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Messages - tristan

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676
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Something Simple
« on: October 07, 2015, 02:09:02 am »
I think that it's a bad idea with VP tokens. Either it'll be strong enough that you'll just want to amass these and that's it, or it'll be weak enough that it's just not worth buying. It might be too strong in some games and too weak in others. That's my guess, anyway. The potential for just treading water while amassing points is too great. Yes you can do that with other cards, but it's way harder.
Like Goons which can lead to games with 20 VP tokens or more?
People who worry about fan made VP token gaining cards leading to a stall might wanna stop playing with the very official VP token gaining cards which actually do break the game.

677
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 07, 2015, 02:00:29 am »
Cantrip trashing + a small bonus sits comfortably at $5.
I disagree. You gotta differentiate between mandatory and normal cantrip trashing (or something like Upgrade which is a mandatory trasher but due to its Remodel ability it doesn't force-trash good cards during the later part of the game). A cantrip trasher might be a strong 4 or a weak 5 but a mandatory cantrip trasher is a balanced 4 IMO.

678
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 07, 2015, 01:55:48 am »

Cantrip trashing + a small bonus sits comfortably at $5.  Cantrip trashing alone might work at $4, but it would be extremely powerful, possibly too powerful.  The card in the OP is cantrip trashing with a bonus.

With multiple bonuses. The setting aside instead of trashing is pretty significant I think. It's an extra 3 points at the end of the game compared to trashing usually. Then there's the other ability to get a lot of money. It's really powerful. It might work at ; though I think its bonuses are at least as good as Upgrade and Junk Dealer.
It is only worth an extra 3 VP if there are no Shelters and no Cursers. For e.g. with Cursers, Shelters and no other trashers this very card leads on average, compared to a normal trasher, to an extra - 5VP / - 7VP (depends on the # of players).

But this is just a special case, on average setting aside is most likely better than trashing. This is why I consider the vanilla version of the card to be a strong 4 and the version with the bonus (Gain for each differently named set aside card. Discard all set aside cards.) a strong 5 which is again why I am not happy with the card yet.

679
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 06, 2015, 08:03:52 am »
I think that the difference trashing and mandatory trashing matters quite a bit.
Let's take Upgrade. Some folks here claimed that its bonus is insignificant but IMO the advantage of the card is that you can still play it in the later part of the game and use its remodel ability. Junk Dealer on the other hand can become a dead card respectively quite risky to play.

680
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 04, 2015, 08:34:11 am »
And yeah, the bonuses of Junk Dealer and Upgrade are fairly insignificant.
A Peddler is never insignificant. Upgrading Estates into Silver or other 3$ cards is also most of the times useful unless you play Upgrade in the middle game and the deck does not feature any half-way decent 3$ Action card.

That's not really how it works, though. An engine is the only strategy that wants trashing every time, so if you go for trashing and your opponent doesn't and he wins, the odds are that you went for an engine strategy and he went for another strategy, and that he won because the other strategy was better than the engine.
Trashing is always useful and has nothing to do with the density of action and treasure cards in your deck. I guess most of us have played ample of base games with Chapel, heavy trashing and BM.

681
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 04, 2015, 03:19:05 am »
Now consider Junk Dealer.  Why do you buy it?  Is it for (a) cantrip trashing, (b) cantrip coin, or (c) both?  The answer is actually (a).  While the coin is a nice bonus, it is not the reason you buy Junk Dealer.  The (b) on Junk Dealer is weaker than a straight cantrip coin because your handsize is smaller afterwards.  And in fact, if you wanted it for the coin, the mandatory trashing is actually a liability, especially after you run out of weak cards to trash.  You buy Junk Dealer to deal with junk, and the coin is just a small bonus on top.
I obviously disagree. Of course the main reason you buy Junk Dealer is to trash but its Peddler part is not insignificant. On the contrary, especially when you trash you are in dire need of coins. Trashing is after all a form of investment, you get rid of your Coppers, can buy less strong cards now but far better cards later. If another player does not trash and wins the game it is precisely because he was able to buy stronger cards while you were buys getting rid of your Coppers.

682
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 04, 2015, 03:13:26 am »
Quote
Given that trashers really only enable engines and aren't actually the thing that makes them tick, I am sure this card would be fine at , but I agree with the people who say it would be really strong at that price point.
Claiming that a mandatory cantrip trasher is a strong 4 implies the claim that either the boni of Junk Dealer as well as Upgrade are fairly insignificant which is obviously utter nonsense or the claim that these cards are strong 5s.
Furthermore it implies the claim that either Ratcatcher would be a decent card at a price of 3 or that the disadvantages of Ratcatcher, waiting 1+ turn(s) and trashing at the start of your turn, are worth a price differential of 2.

683
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 03, 2015, 10:30:26 pm »
Ratcatcher variant sounds very strong. Setting a card aside is going to be stronger than trashing one most of the time; as you start with 3 junk cards that are better to set aside than to trash. Only in games with Cursers would trashing be better. So just the top half is already a little bit better than a straight cantrip-trasher. Which, before Ratcatcher existed, I would have said is extremely powerful.

It is still powerful. Ratcatcher isn't a cantrip trasher, as it trashes a turn late and can only affect your hand at the turn's beginning.
Without the bonus the card is a good 4 (a pure cantrip trasher would probably be a fair 4; Junk Dealer is after all a mandatory cantrip trasher plus a Peddler combined) / weak 5. With the bonus it is probably a good 5 but for 6 it would be too expensive which is why I leave it priced at 5.

I wasn't aware Junk Dealer was weak. Also the step from to is pretty big.
Ehm, my point that Junk Dealer is a mandatory cantrip trasher plus a Peddler. The latter is fairly priced at 5 so a pure mandatory cantrip trasher can hardly be worth more than 4 ^^

Right, it can't be worth more than $4, but it's also probably too strong to cost $4.  The same situation happened in official cards with a Lab-variant that Donald tested.  I think it was called Dungeon; it was "+2 Cards, +1 action, discard a card".  Almost strictly worse than Lab so it can't be be $5+, but in testing it turned out to be too strong for $4, so it was dropped.
I have no idea how a mandatory cantrip trasher is supposed to be too strong for 4 given that cards like Ratcatcher, Upgrade and especially Junk Dealer exist. How can a supposedly strong 4 (mandatory cantrip trasher) plus a 4 (Peddler) combined into one card (Junk Dealer) just be worth 5?

684
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 03, 2015, 08:43:06 pm »
Ratcatcher variant sounds very strong. Setting a card aside is going to be stronger than trashing one most of the time; as you start with 3 junk cards that are better to set aside than to trash. Only in games with Cursers would trashing be better. So just the top half is already a little bit better than a straight cantrip-trasher. Which, before Ratcatcher existed, I would have said is extremely powerful.

It is still powerful. Ratcatcher isn't a cantrip trasher, as it trashes a turn late and can only affect your hand at the turn's beginning.
Without the bonus the card is a good 4 (a pure cantrip trasher would probably be a fair 4; Junk Dealer is after all a mandatory cantrip trasher plus a Peddler combined) / weak 5. With the bonus it is probably a good 5 but for 6 it would be too expensive which is why I leave it priced at 5.

I wasn't aware Junk Dealer was weak. Also the step from to is pretty big.
Ehm, my point that Junk Dealer is a mandatory cantrip trasher plus a Peddler. The latter is fairly priced at 4 so a pure mandatory cantrip trasher can hardly be worth more than 4 ^^

685
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 03, 2015, 08:24:54 am »
Ratcatcher variant sounds very strong. Setting a card aside is going to be stronger than trashing one most of the time; as you start with 3 junk cards that are better to set aside than to trash. Only in games with Cursers would trashing be better. So just the top half is already a little bit better than a straight cantrip-trasher. Which, before Ratcatcher existed, I would have said is extremely powerful.

It is still powerful. Ratcatcher isn't a cantrip trasher, as it trashes a turn late and can only affect your hand at the turn's beginning.
Without the bonus the card is a good 4 (a pure cantrip trasher would probably be a fair 4; Junk Dealer is after all a mandatory cantrip trasher plus a Peddler combined) / weak 5. With the bonus it is probably a good 5 but for 6 it would be too expensive which is why I leave it priced at 5.

686
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: October 02, 2015, 04:12:30 pm »
Here is another card idea I have:


- Cursed Treasure - Treasure
4$
When you play this, gain a Curse.
-----------------------------------
When you gain this, put all the Curses in the trash on the Supply.

OR

- Cursed Treasure - Treasure
4$
When you play this, gain two Curses.
-----------------------------------
When you gain this, put all the Curses in the trash on the Supply.


I am not sure about the correct pricing and the wording. The main idea is obviously that of a self-junker. Unlike similar self-junkers that provide a lot of money like Death Cart or Cache it does not happens when you gain the card but when you play it, i.e. later but more often.
The on-gain effect is there to prevent this card from being overpowered in the presence of Cursers and I also consider something like "when you gain this, add x Curses per player to the Supply" to prevent the self-cursing from running out too soon.

687
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Tomato Patch
« on: October 02, 2015, 03:34:55 pm »
With or without the vp, Tristan?
I'd prefer the one without the VP but I doubt that it makes much of a difference. If Gardens or Silk Road is present there is of course the usual rush issue and this very card might enhance it (assume a 2P game with a 5-3 distribution of Silk Roads and a lot of Tomato Patches and the player with the 5 Silk Roads has an automatic win) but I wouldn't worry too much about these border cases as there are after all ample of extremly powerful combos in Dominion.

688
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Tomato Patch
« on: October 01, 2015, 07:48:00 am »
I like the Necro with a Buy most. Without the Buy I doubt that you'd for go for it except on boards without any other villages.

689
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Convolucid's Cards (Equality)
« on: September 25, 2015, 09:54:05 am »
I like them as they seem balanced and the best way to employ them is not obvious to me which is in my opinion often a feature of a good card.

690
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: September 22, 2015, 10:29:29 am »
About the 'set aside' card, do you think that it is worth 5?

My assumption is that, based upon Upgrade and Junk Dealer, that a pure cantrip trasher is worth 4.
More so on Upgrade to be precise, you are happy to play the card to get rid of coppers. If only Junk Dealer existed you could argue that the card is a Peddler plus a mandatory cantrip trasher so perhaps a mandatory cantrip trasher is only worth 3.
Ratcatcher is probably either a bit too cheap or delayed trashing is really worth a discount of (to be precise more than 2 due to Ratcatcher's Reserve time-flexibility) 2.

But even if a mandatory cantrip trasher is worth a bit less than 4 this is compensated for by this card as it sets aside cards so my guess is that without the Native Village/ Horn of Plenty mishmash thingy it is worth 4 and with it 5.


Making Town Street a strong 2 instead of a mediocre 3 would probably make it feel different from Steward.  I'm not sure I have a design philosophy issue with cards being similar to other cards though.
What if I got rid of the terminal silver part and priced it at 2? I guess that would make it a fairly weak 2 and not really something that could play a flexible enough role in an engine (in decks with terminal draws as well as villages the card would be virtually useless).

691
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: September 21, 2015, 04:51:27 pm »
I wasn't sure about whether Town Street should be a 2 or 3 so thanks for the clarifications about how strong it is.

About the unnamed card, you are totally right GendoIkari, the cards should go into the discard pile. It might be neat to incentivize players to trash good cards in order to get 8 different set aside cards for a Province but it might also be a crappy idea so perhaps I should drop it entirely.

About the wording of Melee Island, I fail to see the problem (of my phrasing as well as coming up with new phrases in general; you wanna do after a little bit of new stuff with fan cards). It should be pretty clear that what it meant by it is that you do as if you played the Treasure card from your hand, i.e. you virtually play a card (and thus, to pick up the examples, you also virtually trash a Spoils or a Horn of Plenty that gains a Victory card, i.e. nothing is actually trashed).

692
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: my cards
« on: September 21, 2015, 08:21:14 am »
Town street seems very weak and compares unfavorably against Steward. Melee Island should read 'each other player with five or more cards in their hand' or else it gets very, very, very powerful. Like, better than Torturer powerful.
Town Street is my Necro variant that was obviously inspired by Steward. I am glad that you do not think that it is OP.
About Melee Island, that you can get hit by several of them is intentional. If the card has to be nerfed I will drop tits Curser ability.

693
Variants and Fan Cards / my cards
« on: September 21, 2015, 04:20:34 am »
Hello. Here are some cards idea and I'd appreciate some feedback:


- Townstreet - Action

Choose one: +2 Cards;
or +2 Actions; or +


I mainly worry about the terminal silver part of the card potentially being too strong.




- Melee Island - Action - Attack

Every other player discards a
Treasure card or reveals a hand with no Treasure cards and takes his -  Token.
 
Use the effects of one of the discarded Treasure cards at the beginning of your
Buy phase or take a Coin token.


Obviously a Cutpurse variant. I considered giving the defending player the option to take a Curse even if he has Treasure cards in his hand but decided against it because the wording would have become more complex.
The Coin token part mainly exists to make the card more decent as during most of the middlegame players will only discard Coppers so the bonus is weaker than that of Cutpurse ... and I doubt that the card hitting Gold during the endgame is strong enough (if there are Kingdom cards with virtual coins players will not opt for Gold anyway) to compensate for that, hence the Coin token.
On a sidenote, thematically I wanted to bring the cursed treasure idea into the card but mechanically it is fairly disarranged.



- Shylock - Action

+1 Card
+1 Action
While this is in play, no more than once during your turn: At the end of your Buy phase, put one Coin token for every unspent on your Tavern mat OR add 1/3 (rounded down) of the Coin tokens on your Tavern mat to them and take them.
覧覧覧覧覧覧覧   
When you buy this, you may overpay for it.
For each you overpaid, put one Coin token on your Tavern mat.


The most complex and most tricky-to-evaluate card. As the wording might be bad I wanna clarify that you can use the effect of the card only once during your turn in order to prevent that you dissave and gain interest & later reinvest. You can either save unspent money or take the invested Coins with interest.
I think that this card provides the inverse of what Coin tokens usually do. Instead of gaining Coin tokens and then using them to gain e.g. a Province if you have 7 you now gain a Coin token when you e.g. spent 4 for a Silver and are able to use the gained Coin tokens only when you play the card again.

This obviously requires heavy playtesting but my main question before I do so is whether I should drop the cantrip part of the card, make it terminal but also drop the rule that you can only use its effect once during your turn. I find it hard to tell whether this is too powerful or whether the card in its current state (not being able to harvets the Coins and reinvest later) is too slow.



- Granary - Action

+1 Action
Set aside a card from your hand.
OR
 Discard all set aside cards.
+ for each differently named set aside card.


The main question is whether setting aside a card is weaker or stronger than trashing. In my opinion it is on average slightly stronger as setting aside Victory cards and greening earlier in the game compensates for not getting rid of the negative VPs of Curses.
The second question is how strong the Horn of Plenty / Native Village -like return of the cards idea is and whether it warrants a price increase to .

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