for Black Market decks.

4498
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Evaluate your best and your worst board
« on: December 20, 2011, 01:25:17 am »
My Best Board is:
$6 Farmland
$5 Hunting Party, Vault, Highway, Haggler, Governor
$4 Walled Village, Noble Brigand
$3 Menagerie
$2 Fool's Gold

With no +Buy I'd say Fool's Gold is a trap, unless you open 5/2 in which case you could open Governor/Fool's Gold and then trash your Coppers into FGs. The rest of the cards aren't that exciting, I'd probably just get a Vault or two and then Vault it up. Maybe buying a Farmland's late game to remodel a Gold into a Province. One thing I noticed about this board is that almost all of these cards are new as of the Cornucopia expansion which I think is when I started actively improving a lot. Vault being the one exception. I do play that card well, and always have.

My worst board is:
$5 Cache, Ghost Ship, Mint, Torturer, Explorer
$4 Bishop
$3 Ambassador, Smugglers, Loan
$2 Duchess

With no Villages present on this board I would probably open this double Ambassador hoping to win the Ambassador war, maybe buying a Mint if a good trashing opportunity came up. This set of cards is interesting as it contains cards I used to overrate and play when I shouldn't (Bishop, Torturer, Smugglers) and also contains a lot of cards I just don't know much about when to use (most of the others), Ambassador is interesting that it's on here as it's long been a card I'm weak with however I think the fact that it's still on here comes from the fact that I spent basically the first 6 months I played online trying to find a way to (usually unsuccessfully) work around the card. I'm more accepting of the card now.

4499
Dominion Articles / Re: Updating the Top 5 lists
« on: December 17, 2011, 03:57:33 pm »
When I see Minion and HT on the same board I usually just pick up both of them, the HTs tend to assist Minion decks as long as you only get 1 or 2 of them . They make it very easy to get to $5 and make it possible to even get to $10 and buy 2 Minions at once. If your opponent is going for Minions also they give you an edge as you also get 6 card hands, and Minions are stronger the more of them you have in your hand. How do Minion decks fare if they pick up an HT or two when they hit $4?

4500
Simulation / Re: Dominiate: a Dominion simulator that runs on the Web
« on: December 15, 2011, 08:25:25 pm »
You know what would be a great feature that I don't think would be very hard to add? A piece of data that shows the average/median turn a game ends on after a simulation has been run. What do other people think?

I tend to think of strategies as being good/bad based on how fast they are and I know it would depend on your opponent's strategy, but if you play a strategy against itself it would let you know how fast the strategy is compared to others.

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