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151
Let's Discuss ... / Re: Let's Discuss Adventures EVENTS: BALL
« on: February 19, 2016, 07:26:45 pm »
This reminds me of Border Village because buying BV basically gets you a $3 (vanilla Village) and a $5, for $6.  Ball is get 2 $4's for $5, so similar concept.  I definitely think Ball can be very worthwhile, as history has proven that buying BV can certainly pay off in many situations.

Ball is more like 2 $4s for $6 with the on-buy penalty, no? (Except in the cases where it isn't, of course, but *normally*...)

152
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Gray's Cards revisited.
« on: February 18, 2016, 04:14:50 am »
I, too am curious about the "Trash 1 or 3 cards." Is it part of the flavor that you can't trash an even number of cards?

Also, Assassin feels stronger than Witch. Making an easy comparison, the difference is swapping out +2 Cards for +(2) and discard your deck. +(2) and discard your deck obviously is worth (3), while +2 Cards is probably worth (1.5) when they're terminal. If this is the case Assassin shouldn't cost less than (6) - I'm not sure if I would buy it for (6), but that is what testing is for.

But Chancellor is a very weak (3). I'm pretty certain I buy Moat in Attack-less kingdoms far more often than I buy Chancellor at all.

153
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Dominion oxymorons.
« on: July 10, 2014, 06:01:46 am »
relevant edge cases.

Can someone enlighten me? I don't get what so +5 about this post

Most of the edge cases described in this forum are extremely contrived and rarely found in normal play. Heron is making fun of this... feature... by drawing your attention to the fact that we have to point out when an edge case is actually relevant. Some members found the level of self-awareness funny enough to upvote heron's post.

Of course, there are edge cases to everything I just described, but they are probably not relevant to my point, nor your enjoyment of the joke, which I just increased for you and everybody else for that matter.

PPE: ah, ninja'd. Woe is me.

Im lost as to how a quoted joke from someone else gets so many +1s. My mind is boggled.

The original quote was using it seriously.

154
Don't worry soulnet, you'll get your Brazil/Argentina :P

Are you still feeling that way after the first half? Is not a huge dominance, but I think Argentina is playing a lot better so far, especially in the last minutes, and the Netherlands defenders have started fouling a lot.

I don't like that Martins Indi guy one bit. This is the second game I see in which I feel like he should see a red card (the foul without the ball against Messi should have been his first yellow card, possibly worse than the foul that actually earned him the card).

BTW, I am not complaining, but Van Persie is playing like crap again. Is there no replacement for him in the Netherlands bench? I was surprised he was not replaced against Costa Rica.
Second Martins Indi foul wouldn't have been a yellow had it not been for the first one - bit of "totting up" as the commentators like to say there. And as I type, he's being subbed off...

van Persie was replaced by Klaas-Jan Huntelaar against Mexico, I agree the same change could easily have been made against Costa Rica.

155
Other Games / Re: Good "strategy" games
« on: July 07, 2014, 06:10:15 pm »
I don't see how knowing the position of a big boat gives you extra information at all.
Some (many? all?) Battleship versions include a rule that different ships can't be in adjacent squares. So finding a big ship rules out a large area of the board.

156
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Difficult non-Dominion Trivia!
« on: July 07, 2014, 12:44:28 pm »
My Google search suggests that Witherweaver's answer is the most correct.

157
General Discussion / Re: Maths thread.
« on: June 27, 2014, 08:46:34 am »
OK, strange question: in UK and non-US post-colonies, you shorten "mathematics" to "maths."  Do you also shorten "economics" to "econs"?
If it gets shortened at all, it would be "econ", but I've not really heard that from people other than economics students (or at least, students who study some economics)

158
Random fact: with Brazil, Chile, Colombia and Uruguay in one quarter of the draw, we're guaranteed a South American semi-finalist already. (Where they will likely meet the winner of France v Germany!)

159
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Strictly better than....
« on: June 24, 2014, 05:57:25 am »
Ignoring universal edge cases and on-gain effects, but not on-trash effects, I came up with the following list: (ignoring Ruins and non-Action cards). This is mostly a compilation of things already mentioned in this thread with a few I've added myself.

Bazaar, Worker's Village, Walled Village, Mining Village, Plaza > Village, Border Village
Grand Market, Market, Treasury, Bazaar > Peddler
Grand Market > Market
Festival > Woodcutter, Nomad Camp
Goons > Militia
Alchemist, Trusty Steed > Laboratory
Expand, Butcher > Remodel
Count > Mandarin
Festival, University > Necropolis

Anyone want to edge case any of these, or add to the list?

edit: removed Fortress, as discussed further down, and  Squire, which clearly has a potential on-trash penalty (e.g. hit by Swindler with Swindlers and Curses out, only other attack on the board is Sea Hag).

160
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Strictly better than....
« on: June 18, 2014, 09:32:54 pm »
Any reasonable definition of "strictly better" has to exclude Possession/Masquerade/Ambassador, as well as the card's cost.  I would argue that "Opponents are more likely to discard it with Spy" also should be excluded.

I disagree that cost should be excluded.  "Strictly better" should include price, and if we want to ignore the cost to purchase (or gain) the card then we should use the term "strictly better effect".  These separate terms are useful when discussing fan cards.

Yes. But we're not discussing fan cards here. theory's original statement was pretty clearly meant as 'in the context of this question, any reasonable definition of "strictly better" has to exclude... etc'.

161
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Strictly better than....
« on: June 17, 2014, 06:44:54 am »
On the other hand, I can't find an edge case to Estate > Duchy, though maybe someone else can.
baron
That was the whole reason of why Estate > Duchy rather than Estate = Duchy. Edited for clarity.
ahh, okay. Rebuild would make you prefer to have a duchy in hand if it is a mirror and you are trying to win the duchy split. However, you also have a province and so having your only duchy in hand lets you safely name province to insure you hit an estate.

This doesn't work with scott pilgrim's "genie" interpretation of the question, which is the one I would use. Also, it's to do with TfB, and thus cost (if Estates cost 5 you wouldn't have this problem).

162
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: fastest growing strategy.
« on: June 15, 2014, 09:34:42 pm »
florrat is right in that even with imperfect shuffle luck you will still be able to empty any finite supply in something like 15 turns at most, given that you can choose the kingdom.
* navical fails at reading past the first few lines (just saw "with perfect shuffle luck" and ignored the rest).  :-[

163
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Strictly better than....
« on: June 15, 2014, 09:24:39 pm »
On the other hand, I can't find an edge case to Estate > Duchy, though maybe someone else can.
baron
That was the whole reason of why Estate > Duchy rather than Estate = Duchy. Edited for clarity.

164
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: fastest growing strategy.
« on: June 15, 2014, 09:22:44 pm »
There was a post before that linked to a site where someone did some asymptotics on VP gaining.  I think it was in the thread about determining Engine vs. Non-Engine.  I think the jist of it was that Big Money accumulated VP at a linear rate, while Engines can accumulate at a superlinear rate.  I think good strategies could get to quadratic.
Big Money is linear, though it isn't the best linear strategy. (4 Princes of Monuments is 10VP/turn to BM's 3VP/turn, for instance, while a 95% reliable engine with 10 Monuments as payload and not greening is 9.5VP/turn).

Alt-VP is generally quadratic - e.g. a Prince of Ironworks gaining a Gardens and buying a Copper gains 1 Gardens/turn and increases the value of each Gardens by 0.2 VP/turn, for 0.2n^2 + smaller terms VP, where n is the current turn. (But even the Money/Gardens strategy of buying Copper on 0-2, Silver on 3, Gardens on 4+ is quadratic, just a lot slower).

Engines are generally exponential, at least in terms of greening power: to take the extreme example, once you've trashed your starting cards and gained 8 Highways, a Highway-Market Square deck doubles the number of Market Squares in it, so having megaturn potential that grows like 2^n. But after the megaturn it'll stall horribly and be overtaken by the Big Money tortoise. If, as stated in the OP, the piles are very large but finite, then this is probably the best. If the piles are infinite, then it gets crushed.

A more traditional engine (with some +Buy) will also grow exponentially, but again if you start greening in the normal manner then you'll splutter a bit before choking entirely. However, it should be possible to build an engine that can increase in size exponentially and also gain green exponentially (with a smaller exponent) whilst still being able to reliably draw itself.

Better than that, though, would be the engine with Goons as payload, which also grows exponentially and gains VP exponentially, but has much less to choke on.

Now I've written this, I realise it's essentially what that article said, I think, though I can't find it either.

[lastly: no, florrat isn't right, because Dominion involves shuffling].

165
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Strictly better than....
« on: June 15, 2014, 08:57:56 pm »
I'm pretty certain that IRL you would never prefer to have a Duchy in hand than a Province, but might sometimes prefer the opposite due to Tournament (i.e. Province > Duchy).

On Goko, however, your opponent plays a Tournament, with a Bureaucrat and some other terminal in hand. If you have a Province, then Goko will ask you whether you want to reveal it, thus informing your opponent that you have a Victory card in hand, and so causing them to play the Bureaucrat instead of the other terminal. (And for whatever reason you consider this worse than them getting +Card +1$ (or it's a 3+ player game and someone else has already revealed)).

A similar situation arises with Young Witch to give a situation where you would prefer Duchy to Tunnel.

On the other hand, I can't find an edge case to counter Estate > Duchy in hand, though maybe someone else can.

(you can replace Duchy with any other pure Victory card with no interactions with other cards)

166
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Really bad card ideas
« on: June 09, 2014, 05:34:04 am »
GCHQ/NSA
Action $6
+1 Action
Look through your opponents' deck and discard pile. You may not reorder them unless you decide you may.

167
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Most Cards in Hand Before Playing A Card
« on: June 04, 2014, 03:55:30 am »
With 6 players the usual rule is to double the basic treasure piles, and have 3 VP cards per player in each pile. That adds 60+40+30+12+16+12*6 = 230 cards
I thought the extra 3 VP cards only applied to Provinces (and Colonies)?

168
How are you playing more than one Tactician in a turn?

169
Variants and Fan Cards / Re: Renovate: An In Play Trasher
« on: May 26, 2014, 08:26:15 am »
As currently phrased I think it's more about returning cards from in play to your discard, than about trashing cards from in play. The trashing (rather than just returning cards from in play) mostly serves to prevent (or at least make very difficult) any broken infinite combos.

170
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Easy Puzzles
« on: May 23, 2014, 09:36:05 pm »
Your opponent has (several) Rogues? If you're overdrawing your deck you could in fact put several Feasts in the trash in quick succession, slowing down his trashing attack and mildly junking his deck.

Though quite why he's using Rogue as an attack I'm not sure.

171
Other Games / Re: Smallworld 2 sale
« on: May 17, 2014, 08:18:45 pm »
Gah. Bought this (at 50% off, at least) only to discover that my laptop's graphics card is so bad it can't even cope with a board game...

172
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: who needs gokoins though?
« on: May 15, 2014, 09:57:31 am »
If the "when you buy a card" effects of Goons count, surely the "when you buy a card" effects of Haggler and Embargo count too? I can make 240VP from one Province buy using those.

173
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Easy Puzzles
« on: May 13, 2014, 05:45:38 pm »
Well that rather crushes my solution based around Noble Brigand, Embassy, Nomad Camp and Baker (and Governor/Council Room for Colonies).

174
General Discussion / Re: Maths thread.
« on: May 13, 2014, 05:41:44 pm »
Love this solution, but I think there is a minor bug:
Ah, good point.

I agree your fix does work.

I think the easiest way to define "opposite points" is to draw a line through one point that's otherwise outside the convex hull, then drawing a perpendicular to that, calling that the y-axis and using a point with the highest y-coordinate. But your way is neater.

I did wonder about the complexity of the algorithm, but it's not something I know much about, so thankyou for working it out :) Although the thing I like most about this solution is that it's constructable with straight edge and compass - interesting the different attitudes.

175
Puzzles and Challenges / Re: Easy Puzzles
« on: May 13, 2014, 05:21:44 pm »
how many players? any number 1-6?
Try to minimize the number of players required. I can manage with 3 and 6 respectively, though it may be possible to do better.

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