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Dominion General Discussion / Re: Plunder is online
« on: December 19, 2022, 12:30:36 pm »
Reckless doesn't allow you to use a Way for the repetition of a card, fortunately.
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77
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Plunder is online
« on: December 19, 2022, 11:37:53 am »It's interesting that in games with Looting, you just don't ever buy Gold.Well, maybe sometimes there is no Loots left, or there are only Endless Chalices left.
And, you know, sometimes you have Encampments or Legionaries or whatever.
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Rules Questions / Re: Harbor Village and Ways
« on: December 19, 2022, 11:22:05 am »This is because Reckless"s text is specifically about following a card's instructions. If you're using a Way, you're not following the card's instructions at all (modulo Chameleon), so the Trait's instruction to follow them twice doesn't kick in. Harbor Village's text isn't about whether a card's instructions gave you +$; it's about whether the card did. When you play a card according to a Way, the card is what's giving you that effect, even though the card's instructions are not being followed.
But it seems a bit arbitrary about when a card is giving you something or not. If a card can give you something outside of just its own instructions giving it to you, then what about Adventures tokens? If you have the +token on a card, does Harbor Village count that? The token gave you the money, not the card (technically I think the effect that put that token on the pile did). But playing the card resulted in you getting money. Taking that even further, playing Throne Room and choosing Market gives you money too, but we don't say the card Throne Room gave you
.
I agree that it's arbitrary, but it's consistent with the rules text, the text on the card-shaped things, and the rulings about interactions that Donald X. has made. (For instance, the Adventures rules booklet frames the effects of Adventures tokens as something that happens in addition to what the card does, whereas the Menagerie rules booklet frames the effects of Ways as changing what the card does.)
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: Plunder is online
« on: December 19, 2022, 11:07:50 am »
"Nearby" might the best groan-worthy pun name for a card-shaped thing in Dominion.
("Doubloons" isn't bad either.)
("Doubloons" isn't bad either.)
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Rules Questions / Re: Harbor Village and Ways
« on: December 19, 2022, 10:04:51 am »
This is because Reckless"s text is specifically about following a card's instructions. If you're using a Way, you're not following the card's instructions at all (modulo Chameleon), so the Trait's instruction to follow them twice doesn't kick in. Harbor Village's text isn't about whether a card's instructions gave you +$; it's about whether the card did. When you play a card according to a Way, the card is what's giving you that effect, even though the card's instructions are not being followed.
81
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Plunder is online
« on: December 18, 2022, 06:40:20 pm »It's always nice to have more Villa variants.
Yeah, Launch looks great! I love that it doesn't run out late-game like the other Villa-effects do. Once per turn seems like a reasonable limitation to compensate.
It will work really nicely with Landing Party - basically spend $3 to put your Landing Party/Parties back onto your deck - potentially letting you play the same Landing Party twice in a single turn!
...I don't follow?
82
Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #4: Next Time *
« on: December 16, 2022, 09:39:03 am »This means that now we need an official order of resolving the setup instructions from different sets. If the Shelters setup or the Heirlooms setup had come after the Traits setup, a Shelter or Heirloom couldn't be replaces by Inherited.
Also, if the Young Witch setup comes after the Traits setup, the Bane pile can't be chosen for a Trait. I don't know if there's an official ruling on that one.
Dutch Rule Books say (translated):
- Handing out the deck (Coppers/Estates) is the last step in preparation. So no problem there.
- Each game is determined by the players in consultation with which 10 of the xx species will be played. So use common sense to fix e.g. Bane "problem"
As far as I can see, handing out Coppers and Estates has to come before setting up Traits (so not as the last step), or you couldn't replace them for Inherited.
That's not quite right. First you choose a kingdom card to be Inherited; then everyone chooses which starting card to replace; then you hand out starting cards based on those choices.
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #5: More Stuff *
« on: December 16, 2022, 04:00:33 am »
Shaman is the new Ambassador
84
Dominion General Discussion / Re: Neat and potentially useful card interactions
« on: December 15, 2022, 07:30:24 pm »Spell Scroll + Treasurer -- instantly empties the Treasurer pile and gives you $30.
Spell Scroll trashes itself to gain & play a Treasurer, which can pull the Spell Scroll back out of the trash into your hand (and net $3 each time). Repeat until the Treasurer pile is empty.
You'd need a bunch of extra Actions to make that work though. Treasurer doesn't play the card it gains and Spell Scroll is terminal
Spell Scroll is a Treasure; you don't need an Action to play it.
85
Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #4: Next Time *
« on: December 15, 2022, 01:41:12 pm »So far my favorite Landing Party enabler is..Band of Misfits
Hmm... so if you Band of Misfits / Landing Party, the Band of Misfits is discarded from play on the turn it's played, as if it were Lost City, is what you're saying? I guess that's because:
* Band of Misfits stays in play for as many turns as the Duration card it's commanding still has something left to do;
* the only thing that the Landing Party has left to do is top-deck itself from play;
* since Landing Party is not in play, we know it's not going to do that;
* therefore the Landing Party has nothing left to do;
* therefore the Band of Misfits is discarded this turn.
...Ah, I see, it's the same reasoning as Band of Misfits / Conjurer.
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #3: Loot *
« on: December 14, 2022, 10:01:52 am »
Ooh, are Loot cards the first pile of cards not in the Supply that don't say "This is not in the Supply"?
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #3: Loot *
« on: December 14, 2022, 09:59:56 am »
I guess since Loot isn't in the supply, there doesn't need to be a special type for cards that refer to them to remind you to get the Loot pile and shuffle it at the beginning of the game? Which is a shame; they could have been called "Ruiners" for maximum confusion.
(More seriously, I am a little confused that there are types that mean you need to prepare the Boons or Hexes during setup, but not one for Loot even though the setup needs appear to be the same.)
(More seriously, I am a little confused that there are types that mean you need to prepare the Boons or Hexes during setup, but not one for Loot even though the setup needs appear to be the same.)
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: * Plunder Previews #2: Durations & Traits *
« on: December 13, 2022, 02:59:18 pm »It would be nice to have a name to refer to traits, events, ways, landmarks, and projects plus any future similar things rather than using an acronym that keeps changing every time something new is introduced. Donald, is there any shorthand you use?
Isn't "landscapes" a pretty common term that everyone uses?
"Landscapes" might include Boons, Hexes, Artifacts, and States, which aren't in the set of things that are used in this way.
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: Summary of all errata
« on: November 19, 2022, 09:02:31 pm »
On Buy On buy effects happens when gaining.
This isn't quite right. On-buy effects technically happen at the same time they always have; there just aren't any on-buy effects anymore.
(Personally I think "on-buy effects happen when gaining" probably would have been a simpler way to handle it, but I'm not Donald X.)
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Rules Questions / Re: Simple Rules Questions
« on: September 24, 2022, 02:44:42 pm »I've throned a duration card and for that, the TR will stay in play too. So would TR count the whole time before it would be discarded as a card in play?
Yes, it's in play as long as the Duration card is, and it counts for Peddler and Changeling and Horn of Plenty and so on.
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Additionally, can i scheme a TR, that thrones a duration in the first turn or the last turn of which the duration does something? I think i can only scheme a TR, if the TR would be discarded (2nd turn)
[/quote
Right, you can scheme a Throne Room when it's discarded from play, which means on the same turn the Duration is discarded from play.
93
Rules Questions / Re: Sailor/Blockade
« on: August 01, 2022, 04:07:29 am »
In the Blockade scenario I described, you do set a card aside with it—you set aside a Caravan (but then after it was set aside it got moved to the play area). The stop-moving rule prevents that Caravan from moving into your hand on the next turn. In the BoM/Conjurer scenario, the stop-moving rule is also what prevents the Conjurer from moving to your hand on your next turn (from the supply). In both cases, there is a specific card that they're supposed to move at the beginning of the next turn, but will be predictably blocked from moving by the stop-moving rule.
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Rules Questions / Re: Sailor/Blockade
« on: August 01, 2022, 12:44:30 am »
Hmm, okay, the wiki also says that if you Band of Misfits / Conjurer, the Band of Misfits stays in play till the next turn. How is that different from the Blockade scenario in my first question? In both situations, a Duration card is supposed to put something in your hand in the next turn, but you already know before Clean-up that the stop-moving rule is going to prevent that from happening. In the case of Blockade, that makes you discard the Blockade during Clean-up (you don't wait for it to try and fail to put the Caravan in your hand), but in the case of Band of Misfits / Conjurer, knowing that you're not going to be doing anything next turn because the targeted card isn't available apparently isn't enough to overrule the card staying play, and you do wait for it to try and fail to put the Conjurer in your hand. Why is that?
I suppose the answer must be because the rule is, Band of Misfits stays in play as long as the Duration card it plays would stay in play if it were in play; and if the Conjurer were in play then it would be going to do something on the next turn because it wouldn't lose track of itself in that situation... but that seems like one too many counterfactuals to really be how the cards are supposed to work, doesn't it?
I suppose the answer must be because the rule is, Band of Misfits stays in play as long as the Duration card it plays would stay in play if it were in play; and if the Conjurer were in play then it would be going to do something on the next turn because it wouldn't lose track of itself in that situation... but that seems like one too many counterfactuals to really be how the cards are supposed to work, doesn't it?
95
Rules Questions / Re: Donating your Entire Hand
« on: July 30, 2022, 09:09:41 pm »
Yes, you can trash everything with Donate. As far as I know, there's no way out of it; you just have to not buy Donate and leave yourself with debt you can't pay off.
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: Hinterlands 2E Preview 3
« on: July 26, 2022, 11:28:05 am »But by the time the when-trash effect takes place, the card is in the (public) trash, no?Yes, we discussed that already in the posts you're quoting. You're moving a card being trashed to a public place, but that is also the case for a card being discarded.
GendoIkari is right, not all discards happen publicly: e.g. discarding your hand to Minion, where other players only see the top card you discarded. So the other hand cards go from a private place (hand) to a completely hidden place (discard pile), without being revealed before discarding.
Same with Cartographer from this expansion when you discard several cards - though in this case, since you have carefully chosen which cards to discard, you'll rarely miss a discard reaction anyway.
I guess you're agreeing that "revealing from a private zone" is not a valid argument.
No? The discard pile (other than the top card) is a private zone. If you discard a few cards, no one will ever know what the third one from the top is unless you reveal it. If you reveal that the third one is a Tunnel, you're revealing it from a private zone. Similarly, if you have a bunch of cards in your hand, no one will know that the third one is a Moat unless you reveal it. I'm not sure what you're objecting to in that analysis.
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Ok, so now we're back to revealing to a private zone. As I said: "Not really, since all the when-discard cards have rules saying that you have to reveal them."
The reason you have to reveal them is because the discard pile is a private zone. Catacombs doesn't say "when you trash this, reveal it and gain a cheaper card"; you don't have to reveal it because the trash is already visible. Tunnel doesn't say "when you discard this, you may gain a Gold"; you have to reveal it, for the same reason Trader doesn't say "while this is in your hand, when you gain a card, you may exchange the gained card for a Silver."
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Rules Questions / Re: Sailor/Blockade
« on: July 26, 2022, 03:59:33 am »
Ah, I see this is already answered on the wiki. Good work, everyone!
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Rules Questions / Sailor/Blockade
« on: July 26, 2022, 03:54:39 am »
Okay so I play Sailor, and then I play Blockade, gaining Caravan. Caravan is gained directly to set-aside-cards-land (no visiting!), which means Sailor can put Caravan into play immediately. Since the Caravan isn't set aside anymore, Blockade won't make anyone gain Curses. Fine and dandy.
My question is: does Blockade stay in play anyway? Does it still have to try (and fail) to put Caravan in my hand at the start of the next turn? Or does it already "know" that the Caravan is gone and that it won't do anything next turn?
(This is conceptually different from a Gear with nothing set aside, since in this case a Blockade has a specific set-aside card that it's trying to put in your hand; it just can't find it.)
(I suspect the answer is that Blockade is discarded this turn, but I'm not totally certain!)
My question is: does Blockade stay in play anyway? Does it still have to try (and fail) to put Caravan in my hand at the start of the next turn? Or does it already "know" that the Caravan is gone and that it won't do anything next turn?
(This is conceptually different from a Gear with nothing set aside, since in this case a Blockade has a specific set-aside card that it's trying to put in your hand; it just can't find it.)
(I suspect the answer is that Blockade is discarded this turn, but I'm not totally certain!)
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Dominion General Discussion / Re: Dominion Log Statistics
« on: July 20, 2022, 07:47:16 pm »
Oh gosh, I had completely forgotten this even existed! By all means, please do create a wiki page for it.
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Rules Questions / Re: Urchin "while in play"?
« on: July 18, 2022, 10:53:06 am »Does it even need "this turn"? "When you play another Attack card, you may trash this from play" would seem to have it covered.Yes, it does. “This turn” tells you how long the ongoing trigger is in effect for.
In what circumstance would the presence of absence of "this turn" make a difference, though? (I agree that the version without "this turn" would probably want a dividing line, but I'm not asking about whether the dividing line would make a difference just the "this turn".)
Not having "this turn" would be super awkward, even if the outcome would be the same. You'd have to do this:
1. Play Urchin.
2. Discard Urchin like normal in clean-up.
3. On a later turn, play an attack.
4. Urchin triggers. Follow the instruction "trash this to gain a Mercenary".
4a. Fail to trash Urchin due to the stop-moving rule.
Every time throughout the entire game that you play an attack card, repeat steps 4 and 4a.
4a would be "fail to trash Urchin because it's not in play"; the stop-moving rule is never invoked. (Recall my wording is "you may trash this from play".)
Just like how it's already the case that every time throughout the game that you play an Attack card, every other player's Diplomat triggers, the follow the instruction "you may reveal this from your hand", and then fail to reveal it when it's not in their hand.