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5801

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas

« on: May 26, 2015, 12:31:14 pm »

Reverse Chapel sounds like a really strong Gardens/etc enabler

Reverse Reverse Chapel
$4 - Action
Trash all your cards
Gain this

That's interesting. Pressing reset and having to buy Coppers for the next 3 turns, then buy Silver, which gets you to $6 in 4 turns but gives you junk. It's certainly a weird card, and it's better if you get $4 on your first turn over your second turn, otherwise I'd consider not opening this if there is a strong trashing alternative.

Buying Mint with $5 in your first hand is terrible unless you have Fool's Gold also; this would be a worse version of that.

5802

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: A mad Traveller chain

« on: May 25, 2015, 11:22:52 pm »

Flying Machine is probably weak as a one-shot; given how long it will take you to play one. Probably too strong just without the one-shot part though, so how about something in between?

FLYING MACHINE (Action - Duration - Traveller) - $6*
At the start of your next turn, draw your deck and discard pile.
(This is not in the supply.)

So this does a couple thing to weaken it instead of making it a one-shot. The turn you play it, it's really bad. It also delays the effect even more, like Teacher does. And finally, as a Duration, you can't play it every turn. If you wanted to make it just slightly stronger than that, make it a reserve just like Teacher. Though like with Teacher, I think it will be extremely rare that you don't call it the turn after you play it every time.

5803

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: A mad Traveller chain

« on: May 25, 2015, 11:15:46 pm »

Draft is too strong, but I think making it "exactly $1 more" might fix it. That eliminates the possibility to trash a Province and gain 2 Provinces. Trashing a $7 would still be very powerful, but it would be pretty rare.

5804

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Homage to the Best Card

« on: May 25, 2015, 11:09:20 pm »

Band of Misfits ->

I don't get it?

5805

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 25, 2015, 10:55:29 pm »

Cards with the word "Action" in the text? Never mind.

5806

Rules Questions / Re: Inheritance / Grand Market and buying Estates

« on: May 25, 2015, 10:34:02 am »

Seriously, a card is yours when you buy it? What about Trader?

It stops being yours if Trader is revealed.

According to the rules, you gain a card after buying it. So, this means i can (for a very short time) own cards in the supply? This feels very unintuitive, to not say "implausible". Also, Donald lists passing, returning and trashing an Estate to make it stop being yours, none of which can be applied to a card you didn't gain before. Why? Obviously because he thinks about gained cards, himself. Looks a lot like this was another "I felt people would think it works this way, so it works this way" ruling. And this makes me sad, because i always kind of admired how Dominion got along without hard-coded interactions - you could always just apply logic to get to the official ruling. I don't see this with Inheritance (or ist older brother BoM), for a lot of interactions.

I think of buying a card like ordering something online. It's yours as soon as you pay for it, but it's not in your possession until it is delivered, which is when you have gained it.

Hmm... I think this is how ownership in the lagel sense works. Maybe you're right. Then again, i'm curious as to what Trader does. Cancel my order?

Hmm... well canceling the order isn't right, because you don't get your money back. I guess it's like calling up the company and trying to cancel your order. They say "sorry, we have a strict no refunds policy." You demand to speak with a manager. Eventually you get through to someone who says "we just really can't refund your money, but if you really don't want the item any more, then we won't bother shipping it out. And as our way of apologizing for being unable to refund your money, we'll send you a nice piece of silver instead."

5807

Rules Questions / Re: Inheritance / Grand Market and buying Estates

« on: May 24, 2015, 08:15:09 pm »

Seriously, a card is yours when you buy it? What about Trader?

It stops being yours if Trader is revealed.

According to the rules, you gain a card after buying it. So, this means i can (for a very short time) own cards in the supply? This feels very unintuitive, to not say "implausible". Also, Donald lists passing, returning and trashing an Estate to make it stop being yours, none of which can be applied to a card you didn't gain before. Why? Obviously because he thinks about gained cards, himself. Looks a lot like this was another "I felt people would think it works this way, so it works this way" ruling. And this makes me sad, because i always kind of admired how Dominion got along without hard-coded interactions - you could always just apply logic to get to the official ruling. I don't see this with Inheritance (or ist older brother BoM), for a lot of interactions.

I think of buying a card like ordering something online. It's yours as soon as you pay for it, but it's not in your possession until it is delivered, which is when you have gained it.

5808

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Vagabond

« on: May 24, 2015, 08:54:30 am »

Problem is, the vast majority of the time, you won't have ranger or giant (or that event) in the game. Even though you provide another option that doesn't use the token, the card is still awkward (and maybe confusing) in most games.

5809

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Remodel/Vault category - let's give it a name!

« on: May 23, 2015, 11:34:32 am »

Do we really need a term for it? This strikes me as not dissimilar to the thread Adam had a few weeks ago about terminology, where my stance (and that of others), was that if the thing doesn't grow up naturally, it's not going to be good.

aka, forcing memes is bad.

5810

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 23, 2015, 10:52:55 am »

Please note: While my rule is very much mechanics-related, it's probably not technically "completely mechanical". If people want I can pick a new rule, otherwise we can continue under that understanding.

It wasn't my intent to limit the game to completely mechanical things (it says that because it was copied from the other thread). I certainly think that rules involving card names and such could be good. Rules involving art are probably a bad idea because I don't know if everyone is that familiar with the art.

5811

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Cabal and Turncoat: handsize attack and non-Supply junking

« on: May 23, 2015, 10:49:58 am »

With that version, it's not clear what Cabal would actually do. It would need to have the attack type, in order to interact with Turncoat, but then what's the attack? The attack is built into having Turncoat be called; but that text is on Turncoat. So what's the text/effect of Cabal?

5812

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Remodel/Vault category - let's give it a name!

« on: May 22, 2015, 10:59:00 pm »

I don't like the term "soft terminals". It makes it sound like they're not quite as terminal as other terminals, but they do terminate your Action chain as much as any other terminals do.

Agree. If anything, I think perhaps Throne Room and King's Court could be called "soft terminals". They're technically terminals, yet they can enable you to play multiple actions. I don't see how Vault is in any way a "soft terminal". It's as hard a terminal as any other. It's just that what it does happens to be to do something with another card in your hand. And for Vault especially, having 2 Vaults in your hand means that the second Vault is as dead a card as any other would be; it might as well be a Victory card or a Curse. Vault 1 is not "making use" of Vault 2.

Spammable terminals is my vote.

5813

General Discussion / Re: Tea

« on: May 22, 2015, 04:12:36 pm »

South here also. I prefer unsweet to sweet; though I also like some sugar in my unsweet tea. And yes there's a big difference between unsweet tea with sugar added, and sweet tea.

5814

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Cabal and Turncloak: handsize attack and non-Supply junking

« on: May 22, 2015, 02:27:00 pm »

Okay then I seem to have no idea. Maybe Turncoat should just be +1 Action or something.

EDIT: Or Cabal could basically do the same thing with Curses.

You could make it a Looter, and just have it give out Ruins. Though then the other attack could be too strong. So I don't think there's anything actually wrong with the cantrip... Just don't think of it as a junk card by itself. It's something that only is an attack when you play it while there's one in their hand.

5815

Dominion General Discussion / Re: About kingmaking

« on: May 21, 2015, 03:55:52 pm »

I just don't have time for people who get annoyed or upset about how other people play.
Unless someone is obviously trying to disrupt the game, in a ruining the fun sense not in a ruining your strategy sense.
You just have to let other players do their thing.

This is fine over a friendly game; anyone who complains about kingmaking outside of a competitive setting is being a sore loser.  (Though discussion of and/or apologies for kingmaking are reasonable.)

I highly disagree with this. I complain about kingmaking even when it is I who won because of it. I see it as poor sportsmanship and do not enjoy playing games with people who are known to do it.

5816

Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Cabal and Turncloak: handsize attack and non-Supply junking

« on: May 21, 2015, 03:52:04 pm »

It's only a junk card because of Cabal's on-play attack, though. In a vacuum, a vanilla cantrip is beneficial (because it gives you more shuffle control than nothing).

That would mean there's no question whether to get a Pearl Diver over nothing. But if you don't draw you deck, any additional card hurts. Having a Turncoat just has to be worse than nothing, barring edge cases like Conspirator.

As Awaclus is saying, this isn't correct... my previous post goes into all the details of why. Most of the time the card will neither hurt nor help, but there's more edge cases where it helps than cases where it hurts. And I didn't even think about shuffle control in my post.

5817

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 20, 2015, 07:22:27 pm »

Cards that always increase your hand size or keep it the same (if you have cards in deck).

Advisor decreases hand size if you have 1 card left in your deck.

5818

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 20, 2015, 07:21:19 pm »

Pearl Diver?
Great Hall?

5819

Dominion General Discussion / Re: About kingmaking

« on: May 20, 2015, 07:13:58 pm »

Aren't the rules of Munchkin based on Kingmaking?

In the same way that the rules of Settlers are, yes. Only more so.

Can you explain this? While the rules of Settlers certainly allow Kingmaking; in games I've played it's never been an issue. Players avoid trading with the person in the lead; if someone is 1 point from victory they won't even consider it.

Right. In the same way, Munchkin players will use up their disposable items/cards to make sure that the leading player cannot gain their last level. That's the game.

EDIT: Sorry, I should explain further.

Somebody is going to win. In both Settlers and Munchkin, there is a point where the player who appears to be the lead will be ganged up on to make sure they don't win. As a result, somebody else will win. Hence, kingmaking.

See that doesn't fit my understanding of kingmaking at all.

5820

Dominion General Discussion / Re: About kingmaking

« on: May 20, 2015, 03:13:52 pm »

Aren't the rules of Munchkin based on Kingmaking?

In the same way that the rules of Settlers are, yes. Only more so.

Can you explain this? While the rules of Settlers certainly allow Kingmaking; in games I've played it's never been an issue. Players avoid trading with the person in the lead; if someone is 1 point from victory they won't even consider it.

5821

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 20, 2015, 03:11:43 pm »

Witch?
Estate?

5822

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 20, 2015, 12:19:34 pm »

I feel like asking about ten cards in one post rather destroys the essence of Zendo...

I agree... though there's no actual rule for it; I had expected people to ask 1-2 cards at a time. Should be the same as Zendo questions.

5823

General Discussion / Re: Tea

« on: May 20, 2015, 12:18:34 pm »

I drink a lot of tea. 4-6 cups a day when I was working. Mostly only decaf; green black or herbal. Just recently got a tea maker and some loose leaf.

5824

Dominion General Discussion / Re: About kingmaking

« on: May 20, 2015, 10:36:02 am »

I generally define kingmaking like this: Taking any action which you know will not help you win the game, but will affect who does win the game. When a player in a game has become mathematically eliminated, it becomes very difficult, because at that point no action he takes can "help him win"... instead I believe that essentially he should ignore the fact that he's mathematically eliminated and try his best to win anyway.

Anyway, in this case, I believe that player A would not have been kingmaking had he chosen to buy a Province (unless he were buying the last Province for a loss). He may have bought Duchies because he felt that it was his best chance to maximize his score... hope to get 2 Duchies now and still get another turn, instead of a Duchy and  Province now and it be his last turn. But buying a Province and a Duchy would have still given him a chance at another turn, just a smaller chance, so therefore I don't think you can say that it would have been wrong of him to do so.

Actual kingmaking comes up when a person stops trying to win. Whether this is because they are actually mathematically eliminated, or just because they feel like they don't have much of a chance. When a player stops "playing to win"; or at least "playing to do the best he can given that he can't win", and instead makes decisions based on who else he wants to win, that is when I consider it bad sportsmanship. Note that "playing to do the best he can" could hold multiple meanings... trying to get the highest score you can, trying to get the highest placing he can, etc.

5825

Non-Mafia Game Threads / Re: Dominion Zendo!

« on: May 20, 2015, 10:21:44 am »

Wow... I was so thrown off by the fact that every card listed (except Great Hall) had "+2 cards" on it.