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Messages - iguanaiguana

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51
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 01:36:58 pm »
So iguana, that last post feels like you believe you know who my alleged partners are.

Who are they?

I really don't. It's frustrating. At first I was thinking Jim/Joth/2.7 because of the wrong meta analysis the team did in terms of picking on me. But since then I've realized it may have actually been your team's idea to pick on a hard exile because you didn't feel you could get two easy exiles through. So that points at scummy looking players.

I don't think it can be Joth/Math/2.7 because both of your partners wouldn't be voting/considering voting for you right now (unless Math is just toying with me and ultimately plans to vote me, in which case Math looks like a partner and that is sort of a mindfuck on how I've been reading this game.)

Swowl also looks like a very likely partner at this point with how quickly he jumped to the conclusion that 2.7 was telling the truth and I was lying. And with Swowl's lack of activity so far this game, that makes more sense that he would just let 2.7 take the reigns on a gambit like this.

Jim also looks like a partner with his hedging, and that would make more sense out of D1 if Jim is scum and Math is town where you came in to rescue Jim by casting shade on Math and starting up the D1 Math wagon. But IDK about Jim yet and where he votes here will obviously be illuminating.

I still think Faust could be a partner with his super weird theories. It looks like he's going hard for getting the misexile on me through no matter what happens with you and that is super scummy IMO. Faust on the team also makes sense with the idea that the team solved MiX/WCD are masons overnight and therefore knew that they needed a false guilty to stay ahead of PoE. 

All that being said, I really need to go back and reread everyone I just listed and look for partner interactions.

52
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 01:28:31 pm »
It's also very clear that 2.7's top 'scumread' at the end of the day was WCD. So if he's town, why not cop your top scum read on WCD?

What makes more sense is that 2.7 didn't want to do a false guilty of WCD EITHER because he felt she would be an easy misexile for LyLo that he needed to keep around OR because the team had figured out that MiX/Didds were masons overnight and he knew that a false guilty on her would lead to a CC and his exile.

So whether 2.7 had figured out masons ahead of time or not, it makes more sense as scum that he would choose me as the cop target and not his actual stated top scum read.

53
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 2)
« on: October 01, 2021, 01:24:42 pm »
So 2.7's EoD2 play is actually very scummy.

Here is 2.7's last vote of the day:

The main reason I think WCD is scummy is how she has maintained her scum read on EFHW. Opens up with a casual EFHW vote, then builds on it, explains why it makes sense this game, etc., etc.  But then, when Joth votes for EFHW, WCD asks for additional rationale.

vote:  EFHW

Why’s that?

Why is that? Why would town who has spent the majority of their day thinking about how EFHW is scum this game need EXTRA reasons to vote for EFHW. Or question why other people have "seen the light" and joined the EFHW wagon. It just feels....off.

Then D2 there is this:

Didds, what happened to your scumread on EFHW?

Its still there, but I am trying to be fair to her...I think I find her scummy because she is cagey. I am so open that I grapple with close to the vest folks. But, she was one of the few people trying to get an exile off at the EOD, and she was so willing to do it that I don't know that it was scummy.  Her wagon was 4 yesterday and never got an higher so I don't think there is enough town will to make that happen today. So, I have decided to just wait and see on her. Same with Joth.

This feels extremely scummy to me. More specifically, it feels like scum who had moved on from her fake scum read on EFHW but then when reminded about it kept it alive, because you never know when you need to get that mis-exile in. Basically, I don't buy WCD's read on EFHW as being a genuine town reading another player as scum.

vote: WCD

So 2.7 is getting ready to frame WCD here pushing the WCD case which led to the CFD@WCD. Looking at 2.7's EoD, I'm actually realizing that the scum team likely did not solve the WCD is a mason idea overnight. Rather, 2.7 was working on building a case that WCD is scum, and the EFHW kill was meant to make her look scummier by proving that her tunnel on EFHW was wrong.

So the plan was most likely to get a fake result on me today, get me exiled, then go for WCD as the final easy misexile at the double-LyLo that would result out of my misexile --> e's correct exile --> final day misexile WCD as the 'scummy' player. This indicates that the scum team did not have a second easy misexile that they felt they could easily push through. Or at the very least that 2.7 was overconfident about his ability to get a free exile out of me with a result, which makes sense given his own meta of overestimating himself.

vote: faust

Hmmm

2.5 hours to go and gkrieg is acting like wants to be exiled.

At least, not joining a viable alternative

This is 2.7's last post of the day, where he hedges of gkrieg and sort of softly indicates that he would support the gkrieg exile without actually committing to it. So this is just the classic scum tactic of wanting a town exile to go through, but trying to make sure that there are as many townies on the exile wagon as possible. Note that he hung back as the masons deliberated about whether or not to hammer gkrieg. My assumption is that he would have been able to come in and vote for gkrieg if he felt there wasn't enough town support for the exile in order to make sure that the misexile went through and the tide turned last minute toward one of his partners.

TLDR 2.7 spent the end of day 2 pushing the WCD exile while hanging around to be ready to support the gkrieg exile if needed.

54
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 12:12:59 pm »
The simplest explanation is that e is scum and iguana is town.

Faust’s idea that they’re both scum is an extraordinary claim that requires extraordinary evidence.

There’s obviously no world where they’re both town.

And if e is town and iguana is scum, well it’s not the end of the world. We have a guaranteed scum exile tomorrow, and e was a 1-shot cop anyway.

This is a good summary, although i think all the factors pointed out by math right before this point much more to my being town. My argument is admittedly a terrible one - I played this so poorly I could not be scum - but it is true. No way my scum teammates wouldn't talk me off the ledge from my crazy schemes.

I just ask you to take the risk on town!e playing poorly and exile iguana based on my result

You are acting like scum have no individual autonomy and that is not true. You may be on a team, but you're still one person on the other side of the screen typing out the words.

55
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 12:03:49 pm »
Anyway, I'm going to bed. Hopefully we move forward with this in some meaningful way tomorrow. I'm ready for anything at this point and I'm not letting Ahab get a free scum double LyLo out of a bogus fake claim.

It's only double lylo because iguana knows he is a guaranteed exile tomorrow after my flip if I do get exiled today

No, you are a guaranteed exile tomorrow if they exile me today.

56
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:47:12 am »
On a different note, I don't think we need anyone to claim because we have caught scum for today

I am a cop
I investigated Iguana last night
iguana is an imposter.

Is a 1-shot cop a cop?


Lol ridiculous. They are two different roles next to each other in the setup description. Ok now I'm really going to bed.

57
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:46:16 am »
Anyway, I'm going to bed. Hopefully we move forward with this in some meaningful way tomorrow. I'm ready for anything at this point and I'm not letting Ahab get a free scum double LyLo out of a bogus fake claim.

58
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:43:36 am »
On a different note, I don't think we need anyone to claim because we have caught scum for today

I am a cop
I investigated Iguana last night
iguana is an imposter.

59
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:38:04 am »
Why on earth do you lie as town in a semi open setup where your claim has bearing on how likely everyone else's claims are and vice versa? Lying about being cop as town has the potential to create, EG, a counterclaim from the actual cop in a CCC situation or just produce so many letters that it's a 1% chance to occur situation. So at best you are making people believe your lie but then they exile another town PR by mistake.

But if you are scum, that's a good outcome to get that counterclaim, so faking full cop is a fine play.

This is not a setup where town lies about their role because they're all related.

60
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:30:42 am »
Also I know we're being figurative here but you basically just claimed scum again.

61
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:28:58 am »
No, if you are town you claim your role and your result. If you are scum, you have to make something up and that is where there is room for error.


62
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: October 01, 2021, 02:20:17 am »
Welcome back Ahab. Glad you're having fun hunting down the great green iguana.

63
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:59:01 pm »
Though we don't necessarily want to go for iguana next. There is a nonzero chance that he's town.

but why does E! jump the gun like this?

At first this didn't make sense to me either. Why not wait until Lylo to claim and go for the win? Then I realized, waiting until Lylo would look scummy as hell, and there would be no way that they'd get me exiled at LyLo. Plus, before LyLo, a million things could happen to PoE scum and put them in a worse position for a gambit like this. Doing it now, 2.7's team just sacrifices one player, and gets themselves to an automatic LyLo by exiling me.

The true towny day to claim as a 1 shot cop is D2, after you get your result. Claiming D3 when scum is one vote away from LyLo is scummy, because it puts their team in a position where they can get to a garanteed double LyLo without having to do any real work except an easy claim.

64
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:50:52 pm »
Okay, I'm just making sense of this now. But this is 2.7's plan.

His team already knew they can't get me misexiled without a claim, because 2.7 tried that yesterday and no one bit or even listened to him. So he decided he needs an incriminating result on me to get me exiled. This puts scum into a very likely LyLo position once I die, ensuring that whoever else it is that they think they can get easily misexiled will win them the game.

Most likely, they had looked at MiX and WCD Iso's and figured out they were probably masons. And so they knew that PoE was going to make it very difficult for them unless they got rid of a towny player.

65
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 2)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:32:39 pm »
Rereading end of D2... I was going to make a long multi-post quote, but I'm breaking it up for easier reference and reading.

We should strongly consider a massclaim start of day 3.

We'll be at 9 players, 3 scum (barring successful protection) which means we need 5/6 town to agree to get scum exiled without a bus. We're going to need maximum information to have any chance.

Joth later said (haven't gone to look in D3 posts yet for where) that maybe it wasn't a good idea to post this yesterday, as it got scum thinking about what to claim.  Not sure the validity of that, as I'm sure most people (scum and town) had already been thinking about when massclaim time comes... as evidenced by even e stating D3 that he wasn't sure whether to claim 1-shot cop or full cop, and decided to claim the 1-shot.

I disagree. In an open setup like this one, scum thinks about what town roles may or may not exist immediately and associated ideas for fake claims immediately.

And if anyone thinks scum wouldn't have seen the writing on the wall that a D3 mass claim would come up after not catching any scum D1 or D2 you haven't played mafia on this site very long

This is a very good argument for why you are fake claiming scum!

66
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:27:23 pm »
I mean seriously, e wants town to believe he's fake claiming town who backs off his fake claim at the slightest provocation. How does that make any sense?

67
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:26:17 pm »
I mean you hadn't even decided what to claim at the moment you were typing it out. Did you just realize 1 shot was way more likely with EFHW's flip after the fact?

I see you did some setup analysis in the scum QT N0. Not surprising.

Yeah except this isnt exactly the first time I've played Asher++ and I read the gkrieg/Ash masons one where it all came down to bad analysis of how likely roles are to appear, so I just know this stuff a priori.

This is another reason we need to mass claim. To see how likely his role is to even exist in the first place. (Probably not, because he made it up)

68
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:16:39 pm »
I mean you hadn't even decided what to claim at the moment you were typing it out. Did you just realize 1 shot was way more likely with EFHW's flip after the fact?

69
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 09:15:11 pm »
Results: I'm a cop! Actually a 1 shot cop..... who didn't feel like using my ability N1.

And we're supposed to take this seriously?

Results are only results when they are true.

70
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 08:30:27 pm »

my order would be

Joth/Iguana
E!
Math
MiX/Faust
Jim/WCD
Swowl

But yes, if we did do it, I would be fine with Iguana being first. Though you suggesting it makes me slightly weary.

Ok, I'm officially moving on from the iguana!meta!wormhole.

Let's not derail this day. Math should be the next one to claim. MiX already did (well faust did it for him). Then Jim, then Swowl. Either that, or we are not massclaiming because today is just about 2.7 vs. Iguana.  Personally I believe it's going to be better to get more claims out there, because that might help PoE 2.7's partners and show people that he's scum.

71
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 08:19:52 pm »
Alright, just for kicks, and because I'm ill and called in sick and have nothing to do today, and because also it's starting to feel like a nuclear holocaust happened based on thread activity, here's one more classic scum!iguana post:

I can't believe that D1 of this game is now approaching 1200 posts. Has there ever been a game like this before? This is so so crazy.

I'm seriously getting exhausted with it. I'm starting to feel like scum just wins here because everyone looks the same.

I mean even if we do get a scum flip, then we have to go back and look at 1200 posts of stuff to figure out their partners. So crazy.

I feel demoralized.

In this game, I actually managed to make a fair number of big posts at first, but later in the game I couldn't keep up anymore because the weight of all the lying was really getting to me, and I eventually revealed myself to be scum with my angst and exhaustion.

That has not happened this game, because I am NOT scum NOT lying and instead I am in the exhilarating position of being town fighting for my life!

72
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 07:44:26 pm »
(fun side note; that post took so long to write because I got distracted rereading my QT from Rewind mafia and getting lost in the nostalgia of being a survivor. That was a fun game!)

73
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 07:43:37 pm »
Another thing that makes me town here is just the meta aspect of my play, which I think some people are probably underestimating.

I literally have NEVER EVER been able to muster this kind of activity, scumhunting, or anything like it as mafia before. The closest I've ever come were two games, Breaking Bad mafia where I was basically serial killer, and Rewind Mafia II where I was a survivor-vigilante. But both of those games didn't feel anything like being on a conventional mafia team, and so I was able to filter out the fact that I was scum and focus on the very real scumhunting that I could do and basically just play a pro-town game as a non-town player.

In contrast to that, you can see #s based differences in my mafia games every single time.

So I dug around a lot and the last time I was straight mafia was in Space Alert and that is a really exemplary mafia game for me. In that game, I make a grand total of 57 posts across several days of being alive. Here's an exemplary post from that game:

I get Faust's case on me and I have lurked as scum before because I was overwhelmed as scum before. But actually I got over that and I was really really active as scum in Rewind and Breaking Bad, both of my last two games.

This game I felt overwhelmed because it's based on a board game I don't know how to play well and everyone was talking about how to do it. So I lurked because I really didn't know what to add.

Faust's case on me isn't bad as in he is scummy for making it, it's just out of date.

Sorry it took so long to respond to it. IRL sucked for a bit there.

Basically, I still hadn't figured out how to not lurk as mafia, so I point at my survivor game and my serial killer game as evidence that I don't lurk as scum, then complain about having a hard time getting into the setup as an excuse for lurking. But actually, I'm lurking again because I'm mafia and still don't know how to do it. Inspiring play!

I could dig more; I've been mafia about half a dozen times, and I lurked every single time and every single time it I was exiled. But it would honestly be a waste of time to find six more examples of scum!Iguana making excuses for lurking hard.

Instead, I challenge anyone here to find one single example of a mafia game where I play anywhere remotely close to how I'm playing in my most recent two games, where I rolled town. If you can find even one, I will vote for myself.

74
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Signups)
« on: September 30, 2021, 07:15:26 pm »
So, time to defend myself. I am going to try to walk people through what I was thinking during some of the major phases of the game so far

Ironically, a lot of my D1 scumread on Mathdude was actually informed by how I thought that 2.7 and his case on Math were towny and therefore the Math wagon was town driven.

I got a very towny vibe from the posts (starting here) that 2.7 made when he came into the game and suspected Math. Specifically, 2.7 made the "Jim screamed town" comment that really stuck out to me as something I thought a town would say. It also jived with my own sense that Math was saying a lot of scummy sounding things and Jim was saying a lot of townie sounding things and that the Jim wagon had to have scum who hopped on it trying to capitalize on faust's scumread.

That being said, Mathdude sounded scummy during the Oz game a lot, but turned out to be town and really only made a few townie comments that I could use to know he was town and a lot of just either off-the-wall comments or scummy sounding comments in that game. So to me, just hearing scummy comments from Math wasn't enough reason to vote him. That's why 2.7's case that it was Math's placement on a wagon that was scummy was what pushed me over the edge to really seeing a scum!Math narrative.

My Math scumread persisted until EoD1, when I looked back at the wagons over night and concluded that if Math had been scum and Joth had been town, Math would almost certainly have moved his vote onto Joth. No one had moved to the Jim wagon that he was on over a long period of time, and people were starting to leave it. So if scum!Math had moved to Joth, Joth would have come much closer to exile, so for Math to hesitate on switching his vote off Jim before he left for the day seemed really townie to me. If you're scum, why not just take the pressure off yourself when you know you can get a misexile either way? But if you're town, you don't always want to move onto another player if you don't feel good about it, so you hold off until the last minute and maybe miss a deadline. So with Joth & Jim being two of my top townreads D1, I felt that Math's hesitation to move from Jim to Joth even when it would preserve his own life was actually very towny.

The same argument didn't really apply to Joth, because at the point he signed off, there was only faust and MiX voting him, so although I thought he was towny based on his meta, I didn't see his failure to switch wagons at EoD as a towny move. That was part of the reason that I've been going back and forth of Joth so much. Because if Math is town, that would mean that the wagon on him was most likely either T v T or scum!Joth v Town!Math.

That is why I came into D2 and immediately picked a fight with MiX because for some reason (that I still don't understand!) MiX had reread the EoD1 and actually come to the opposite conclusion from mine about Math, and that made very little sense to me. At the time, though, I didn't want to share my reasoning for why I found Math towny because I felt like scum would still want to push the Math exile, and that if I held back on my reads, scum would feel more likely to push him again D2 and that I would be able to analyze those interactions and find scum D2 better than the nothing D1.

I ended up thinking gkrieg was scum mostly because of his placement on the Math wagon, and pushed him equally for his lurking and also because the more I looked back at D1, the more it felt like the Math wagon from D1 had scum on it whether Joth was town or Joth was scum. I also was having a love-hate kind of relationship with faust at that point, to where I had to kind of convince myself that even though my gut was calling him scum for no good reason, he's still more likely town than scum, and usually when faust is town he's a really good scum hunter. So with faust pushing gkrieg, and gkrieg looking like the scummy vote on the Math wagon, I started to feel really good about a gkrieg exile.

WCD was saying she didn't think gkrieg was scum by the end, but just wanted an exile. But I had total tunnel vision that gkrieg was lying scum right up to the flip, and the facts of his Math vote and my townread on Math were pushing me to think that way regardless of what he tried to say to defend himself. I also really did not like that he wasn't elaborating much on his Math vote when defending himself, which made me think even more that his Math votes were just manufactured scum votes.

The final irony is kinda like the first one. It turns out I actually was right about there being scum on the Math wagon, but I just had picked the wrong Math voter. 2.7 tricked me D2 into still thinking he was town by backing off his Math scumread shortly after I announced that I also had backed off it. Then he started to suspect faust shortly after I announced that I suspected faust. What I didn't realize is that most likely he was looking at my posts for cues about how he should be reading things and copying my opinions D2 because I was a player who sheeped him D1. So yeah that basically brings us up to today where I am kicking myself for pushing gkrieg yesterday when I should have been pushing 2.7.

Other than that, I'm in a really awkward position here as VT because I don't have any special information I can share that reveals my towniness. I'm guessing that scum must have looked through my ISO last night and guessed from my active play that I was VT and decided that would make me a good person to try to incriminate. I'm also thinking that scum is among players who don't know my meta very well, because everyone who knows me knows that I don't play anything like this at all as scum. So I know I said faust (I kind of always leap to that -- faust complex) but actually faust knows that I'm the towniest towny, so I don't think he's on the team here. I'm going to say the team is probably 2.7, with Jimmm and maybe Joth because those are the players who know my town MO the least and wouldn't know that I'm a bad target for a gambit like this.

75
Mafia Game Threads / Re: M135: Among Us Mafia (Day 3)
« on: September 30, 2021, 12:49:57 pm »
So I guess it's e/iguana/X?

Should this change the order in which we exile them?

Here is you putting us in a literal line

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