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Topics - philosophyguy

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26
Dominion General Discussion / Would you buy Platinum in a Province game?
« on: December 12, 2012, 03:33:06 pm »
Dominion's rules have you only put out Platinum and Colony together. But, suppose for a moment that Platinum were available but no Colonies. Are there situations in which buying Platinum would make sense?

The best scenario I can think of would be a player who has to piledrive the Provinces (maybe a BM race against a Monument engine); I can imagine Platinum being useful to avoid stalling on green.

27
Dominion Isotropic / Quitting Iso solo games
« on: December 12, 2012, 11:04:44 am »
Is there a way to quickly quit an iso solo game? If I use the exit button I have to re-login, confirm my username, etc. I'd like to be able to just go back to the lobby.

I ask because I'm trying to test a couple of opening strategies to see how quickly I can hit a Grand Market, but I don't really care about playing the rest of the game out.

28
Help! / Remodel opening
« on: December 08, 2012, 06:30:15 pm »
Reading the tournament logs, I was impressed by two engines that were put together by top players using a Remodel opening.

In the first game (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/08/game-20121208-131357-02e9d5d0.html), -Stef- uses Remodel to stock up on Mining Villages and Duchesses (!) in order to power his Minion-for-draw-Goons-for-points engine.

The second game (http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201212/08/game-20121208-051449-28b50f89.html) features Rabid using Remodel to pick up a Cutpurse and then Cellars, all while building a Festival-Rabble engine.

These games stood out because normally Remodel is a slow opening, especially if there are key $5s that you need to pick up. Yet in these games, $5s were at the heart of the engines: Minions in one game, and Festival and Rabble in the other.

Can someone help me improve my understanding of Remodel as an opener. Specifically, what about these boards made Remodel viable even in light of the race for $5s?

29
Dominion General Discussion / Improbable engines
« on: November 30, 2012, 07:36:08 pm »
Ok, you crazy engine builders: let's see your most mind-blowing engines. If you've made an engine out of unexpected pieces, tell us about it. Game logs are awesome; explaining how you approached the engine is even better. Consider this your opportunity to show us lower-level players a master class on engines in unexpected places.

30
Help! / Festival/Torturer awfulness
« on: November 29, 2012, 09:23:25 am »
In this game, I got crushed by a Festival/Torturer engine (the final score is much closer than the game actually was): http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201211/29/game-20121129-061907-78c2657a.html

Despite ending the game with 6 Festivals and 5 Torturers, I didn't draw a Festival and Torturer in hand together until turn  18!

How should I have played this differently? I'm guessing some (maybe all?) of the early Conspirators were not good choices, but I thought I was going to be chaining Festivals and Torturers which would activate Conspirators and give me cash to take advantage of Festival's +Buy.

31
Help! / Critique of a Duke game
« on: November 27, 2012, 02:09:03 pm »
I'm very bad at alt-VP, so I was glad that this board provided an opportunity to practice my Duke game.

http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201211/27/game-20121127-110709-7f36ed0d.html

I managed to win the game, but I would appreciate comments for how to play this board more effectively. Obviously it made a big difference that my opponent did not contest Duchies, but are there specific plays that could have been more effective on my part?

32
Dominion General Discussion / Not triggering reshuffles
« on: November 24, 2012, 12:33:02 pm »
How do you decide when not to trigger a reshuffle? When is it worth missing a reshuffle in order to play a card?

For instance, if you open 5/2 on a Witch-BM board and draw your Witch turn 5, do you play it?

What about an engine board where playing an extra Market will reshuffle but will allow you to pick up two engine components rather than just one?

Any thoughts, examples, game logs, etc. are welcome.

33
Help! / Engines in Goko adventure
« on: November 23, 2012, 08:54:17 pm »
The way that Goko's adventure mode is set up--with opponents getting an edge via extra VPs--seems to make engine-building more important, since BM will have a hard time overcoming the extra VPs without stalling.

The problem is, especially in the base game, I am not much of an engine builder. I've been studying the first game engine discussion by Geronimoo and the sim contest followup, but I struggle when key cards like Militia are not on the board.

So, my question is: what sort of engine would you build on the following board?

Mine, Market, Festival, Council Room, Spy, Moneylender, Feast, Workshop, Village, Moat. My problem is that the only good card draw is Council Room and Spy is a pretty awful payload. Just typing that list I thought maybe a CR-Mine engine, but I don't think that would br fast enough to overcome the point handicap since CRs give opponents free cards.

34
Rules Questions / Possession/Graverobber
« on: November 19, 2012, 10:09:07 pm »
Let's suppose that I am possessing my opponent, and during the possessed turn I make my opponent trash a Duchy and then play a Graverobber. Is that Duchy available in the Trash to be graverobber-ed?

35
Puzzles and Challenges / Puzzle: Potions run out?
« on: November 09, 2012, 03:12:49 pm »
This is a puzzle rather than a challenge because I don't have a specific answer in mind…I just want to see what the community comes up with.

The puzzle: is there a board where the game could plausibly end with the Potion pile depleted? The game doesn't necessarily need to end on piles, but at the end of the game the Potion pile must be empty.

Bonus points is emptying Potions is not only plausible but in fact the best play in the situation.

36
Dominion General Discussion / Shelters exacerbate 5/2
« on: September 02, 2012, 09:42:47 am »
Last night I was playing some Dark Age heavy games IRL and discovered that Shelters can exacerbate the impact of a 5/2 split.

Normally, getting a 5 is already a strong opening, especially with something like Witch on the board. Usually, you don't want to buy anything with your $2. But with Shelters, you can buy an Estate to trash your Hovel and gain a 1vp lead without slowing your deck! In games with heavy cursing, that point is often worth a lot because the game will end on piles.

Other notes: Death Cart's gain Ruins penalty is not as bad as I feared, although they severely slow your second shuffle if you open with the Cart. Wandering Minstrel has to be one of the top, if not the top, $4 villages: deck filtering, setting up your action chain, and replacing itself in hand. Rogue can really swing if you want the attack but something else ends up in the Trash first (like Rats!).

37
Goko Dominion Online / Rank the (Partial) Sets
« on: August 16, 2012, 12:30:22 pm »
We know how some of the sets are going to be broken up in Goko, so why not rank those sets like we rank the expansions?

My rating (best to worst):
Prosperity: Bigger and Better (the defining cards of one of the best sets, IMO)
Seaside: Ports and Beaches
Intrigue: Underlings
Seaside: Ships and Sailors
Prosperity: Treasure Troves (although this probably needs to go up with DA, because of Watchtower)
Intrigue: Peasants and Aristocrats (although Masq + alt VP make this seem too low, I can't figure out what to bump down)

38
Dominion General Discussion / Engine viability (advanced)
« on: July 30, 2012, 08:54:58 am »
Lately I've seen a number of posts about engines that were successfully constructed on boards where I would never have thought an engine could succeed. (Examples: Geronimoo's DS post on an engine in the First Game setup and Fabian's sample game analysis) What I'd like to do is revisit, at a higher level, what engine builders look for when determining if an engine is viable.

Obviously, there are the components of an engine:
  • +Actions (including obvious sources like Villages and odd sources like Throne Room/cantrip or Golem/cantrip/cantrip)
  • +Cards (although not all are created equal; Embassy is definitely a BM drawer because it filters and only gives net +2 cards)
  • +Buy

There are also engine enablers:
  • Attacks
  • Trashing
  • Cards that smooth out your shuffle luck (e.g., Scheme, durations)
  • TR/KC
  • (Potentially) alt-VP that can extend the game length (as long as there's no rush strategy and your engine can sustain Garden/Duke dancing)
  • Gains (Ironworks, Mint, and Possession are all different examples from this class)

So, for the advanced engine builders: are there other elements that you look for when deciding to build an engine? When can a really strong board in one area overcome a deficiency in another area?

Some of the answers to the above question, collected from the posts below:
  • Whether the engine needs to get to double Province/Colony or whether it can get to single Province faster than a BM deck.
  • Whether the engine builds itself faster as it gets going. An accelerating engine building phase results in a more explosive engine; conversely, an engine that just adds a Conspirator each turn is going to need to slow down the BM player much more.
  • Whether the engine allows you to control the endgame. An engine with tons of +Buy, cost reduction, or megaturns (like Horn of Plenty) makes it feasible for the engine player to dictate when the game ends.
  • Whether there are cards that do more than one function. Develop on a good board serves as both trashing and gaining; it's not great at either, but the combo function compensates if you can take advantage of it (as Marin does here).
  • Whether the attacks are engine-friendly. Engines can handle hand-size reduction much better than BM; sans trashing/filtering, cursing is more devastating for engines than BM.

NB: Some engines work as simple stacks: Minion and Hunting Party-terminal Silver are the canonical examples of this genre. Because that engine is built around a single card, you often don't need to evaluate the engine components in the same way as you would in a fit-all-the-parts-together engine type. For instance, Hunting Party gives you +Actions and +Cards, as well as virtual trashing (by skipping repeated cards), but adding a +Buy is generally not worth it unless the +Buy is your terminal Silver (Woodcutter, Nomad Camp) or the +Buy is a cantrip (like Market), lest you break the HP chain.

39
Help! / Mandarin/Talisman/Duke on 5/2
« on: July 25, 2012, 12:36:48 pm »
I'd appreciate feedback on this game:

http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120724-135829-a9eb41a7.html

Key cards are Mandarin, Talisman, and Duke, with some potential support from Farming Village, Border Village, and Salvager.

Opening 2/5, I decided to go for Mandarin/Talisman. I was planning on Duchy/Duke from the start; I saw Farming Village for skipping through green cards, Mandarin could help hit $5 and smooth my cash, and Talisman is at worst a Copper (which is fine in Duchy games) and at best a free Silver early on.

I'm pretty sure I misplayed by getting Farming Villages with a Talisman in play instead of Silvers, but otherwise I'm not sure where this strategy fell apart. Was simply the tempo loss from the Mandarin put back effects enough to give me opponent the lead? Should I have played for a different strategy?

40
Help! / Help building a double Tac engine
« on: July 07, 2012, 12:30:37 pm »
The following is a game that I won against a friend who plays Dominion very casually. What I would like is detailed critique about the order of my purchases and play given my goal to set up a double Tac engine. I'm not confident in how I assembled the engine components or in when I started greening about would appreciate feedback.

I have attached a game log with my commentary about what I was thinking at different stages to this post. Thanks for your help!

41
Dominion General Discussion / Phil Stone at 2p?
« on: July 07, 2012, 07:44:09 am »
Do you think Phil Stone is better as a 2potion card rather than 3potion?

The difference between the two costs is primarily that 2p is almost certain after the first reshuffle, whereas 3p is dicey. But, Phil Stones aren't worth much after the first two shuffles--they only explode later in the game. So, it seems that the primary impact of that cost is to make going for Phil Stones harder early in the game. Unless there are other Potion cards on the board, that delay is often enough to discourage buying a Potion if there are moderate or better $5s on the board.

Given that Phil Stone is usually a weaker card, except for some cases like Herbalist or Curse decks, would the extra encouragement to buy Stones at 2p be a net improvement to the card?

42
Dominion General Discussion / Multiplayer games and combos
« on: June 27, 2012, 03:53:00 pm »
It's pretty common knowledge that attacks get stronger in multi-player games. One thing that I haven't seen discussed is how the relative strength of attacks affects the strength of combos.

In two-player games, it's relatively easy to set up 2 or three card combos. Village-Torturer, Wharf-Fool's Gold, NV-Bridge, and HP-terminal Silver are common examples. These combos can often be supported by additional cards on the board, but usually the combo itself runs reliably.

In multi-player games, a lot of combos become harder to execute because of the increased strength/frequency of attacks. In standard drawing combos (Torturer chains, Wharf decks), discard or deck-junking attacks pose a far more significant barrier than in 2-player games because you're more likely to be hit by something every turn, which really slows your ability to pick up the linchpin cards. In addition, the additional turns you spend buying Silvers to get over the $5 threshold mean that it's harder to line up your combo once you finally have the pieces.

Conversely, combos that don't have to worry about those attacks, like NV-Bridge or Chancellor-Stash, become stronger on these boards because the deck junking/decreased handsize doesn't matter as much, which means these combos are more powerful vs. the attack than they would be in a 2-player match. Consider Sea Hag vs. Chancellor-Stash: sims give the two-player matchup to the Sea Hag player 74/23, while a three-player game with two Hag players against Chancellor-Stash gives the win to Chancellor by a massive 62/17.5/17.5! Sometimes the result is more modest: Witch has a 53/46 edge over NV-Bridge in 2-player but NV-Bridge against 2 Witch players is a virtual three-way tie.

The point is that, when evaluating combos, trying to connect cards in multi-player is trickier than in 2-player. So, combos that don't require cards to line up become more powerful. Hunting Party gets crushed by Village-Torturer in 2-player, but because it doesn't require the Hunting Party to be drawn with the terminal Silver, the HP deck edges out Torturers in a multi-player game.

Examples of combos that get stronger in multi-player: NV-Bridge, Hunting Party-terminal Silver, Chancellor-Stash
Examples of combos that get weaker in multi-player: +actions/+cards/+payload, Herbalist-Phil Stone, single-card engines like Minion or Governor

43
Simulation / Simulator rules for Mandarin's put-back effect
« on: June 13, 2012, 01:25:33 pm »
Does the simulator allow control over Mandarin's put-back-a-card effect? I'm interested in optimizing a simulator strategy for Mandarin/Duke, but I don't know how to modify what is put back based on the $5/$8 price points (and probably some checking for pile status etc).

44
Dominion General Discussion / Card value: Bridge vs. Highway
« on: May 24, 2012, 02:59:50 pm »
I'm trying to understand why Bridge and Highway don't have their values switched.

One is a cantrip that reduces costs by one but can't be stacked via TR/KC.
One is a terminal that reduces costs by one, gives you an extra buy to increase the impact of the cost reduction, and allows both of those effects to be stacked via TR/KC.

Is the fact that Highway is a cantrip enough to justify the extra value, given that the rest of the benefits so obviously weigh in favor of Bridge having the higher cost?

45
Dominion Articles / Request: Farmland
« on: May 08, 2012, 10:44:19 am »
I'm looking for strategic thinking on Farmland. The obvious enablers for Farmland strategies are $6 cards (so you have more targets to Farmland into Provinces). Other than that, what circumstances allow Farmland to shine? Does Farmland have any use prior to the heavy greening stage of the game? Any nifty combos you've discovered?

46
Dominion General Discussion / Throne Room
« on: April 24, 2012, 12:32:53 am »
How do you play Throne Room? The obvious parallel is with King's Court, but besides the fact that King's Court is game-warpingly powerful when stacked, there are another couple of key disanalogies:

1) By the time you can afford a KC, you usually have a decent action density. So, there's a lower chance of KC being drawn dead. By contrast, TR only costs $4, so you can get it after the first or second shuffle and still have an ok chance of not drawing it with an action card.

2) Since KC costs $7, it's rare that you have to overspend for it. By contrast, TR's $4 price trades off with important $5 or $6 cards unless you buy the TR really early (and then see #1).

The obvious ways to work around 1 and 2 are with gainers or +Buy. But, in the absence of those elements, what makes TR worthwhile?

47
Simulation / Learning simulator logic
« on: April 21, 2012, 01:00:12 pm »
I'd like to post a request for people who have created interesting simulator logic to post their code and explain how the code works. WW's commentary on his Ironworks/Silk Roads bot after the simulator tournament was very helpful in understanding what the bot was doing, and I learned a lot about how to build different scenarios into the simulator. I'd appreciate if others can likewise post code snippets and explain what they do. Examples of useful things to learn could include:
  • How to build in logic for when a simulator should use the gain Copper ability with IGG for weird scenarios like having 4 IGGs in hand (you probably want to buy a Province, but how does the simulator know to take the coppers there but not with only 3 IGGs in hand and no other treasure?)
  • How to determine whether playing Haggler is useful or whether it will force you to gain a junk card
  • Changing play priority of cursing attacks once curses have run out

This is just a sample of ideas off the top of my head. Just consider this a place to show, and explain, how you got the simulator to do something nifty.

48
Game Reports / Piles! Sea Hag/Hamlet/Woodcutter/Vineyards
« on: April 18, 2012, 06:09:23 pm »
I'm very proud of this win against HiveMindEmulator: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/18/game-20120418-145834-e05fdf34.html

Long story short, I realize about a turn into the game that with curses running from Sea Hags, Hamlet + Vineyards + Woodcutter is a solid combination. I make the turn to Potions a couple of turns before him and the early focus on acquiring cheap actions gives me the edge. This game isn't perfect—I'm especially mad about the two times I misclicked on Hamlet and either wasn't able to play a second action card in hand or didn't have the extra buy I needed—but I felt like I played the game better overall.

49
Dominion General Discussion / Cache use?
« on: April 11, 2012, 11:02:58 am »
What kind of decks benefit from Cache? Obviously decks that can handle the extra Coppers (e.g., Apothecary, Trader, Watchtower) are going to do just fine, and decks where Copper is a benefit (e.g., Gardens, Dukes) are no-brainers to pick up Cache. In the absence of those cards, though, what makes Cache viable? Is strong deck cycling/sifting like Warehouse enough? Stables? Other scenarios?

50
Dominion General Discussion / Early Deck Cycling Revisited
« on: April 06, 2012, 10:18:43 am »
There were recently a number of threads about the statistics of playing a Venture or other cycling card and how that impacts the deck distribution, if at all. Before that, there were threads discussing cycling in general, with the general consensus that cycling early is good because it gets new (and presumably stronger) cards into your deck, while cycling once you start greening is disadvantageous because you're adding dead cards to the deck.

All of this analysis seems to overlook something really important: namely, that the impact of lucky or unlucky cycling is not equal, even if the odds are equal for having a lucky or unlucky cycle. The point was driven home to me in a recent game where my Loan flipped my opening buy on the first play and set me behind for turns 4 and 5, and then the rest of the game. It's the same reason that having a Sea Hag flip a Sea Hag is often gg. If you cycle in a lucky manner, you may gain at most a turn advantage. If you cycle unluckily, however, you can be set back a full reshuffle.

I think this suggests that early deck cycling (especially blind cycling, like Loan or Fortune Teller) is more dangerous than usually believed. Cycling effects are a high-variance strategy early on, with a much bigger downside than upside in most cases.

What this implies, in terms of strategy:
  • Self-cycling cards like Loan are extremely risky as openers
  • In multi-player games and games with a high first player advantage, cycling attacks like Fortune Teller or Pirate Ship become better buys for players in later turn order

Thoughts?

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