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401


Great for early gaining of golds or $5 cards.  Terrible for engines later on.  Can't tell if this is way too good or terrible, so I'm hoping that means it's just right.

Reminds me of a much more complex card I have. I really like Heist's simplicity, but I don't think it can really get away with "End your turn." It just creates too many rules questions. Many people will think you still do your Clean-up phase, and some will realize you don't.

"Gain a card costing up to $6. End your Action Phase.  Skip to your Cleanup Phase."
Does that sound too stupid? At this point, is the "end" even necessary? It's basically just there to clarify that you're done playing action cards now. I may have to scrap this idea.

hey good news on the "is this stupid" front: DxV does not think so. Check out "Vacation" and how it words the "end your turn" stuff.

Those are joke cards, so I would take their wording with a bucket of salt.

402



A simple, but sneaky, Way (and death to hand-size attacks) – useful in some spots, but mostly not once you get an engine going.
He, that is my idea but in a way instead of an action XD

But this way is not useless once you get an engine going: It can be your engine. You can make an engine out of Chaining festivals. Village, terminal action and any following action is an Laboratory. Chaining Cellars/Warehouses become even more useful to sculpt your perfect hand. You greatly underestimates the power level of this way.
And you overestimate it’s strength. It certainly isn’t a $4 as your card.

Minion's "refill to 4" option turns a silver into a $5 action.
And draw to five is even better. That's too good to be a way card.

This Way doesn't have a desirable way of reducing your handsize built into it like Minion does, and doesn't attack like Minion does. You can't just look at one aspect of a multifaceted card like Minion and decide that specific aspect is the reason behind its price. Not to mention that discarding your hand and then DtXing is way better than just DtXing. If they were the same, Scholar would be clearly outclassed by Library. Yet Scholar is widely considered the better of the two by a significant margin.

I disagree that Way of the Flying Fish is too good. From a default handsize, it's identical to Way of the Pig, and with a bigger handsize it's Ruined Village. It's usually easier to have a large handsize than a small one. Flying Fish is usually worse than Pig imo.

403
Equivalent or better? This is strictly worse than Lost City for the very reason you described; setting aside an Action card and playing it is strictly worse than +1 Action. With Thrones and terminal draw this becomes a significant disadvantage.

I agree that it is worse--the cost is huge and setting aside an Action card is indeed worse than +1 Action--but it isn't quite strictly worse than Lost City. Lost City can only play two cards.

Also, the fact that it gets all of the Action cards out of your hand before you start resolving them has a variety of interactions with cards that care about what is (or isn't) in your hand: think Tactician, Diplomat, Shanty Town, and and draw-to-x (off the top of my head). (Although Tactician's synergy is more about the fact that you can have another Action card pending [for lack of a better term] when you play it and dump your hand.)

There's way more times just getting +Actions would be better, though. If you draw this with a Smithy, you have no Actions left after playing this and the Smithy. If you draw Lost City and a Smithy, you can still keep playing Actions after playing the Smithy. You have to have this in hand at the same time as all cards you want to play with it; not true of +Actions. And terminal draw cards are more common than all those cases you listed, combined.

404
Equivalent or better? This is strictly worse than Lost City for the very reason you described; setting aside an Action card and playing it is strictly worse than +1 Action. With Thrones and terminal draw this becomes a significant disadvantage.

I agree that it is worse--the cost is huge and setting aside an Action card is indeed worse than +1 Action--but it isn't quite strictly worse than Lost City. Lost City can only play two cards.

405
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Interview with Donald X.
« on: July 20, 2021, 04:05:12 pm »
Since you've abandoned the idea of "all non-Supply cards cost ," how much would the Prizes cost if you made Tournament nowadays?

406
Book Seller
$4
Action - Reaction
+1 action
draw until you have 5 cards in hand
-
If you discard this card, draw up to 5 cards in hand afterwards

The issue I see with this card is that it doesn’t do anything without a discard outlet or a non-terminal action that does not draw a card (or a discard attack to counter). For that reason, it doesn’t seem worth $4, and a lower cost would not solve that it would not have any use in many kingdoms.
You don't need an non-terminal action card that does not draw, as it does make it easier. Just an village is enough to turn in into a laboratory.

Village draws. Village doesn't help this at all.

407

Quote
Scribe
Action - Duration - Reaction
$5
+1 Action
Now or at the start of your next turn, draw until you have 6 cards.
-
When you discard this other than during Clean-up, you may play it.

Most of the time, this would function as a non-terminal draw-to-6, like a Cursed Village without the extra action. Unlike Cursed Village, however, you don't have to get hexed when you gain it. With cards that discard, however, this significantly stronger. The duration aspect makes it a strong counter to discard attacks - by being duration draw you're safe against repeated discard attacks. Get hit by a Militia, play it for next turn, then a second Militia and nothing happens, while if you did the immediate draw, then a second Militia attack would force you to discard back down to three. That would be the main use of the duration option, since otherwise it would normally just amount to a duration +1 Card. The duration option could also function, however, as a proactive defense against discard attacks. It also has a really strong combo with Minion, Hunting Lodge, and Scholar, since you get the draw-to-6 as a reaction to discarding, which happens before the +4, +5, and +7 cards that those three give you - giving you a net handsize of 10, 11, and 13 respectively! Plus an extra Action. As a reaction to an opponent's Minion attack, there'd be an interesting gamble there - you could choose the same-turn option, in which case you'd draw to 6, then get the +4 Cards, for a final hand size of 10. However, if your opponent played another Minion or other discard attack, you'd end up losing those extra cards, while if you chose the next-turn option, you'd be guaranteed 6 cards at the start of your next turn - fewer cards, but safe from other discard attacks. Artificer would also be a strong combo with it, since you can discard a large number of cards and still have a 6-card hand afterwards

I know this is extremely nitpicky, but it should say "draw until you have 6 cards in hand." Otherwise it's checking if you have 6 cards period, and drawing doesn't change the number of cards you have. Also, just to help prevent misreads, it should say "either now or..." like official cards do.

408
What if draw-to-X but X is actually a variable?


Quote
Geographer - $4
Action

+1 Action
Reveal and discard a card from your hand. Draw until you have cards in hand equal to its cost in $.

This is extremely weak. From a default handsize, you need to discard a just to get the same net handsize as a Cantrip. Even discarding a just gets you the same net handsize as a Lab, and that's a weak enough effect that you'd probably be better off just playing the !

Also, revealing is unnecessary because you're only discarding one card; that card is visible normally.

409
Book Seller
$4
Action - Reaction
+1 action
draw until you have 5 cards in hand
-
If you discard this card, draw up to 5 cards in hand afterwards


This card would feed action engines quite nicely, while on it's own only an replacement. With one action played it is an laboratory.

The proper wording for the Reaction is "when you discard this other than during Clean-up, you may reveal it to draw until you have 5 cards in hand." The current wording doesn't work because it doesn't show the Book Seller to prove you discarded it (whenever you discard multiple cards, only the topmost one is seen), it's mandatory (which is a problem for the same reason as problem 1, i.e. because most discarded cards are invisible to the other players), and it includes discarding it from play (which I'm sure is unintended).

410
Refuge
Action $3

+1 Action
+1 Buy

Exile from 1 to 3 differently named cards from your hand.

Notes
- Exiling cards has a nice synergy with draw to X engines. Unless you are playing a megaturn strategy, you are going to have to address or accept the problem of victory cards taking up valuable hand space in the latter stages of the game. Exiling them is one way to solve this.
- There are no official cards that allow you to exile multiple differently named cards from your hand. I decided to go down this path.
- I think a non-terminal that allowed you to exile as few or as many cards as you want would be overpowered. I decided to borrow the trashing restrictions from Temple as I find them interesting.
- I decided to put a +buy on the card. It adds another engine component when viewing it as a draw to X enabler.

This is way better than Temple imo. Sure, Temple also scores, but this is non-terminal, so you don't need to spend your precious Actions using it, and Exiling is way better than trashing most of the time since you can Exile your Victory cards without losing points; Temple breaks even on VP most of the time since it usually trashes at least one Estate. I think this is strong enough to cost . The benefits over Temple severely outweigh the negatives imo.

411
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Fan Card Mechanics Week 15: Level Up
« on: July 18, 2021, 12:41:18 am »
20 Hour Warning!!!
(I'm a few minutes late again. The deadline for submissions is still 23:59 UTC / 7:59 p.m. Eastern (Forum) time on Sunday, July 18, 2021.)


Here are the submissions so far:

spineflu's Carnavale
mxdata's Warlord
fika monster's Volatile Laboratory
naitchman's Breeder

You're missing Aquila's Aristocrat.

412


Facilitates DtX in two ways: 1. Non-terminal Village that doesn't draw, and 2. it can get rid of junk from on top of your deck in order to help make sure your DtX card draws good cards instead of rubbish.

413
Does an Artifact count as "more than one card in one post?" Or would that qualify?

414
Congratulations, X-tra. I'm not at all surprised by the results; as soon as I saw Spelunker, I thought it was a definite shoe-in for 1st.

415
Livery + Academy + multiple buys

I had an irl game recently where this combo came up. I was the only one who noticed the Livery + Academy combo, and I was producing Villagers so fast, I only had one Village in my entire deck, and the rest of my Action cards were terminal, AND I was drawing my deck every turn, and I was STILL getting Villagers faster than I was spending them.

417
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: July 11, 2021, 11:55:29 am »
You seem to be relying on the online implementation, not the rulebook?

From the 2019 Errata (Stop-Moving Rule section): "If a card isn't where the effect would expect it to be, or has moved away from there and then back, it can't move the card. Played cards expect to be in play."

Foal expects itself to be in play, which it isn't if it's already in its pile. Thus Stop-Moving prevents it from returning to its pile as it is not where it expects itself to be. This isn't a new concept. All cards that move themselves on-play fail (at moving themselves) if they aren't actually in play.

418
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: July 10, 2021, 01:15:49 am »
Way of the Butterfly says yes.
So far as I can see it's silent on the matter?

Have you ever tried Throning a card and using Way of the Butterfly on the Throned card both times? It fails the second time, because by then it's already in its pile.

That was my initial thought as well. Vampire and Bat are not Action cards, so cannot be played in unusual ways using emulators/command cards/throne variants, which, in theory, could cause issues.

Command cards wouldn't work. "Play a card [with X criteria] from the Supply." - Command cards. Foal is not in the Supply. Only Throne Room variants would work.

419
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: July 08, 2021, 03:08:45 pm »
Ah, but can you really not "return" a card to its pile when it's already there?

Way of the Butterfly says yes.

420
Wrangler
Action/Season - $5
+1 Card
+1 Action
Gain a Horse...
In Summer: to the bottom of your deck
In Autumn: onto your deck
In Winter: to your hand

Rules clarification: In Spring, you Gain a Horse (to your discard pile)

Just want to let you know, Spring, Summer, and Autumn, this card is a delayed lab, with varying degrees of delay (with Autumn being equally strong as lab). However in Winter, this card is a double Lab. A double lab is pretty significantly stronger than a lab, DonX tested it at $8 and it was still too strong. Its okay that winter be a really strong effect, stronger than the cost would suggest, but that is pretty overboard. I suggest having Winter discard a card after gaining horse to hand. That way its +3 cards, +1 Action, discard a card. Still strictly stronger than lab, and still easily the strongest of the four seasons, without it being too crazy. Otherwise, I really like the card!

Cantrip + gain a Horse onto your deck isn't "equally strong as Lab."  It would only be equivalent to a Lab if you actually draw the Horse in the same turn. It's hyperbolic to call a card that's only a Lab if combined with another Cantrip "equally strong as Lab". You're right about Winter being a double Lab, though.

I didn't say "equivalent to" I said "equally as strong as". Setting up your next turn with a horse is about as good as getting +1 card now. There are definitely situations where you'd rather have a horse top-decked then get +1 card now, for example when you've already drawn your whole deck. With a drawn deck, autumn is *stronger* than a lab. Autumn is not a lab, but there are situations where it stronger than lab, and situations where it is weaker, and imo those occur about equally often. That's all that is meant by equally strong as. Autumn wrangle is to lab as Supplies is to peddler, they're not the same, but they are about as strong.

Sure, they're about as strong, I agree with that. But "about as strong as" is not the same thing as "equally as strong as." It's slightly weaker imo, and it would certainly look odd for a Cantrip that gains a one-shot Lab onto your deck to cost the same as a Lab (although it would also be very clearly too strong for ).

Setting up your next turn with a Horse is about as good as getting +1 Card now.

If you play a Cantrip that gains a Horse onto your deck and you do not draw that Horse until next turn, that's +1 handsize to next turn and net 0 handsize this turn. That's equivalent to Caravan, which is a , and not even one of the crazy s.

I do absolutely agree with you that Wrangler is currently too strong. The Summer and Spring effects would be overpriced at , probably even at , but Autumn would be an upper-mid and Winter is insane.

This last part's just my opinion, not really a balance concern, but I think Seasons cards should sidegrade themselves between Seasons, rather than being strictly better during certain Seasons than others.

421


Feel free to suggest wording changes (and, well, other changes besides, I suppose).
Compost can turn your junk into whatever you Wish! It's a solution to all junkers. Be it from outside or in, Compost takes care of it all. If you need more of its services, you can always gain a Compost back to your hand and put it into play again.

A "hidden" usage is to set aside green cards like Provinces while being sure not to make the Compost overflow, to ensure that your green never enters your deck. Nifty, ain't it?

This card has been buffed several times over the course of its conception. Now it's a lot stronger.

Won't this keep working forever if played with BoM, Captain, or Necromancer? In all these cases, you fail to ever trash it.

422
Wrangler
Action/Season - $5
+1 Card
+1 Action
Gain a Horse...
In Summer: to the bottom of your deck
In Autumn: onto your deck
In Winter: to your hand

Rules clarification: In Spring, you Gain a Horse (to your discard pile)

Just want to let you know, Spring, Summer, and Autumn, this card is a delayed lab, with varying degrees of delay (with Autumn being equally strong as lab). However in Winter, this card is a double Lab. A double lab is pretty significantly stronger than a lab, DonX tested it at $8 and it was still too strong. Its okay that winter be a really strong effect, stronger than the cost would suggest, but that is pretty overboard. I suggest having Winter discard a card after gaining horse to hand. That way its +3 cards, +1 Action, discard a card. Still strictly stronger than lab, and still easily the strongest of the four seasons, without it being too crazy. Otherwise, I really like the card!

Cantrip + gain a Horse onto your deck isn't "equally strong as Lab."  It would only be equivalent to a Lab if you actually draw the Horse in the same turn. It's hyperbolic to call a card that's only a Lab if combined with another Cantrip "equally strong as Lab". You're right about Winter being a double Lab, though.

423
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: July 07, 2021, 05:43:11 pm »
Sure, it doesn't especially matter for a RBCI, but Foal would need a "when you discard this from play" big-background-arrow thingy like the Page/Peasant lines, rather than a flat-out "exchange". Otherwise you end up in corner-case hell.

???
whys that? bats + vampires exchange both to and from the supply/out-of-supply with no problem

That was my initial thought as well. Vampire and Bat are not Action cards, so cannot be played in unusual ways using emulators/command cards/throne variants, which, in theory, could cause issues. The official rules cover an Exchange failing because there is no card to get, but I don't think they cover one failing because there is no card to return (or it has been lost under the stop-moving rule).

The logical answer is that an exchange requires both, and so just as you don't return a card if there is none to take, you don't take a card if there is none to return, but that is not officially set forth. I suppose someone could argue whether exchange should work conditionally like Wish or unconditionally like Horse (if you Throne the former you only gain one card, but if you throne the latter you get the +Cards and +Actions twice, even though you only return it once), but I think the plain meaning of the word pretty clearly suggests the former.

I don't know what other problems there could be.

The rules DO actually cover an Exchange failing because there is no card to return. From the Nocturne rules:

Quote
Nocturne has three cards that tell a player to "exchange" a card for another card. The card being exchanged is returned to its Supply pile, or non-Supply pile, and the card being exchanged for is taken and put into the player's discard pile. This does not count as gaining a card. The exchange only happens if both cards can be exchanged; if the pile is empty, the cards are not exchanged.

And the stop-moving rule would prevent a Commanded Foal from returning to its pile, as it's already there. "Exchange this for a Card X" is effectively identical to "return this to its pile. If you do, put a Card X from its pile into your discard pile."

424
Escort - $4
Action - Duration
+1 Action
Trash a card from your hand. Put a coin token on here for each $ it cost.
At the start of your turn, you may remove one coin token from here to discard your hand and draw 5 cards.

Is this a paid-for Guide? Yep! Could it be done as a mat with tokens as well? Sure it could! Has it been done in a previous WDC? Probably, I've been skimming them for a while now. Is it priced right? Almost certainly not!

I think this needs "while any remain" for the second part. As worded, it stays in play forever even when you've run out of tokens, as it still gives you the choice every turn even though it's meaningless.
I originally had that in the wording of the card, but it looked like it was going to make the text smaller than I'd like so I was going to have it as a side ruling that you discard it in Clean-up when there are no tokens left. If people think that it should be in the card text then I'm fine adding it back in.

I think it should have that wording back in just to make it explicit. I don't think it's a good idea to rely on an FAQ for fanmade cards to work properly.

425
This wording also breaks Command cards, though. If you Overlord a Galley (via cost reduction), the Overlord will be a Galley in-play forever. Based on previous comments, I'd suggest "until after you choose not to, at the start of each of your turns, you may Exile a card from your hand. If you didn't, Exile this for +3 Cards."

What about "Until after you choose to Exile this, at the start of each of your turns, choose one: Exile a card from your hand; or Exile this for +3 Cards."

Best wording yet.

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