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26

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 4

« on: July 09, 2016, 01:02:54 pm »

My computer broke, which sucks. Hoping to fix it asap, but that might be Monday.

I could vote Awaclus, but that loses to RR+Joseph team, while voting Silver loses to Awaclus+Iguana. The former team is super unlikely though, I think?

Vote: Awaclus

Everyone:Who do you think is the scumbuddy of your top suspect right now?

27

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 4

« on: July 07, 2016, 10:08:09 am »

So, gkrieg mentioned yesterday that it was possible that Jimmm asked his buddies to bus him on day one, which hadn't really occurred to me before. It would make a lot of sense with my current reads, since Joseph/Awa/Silver were voting Jimmm by the end of day one - meanwhile, my top town reads (RR + Iguana) were not. If it is the case, then it just doesn't seem likely that Joseph's vote was a prompted bus, just because it came so much earlier. It also seems more likely that Joseph would have said something about his vote at the time if he were scum, rather than lurked the last 24hrs of day one.

I can definitely see Awaclus and Silver as scumbuddies. Silver has been pursuing Awaclus for much of the game, but it's only resulted in tangential arguments like in 1230 onwards. Really, those sort of arguments are ones I often see in distancing, since other people will tend to skim them rather than get involved.

So it comes down to PoE. I don't think it's RR or Iguana, I think it's probably not Joseph, leaving Awaclus and Silver as the likely two scum.

I'm loathe to vote right now, since it's LyLo, but I will be around up until the deadline.

28

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 4

« on: July 05, 2016, 07:38:02 pm »

So I'm gone, I'm afraid.

We have time, don't lynch me in the next few days.

Well, you only have like one vote on you, and that vote is evidenceless as we stand. What did you say that Awaclus is referring to?

29

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 4

« on: July 04, 2016, 10:05:48 am »

I'm a bit lost after gkrieg flipped, really. I don't think there's scum in iguana and RR, leaving Awaclus/Joseph/Silver. I think there's good odds of both scum being in those three, so I've just got to find the townie amongst them.

In the midst of a reread right now, but I'm fairly busy this week and won't be able to complete it til Thursday.

30

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: July 01, 2016, 02:07:27 pm »

I fail to see how Awaclus is the default lynch, really.

Before Joseph's vote, he [Awaclus] would have been the lynch at the deadline.

31

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: July 01, 2016, 10:55:58 am »

You honestly think that the scum team is me and silver? 

And from my perspective even a no lynch is better than lynching me. We give up our mislynch either way and it would force scum to kill two town that aren't me which will make it easier at LYLO. I mean as either alignment I would rather no lynch than have me get lynched so why are you attaching a scum narrative to it?

I think we're talking mafia theory now, so:
This is a team game. If you're town, and we double no-lynch instead of lynching you, we go into day five at LyLo and probably end up lynching you anyway. Not good. If no-lynching is the only other option, you might as well get mislynched so other townies actually know your alignment instead of it continuing to be a question mark.
If you're scum it goes without saying you'd prefer no-lynch to your lynch.
No-lynching is very narrow. It's only worth doing if remaining night actions are so powerful they are stronger than a lynch.
In any case, you'd obviously prefer an Awaclus lynch regardless of alignment (unless he's your buddy which I doubt) - and he is still the default lynch.

32

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: July 01, 2016, 10:20:18 am »

Deadline in 8.5 hours by my count. Would really like to hear from Awaclus, since he's still the lynch right now with two unplaced votes.

I guess this is true.  Except that if we no lynch, we at least will have different partners.  Lynch rules won't be all that much different, but we would probably want to no lynch again to be at LYLO instead of MYLO.  So I guess that just forces scum to kill two people instead of letting us decide who we want to lynch.  So actually now I'm not sure if my lynch actually is better than a no lynch.

After this post I'm not sure why anyone would want to lynch anyone other than gkrieg.

The way you're pushing me is pretty scummy. You keep just posting things that I've written and saying that people should lynch me based off of it but then not explaining why. Man if you have a case, explain it. What you are doing now makes it impossible for me to defend myself.

Why don't you want to lynch Awaclus?

No-lynching is clearly not the play here. Right now we are two mislynches away from losing. If we no-lynch today, we're down to one. You were proposing we forgo our mislynch safety net and give the scum an extra NK. "Forces scum to kill two people", woe to them indeed.

I read a few days of that Awaclus scum game. Nothing really jumped out as compellingly similar between here and there, anything that was is stuff he'd also done in day one anyway. Really though, you and Silver being on his wagon is the big thing.

33

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: July 01, 2016, 08:50:50 am »

Deadline in 8.5 hours by my count. Would really like to hear from Awaclus, since he's still the lynch right now with two unplaced votes.

I guess this is true.  Except that if we no lynch, we at least will have different partners.  Lynch rules won't be all that much different, but we would probably want to no lynch again to be at LYLO instead of MYLO.  So I guess that just forces scum to kill two people instead of letting us decide who we want to lynch.  So actually now I'm not sure if my lynch actually is better than a no lynch.

After this post I'm not sure why anyone would want to lynch anyone other than gkrieg.

34

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 30, 2016, 01:00:57 pm »

I would really like to know what the scum motive can be.  Because it seems like you don't have a reason why scum would want to know who people are requesting before the fact.

I outlined it earlier, here:

You suggest you thought that people would request their top scumreads, right? Then why, precisely, did you ask for a before-the-fact request claim? It's, like, actively damaging to have such a claim if you think we'd otherwise request the scummiest people, since the lynch flip might change peoples' opinions. Not to mention that the scum would be interested in hearing everyone's top scumread right before night.

35

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 30, 2016, 04:07:51 am »

I'm happy with a gkrieg lynch right now. I really do think he had a scum motive for suggesting the before-the-fact claim, and the townie motives he tries to provide just aren't very strong. Additionally, his latest post has a few things that come from a scum mindset, IMO. I can expand on that later when I have more time.

I'd like to hear more from our two nonvoters (Awaclus and RR) about who they'd like to lynch as the deadline approaches.

36

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 28, 2016, 04:33:03 pm »

Forgot to type my response to this post.

I have been trying to be more proactive, because people said that they didn't like that I was being mainly reactive.  Trying to make cases and get people to go along with them.  My reads haven't been good this game at all, but I'm trying to get it moving after a fairly stagnant D2.

Also for those who want to know what was in the QT, I said this-> "Who are you requesting?"

To which ADK said that he didn't want to tell me, because he thought it might benefit scum to know, although he wasn't sure exactly how.

I then said->"I'm pretty sure it can't benefit me at all. It just helps me to get a better read on you. It's interesting that you don't want to answer. I don't know exactly what that means either."

ADK thought it was a scumslip because I said that I'm pretty sure it can't benefit me at all, which I didn't really get as a scum slip.  I was really just asking a question to someone I thought was townie and then he got all defensive about his choice, when I really didn't think that the claiming provides any information to scum.  The only upside to knowing who someone else is going to request is that you can be sure of one of their scum reads.

I thought Awaclus was townie because he was sticking pretty close to his meta D1.  Obviously I don't think that is the case now.  And if your case on me is that I have reads that have changed, well that's just a crappy case.

I really remembered your post about claiming who we had requested as being you saying we should claim before the fact.  I still think that isn't a horrible idea because it ensures that people can't lie about who they requested.  I have no idea what the optimal play as scum would be in claiming and requesting.  I mean obviously they don't want to end up as partners, but I don't think that it matters that much as long as they aren't made lovers.

My talk with ADK was fishing for info, but I really don't think that that info could be used by scum in such a way to be bold enough to ask him for it.  I don't think the pros could outweigh the cons of him outing me that I asked.  I was honestly just bored, so I thought I would ask him, and got a weird response out of it.

By the end of the day, I didn't want to lynch Joseph, and really just wanted to lynch RR or Seprix.  I still think that lynching RR would be good, and I was obviously wrong on the Seprix lynch.  What swayed me was everyone else's opinion on him and his day went from being on the townier side, to being on the scummier side.

Well, you're conceding a fair few points here, that's what I first noticed. E.g. "my talk with ADK was fishing", "I remembered your post differently." Not sure how I feel about that - it can be indicative of honesty, but I've seen scum defend themselves like so too. This is an aside, really.

You suggest you thought that people would request their top scumreads, right? Then why, precisely, did you ask for a before-the-fact request claim? It's, like, actively damaging to have such a claim if you think we'd otherwise request the scummiest people, since the lynch flip might change peoples' opinions. Not to mention that the scum would be interested in hearing everyone's top scumread right before night.

Re: Awaclus, my point there isn't that you might have just changed your mind (and I said as much), it's that your case was a simple one where you counted out his posts and said "look at how few posts he's talking about others!" But I don't think there wasn't much difference between how you summarized things in 1224 and what you said "seems townie" earlier. I see you presented some more detailed meta arguments in 1249, though. I'll be sure to read those and see what I think.

"Didn't want to lynch Joseph", ehh. As far as I can see, he pops up on your lists in the early and mid day, but not for any discernable reason other than the lovers-with-RR thing. AFAICT he disappears from your list when it's clear it is between RR and Seprix for the lynch and Joseph isn't on the table. Any other reason you didn't want to lynch Joseph by the end of yesterday?

?? yes I did.

I meant that you didn't post between his scumclaim and your "guess I was wrong" post. So, where were you wrong?

Gkrieg seems towny today.

Vote: Awaclus

He seems scummy too

Vote: Gkrieg

Huh?

If RR isn't happening, then the 2 lynches I'd like the most are Gkrieg and ss.

Don't feel like putting Gkrieg at L-1 right now though (as my vote would count).

So Vote: ss it is for now.

I could go for a Silver lynch too but I think Gkrieg is scummier. Also, you'd need both Awaclus and RR to vote Gkrieg to lynch him if you place a vote, so it's not really L-1.

37

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 27, 2016, 11:29:36 am »

No way there is a 20-page post anyone could write that would make scum think that it would increase their odds to win the game to reveal their identities.

Well, this site's mafia rules bizarrely don't seem to mention/ban out-of-game incentives & threats, so such a post would exist (providing you're ok being banned from the site afterwards).

Regardless, this back-and-forth is pretty stupid. Let's get back to gkrieg, guys.

38

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 1

« on: June 27, 2016, 06:37:49 am »

Other gkrieg stuff.

I don't really want to lynch Awaclus.  He seems townie here.  I'm not sure I'll actually get to a ced reread tonight.  I will try to do it in the next hour, but I might not be completely free.

Gkrieg said he thought Awaclus was town on day one. Sure, opinions can change, but gkrieg's case is a meta case. Why'd you think Awaclus was townie?

In the pregame I considered the applications of accountability for partner requests - e.g. claiming all requests at the start of the following day, or simply when run up to L-2 or whatever. It seems likely that the scum would have interest in manipulating the partnerships, and having an after-the-fact request claim doesn't seem like it'd hurt.

This post is actually a good idea.  It wouldn't hurt to say who we plan on requesting before the day is over.

I did not like this post first time around, and still don't. I suggested an after-the-fact claim and gkrieg suggests we do before-the-fact, but the way he frames it suggests that I asked for a before-the-fact claim. I almost voted for him on this when he originally posted it, but the one thing giving me pause is that there isn't an obvious gamebreaking element of the scum knowing pairs the night before that I could think of. Still, you'd think they'd like to know.

But also: gkrieg said some scummy stuff in our QT last night. The main thing is that he asked who I was requesting, which I found odd, but he also said something that I wouldn't exactly call a scumslip but seemed to imply he was speaking from a scum perspective. It's enough to make me want to vote: gkrieg

This is a follow-up to the pairs claim thing. ADK (confirmed town) reports on gkrieg's N1 words. Gkrieg apparently stuck to his guns on this request claim. Not sure he'd shown much suspicion of ADK the day before, though - so why ask him in particular? Really smells of fishing for info.
The "not quite a scumslip" thing is too hard to call without seeing the exact wording, which we unfortunately cannot get.

I'm fine with a Seprix, RR, or Joseph lynch at this point.  Would rather lynch Joseph, but Seprix would make me very happy as well.

I think we should go for Seprix/RR/Joseph, with RR>Seprix>Joseph, but those > signs are pretty small in my opinion.  I would be fine with lynching any of the three of them.

These are a couple of posts with the Seprix/RR/Joseph thing.

So gkreig is scum, pretty much confirmed now. He's been inconsistent, and hopping on wagons while looking indecisive so he won't be under the watchful eye of town when I do flip. In addition, gkreig has submitted very little in terms of actual content, mainly agreeing with people in wordy ways.

well I have been agreeing with certain people when they make sense.  I have been very decisive.  I said that I wanted to lynch RR, then you, then Joseph.  I think after your little interaction with Awaclus, that you are more likely to be scum than RR right now, so I voted for you.  With you voting for me, it doesn't matter all that much where my vote goes because it won't be a vote that counts anyway.

I haven't really gone from wagon to wagon.  I have voted for three different people today, all of which have been especially scummy.  Obviously I also think that we should lynch one of RR/Joseph as well today because there is some reason why scum didn't kill them last night.  I guess they are both easy mislynches, so it might be a good enough reason to keep them alive, but I really think that you go for the double kill as scum there.

You had a scummy end of day D1, and you are having a scummy end of day D2.

Gkrieg justifying his multiple lynches thing. I'd say that wanting to lynch three different people is the opposite of decisive, especially when that is a greater number than the remaining scum in the first place, but meh.
Interesting that he refers to RR/Joseph as "easy mislynches" yet still advocates killing them both. Perhaps it's just caution, but maybe it's a case of how he sees them (as mislynches).

39

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 27, 2016, 04:47:29 am »

Er... I mean, it only matches up with me wanting to vote gkrieg. The comment doesn't make sense with the seprix vote.

Here is what happened. Seprix was towny. I always thought that he was towny. Then we lynched him, and he claimed scum. You don't do that as town. It's obnoxious. So I thought he was scum, hence I was wrong.

You didn't post after his scumclaim, though?

Awaclus has made one post in our QT.

It was a reply to my question 'are you even here?' He answered in some variation of 'affirmative.' He hasn't said anything since.
Vote: Awaclus

He said nothing in our QT either, but I'm not sure I expected him to.

So now you're sure Joseph is town?

Yeah. I don't think scum does something like this. And it seems like Joseph, you know? Weak case but people get behind it cause hey! free RR lynch.

What has Joseph done that you don't think scum would do?

You are very wrong on that front.  You always stay more in the background when you are scum and you don't rub people the wrong way as much.  This is why you get lynched more as town than you do as scum

I don't know, I felt he was pretty abrasive on day one.

...

I don't like how Gkrieg's Awaclus case came to be, really. He started the day going for Awaclus as an RR scumbuddy, now he's directly voting Awaclus. Feels a lot like scum getting ahead of themselves on setting up mislynches. Plus, this matches his apparent MO from yesterday too - where he wanted to lynch Seprix and RR (and Joseph!).
Then there's his Awaclus case. The "scumslip" post is obvious sarcasm (even out of context, really). I'm not sure how gkrieg read it otherwise.

Vote: gkrieg13

Silver makes most sense as his buddy here - mostly because RR/Awa/Joseph really don't make sense, and Silver's certainly scummier than Iguana. They're paired too, aren't they?

40

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 25, 2016, 10:38:13 am »

Awaclus is still a tough read, really. I was hoping he'd get easier by day three, but I can't really fault him for joining the Seprix wagon in the circumstances, and, well, that's all he did yesterday. Gkrieg made a case out of Awaclus's day 2 posts, so you can see a list of them all there. Really, the case is entirely predicated on RR being scum so it isn't of much interest right now. Though the "that's stupid" post is less likely to be a scumbuddies thing, IMO.

Silverspawn's vote on Seprix was a big twist at the end of the day, and it was really unprecendented on his end. Most of what Silver had been talking about was that "no-one else is scummy" and therefore pushing an Awaclus lynch, in lieu of both Seprix and RR. In 957, Silver specifically says "Seprix is towny", then votes him in 1108. Today he's come out with the explanation that this was actually a Gkrieg vote? Pretty big mistake to make if true. I'd like to know why silver wanted to vote for gkrieg there, and how his mistaken vote matches up with his post 1137.

Gkrieg was bugging me a lot in day two. He had a real "will he, won't he" relationship with the Seprix wagon, and said he was fine with lynching either RR or Seprix (or even Joseph). Seprix did bring this up earlier and gkrieg defend himself in 1006.

I still feel Joseph is scummy from day one, and we didn't lynch him only because of the lovers thing. But that was a while ago now, so I'll leave that out. He was pushing for an RR lynch almost all of yesterday, the narrative being that if they didn't get NK'd then one of them must be scum. He was going for the Seprix lynch as well, but looking back that was pretty consistent throughout the day.

Really, I don't think any of my scumreads are that strong. I want to reread the game.

41

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 24, 2016, 05:54:14 pm »

My frustration stemmed (and I'm still frustrated about it, just a lot more apathetic now) from the fact that you kept saying I wasn't ever going to vote with you, and that your vote wouldn't count on anyone but Haddock, when in fact I was totally happy to vote for any of your scumreads and completely bend over backwards to vote for almost anyone you wanted.

I wish I could say the same for you - that it comes from a townie mindset - but my experience is that this way of style of play comes from scum more often than not and at this point the PoE doesn't exactly look great for you.

Except that I said that like once and in reaction to posts like 654, which I read as you going harder on the guy I said I would probably vote for.

...

Who did people request, by the way?

42

Dominion General Discussion / Re: Seprix's Empires Reviews

« on: June 24, 2016, 09:01:40 am »

The first game I played:

Charm, Crown, Groundskeeper, Legionary, City Quarter, Settlers, Castles, Sacrifice, Temple, Engineer

Events: Wedding, Triumph

Landmarks: Basilica, Labyrinth

Is some sort of Golden deck viable here? Legionary/Gold/Sacrifice with a City Quarter and a bunch of Groundskeepers. You could add Charm so you can buy Duchy/Groundskeeper for the Labyrinth points. Wedding means you can easily pick up the Gold whenever, so it's a question of how quickly Temple/Sacrifice trash down. Seems like your opponent would never hit $9+ in a Castles deck vs Legionary.

43

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 3

« on: June 23, 2016, 07:03:48 pm »

mh. So with the doctor dead, we do want an odd number of players. We now have one mislynch left.

This means that we should not lynch lovers. An extra town death costs us our potential mislynch.

It's not a hard and fast rule. If our two top suspects at the end of the day turn out to be lovers, it might be correct to lynch them. Obviously we'd need one of them to be scum, otherwise we would instalose, but if they're both townies we'd have lost even if they were nonlovers I guess so who cares.

...

Not got a lot of time at the moment, going to collect my thoughts some more tomorrow evening. Gonna leave a couple things here for now.
Iguana's my strongest townie read. This goes back to his small outburst near the end of day one, when he said he was replacing out. Short version is I know what caused it: something I said in our qt and then went back on. He was obviously frustrated by it but I think that frustration stems from a townie mindset.
The other big one is RR. There's a few reasons I don't want to lynch him, the most prominent being his decision to not vote Seprix yesterday. Given the situation, I think scum-RR would clearly want to vote for Seprix there, but he doesn't (and I suspect that RR is not the type of player to gambit as scum in those situations). I also requested Joseph last night so I could have some modicum of control over his vote which I figured he would place on RR.

44

Dominion League / Re: Season 15 - Results

« on: June 21, 2016, 06:46:02 pm »

C3:

ced 2 - 4 Harley Beckett

45

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 21, 2016, 03:53:33 pm »

OK, well given that you're voting Seprix, who do you think would make sense as his partner?  Other than RR.

I don't really see it.  I mean.  MAYBE iguana?  I dunno.  Nobody really fits.

I'm wondering if it's ADK. Seprix not mentioning him in his earlier PoE post was bizarre (considering the nature of the post), and in the past I've seen scum name/not name their buddies in little things like that. Best to revisit after he flips scum, though.

46

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 21, 2016, 02:13:44 pm »

Like, I'm feeling neutral on RR atm, but I don't see this lovers-dichotomy thing. Especially given the timing of their dual Jimmm votes (which I'd really really like to hear about their rationales on still). I feel I've said all this a dozen times yet people aren't listening.

I think we should lynch Seprix and decide what to do with RR/Joseph later.

47

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 21, 2016, 02:09:07 pm »

Is this for real?

The Seprixscum case has been clear for like the entire day, yet people are voting RR instead?

48

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 20, 2016, 04:23:38 pm »

It is amazing to me that the day did not go like this:

3 couples votes Seprix within 48 hours > lynch Seprix > day ends.

Instead, we are wasting our time talking about nothing all day long unable to cobble a lynch together until the deadline.

This, pretty much.

The Seprix case is pretty open-and-shut, yet we're spending forever talking about RR/Joseph for some reason. For that matter, I'd still really like them both (RR/Joseph) to answer my question about their Jimmm vote.

49

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 19, 2016, 11:30:39 am »

Do you mean #311?

Oops, yes I did. Typo.

Deadline is not far away now.
And last day end was crazy stressful so best avoided.

Wouldn't be surprised if we end up deadline lynching again since getting three pairs is hard.

50

Mafia Game Threads / Re: Mafia 82: Speed-Dating Mafia - Day 2

« on: June 19, 2016, 08:36:02 am »

Haddock's PBPA of RR is pretty interesting. He looks at some posts I didn't really consider too much before. I disagree on 331, which I still think is a pretty townie post, but I am reconsidering my read on RR.  I would like for RR/Joseph to get back to me on my question from my last post:

What I would like to know is what was going on in their qt when they voted. RR/Joseph: In your own words, why do you think the other one of you voted for Jimmm?

Really, considering they're voting for eachother, this seems a pertinent question for them to answer. They voted for known scum, but what went down in the QT beforehand?

...

Seprix: Thanks for at least some insight into your PoE thing. Why do you discount ADK? Why did you originally say you "think you know the next scum" in 807?